[sexybeasty]

How many Christians believe in the addage, once saved always saved?

I have been a Christian since age 8 and never was sure until adulthood. I heard it said at the pulpit, that once you name is written in the Book of Life it cannot be erased. A good example of this is the relationship we have with our parents, if good.

We can disappoint them and frustrate them. They may even punish our behavior when we are wrong. They. On the other hand, will never cease to love us or to be our parents. As loving children who want a good relationship with them, we try hard to please. Blessings come from being pleaseing to our parents. They would cut their right arm off for us (not literal) if we are being loving and obedient. Regardless, life is easier in obedience with our parents AND with the Lord.

Our sin, was paid for on the cross. Our eternal salvation is a guartantee once we are saved. Our blessings are not a guarantee however, unless obedience comes into play. In fact, how much harsher the punishment may be, coming from a parent than from a stranger.

Just wanted to give food for thought. Blessing to all.

[NeedKarma]

once you name is written in the Book of Life it cannot be erased.

I hope that isn't true. There are people who may have been sweet at 10 years old but as adults they are terrorizing others.

[sexybeasty]

God sees us as his children throughout our lives. He wants us to keep in line. He gave Christians instructions. As human beings, whether Christian or not, we have the choice on how to live. Christians risk Earthly and Godly wrath if we try to hurt others. God wants His chilren in line. Believe it or not, most people care about the quality of their lives here on Earth and love God because of His love.

Security in salvatin is not a BAD thing. We still face punishment for wrongdoing. Believe me, it is true.

[robynhgl]

Not to make light of the subject... but have you read some of the posts in the Parenting or Children Forums? Some parents don't love their kids and some kids don't love their parents...

As for once saved, always saved... I don't think so. I figure it this way. My Father will love me in spite of my transgressions and the mistakes I make. But if I continue to make those mistakes--taking for granted His love and his forgiveness, I am thumbing my nose at Him. If I just carry on and do horrendous things because I can without the repercussion of losing His favor--what's the point in even loving, honoring or respecting Him and His will? I can go out and kill randomly for the 'fun' of it and still enoy the privilege of being in His glory upon my death...

[sexybeasty]

Well, God is a good Father. As I stated, He will put is in our place and there WILL be Earthly consequences. We do not know the hearts of those who claim Christianity. We will see, in heaven that those we think got LOST were never FOUND.

I respect you opinion, Rob. I do not agree with it, but I fully respect it. God has such a stronghold on me, and I am sure you too. Can you imagine NOT having a place in your heart for God? I cannot. True Christianity cannot be shaken loose.

Some folks only respond to pressure, perhaps when growing up in Christian homes, and maybe their hearts never honestly took the step. I am not here to judge that, but to say I believe true repentance cannot shake the love given by our Lord. He that Knows the future, would not give something He did not intend for us to have. That is MY belief.

Carry on my good friend.

[robynhgl]

The defining term that you used--TRUE REPENTANCE. I do think once a person has been able to do just that--he/she will not be erased. It's the choice thing.

We are all there, we make the choice to stay there or not. That's just my understanding of it... the thing that matters most--is that we do have Him in our hearts and in our lives, beyond that, nothing else really matters does it?

Have a great day!

[sexybeasty]

You too, sweetheart.

[JoeCanada76]

sexybeasty,

I agree that once your saved your always saved. That is a very strong Baptist belief. I was brought up both in Catholic and Baptist churches. Both teach and look at things a bit different but the fact remains is that we are all children of God. All of us. We need to learn that whenever we do fall, we do sin. Yes, we will get punished. Yes, they are consequences. I would say a lot of us do learn from our sins (mistakes) and grow and learn from them and do not commit the same sin again. Truly speaking human nature is sinful. Jesus came to teach us about God. To teach us about the true love of our father with his children and that we will have eternal promised life in the house of God when we leave this world.

Joe

[sexybeasty]

It is nice to be on the same spiritual plane with a fellow Christian. You are fun to talk to Joe.

Cindy the beasty

[Retrotia]

I thought if a saved person does a 180 & then renounces Christ then they would no longer have salvation secured. But according to some Christians, they say he was never saved in the 1st place.
OK, so I was referred to Scripture. John 10:28(NKJV) "And I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; neither shall anyone snatch them out of My hand."

I do understand all you previous posters comments about repentance & renouncing sin keeps us filled with the peace, joy, & abundance that Christ has promised in this life.

Then while looking for an answer about renouncing Jesus after having been saved(&how would that affect salvation) I came across this particular paragraph from a Christian writer.

But what do you think it means?:

Can a saved person ever be lost?

"For a believer to lose his salvation would demand a reversal and an undoing of all the preceding works of the Father, Son, and Spirit. The key issue in the discussion of the believer's security concerns the issue of who does the saving. If man is responsible for securing his salvation, then he can be lost; if God secures the person's salvation, then the person is forever secure." [4]

-Paul Enns

Other than that I know Born-again believers go to Heaven. What they'll be doing & what place they'll have depends on their "works" after they are saved.

But the question in blue, what does that mean? Don't make me have to buy his book to find out! Lol. :)

[sexybeasty]

I think they are saying man does not chose salvation first , but man's chosing is a manifestation of being chosen by God in the first place.

See, God made us, and He made our hearts and He always knew us, even before we were born. God is timeless and therefore in knowing us always is very complex yet believeable. As Christians, we were born to love Him.

Since God is all knowing, how can it be different?

It seems so, to me at least. I am just a girl muttling through and trying to get it right. (smirk)

[shygrneyzs]

No, I do not believe that once saved, always saved. If that were so, then we would never need forgiveness for our sins, so why not go on sinning, since we are already saved?

The once saved, always saved leaves the back door open, so to speak.

[sexybeasty]

I don't go on sinning (as much), because I love my Heavenly Father and I am in fear of Earthly dicipline. If I believed your way, I would just want to die right when I am in the right, because I am bound to slip up when in depressions or another state of mind that would make me weak.

I don't think that would foster a loving relationship with the Father and His children as we would be operating strictly out of fear and not so much out of love. You don't believe that your name is permanently in the Book of Life. You feel you are in jeopardy of losing Him if you fall back? How can you experience joy in that state? I am not trying to sound rude, I really am interested in your take on God. Blessings... by the way. (smile)

[shygrneyzs]

In brief; I believe our salvation is a relationship with God through faith in Jesus Christ. I believe we all stumble at times and sin. I also believe that when we sin the Holy Spirit convicts us and draws us back to a closer walk. If we confess our sin we repair our relationship and everything is okay, but if we refuse to repent and confess and continue to sin our relationship will deteriorate, at some point we grow cold and our relationship is ruined. Paul called this turning from the faith, shipwrecked faith, etc... Paul even said if we don't hold fast then we have believed in vain.

I do believe that a person can choose to give their eternal security back and reject their faith. There is no 'risk' you either hold on to the faith or you decide to reject it. There is no reason for a person to worry about their salvation. I believe God will hold you as long as you want to be held. Why would God force a person who has made the choice to reject Him to live with Him eternally?

I am saying that we can choose to reject the faith we once had and walk away from our salvation. I believe this is what the scripture teaches and will attempt to show those passages which I believe support this view. No one should ever worry about their salvation, if you want to stay safe and secure, God will help you, but we should never take our salvation lightly and think we have been forgiven and locked into heaven no matter what we do from this point forward.

(1 John 1:9-10 NIV) "If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just and will forgive us our sins and purify us from all unrighteousness. [10] If we claim we have not sinned, we make him out to be a liar and his word has no place in our lives. John under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit wrote this to Christians." Why would God command Christians to confess their sins and then say that He would forgive them if they (the sins) had already been forgive when they were saved?

(2 Timothy 4:9-10 NIV) "Do your best to come to me quickly, [10] for Demas, because he loved this world, has deserted me and has gone to Thessalonica. Crescens has gone to Galatia, and Titus to Dalmatia." In this verse Paul says that Demas deserted him because Demas loved the world. This does not prove that Demas was then lost, but it sure shows that a person can walk away.

(2 Peter 1:8-11 NIV) "For if you possess these qualities in increasing measure, they will keep you from being ineffective and unproductive in your knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ. [9] But if anyone does not have them, he is nearsighted and blind, and has forgotten that he has been cleansed from his past sins. [10] Therefore, my brothers, be all the more eager to make your calling and election sure. For if you do these things, you will never fall, [11] and you will receive a rich welcome into the eternal kingdom of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ." In this passage Peter mentions that the person has forgotten that they were forgiven of their past sins. He does not mention past, present and future, just past. He goes on to say that we should be eager to make our calling and election sure. If we can never give up our salvation then this verse makes no sense. Nor does the statement that if we do these things we will never fall. To make that statement would have to mean it is possible to fall or it would be meaningless.

We are all sinners, and we all fall short. That does not mean we give up, it does mean I give up. It does not mean I walk away because I think there is no hope. There is the promise of eternal union with the Father. But I cannot say that once saved, always saved.

[sexybeasty]

For me, it is the difference between real repentance and perceived repentance. Of course there are people who say they were once saved and are no longer Christians. I just have to question whether they knew the Holy Spirit was in the first place. Only God knows, but the Spirit's stronghold on me is so tight and steadfast that I know I am redeemed eternally. I do sin and fall short, everyday, but I feel loved and secure and I talk to Him daily and I love this site because I can share Him. My heart belongs to Christ and my sin nature is still there, but I try to do what is right and sometimes it is a pain, but I still try because I want to please God.

Thanks for sharing your interpretation. Hope you are having a lovely day.

[Retrotia]

For me it's the same, sexybeasty. I thought one could FORFEIT their salvation by denying Christ afterwards but I'm thinking and getting some opinions on that too--that they never were saved in the 1st place. Weren't sealed with the Holy Spirit.
The H.S. convicts the believer about sin. He is much less inclined to sin. Even so, man can repent & renounce the sin(s) before they die. Satan cannot snatch us out of His hand!
I believe in a merciful God even if we didn't say "forgive us our trespasses" the night before we died, if we truly meant to but fel asleep.
Oh btw- that paragraph I asked about had to do with predestination. Too much to grasp at one reading. But what u said was right- but the theologian was way too deep for me & I'm not that interested in predestination interpretations.
Hope you have a good one!

[Morganite]

For me it's the same, sexybeasty. I thought one could FORFEIT their salvation by denying Christ afterwards but I'm thinking and getting some opinions on that too--that they never were saved in the 1st place. Weren't sealed with the Holy Spirit.
The H.S. convicts the believer about sin. He is much less inclined to sin. Even so, man can repent & renounce the sin(s) before they die. Satan cannot snatch us out of His hand!
I believe in a merciful God even if we didn't say "forgive us our trespasses" the night before we died, if we truly meant to but fel asleep.
Oh btw- that paragraph I asked about had to do with predestination. Too much to grasp at one reading. But what u said was right- but the theologian was way too deep for me & I'm not that interested in predestination interpretations.
Hope you have a good one!

What do you make of 2 Pet 3.17; 1 Cor 10.12 ?

Those who preserve and cultivate the word of God in honest and good hearts, and bring forth fruit in faith, patience and sacrifice, will not depart from the Lord, for "If ye know that he is righteous, ye know that every one that doeth righteousness is born of him." (1 John 2:29.)

But a person shuts himself up in the crumbling fortress of pride, when he boasts that he is saved, sanctified and beyond sin. Such should indulge in a little self-examination, and purge himself of this unwholesome pride, for it is the pride that goeth before a fall. He should take to heart this warning. "Wherefore let him that thinketh he standeth take heed lest he fall." (1 Cor. 10:12.)

John severely rebukes those who are under this sort of self-deception. He says: "If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us." (1 John 1:8.) Even in old times it is written: "For there is not a just man upon earth, that doeth good, and sinneth not." (Eccl. 7:2.)

The sad story of those who made shipwreck of their faith and fell from grace is told in holy writ. Of such Peter says: "For if after they have escaped the pollutions of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, they are again entangled therein, and overcome, the latter end is worse with them than the beginning. For it had been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than, after they have known it, to turn from the holy commandment delivered unto them. But it is happened unto them according to the true proverb, The dog is turned to his own vomit again; and the sow that was washed to her wallowing in the mire." (2 Peter 2:20-22.)

"Watch and pray, that ye enter not into temptation: the spirit indeed is willing, but the flesh is weak." (Matt. 26:41.)

"But I keep under my body, and bring it into subjection: lest that by any means, when I have preached to others, I myself should be a castaway. (1 Cor. 9:27.)

As to the possibility of falling from grace, the Bible has oplenty to say, but saying that it is impossible does not appear. See:

Matt. 24:12
Gal. 5:4
Luke 8:13
1 Tim. 4:1;
1Tim. 1:19
Romans 1:21-32
Heb. 6:4-6
John 6:66, 67
2 Peter 2:4
Jude 1:6.

Of those to be saved, the Bible says, "none shall pluck them from my hand," but it does not say that a person who has put his hand to the plough and looks back will remain fit for the kingdom of heaven. Quite the reverse.

An interesting subject, but one that requires a more in depth approach.

M:)

[Wangdoodle]

Mt 24:13 tells us that we must "persevere to the end" in order to be saved. In Rom 11:22 we are warned that they will be cut off if they don't persevere in the kindness of God. Heb 6:4-6 describes people who are sharers in the Holy Spirit, but then fall away from God. 1 Cor 9:27 "I drive my body and train it, for fear that, after having preached to others, I myself should be disqualified."

Who could have more assurance of salvation than St. Paul? Yet he worned us that we too could be "cut off".

[Retrotia]

I think you're keeping yourself prone to worrying, that if you don't consecrate every last deed of the flesh- you might perish anyway. Really need to relax about your salvation and know it is secure. God started the good work in you and will finish it. Now I'm beginning to see why predestination is involved in this question after all. Can a Saved Person become Lost? - ChristianAnswers.Net

[go-ask-mom]

I know several say that salvation can never be lost... but I don't believe that just because some of these people had "alter calls" in the 70's yet have not changed for the better means they are still saved no matter what! Jusy MY own opinion.