[MaggiexMay]

Deleted

[ScottGem]

to answer your question or your assumptions that I have never given up a child you are all wrong.

OK, So you claim to have given a child up for adoption. Sorry, but I found it hard to believe a birth mother going through what you did, would have the attitude you have.

I still have a major problem with your attitude. Because it is so one sided. Not only are you looking at this from the side of the adopted child with little if any consideration for the rights of the birth parent, but you want to compound the birth parents angst over making this decision by placing more angst on them.

You seem to have no understanding (surprisingly for one who has gone through it) of the issues a birth parent faces and why they might want to put the situation behind them. You keep harping on taking responsibility for the mistakes made in conceiving the child. What you don't seem to want to understand is that choosing adoption DID take that responsibility. That the birth mother not only chose to give birth to the child, but also chose to do right by the child in giving the child a home they couldn't. That be making those choices, the birth mother has earned the right to put this behind them. And has earned the right not to have the situation thrown back in their face 20+ years later. How many mothers do you think would give their child up for adoption if they knew that 20+ years later they would have to face that decision again.

And I don't get your harping on birth parents "pointing the fingers at society". I don't see where a birth parent wanting to put their mistakes behind them is doing that.

I stand by my original statement. Your viewpoint is very narrow minded and short sighted. You see only what the child wants and have no consideration for the wants and needs of a birth parent.

[MaggiexMay]

Deleted

[J_9]

I work with the children that we birth mothers placed up for adoption every day.

Very interesting indeed. I LIVE with those children who were placed for adoption. I have 3 in my family. I also have lived with a woman who placed her child up for adoption. Come to think of it, since I am L&D nurse, I have actually had a hand in placing children up for adoption.

I think if you were to spend only one week with these adults then you would see my view point.

I've spent every day for the past 22+ years with these people and I don't see your viewpoint.

[Synnen]

Maggie--I'm betting that your adoption story is less than 5 years old.

I'm ALSO betting that you have an open or semi-open adoption.

You're just a little too optimistic about your adoption story, and a little too dismissive of birthmother pain. We call it the "honeymoon" stage of adoption.

I'm also betting that you've talked to relatively few other birthmothers.

I've worked with birthmothers and been in birthmother support groups for almost 20 years now. I know women who have literally broken down in panic that a child found them after 30+ years---and NO ONE knew they had a child. That woman met with her child, her husband found out, he divorced her. One of her other children decided she couldn't handle having a mother that "lied" about her life and cut her mother out of her life--and her children's lives. This woman lost her husband, her daughter, and three grandchildren to satisfy the CURIOSITY of a child she was PROMISED would never know who she was. Thankfully, this woman was strong enough and had enough faith in her religion to get through it, but she had to relive the pain of her adoption story all over again and THEN lose everything she had because of it.

Adoptees HAVE families. They have family histories, and family stories and a birth story that involves parents that CHOSE them. They have stories about how their parents met, and stories about their childhood. They do not NEED their birthparents to satisfy what is nothing more than idle curiosity.

And seriously--maybe we need to work on society showing adoption as a "rejection" instead of blaming birthmothers for making a responsible choice with their situation.

And by the way--I thought I knew what I was choosing when I signed that line for adoption. What I didn't realize was that there was no way for me to truly understand what I was giving up. How do you explain to someone how moving a first tooth is? How do you make someone TRULY understand that they're giving up EVERYTHING? That essentially their child will "die" so that an infertile couple's child can be "born"? And how do you make someone understand that society will not only NOT support their grief in that loss, but will belittle it and take away any choice they have about later contact because to society, that poor innocent "abandoned" baby's right to whatever the hell they want trumps a birthmother's right to have privacy and peace with her grief.

I agree that birthmothers should have made different choices about sex, but frankly---I've had the pain of the loss of my daughter for 20 years as penance for that choice, thank you very much. I shouldn't have to pay MORE if I don't want to just because you think adoptees should get more than their medical information as part of their "story". As I said before--they already HAVE a story. They just want their curiosity satisfied.

[MaggiexMay]

Deleted

[JudyKayTee]

go and be angry I can see it in your words and the way you type. If I am thinking different then you then I must be lying and have not given up a child, if I am seeing another side of things (birth Childs side) I must have given my child up in last 5 years .... you are all set in your minds, spirit, hart, and your soles will never heal with that attitude you are betting and ASSUMING about my adoption and well you know what? it was more then 5 years ago I am 50 now so it was 32 years ago...
{insults removed} Do we have to be punished everyday after it no! but taking responsibilities for it other then signing the piece of paper that we were told and hoping would make things right again.

I can see I certainly stirred things up and believe it or not it was not my indention I thought I would have a say and then perhaps let the poster see another side {insults removed}

{Insults removed}

I was intent on what you had to say - right up until the "go to HE!!" part. You think you see anger in other people's words? Maybe you should look into your own "hart" and "sole." You see anger in the way a person types? I think that's pushing things.

Odd to comment on what "the church" told you to do and not to do and then tell people where to go, all in the same post.

At any rate - you just lost an audience and, no, I've never had children so I was interested in both sides of the discussion.

Not any more.

[MaggiexMay]

Deleted

[Synnen]

I had my child in 92 and had an open adoption.

And seriously---4-5 other women? I've worked with over 200 women from all walks and varied adoption stories. Most--like myself--WANT contact. Many have happy reunion stories.

But several had their lives ripped apart by an adoptee that felt he or she had the RIGHT to invade their privacy. And I've personally talked to several that attempted suicide. 3 of those women were successful.

Birthparents repay ANY obligation they have to their children when they give them to loving parents and provide medical background. THAT is where OBLIGATION ends. After that, anything is a GIFT that needs to be freely given.

In other words: adoptees have no RIGHTS to invade the privacy of their biological families.

Sorry for spelling/grammar. Fussy baby so I'm typing one handed

[ScottGem]

I have bent over backwards to give you the voice you crave. But you refuse to accept the rules of this site. Any further attempts on your part to personally attack other members will be dealt with more harshly.

No one is saying you are lying, but we do have a hard time given our experience, to understand your attitude, especially with the experience you cite. I am usually not one to comment on typos or spelling errors, but "hart and soles" is odd spelling for a "firm believer in Christ".

It is not a matter of us being "set in our minds" but rather a matter of the experience we have had that has formed our positions.

You have made an argument that adoptees are entitled to know about their families and that birth parents should accept their responsibility. Frankly, I think you have negated your stand by the attitude you display, but I'll let others judge that for themselves.


But the bottom line here is no one should be permitted to invade another person's privacy. And people are entitled to their privacy whether you think they should or not.

[JudyKayTee]

LOL... funny again not reading what I posted as a teenager I wanted say go to HE!!.... And I am glad you posted but I am far from being angry if you did read all my posts I am in a very calm place within my hart and sole.
But then again you only see and read it the way you want to read it. Has your church leader never said you will be sent to he!! I am a firm believer in Christ and I do believe that if we did as our parents, school and the church told us to do and live our lifes then we would be talking differently.
I never asked for an audience so read if you like be my guest but was just posting my view points and in hope to help the poster out see the other side of things. You know as a matter of fact there was a topic at church not long ago that was "there are three sides to every story. There side, your side, and the right side. I do believe this might be one of those. With everything there are so many different point a views.

I don't get into religious discussions so your church and your Christ and your H*ll are exactly that - yours. I feel no need to explain what my "Church leader" has or hasn't said. That's for another Board.

Unfortunately, when you post on a public board you get an audience, whether you intend to have one.

I also found the "we gave them to another family ..." language to be somewhat offensive. I'll leave it up to others to ponder whether that phrase is appropriate. Gave?

Your spelling and lack of punctuation (for starters) cause me to wonder just what it is that you do with/for the people you are discussing. Social worker? Nurse? Something else?

I don't see any of this discussion helping the OP - who apparently has wandered off. In fact, she posted once - in March.

Wonder if this is a topic for a discussion board - ?

[JudyKayTee]

You have NO idea what my life as a birthmother has been like since I chose adoption for my child. You have no idea what kind of pain I went through and how much society has hurt me with ideas a lot like yours. Would it have been better for me to have kept my child and lived off of welfare? I KNEW the father would walk away, and that I'd get no support for him.

The sincerity always touches me deeply. I can reach inside myself and feel the pain of making the adoption/no adoption decision.

Great sharing - I am always touched.

[MaggiexMay]

{Argumentative post removed-<>}

[JudyKayTee]

{Argumentative post removed-<>}.

Here is my VERY specific comment - read the AHMD rules. This is not a blog, this is not a discussion forum This is a Q&A forum.

Your English ebbs and flows - I'm not sure you are one person doing all the writing. Some posts are in almost perfect English. Others - and this one is an example - have error after error. Seems strange to me.

So - what exactly do you do for and with people that gives you experience in this area? You never answered me.

And AGAIN "we" did NOT go through a similar history. PLEASE don't even attempt to speak for me.

[JudyKayTee]

deleted

Before you delete what you've said make sure no one has quoted you. So here's your deleted post in all its glory (aren't you a little old to be playing games on the Internet?":

"go and be angry I can see it in your words and the way you type. If I am thinking different then you then I must be lying and have not given up a child, if I am seeing another side of things (birth Childs side) I must have given my child up in last 5 years .... you are all set in your minds, spirit, hart, and your soles will never heal with that attitude you are betting and ASSUMING about my adoption and well you know what? it was more then 5 years ago I am 50 now so it was 32 years ago...
{insults removed} Do we have to be punished everyday after it no! but taking responsibilities for it other then signing the piece of paper that we were told and hoping would make things right again.

I can see I certainly stirred things up and believe it or not it was not my indention I thought I would have a say and then perhaps let the poster see another side {insults removed}"

{Insults removed}

AND THEN THERE'S:

"why is everyone mad at the children (that are now adults) they were not asked to be born to a woman that was either to young, not married, in a bad situation.... if anyone has behaved badly it is the birth mothers. If they had made better choices for themselves all those years ago and either waited to have sex until they were married, or waited to have sex until they were in a better situation. Again I think that birth mothers made bad choices back then and the children placed up for adoption with no say in the matter are the ones to pay the price. Unless it was rape and I do feel very badly for those birth mothers that has had that happened to but unless it was rape then the birth children should be given information if they would like."

AND:

"I work with the children that we birth mothers placed up for adoption every day."

AND:

"this is not a dicussion board this is a board that if you agree then we speak nice if we don't agree then re-report. I was called a lier but nothing is done with those words. When I miss type and place words in a different value then another then I am slamed for that. English is not my first language and it happens within the means of words...but all good I am a tough cookie.
Report all you like because I did think posting my point a view may help another person. But you are all more narrow minded then I thought people with the same history could ever be. That is sad to think that we all went through similar history."

AND:

"to answer your question or your assumptions that I have never given up a child you are all wrong."

I'm guessing they were deleted because the writing style varied so much and you are 2 people with 1 name?

At any rate, enough of what you posted remains for others to read.

[ScottGem]

I warned you before about violating our rules. You apparently don't want to listen. And worse your deleting previous posts was an unethical ploy.

I want to add one more point here, because I detest hypocrisy. You came on here and posted a response not just disagreeing with the position of several members here, but attacking that position and being very critical of birth mothers who want to preserve their right to privacy. But when the members disagreed with YOUR position you didn't like that much and attacked and insulted us. Even though we made sure you got the right to express yourself despite violating this site's rules. What you fail to understand is that this is a 2 way street. If you want to express your opinions you have to allow others their opinions. If you can't stand the heat get out of the kitchen as they say.

I'm closing this thread as there seems to be no further value in continuing.