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mel777 · Sep 25, 2011, 04:49 PM

I live in a town house and one of my neighbors lives 3 houses from me. Our properties don't have fences and this is the issue: My husband and the guy (don't even know his name) got into an argument over the fact that my small dog sometimes goes to do his business on our deck. Although we always cleaned it, he called the SPCA which they did nothing because they saw nothing wrong. When they got into this thing, my husband asked this guy to please take his Grate dane away from out property to do his business. It stopped for a little but then, I started to see them all the time except now, they would go right in front of me look at me laugh etc. I called the police and they said to try to talk to them. Well I did. They continue to do it. I feel this is totally against the law, I feel, they are harassing me in so many ways. I just got into them again. My husband says let it go. I say no way. They are making me feel like a little kid being bullied. What do you guys think?

lilpoppa · Sep 25, 2011, 05:01 PM

I suggest if he lets his dog do its business on your yard and doesn't pick up after it, simply scoop up the dog pile and place it on his porch. You mentioned you live in a townhome, I would recommend you take your problem up with the homeowners association. Document everythng in case your neibor escalates the situation. If you feel threatened by the man you may be able to get a restraining order against him. Hope this help a little, we've all had a problem neibor at one point, and its never fun, good luck

ScottGem · Sep 25, 2011, 05:29 PM

First, are the yards common areas or personal property? Second, is this a property under the auspices of a Home Owner's Association? Third, are there local ordinances about cleaning up (pooper scooper laws)?

Until we know the answers to these questions, its hard to help.

mel777 · Sep 25, 2011, 05:58 PM

ScottGem, The answer to your Q'a are yes, yes, and yes. They thing is not so much the fact that the dog gos in my yard. The thing is that they are getting to the point that they come all the way up to my deck, stand there and laugh as they look at me. To me it's their way of telling me... "What are you going to do about it". I told to the guy and asked him to please don't go through my property I told him I will file a formal complaint... he laughed. I also told him that I felt his behavior was intimidating and I didn't want have any more issues... he laughed.
I will not pick up after his dog number one. That dog is a horse. Number two, I do not go through his property. I do not bring my dog to do his business at his property and I just do not want them coming near my place. Our yards are huge and we have lots of trees behind each property. The only reason he does it I'm sure it's to get to me and show me that he doesn't care what I think or say. I will not let anyone make me feel inferior nor harass in my own home. The association is a joke, he is probably the president of it.

ScottGem · Sep 25, 2011, 06:18 PM

The first question I asked was not a yes/no question. So a Yes answer doesn't cover it. If the yards are common property then he can use them. If they are private property, get a surveillance camera. Get film him coming onto your yard and allowing his dog to go without picking up. Then go to the HOA and present proof that he is violating trespassing and pooper scooper laws. If the HOA doesn't do anything then take it to the police.

Fr_Chuck · Sep 25, 2011, 06:25 PM

If the yards are not common yards, he can not legally come into your yard, you have him issues a criminal tresspass warning not to come back into your yard, if he does, he can be arrested.

If the dog is doing the business along the sidewalk, in what is normally city right of way, then city laws on picking up the poop will apply.

mel777 · Sep 25, 2011, 06:36 PM

They are all personal areas. Just the fact I don't have a fence it's my property.

mel777 · Sep 25, 2011, 06:42 PM

Thank you all for your opinion. I feel that I shouldn't let it go, it can only get worst.

ScottGem · Sep 25, 2011, 06:45 PM

I assume the HOA has a prohibition against putting up fences. If there isn't maybe a fence is the answer.

AK lawyer · Sep 26, 2011, 07:42 AM

This is clearly a criminal trespass situation.

If the police refuse to do anything about that, ask them if they will do their job if you were to shoot the Great Dane. I suspect they would in that case.

twinkiedooter · Sep 26, 2011, 06:02 PM

It can be a trespass situation only if there is a fence involved. Went through something similar and was told if the person went onto my property by going over my fence after I posed a No Trespassing sign I would be covered and the person could be arrested accordingly.

Don't shoot the dog as you could be held on charges for discharging of a firearm in the city limits, and the owner could sue for destruction of his personal property (the dog).

ScottGem · Sep 26, 2011, 06:19 PM

Originally Posted by twinkiedooter

It can be a trespass situation only if there is a fence involved.

Not accurate. If there are clear property boundaries and the neighbor has been warned and trespassing can be proven, then yes there can be charges pressed.

twinkiedooter · Sep 26, 2011, 06:29 PM

What does the homeowner's association say about this nuisance neighbor's dog? Do you have leash laws where you live? If the animal is off the leash take photos and show to HOA. The only way clear property boundaries are determined is by a fence period and by clearly posting No Trespassing signs. No real delineation in the grass is meaningless.

Contact your local police department and ask them if you had a fence with clearly posted No Trespassing signs would this enable you to call the cops and have the neighbor arrested for trespassing onto your property with his dog. You did not give your location for us to be able to do any research on this problem,

ScottGem · Sep 26, 2011, 06:39 PM

You may be talking from a single experience but its not accurate. While the absence of fences may make proving trespassing harder it doesn't make it impossible. Also No Trespassing signs are not necessary in a situation like this with clear private property.

twinkiedooter · Sep 26, 2011, 08:05 PM

Not knowing the OP's location here is an excellent link to what several states offer as far as trespassing laws. Hopefully your state is listed.

Trespassing: Encyclopedia of Everyday Law

In pertinent part...

Traditionally, for either type of trespass, some level of intent is required. Thus, the trespasser must not simply unwittingly traverse another's land but must knowingly go onto the property without permission. Knowledge may be inferred when the owner tells the trespasser not to go on the land, when the land is fenced, or when a "no trespassing" sign in posted. A trespasser would probably not be prosecuted if the land was open, the trespasser's conduct did not substantially interfere with the owner's use of the property, and the trespasser left immediately on request

AK lawyer · Sep 26, 2011, 09:08 PM

Originally Posted by twinkiedooter

...
In pertinent part......

Traditionally, for either type of trespass, some level of intent is required. Thus, the trespasser must not simply unwittingly traverse another's land but must knowingly go onto the property without permission. Knowledge may be inferred when the owner tells the trespasser not to go on the land, when the land is fenced, or when a "no trespassing" sign in posted. A trespasser would probably not be prosecuted if the land was open, the trespasser's conduct did not substantially interfere with the owner's use of the property, and the trespasser left immediately on request

This quote does not bolster your position that the land has to be fenced. You bolded text in one way; I would bold it differently:

"Traditionally, for either type of trespass, some level of intent is required. Thus, the trespasser must not simply unwittingly traverse another's land but must knowingly go onto the property without permission. Knowledge may be inferred when the owner tells the trespasser not to go on the land, when the land is fenced, or when a "no trespassing" sign in posted. A trespasser would probably not be prosecuted if the land was open, the trespasser's conduct did not substantially interfere with the owner's use of the property, and the trespasser left immediately on request."

Read this way, it is clear that the "knowing" requirement is satisfied if one of the three conditions is satisfied. In this case, the OP has told the neighbor not to go on her land, which is the first of the three alternate conditions. Therefore fencing is not required.

The next quoted sentence is applied in a different way because it contains an "and" not an "or". The trespasser probably wouldn't be prosecuted if all three conditions apply. In OP's case, although the land is open, the neighbor does not leave immediately upon request and, in fact, returns repeatedly knowing that he and his dog are not welcome.

ScottGem · Sep 27, 2011, 03:08 AM

Originally Posted by twinkiedooter

Not knowing the OP's location here is an excellent link to what several states offer as far as trespassing laws. Hopefully your state is listed.

Trespassing: Encyclopedia of Everyday Law

In pertinent part......

Traditionally, for either type of trespass, some level of intent is required. Thus, the trespasser must not simply unwittingly traverse another's land but must knowingly go onto the property without permission. Knowledge may be inferred when the owner tells the trespasser not to go on the land, when the land is fenced, or when a "no trespassing" sign in posted. A trespasser would probably not be prosecuted if the land was open, the trespasser's conduct did not substantially interfere with the owner's use of the property, and the trespasser left immediately on request

Thank you for providing that link to prove my point. And thank you to AK for beating me to correctly interpreting the information. Hopefully the OP will be able to make use of this information in resolving the situation.

twinkiedooter · Sep 27, 2011, 09:40 AM

Since we don't know location of OP we don't know which version would be applicable. The no fence get off my property or the fenced get arrested. Most times the local cops want to take the easy way out if they can wiggle out of not arresting somebody due to a technicality, and the fence part may just be the technicality they need. To be 100% effective the fence with posted signs is the way to go. Then the cops can do their duty.

ScottGem · Sep 27, 2011, 09:49 AM

In a case such as this, the homeowner can press charges forcing the police to react. While I agree the police aren't going to get excited over a trespassing case, the homeowner can file charges.

It is highly unusual for a residential area to have no trespassing signs. Private property in such areas is implied and understood.

Fr_Chuck · Sep 27, 2011, 10:23 AM

In my experience as a police officer in the past, while I can only talk about Georgia law, ( or Federal property rules)

Even homes or apartments areas, even if not fenced the person will have to be warned first, normally this will be the police doing a warning and making a report of that warning.

After that if they are on that property again, criminal tresspass can also be pressed, If the officer who responds does not want to do anything, the property owner can still take it to court to press charges

I have no idea why you wish to argue a fence, which has nothing to do with it in any area where I have had police authority