[NeedKarma]

Interesting read:

HowStuffWorks "10 Great Moments in Corporate Malfeasance"

[paraclete]

Interesting read:

Indeed, it is what so endears capitalism as the system of choice.

[tomder55]

So how hard would it be to come up with examples of socialism's "malfeasance" ?

Let's start with mass murder conservatively estimated near 100million people or more .

[NeedKarma]

Why do you feel the need to defend these people?

[tomder55]

Did I defend them ? Answer no . I was responding to clete's observation that this was a result of 'capitalism '... an absolutely unfounded linkage.

[NeedKarma]

Nope it isn't capitalism, it's unchecked greed. Basically a large corporation is not out for your well-being... not at all.

[tomder55]

That is why I favor the use of bankruptsy instead of bailouts . That is why I favor the limitted use of regulations which has an unintended consequence of industry consolidation . That is why I oppose this use of corporate /government cooperatives that are being set up by the current group of leaders which more resembles merchantilism than capitalism.

[NeedKarma]

that is why I favor the use of bankruptsy instead of bailouts .

How would that have solved any of the examples in the link? None of those companies were bailed out. They ran roughshod over investors, consumers and the local populace.

[tomder55]

So did the companies that were bailed out... and we rewarded them.

[NeedKarma]

Well the US did, that's correct.

[tomder55]

I'll go case by case then :

1. Enron... an example of gvt business cooperative . They were intimately involved in the ground floor of the carbon trading scam. Many of their scam trades were related to it.
The Briefing Room: Investigate Oct 05, The Kyoto Conspiracy

2. Roche .It took years of development and an upfront investment of $600 million for Roche to develop Fuzeon . Did the South Korean government do it ? No . It's very nice that they can place a price on a product they desire but had nothing to do with producing .it's also very easy for the people who are not putting up the money and risk to determine what a reasonable return on their investment should be.

3. The Haliburton case appears to be a breach of contract and should be treated as such

4.The United Fruits case is an example of the merchantile system I already came out against.

5.The WellPoint case is in contention . No comment yet.

6.The Ford case is ancient and irrelevant to today's world .

7. anyone who reads my comments here knows that I am not a fan of Goldman Sachs .Again,an example of merchatilism or what is generally mistakenly called today "crony capitalism" .

8. Can't comment too much on Yaguarete Pora S.A. . Best guess is that their actions were approved by some government .

9.The Walmart case is an example of the exploitation that happens when we encourge illegal immigration.

10. Union Carbide should be forced to address their responsibilities regarding Bhopal .

11. IBM ? Yes there was lots of cooperation with the National Socialists.

But there are also more recent examples like the UN Oil for Food Scandal where sanctions were violated by corporation and government alike .The sanctions would've brought down the Hussein regime if they had been faithfully applied .

Instead ;the violations strengthed the Saddam regime and guaranteed an end to a peaceful resolution of Saddam's violatons .

[excon]

Hello again, my brothers...

You're both right, and wrong too... This is a teachable moment. We can ALL walk away from this question, linked arm in arm, singing cooom bi you...

Socialism didn't kill anybody. That's an economic system... You're a socialist now. We ALL are. Tyranny kills people. Don't think capitalism kills people?? China is now VERY capitalistic and VERY tyrannical...

Corporations aren't inherently bad. They actually do GOOD. I know. I own one. They just need some ground rules. Every game needs rules.

Certainly, way back in the beginning, the playing field WAS inherently fair. Libertarianism reigned. There were NO rules.. That was good. NOBODY had an advantage. That's the way capitalism is designed to work, and it DID work that way. If somebody produced a shoddy product or service, he'd go DOWN...

But then, somewhere along the way, some businessman went to his local politician, and asked him to make a law that BENEFITED him. And, because the politician needed some bread to win re-election, he did the bidding of the deep pocketed businessman, and gave him an ADVANTAGE in the marketplace.

That happened, and is STILL happening. As a natural consequence, shoddy products and shoddy companies are being protected. So SOMEBODY needs to make laws that return the playing field to where it was. Somebody needs to stand up for the consumer. But, businessmen LIKE their advantage, and they're not going to give it up. THAT isn't good for us...

Now, a-one, and a-two, and a-three - cooooom byyyyyyy you...

excon

[speechlesstx]

If the first lady is right, an evil Canadian company is a threat to our national security as the world's largest producer of french fries. That is corporate malfeasance of the highest degree, making the world fat.

[tomder55]

China is now VERY capitalistic and VERY tyrannical...


Certainly, way back in the beginning, the playing field WAS inherently fair. Libertarianism reigned. There were NO rules.. That was good. NOBODY had an advantage. That's the way capitalism is designed to work, and it DID work that way. If somebody produced a shoddy product or service, he'd go DOWN...

If 'he'd go down' means that occasionally the people would take the law in their own hands and punish him ,you are correct. Tar and feathers worked well.

China is far from a model capitalist country . Every single business has a relationship with some level of government and operates at the whim of that government. They are also protectionist which makes them an example of the merchatilism I was speaking of. They are however a good example of those good old days you speak of .

Back in the no rules days there were travelling sales people peddling poison. Rules were necessary and proper to prevent that travelling sales person from harming people... otherwise the poison was peddled as a miracle cure.When the peddler was caught he was either subject to vigilate justice ;or moved his business to the next town over the horizon.

Back in the bad old days corporations were able to corner the market by taking advantage of their strength and vertically and horizontally controlling the market stifling competition. Anti-trust laws were needed to level the field .

The problem is not regulations .It is that regulations often have unintended consequences that are worse than what they are designed to prevent.

[NeedKarma]

If the first lady is right, an evil Canadian company is a threat to our national security as the world's largest producer of french fries. That is corporate malfeasance of the highest degree, making the world fat.

You're saying that making french fries is worse than the Bhopal disaster. That's the most ignorant thing I have ever read on this website... ever.

[speechlesstx]

You're saying that making french fries is worse than the Bhopal disaster. That's the most ignorant thing I have ever read on this website....ever.

So you were deprived of the sarcasm gene?

[NeedKarma]

So you were deprived of the sarcasm gene?

That's your standard response whenever you get called on an inane posting, it's getting old and tired and frankly I don't believe it anymore.

[tomder55]

We need to get the link color changed to bold purple .

[speechlesstx]

we need to get the link color changed to bold purple .

I'll try and make it a point to note whenever sarcasm is employed for those deprived of the gene.

[NeedKarma]

i'll try and make it a point to note whenever sarcasm is employed for those deprived of the gene.

Maybe that's the way Jesus made us.
This is cool, we can say any stupid thing we want and afterward say it was sarcasm - how liberating.