[blmtsi]

I began working for a temp agency more than 6 months ago and have been in the same position since. I was interviewed by the shift managers who both told me that they wanted me to be hired onto the company's work force after 1 month. I openly told the managers that I had a felony conviction, and this did not bother them; I was told to fill out the application. After filing out the application I waited about 3 weeks then asked about my interview with human resources, and the response was, "oh she didn't interview you yet." The next week I waited after work for the human resources director to come in. When I approached her to ask about getting an interview the first thing that I was told was "we do not discriminate agaisnt people with felony records." I was also informed that "the company is looking for more qualified canidates." I have continued to work for the company through a temp agency and have seen many other people come and go. Each time there is an opening I file a new application, but continue to receive rejection letters. I am not late, I do not call off, I work just as hard if not harder than everyone else around me, but continue to be rejected for the job that I am more than qualified to hold. I have recently begun asking questions again and each time the shift managers tell me to ask the HR director, when I spoke with her yesterday she told me that the shift managers have never filled out request forms for me to be hired, although they tell me that they have. Last night while at work an employee who has a "special friendship" with the boss asked him why I am not being hired and he told her that it's because I have a felony, but they can't tell me this directly because it would be discrimination. Do I have grounds to file a law suite, and if so should I first contact the ACLU, Pennsylvania Human Rights Commission, EEOC, or should I search for a private attorney that will work the case with no money up front?

The EEOC website states the following: "There is no Federal law that clearly prohibits an employer from asking about arrest and conviction records. However, using such records as an absolute measure to prevent an individual from being hired could limit the employment opportunities of some protected groups and thus cannot be used in this way.

Since an arrest alone does not necessarily mean that an applicant has committed a crime the employer should not assume that the applicant committed the offense. Instead, the employer should allow him or her the opportunity to explain the circumstances of the arrest(s) and should make a reasonable effort to determine whether the explanation is reliable.

Even if the employer believes that the applicant did engage in the conduct for which he or she was arrested that information should prevent him or her from employment only to the extent that it is evident that the applicant cannot be trusted to perform the duties of the position when: considering the nature of the job, the nature and seriousness of the offense, and the length of time since it occurred. This is also true for a conviction."

[excon]

can I file suite because I'm being discriminated for a felony conviction?

Hello b:

No. Even if your version of events is absolutely accurate, and I don't doubt that it is, felons are NOT a protected class of people who, by LAW, cannot be discriminated against. Consequently, they aren't violating any laws.

excon

[twinkiedooter]

Since you are technically an employee of the temporary agency you can work at that company but as far as them hiring you to directly work as their employee, then no, you won't qualify to work for that company. The company won't hire felons but since you are a temporary employee they can skate around the felon issue and keep you employed there.

The more you keep asking the less likely I see you still working for them in the future.

Felons are not in any way a class of minority that can be discriminated against such as race, religion, etc.

Most factories don't hire felons and some even insist that the temp agencies don't send any felons to work temp jobs for them either. Be happy that the company you are temping at even lets you work temp there.

[excon]

Hello nail:

We allow rookies here all the time... For SURE, I ain't no lawyer.. But, if you're going to give legal advice, it better be CORRECT legal advice or we'll call you on it.

excon

[Fr_Chuck]

NailTech, on the legal boards, you are dealing with many experts who have all sorts of legal training. Excon is right, if you post a answer here, expect it to be questioned, or even attacked if it is a poor answer, new poster, old poster does not matter, one word wrong can cause a 4 page discussion over the proper phrase or word.

[excon]

"allow" is this your website? If you were so knowledgable on the area you wouldn't have asked the question.

Hello again, N:

No, it's not mine... And, of course, I don't mean "allow" in the RULES sense.. I mean "allow" in the correct legal advice sense. Because, if you give BAD legal advice, EVERYBODY will come down on you like a ton of bricks.

So, when I say allow, You're not going to want to be around after we take you down a few pegs. It was like I said. We WELCOME rookies here, but give good advice.

I have NO idea what your last sentence said.

excon

[NailTech]

NailTech, on the legal boards, you are dealing with many experts who have all sorts of legal training. Excon who you insulted ( I have deleted the post) has years of experience from many sides of the legal system.
And he is right, if you post a answer here, expect it to be questioned, or even attacked if it is a poor answer, new poster, old poster does not matter, one word wrong can cause a 4 page discussion over the proper phrase or word.

I have a felony and since I do I felt that I could answer the question. Community rules or not.

[excon]

I have a felony and since I do I felt that I could answer the question. Community rules or not.

Hello again, Nail:

That's FINE. Just make sure your answer is CORRECT.. That's the ONLY criteria.

excon

[bkdaniels]

The above user was correct, Felons are NOT a protected class of people... however, an employer CANNOT discriminate against a felon, solely upon that fact. State and Federal discrimination laws has implemented a specific process for employers to go through when a background check resulted in a hiring decision against an applicant with a felony. If that employer has not followed this procedure, you may then have a valid legal suit against them.

The only way an employer can use a felony conviction against an applicant is by showing how that felony conviction relates to the position and they must prove how that conviction is directly affected by that felony conviction. This is the one of the "legal loopholes" employers operate within. They fell that they can turn you down and in the event of a lawsuit, simply say, "A felony conviction directly affects that position." Your challenge is to prove other wise. Good luck with that...

The process requires for the company to supply you with the name of the agency in which they used to conduct their background check. They are supposed to allow you a chance to dispute the information on that report, explain the conviction, and 30 days to allow the agency to correct any false information. The problem, however, this is too much for a company to go through. It is easier for them to go to another job candidate. In many cases, I have seen them completely avoid mentioning any reason for not hiring. That is probably the reason the lady acted as if she didn't know you wasn't called.

Employers have a thin line to walk when it comes to discrimination. And, they know it! This is why the best thing for them to do is avoid the situation altogether. For example, before an applicant walks into an office, how difficult would it be for the employer to conduct a check prior to them arriving? The law requires the employer to get consent, first, but what's going to stop them if they do? Luckily, new law are being established to hep felons escape the "civil death," or collateral consequences that follows a felony conviction.

Also, keep in mind, that most of the practices regarding felons are based on personal understanding of the laws and not necessarily the company. For instance, the person may believe no felons can be hired when in all actually, only those within a certain period. For this reason, I would recommend that you contact corporate headquarters of the company to start your grievance process.

Oftentimes, they remain in the dark and do not know about certain practices going on in certain locations. Corporate offices are more conscious of lawsuits than local branches. You may have a better chance getting them to reverse a decision.

The most important thing as a felon seeking employment is to get the interview. This is similar to one law a few states have enacted entitled, Ban the Box. This law will require employers to remove the box asking if an applicant has been convicted of a crime prior to a certain point in the hiring process. The concept is: A felon is more likely to get a job once the employer knows him/her rather than just seeing his/her name on a piece of paper.

With my experience with the law and as a person, I have learned that anytime you feel you have been treated unfairly, then you probably have. If you think you have been wrongly discriminated against, you should contact the FTC (Federal Trade Commission and file a complaint. They have Attorney's specializing in these cases who will evaluate your case. This will also keep the FTC informed about current practices for future actions.

[JudyKayTee]

I do not know your education or experience - I'm an investigator and it is my experience that the majority of people who feel they have been discriminated against are, in fact, incorrect.

Where has "ban the box" been passed? I know it's a topic of discussion but am not aware it's in effect anywhere. I'd be interested because I work on discrimination cases.

I am in NY - if you are not hired you do NOT have the "right" to know why. Maybe it's because of a criminal record; maybe it's something else.

These cases are next to impossible because, for example, you (without a criminal record) and I (with a criminal record) would have to have exactly the same education, experience, background in order for me to win a discrimination action were you to be hired instead of me.

Discrimination is not as blatant as many people believe. I've seen employers who would not hire women with children. It's been cloaked in many ways, but that's the policy... and it's this side of impossible to prove.

I do not believe the FTC handles employment discrimination matters.

If a background check is given as the reason for the "no hire," yes, the potential employee can ask for the name of the company, the report and can correct any misinformation. It has been my experience that in the majority of these matters when felons are not hired there is no background check. Employment is denied based on the employee's disclosure of the criminal record. Of course, if the felon claims no record and a background check uncovers one, then it's a different story. In that case employment is denied based on the "lie."

I have no idea what this means - "For instance, the person may believe no felons can be hired when in all actually, only those within a certain period of time."

Could you post your sources for the FTC and "ban the box" statements?

[bkdaniels]

Could you post your sources for the FTC and "ban the box" statements?[/QUOTE]

Thank you for your soft tone. Other's would have been rude, claiming "You're Incorrect!" Nevertheless, here are the answers to your concerns.

First, the source to the FTC's Federal Sector Employment Discrimination Complaint Process. You can view that by clicking here:
No Fear - Rights and Remedies Against Discrimination and Other Prohibited Practices

My understanding is they have Attorney's who specializes in these issues and will forward the complaint to them to investigate further. Secondly, it is also a good idea to file a complaint because FTC likes to stay informed of recent practices and can use this information to identify current discriminatory tactics. Now, as for the Ban The Box discussion.

Here is a link listing the states who have adopted Ban The Box or introduced it or other areas to lessen collateral consequences of the convicted felon, such as a Federal Opt Out, which allows certain felons opportunity to receive Federal benefits. This is a PDF document, but I will leave a html link, too.

I do not know your education or experience - I'm an investigator and it is my experience that the majority of people who feel they have been discriminated against are, in fact, incorrect.

Employers have to walk a thin line. Usually, before they terminate an employee they discuss this issue with their attorney and he or she advises them on how to terminate that employee to stay within that legal line. If that employer does not speak with an Attorney, that does not mean they are not terminating an employee using a "standard process" on in which works well against discrimination and wrongful termination. Therefore, it is always good to file a complaint when an employee feel he or she has been wronged. Sometimes, these violations fall under certain civil rights issues, such a due process which is required by some government employers.

There may be litigation issues with the so-called "at will" states. The law allows an employer to terminate an employee "at will" (without reason), but not "as will." There are still civil rights issues for an employer to address.

You are right, Ban the Box have not been passed in certain states, but changes are yet to come, including Federal. A person can still argue against "civil death" as being cruel and unusual punishment or that it violates their right to work, among other issues. By the fact that the courts are at least looking at the issue, there is a good chance their case will be considered.

Again, you are correct. These cases are next to impossible because new laws against discrimination only encourage racists to become more clever in the way they discriminate. This is why several issues are classified as discrimination because of its link to certain individuals from certain socioeconomic status or geographical area. For this reason, divisions of local government must become more familiar with recent; contemporary trends of discrimination.

Finally, the statement "For instance, the person may believe no felons can be hired when in all actually, only those within a certain period of time" just say's that many managers or others in charge of hiring, may allow personal misunderstanding or opinions influence their decision to hire a felon or not. Sometimes, this can come in the way of a real or a perceived liability. Other times, it can be a strong opinion against a felon, such as they may believe once a felon, always a felon. In either way, these opinions can be discriminative. And although the corporation follows federal policy, the applicant's application never reach the corporate office.

This is a very touchy subject. I was gunned down by an ex-con who had a gun and wasn't supposed too. So, when I talk about a felon being able to seek employment, I also become angry and wish the guy would just die. I even dhow my disgust and hope that he never gets a good job, vote, or a permit to carry a weapon. So, I understand where employers come from. That's why I believe sufficient time in between the offense would offer a felon the greatest chance to rehabilitate his or her life.

Ban the Box will offer little help. What needs to be banned is these companies offering these databases to companies allowing them to do unlimited background checks. There is no restriction on how far they can go back or how ofter a background can be checked. So, even if your state has a 7 years rule for employment background, an employer can still search beyond that time and not even admit it. This would be the worst form of discrimination. It is, however, a practice that the Federal court needs to recognize.



Hope this answers your question!

[JudyKayTee]

Much of this has turned into a discussion, not legal advice, and probably should be in one of the discussion forums. Please re-read what you've said about the
FTC. There IS a procedure for FTC hiring complaints. This does not pertain to anything else. The Federal
Trade Commission does not handle employment discrimination claims outside of the FTC.

Very interesting info on "ban the box." Great research. I'm sure you read it. I doubt it is as helpful as it was meant to be. Yes, it will take away any discrimination where applicants do not have a background search done. It will help no one if a background check is done and the employer does not wish to hire someone with a criminal background. As I said, discrimination takes many forms, many excuses, very difficult to prove.

Again, good subject for discussion. Likewise, I enjoy our exchanges. We may not agree but you are always well "spoken," have your facts lined up (great research and no "I think so and so it is" statements), open to comments, you don't take a difference of opinion personally.