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    Geoff5's Avatar
    Geoff5 Posts: 10, Reputation: 1
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    #1

    Sep 17, 2010, 10:30 AM
    Religion or not religion. That is the big Q
    Personally, I think an all seeing , all powerful, all knowing, invisible god of any religion has finnaly been recognised by many people for what it truly is. An invention of man with all his insecurities, the hope that his god will look after him in times of trouble. Well its time to wake up and I do believe modern man is starting to do so. Of course theire are many religions and islam probably the faster growing, but its only growing because of peoples insecurities and the need to believe in something greater than themselves.

    I think that if and when mankind starts to believe in themselves and their neibours a bit more, religion may go the way of the dodo, as it rightly should. Then we will be free of all its various shackles and doctrines, not to mention religious wars. Anyway, I`m a pagan. Any comments and responses welcomed. Oh, and it was the Christian faith that practically butchered the pagans in the past for how they lived and then stole most of the pagan festivals and icorperated them into Christian ones making them their own.
    Synnen's Avatar
    Synnen Posts: 7,927, Reputation: 2443
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    #2

    Sep 17, 2010, 10:38 AM

    You are NOT a pagan.

    You are an atheist.

    Pagans believe in some form of god or goddess--not in nothingness made up by man.

    Please don't associate yourself as a part of MY religion without losing your bigoted attitude.
    spitvenom's Avatar
    spitvenom Posts: 1,266, Reputation: 373
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    #3

    Sep 17, 2010, 10:40 AM
    Quote Originally Posted by Synnen View Post
    You are NOT a pagan.

    You are an atheist.

    Pagans believe in some form of god or goddess--not in nothingness made up by man.
    I was thinking the same thing. I think we have a little trolling going on here.
    Catsmine's Avatar
    Catsmine Posts: 3,826, Reputation: 739
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    #4

    Sep 17, 2010, 10:48 AM

    Please download spellcheck.

    Which pagans were you referring to, specifically? Druids, Celts, and Asatru were plagiarized by the Roman Christian Church, true, but Zoroastrians were pretty much ignored along with the other "oriental" systems. Byzantine Christians pretty much went their own way all along if memory serves.
    Wondergirl's Avatar
    Wondergirl Posts: 39,354, Reputation: 5431
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    #5

    Sep 17, 2010, 11:00 AM

    Without religion, many people are hard-pressed to consider anyone other than themselves. Religion teaches a person to believe in and love himself and his neighbors.

    And yes, the word "troll" popped into my mind by the time I got to the OP's third sentence.
    Kitkat22's Avatar
    Kitkat22 Posts: 6,302, Reputation: 1191
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    #6

    Sep 17, 2010, 01:08 PM

    I think you and your comments are hilarious. Everybody believes in something. I did get a good laugh... from your post and I'm a
    Baptist. Thanks for the ridiculous
    Post.
    ScottGem's Avatar
    ScottGem Posts: 64,966, Reputation: 6056
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    #7

    Sep 17, 2010, 01:19 PM

    I actually agree with you to some extent. I do not believe in organized religion. I do believe that organized religion was created by man to explain what they couldn't explain and it was fostered by the ruling or priest classes to control others.

    On the other hand, organized religion does provide comfort and direction to a huge number of people. If people get comfort from it, that is their choice and I'm happy for them.

    As for being a pagan, well that's organized religion in itself. Pagans believe in multiple gods each having different powers to control certain aspects of mankind's existence. So claiming you are a pagan negates a good part of what you said.
    Synnen's Avatar
    Synnen Posts: 7,927, Reputation: 2443
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    #8

    Sep 17, 2010, 04:10 PM

    Actually, pagans believe all SORTS of things. It really depends on which "branch" of paganism you're talking about here.

    I believe in one god and one goddess--and that everyone just calls them by different names for their different faces. And Wicca is very much considered a pagan religion.

    I just HATE it when someone passes themselves off as "pagan" and doesn't 1. specify what KIND of pagan and 2. spouts religious intolerance and professes lack of belief in a god and STILL has the gall to call themselves a "pagan".
    Catsmine's Avatar
    Catsmine Posts: 3,826, Reputation: 739
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    #9

    Sep 17, 2010, 05:08 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by Synnen View Post
    I believe in one god and one goddess--and that everyone just calls them by different names for their different faces. And Wicca is very much considered a pagan religion.
    Whereas my beliefs do not anthropomorphise the creative and destructive forces, yet I too fit under the "pagan" tent. Etymologically the term encompasses all non-patriarchal belief systems. Christians have used the term as an epithet for centuries, which I'm certain is why young Jeffie wanted to claim it.
    shazamataz's Avatar
    shazamataz Posts: 6,642, Reputation: 1244
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    #10

    Sep 18, 2010, 12:19 PM
    I agree and disagree.

    I do believe that God was 'created' by man as a way of bringing law to the world... get people to believe if they are bad they go to hell, if they are good they go to heaven? Sounds like a pretty good way of controlling people if they believe it.

    Having a hard time in life? Pray to God and it will all be OK... yep also sounds good, a lot of things turn out for the best but I don't believe praying to God will help, I don't and my life has been fine so far. I have been in a few terrible situations, I am in one at the moment, but things will sort themselves out.

    But... the difference between me and Geoff is that I rarely venture into the religious boards because I have no feelings towards religion.
    If people want to believe that a God or Goddess will save them then that's their business, it's not my place to judge, I have one set of beliefs, they have another. Ask my opinion and I'll give it to you, but I'm not going to go telling people "haha, you believe in something that's doesn't exist" when clearly they DO believe it and there's nothing to prove otherwise.
    Catsmine's Avatar
    Catsmine Posts: 3,826, Reputation: 739
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    #11

    Sep 18, 2010, 12:34 PM
    Name:  no soup for you 2.JPG
Views: 106
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    My word, we are feeding this one a huge helping of rationality, aren't we?
    Wondergirl's Avatar
    Wondergirl Posts: 39,354, Reputation: 5431
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    #12

    Sep 18, 2010, 12:51 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by Catsmine View Post
    My word, we are feeding this one a huge helping of rationality, aren't we?
    We heard there is going to be a pop quiz on Monday.
    Catsmine's Avatar
    Catsmine Posts: 3,826, Reputation: 739
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    #13

    Sep 18, 2010, 01:18 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by Wondergirl View Post
    pop quiz
    Pepsi please.
    Wondergirl's Avatar
    Wondergirl Posts: 39,354, Reputation: 5431
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    #14

    Sep 18, 2010, 02:39 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by Catsmine View Post
    Pepsi please.
    Oooooooooooooooooooh, my favorite! Do you want snacks and appetizers with that? I can fix hot hors d'oeuvres, little open-faced sandwiches with cream cheese-based toppings, or water crackers with brie or chevre. Or all three. Do you mind girly floral napkins, or should I put out more masculine ones? Would you like to also have several dishes of salted cashews, shelled pistachios, and spiced pecans at hand? Let me take off your slippers and massage your feet. Did you find the remote? Here's your heated pillow; lift your head.
    Catsmine's Avatar
    Catsmine Posts: 3,826, Reputation: 739
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    #15

    Sep 18, 2010, 04:37 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by Wondergirl View Post
    Oooooooooooooooooooh, my favorite! Do you want snacks and appetizers with that? I can fix hot hors d'oeuvres, little open-faced sandwiches with cream cheese-based toppings, or water crackers with brie or chevre. Or all three. Do you mind girly floral napkins, or should I put out more masculine ones? Would you like to also have several dishes of salted cashews, shelled pistachios, and spiced pecans at hand? Let me take off your slippers and massage your feet. Did you find the remote? Here's your heated pillow; lift up your head.
    With soda the hors d'oeuvres would go well, providing they're salty enough. Bacon wrapped scallops would do. Napkins I leave to your discretion. I'm Southern, of course put out pecans. I'm a hillbilly, so mocassins rather than slippers are preferred. I'd rather the satin pillow than the heated one, thank you.
    Wondergirl's Avatar
    Wondergirl Posts: 39,354, Reputation: 5431
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    #16

    Sep 18, 2010, 04:55 PM

    Would you like your eyebrows stroked?
    Catsmine's Avatar
    Catsmine Posts: 3,826, Reputation: 739
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    #17

    Sep 19, 2010, 03:23 AM
    Quote Originally Posted by Wondergirl View Post
    Would you like your eyebrows stroked?
    I guess you can start at the eyebrows.
    shazamataz's Avatar
    shazamataz Posts: 6,642, Reputation: 1244
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    #18

    Sep 19, 2010, 06:33 AM

    Apart from not understanding what a pagan is, why is Geoff automatically labeled a troll?
    Fr_Chuck's Avatar
    Fr_Chuck Posts: 81,301, Reputation: 7692
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    #19

    Sep 19, 2010, 07:03 AM

    While I did not do it, a person with a very low post count, comes in and posts a thread that would or could normally cause a lot of debate or argument.

    What if someone with a post count of 3 or 4 came to dogs and asked why can't we just kill all pit bulls for the safety of people. ( would you not consider them a troll perhaps) fairly same issue here.
    QLP's Avatar
    QLP Posts: 980, Reputation: 656
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    #20

    Sep 19, 2010, 01:30 PM

    I was raised a catholic but now choose not to follow any religion. It saddens me when people believe that lack of religion equates to lack of caring or morals. Indeed one of the many reasons I left religion behind was that I could not condone the fact that the leader of the church I was a member of could preach the wrongness of using condoms while great numbers of people were dying of Aids and the planet I live on is becoming overpopulated. Yes I know people can say no to sex but for me it is a greater wrong to watch people suffer and die because they do not live up to certain ideals than to accept human falllability and help people despite their failings.

    I don't want to stir up a huge argument about different opinions on what is right or wrong nor to offend anyone who has religious beliefs. I know there are many good relgious people out there, but there are many good atheists, agnostics, and people who have their own private spiritual beliefs.

    There were many other reasons I took the road I have, and believe me walking away from a religion I had been indoctrinated with since a small child was not easy. However, for me, my conscience and sense of integrity would not allow me to continue on the old path without considering myself a hypocrite. I have looked at other religions and have yet to find one that I find has what I consider to be all the answers. Indeed I question the idea of an omnipotent God but do believe in 'something'. It may seem a bit feeble to have no firm belief but I consider it is actually quite a difficult thing that took quite a lot of courage for me to admit that I cannot find the answers and am prepared to live with the uncertainty.

    Finding my own path has been a very liberating journey for me, it hasn't suddenly turned me into a selfish hedonist, but has freed me from dogma I could not embrace and allowed me to use my compassion from a genuine desire to help people, not from duty. It has also been very scary at times but I know it is the right thing in my life.

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