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holz1 · Dec 20, 2006, 11:14 AM

My mother has had clinical depression for as long as I can remember but she has also been aggressive, threatening and vindictive for that long too. She does things to people in the family that I wouldn't even want to type here and then thinks that THEY are in the wrong. She is a threat to herself and others and in my opinion, and several family member's opinion, she is not of a sound mind. It is hard to explain in writing but I sincerely think she needs help before she sends someone over the edge with her. How would I go about getting her committed or to show her what she is really doing?

ScottGem · Dec 20, 2006, 12:06 PM

You need to first talk with her physician or get her examined by one. The physician determines whether she is a danger. At that point you have to go to court for a competency hearing that will make you or someone else her guardian.

holz1 · Dec 20, 2006, 12:09 PM

OK, a few problems with that. She will never speak 2me without wanting to kill me, never mind agree to have her doctor examine her for the looney bin! Also, I do not want to be her guardian for any reason.

ScottGem · Dec 20, 2006, 12:30 PM

I just noticed you are in Scotland, so the rules may be a bit different there. In the US, to get someone committed you have to have a doctor examine them and sign the papers that are then approved by a judge.

holz1 · Dec 20, 2006, 12:44 PM

Yeah, I know its roughly the same here but how do you do it without the person having to agree to things? This woman thinks she is perfect and is never in the wrong and to insinuate any such thing would basically open the gates of hell!! :eek:

I know a doctor must sign the papers and so many family members but in order to do that she must agree to being examined. That's the problem because itl never happen.

ScottGem · Dec 20, 2006, 12:55 PM

Then you are stuck. Unless she commits some act that physically damages herself, someone else or someone's property where you can have her incarcerated for an examination, there is nothing more you can do.

holz1 · Dec 20, 2006, 12:59 PM

That, my friend, will not be a problem! She has already threatened that today in a letter to my great cousin who is disabled and just lost his mum to a bad case of cancer.

But, if she does end up in jail for something, will I need to have the papers ready or can I just request that she be examined for those purposes while shez in there?

ScottGem · Dec 20, 2006, 01:08 PM

You can request that she be examined at that point.

sadiesmom · Dec 20, 2006, 08:08 PM

I don't know about Scotland law, but in the US you can contact the Sheriff's dept and tell them you want to take out an MIW (mental inquest warrant). The police would pick her up and take her to a therapist who would evaluate her and if they believe she is a danger to her self or others she will be taken to a psychiatric hospital for a 72 hour observation. If after 72 hours they still believe she is a danger to herself or others they will continue to keep her until she can safely be discharged.

ScottGem · Dec 21, 2006, 06:49 AM

Originally Posted by sadiesmom

I don't know about Scotland law, but in the US you can contact the Sheriff's dept and tell them you want to take out an MIW (mental inquest warrant). The police would pick her up and take her to a therapist who would evaluate her and if they believe she is a danger to her self or others she will be taken to a psychiatric hospital for a 72 hour observation. If after 72 hours they still believe she is a danger to herself or others they will continue to keep her until she can safely be discharged.

I'm curious about this. Definitely such a warrant exists, but it can 't be as easy as contacting the local sherriff or police department. Wouldn't a judge have to issue such a warrant? Wouldn't that mean a hearing where the subject of the warrant could defend themselves? I can't believe that someone can just waltz into a police station and say my mum is acting crazy can you make her go to a shrink and have it done.

sadiesmom · Dec 21, 2006, 04:29 PM

It does have to be signed by a judge but the citizen taking out the MIW isn't the one responsible for doing that. The person is picked up for an evaluation and if they are deemed a danger to themselves or others they are taken to a hospital. Any one can take out an MIW on some one. Charges can be filed against you if you take one out under false pretenses.

ScottGem · Dec 21, 2006, 07:05 PM

I still can't see a judge ordering someone to be picked up like that without some compelling evidence.

sadiesmom · Dec 22, 2006, 03:49 PM

The person taking out an MIW on someone either goes to the sheriff's dept or the District attorney's office and files a petition stating what the person is doing that is supposedly a danger to them self or others. If they don't have sufficient grounds then the petition isn't signed.

holz1 · Dec 28, 2006, 12:00 PM

Thanks 4 tha advice anyway, ScottGem! I know the whole sherriff thing isn't in scottish law, mainly because we don't have sherriffz! Lol!

ScottGem · Dec 28, 2006, 12:50 PM

Originally Posted by holz1

Thanx 4 tha advice anyway, ScottGem! I know the whole sherriff thing aint in scottish law, mainly coz we dont have sherriffz! lol!

You don't? Isn't there still one in Nottingham? ;) Or is it just the English who have them and not the Scots?

holz1 · Dec 28, 2006, 12:52 PM

Originally Posted by ScottGem

You don't? Isn't there still one in Nottingham? ;) Or is it just the English who have them and not the Scots?

Lol!:rolleyes: a comedien! hahaha! English hv "the fuzz" and scots hv "tha polis"

Try that! Lol

31pumpkin · Dec 28, 2006, 02:39 PM

I thought there has to be 2 adults,(you + another witness) going to the courthouse to have a claim for someone to be Baker acted. Then the police come & the patient is held for 48-72hrs. Never heard of the MIW though.

Lorna Jane · Dec 29, 2006, 11:12 PM

Originally Posted by ScottGem

I'm curious about this. Definitely such a warrant exists, but it can 't be as easy as contacting the local sherriff or police department. Wouldn't a judge have to issue such a warrant? Wouldn't that mean a hearing where the subject of the warrant could defend themselves? I can't believe that someone can just waltz into a police station and say my mum is acting crazy can you make her go to a shrink and have it done.

Where do I sign up for this?? My mother-in-law accuses me of stealing her broken costume old lady jewelry, the deed to her house (which the bank actually has because she got $20,000 in debt from buying herbs, and home shopping!) etc. She thinks people are in a conspiracy, spies on neighbors with binocculars and calls drug strike force etc. Said just today that a neighbor told her I was down at her house while she was gone Wednesday and I was digging around out in the dirt in her yard for something. I actually live in a town north of her, and was at work as I always am during the week Monday through Friday! What do we do? She just had quad bypass, diagnosed diabetic type 2, and is 80 years old. Has always been weird, but getting MUCH worse lately! Smelling things like carbon monoxide there for awhile too, diagnosed with olfactory hallucinations. Any advice? Lorna Jane

ScottGem · Dec 30, 2006, 06:50 AM

Originally Posted by Lorna Jane

Where do I sign up for this??? My mother-in-law accuses me of stealing her broken costume old lady jewelry, the deed to her house (which the bank actually has because she got $20,000 in debt from buying herbs, and home shopping!) etc. She thinks people are in a conspiracy, spies on neighbors with binocculars and calls drug strike force etc. Said just today that a neighbor told her I was down at her house while she was gone Wednesday and I was digging around out in the dirt in her yard for something. I actually live in a town north of her, and was at work as I always am during the week Monday through Friday! What do we do? She just had quad bypass, diagnosed diabetic type 2, and is 80 years old. Has always been wierd, but getting MUCH worse lately! Smelling things like carbon monoxide there for awhile too, diagnosed with olfactory hallucinations. Any advice? Lorna Jane

Your first step is to talk to her doctor. Also talk to the Social Services or Senior support agencies in her area.

Try reading the info in previous noptes in this thread on how to go about it. If you do need to get an MIW, the guidelines for how are in the previous notes.

Lorna Jane · Dec 30, 2006, 07:11 AM

Originally Posted by ScottGem

Your first step is to talk to her doctor. Also talk to the Social Services or Senior support agencies in her area.

Try reading the info in previous noptes in this thread on how to go about it. If you do need to get an MIW, the guidelines for how are in the previous notes.

Thanks for your response ScottGem. We have spoken to her doctor and he will absolutely be of no help what so ever, for reasons we don't understand. The last doc she had told her she had mental issues, and she was FURIOUS... then switched doctors! So all of this is in her file with the new doc, and maybe that is why he won't say anything. Or maybe it's because when he set up her psychiatric evaluation, she met with the professionals to have it done, then REFUSED to allow the results to be released to even her physician that set the testing up!! The person that did the actual testing could not tell us at that time what the results were... all she said was quote "there are some serious issues here!", so we have to wait now for power of atty to send a letter for those test results to be sent to doc before we get them. If we knew exactly what her mental issues were we might be able to better help her. If it's alzheimers, a place for those issues, if it's a mental thing like paranoid whatever... maybe a medicine could ease her issues etc. She is just wearing out the family though, that much I do know. And if something is not done immediately, she will totally bankrupt herself, as she is now not even writing the monthly bills out for some reason, not deducting over draws when she does write checks etc. Her bank account is a mess, and power of atty has not taken over finances just yet. She also has tried to get total mastectomy done (doc refused, not necessary... tried to get a foot of colon removed, another doc refused, no need... wanted another doc to remove 2 vertebre in back which he said would paralyze her, but he refused, not needed either... she may have an issue with munchausens syndrome or who knows what) We will wait and see what each day brings, but day by day she seems to worsen. I am just hoping she does not get in her car (she has pulled whole front ends off cars and not realized she was dragging it behind her, went on in the store!! ). Power of atty has not taken car or keys away yet either. Again, thanks for info... appreciate it.