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ScottGem · Nov 19, 2006, 10:59 AM

I have the mentioned unit and I can't get it to turn over. It has a pull string starter and it doesn't seem to generate a spark. Should I check the plugs. I don't use it much and did not drain it for storage. But I have a lot of debris from branches that came doen in a storm so I really need it.

If I take it to a repair shop any idea how much it would cost?

Scott<>

Naterpatater · Nov 19, 2006, 11:28 AM

Scott, the plugs could be your problem. The best way to test for spark is to unhook the spark plug wire and lay it next to the spark plug where you can see it. Next pull as your normally would, you should see the electric sparking between the two. If you don't have spark, try replacing the spark plug. It would also be a good idea to drain the old gas and put fresh in there. If you are going to leave it sit over the winter it is a good idea to drain the gas or put fuel stabilizer in the tank. Try this out and if it doesn't work let me know. I would much rather answer your questions than have you take it to a shop and have them charge their outragoues prices.

P.S. DO NOT TOUCH THE SPARK PLUG BOOT WHEN YOU ARE TESTING IT. It won't kill you but it is very uncomfortable.

thebriggsdude · Nov 19, 2006, 04:02 PM

Or you could take the plug out, put the plug wire back on it (and while holding it with pliers with rubber grips up to the engine) in the evening (or where there's not much light) and turn it over, and watch for a blue snap... (a helper is good for pulling it over)

If it set for a long period without any fuel stabilizer?! I'd first try a little gas down the carb (take the filter off) and see if it will fire off that... then check for spark.
If it did indeed sit for maybe (gas starts going bad after about a month) 2-3 months with no fuel stabilizer... I'd expect to check and clean the carb... if you feel up to doing it yourself... its going to be pocket change... get a small engine shop to do it... its going to be the wallet.

ScottGem · Nov 19, 2006, 04:16 PM

I pulled the plug, wiped off the carbon and attached the wire and pulled the cord. I did see a faint blue spark.

And yes, the thing has set for several months. So I guess the carb is the next thing. Got to find the manual to see what's involved in cleaning it out. I'll drain the tank (what do I do with the old gas?) is there some additive I can put in a refilled tank to clean out the carb?

thebriggsdude · Nov 20, 2006, 11:17 AM

Nothing added to the gas will clean a carb... waste of time and effort (and money)...
Next thing I'd do is try a little gas down the carb... (just a little dribble) and see if it will start and run off that...

Now for the manual... owners manual? Usually they don't put anything about cleaning the carb in there...
What's involved is getting a carb kit (gaskets, needle and seat, etc) and take the carb off, apart... soak it in carb cleaner for a few hours and blow it out (all holes)with compressed air...
May need to rinse and repeat...
I'd just try a little gas down the carb first to see if it actually will run off it... blue spark is a good sign though...

For the old gas... drain it out, and put it in your car/truck when its relatively full (if it has no water in the old gas) it'll be fine.

ScottGem · Nov 20, 2006, 12:02 PM

Great, I will do that this weekend. I'm also going to replace the plug if I can find the right one. ACE hardware had a variety of plugs for a couple of bucks so its worth getting a new one. There was RNC4 printed on the plug.

But umm, where do I find the carb and how do I put a little gas down it?

I found this model, though it doesn't look exactly like mine its very close:
http://www.yardmachines.com/webapp/w...02007_36251_-1#

thebriggsdude · Nov 20, 2006, 05:24 PM

Do you know where the air filter is? The air filter goes in right on the carb (has a back plate bolted to the carb the filter sits in, then a cover to hold the filter in... ) the carbs behind that.
In the picture it's the box right next to the muffler... under the tank.

Now the spark plug (unless someone else has heard of that type plug) usually if it's a ohv engine, it'll take a rc12yc (or equivalent)
Side valve flat head would be a j19lm (or equivalent)
Never gave engine brand... briggs or tecumseh?

Be warned... if this is the first time you've taken a carb apart... make sure you know where everything goes because there are lots of tiny parts and screws (why I suggest pictures) your average small carb like on these engines are less complicated though... (less parts)

ScottGem · Nov 20, 2006, 07:01 PM

I checked online and the RN4C is a listed champion model. I'm not 100% sure. I think the engine is a Briggs, but its not clear from the MTD sites. I'm going to try and take some closeup pics and post them tmmw.

If I have to take the carb apart, it will be a last resort after everyhting else fails.

ScottGem · Nov 21, 2006, 07:22 PM

The unit is an older version of the one I linked to earlier. It is a Yard Machines brand with a Tecumsheh 5.5 HP engine. I've attached some closeup pics of the engine. I haven't a clue where the carb is or how to dribble some gas into it.

In Side2, is that the gas filter below the red button?

Any insights would be appreciated.

Scott<>

thebriggsdude · Nov 22, 2006, 05:36 PM

What's circled in white is the carb... what's circled in yellow is the carb bowl

(fuel bowl... fuel sits in here, there's a float and a inlet needle... the float sinks letting fuel in (opens the needle) and closes when it gets full (pushes the needle up) keeping it full of gas to feed the main jet... the main jet is up the float bowl nut that holds the bowl on)
What's circled in blue is the primer bulb.

That box right beside it is the air filter box assembly.

ScottGem · Nov 22, 2006, 06:16 PM

This is great. Two other questions. Where do I dribble in the new gas, into the bowl? Is there a drain for the tank, or do I have to siphon out from the top?

RichardBondMan · Nov 22, 2006, 07:13 PM

Scott, I have read all the answers, your post and responses, here's what a non trained mechanice like me would do -- TRY NOT TO TAKE CARB APART UNTIL YOU HAVE TRIED ALL ELSE ! I have done it before, not that hard but why go to the trouble if you change the plug, start with fresh gas in the tank and change the air filter or at least make sure it's not loaded with dust, debris.

thebriggsdude · Nov 22, 2006, 11:23 PM

Take the air filter off, and put a little shot of gas down the carbs throat (the hole there)

If you didn't need it right now... I'd tell you to go ahead yourself and learn how to do it (with help from members here) but you need it now... so go with bondmans advice... start with the simple stuff... but usually if its sit for months... carb is gummed up (or water/trash is in it) and this is a tecumseh... they can be picky about they're carbs.

ScottGem · Nov 26, 2006, 07:29 AM

Well, weather and time prevented me from working on it until this morning. The good news is that I got the thing to catch. The bad news is it died out after about a minute. I tried it several times. Each time putting a couple of ounces into the hole behind the air filter (whihc looks clean). Each time it caught after a 3-4 pulls, then ran for about a minute and died. So I guess the carb is gummed up preventing fuel from flowing from the tank.

I've attached another picture just to make sure. Is the carb, what I marked in yellow or the thing behind that, marked in red? I think it's the yellow thing, but want to make sure. There is a bolt at the botton of the pipe coming from the tank. Is that where I disconnect it? Anywhere else? Any more tips?

I'm a fairly handy guy, but I wonder if I might not be better taking it into a shop. Any ideas how much it might cost. I'd been willing to go $50-$100 to make sure its done quickly and right. But the unit only cost $400, so I'm not sure I want to sink that much more into it.

Scott<>

newaukumdon · Nov 26, 2006, 11:31 AM

You may be in luck, this is a fairly simple carb, the easiest way to try on your own without causing more problems (it doesn't start now can't be worse) The silver "cup" is the float chamber. The bolt holding the chamber on is the main nozzle.

Remove the bolt and chamber, clean the bolt completely all the small holes. Does fuel flow freely when the float is in the lowered position? If the cup was on it would alllow the fuel to hold the float in the up or closed position until more fuel is needed in the carb. If fuel does not flow you have a blockage before the carb.

If fuel flows, get a can of carb cleaner and spray liberaly into the threaded area where the bolt held the cup on this is the pilot jet and can also plug up
.
This should get you started without a complete removal of the carb. If it does start and run great, if not try using a partial choke method until it pulls fuel on its own. (covering the intake off and on keeping it running this way until it runs on its own or just won't).

If none of this works you can expect an hour minimum at a shop $40-$65 and parts no more than $25.00.

ScottGem · Nov 26, 2006, 12:51 PM

I just want to make sure here cause I'm not sure I see the bolt holding the float cup on. I see the bolt holind the asembly onto the down pipe. I see a screw at about 11 o'clock in reference to the red button. But I don't see anything else.

I'm also not clear on what you mean by a partial choke. Are you talking about running with the air filter cover off?

I'll go out tmmw morning and get carb spray. So I'll be able to try this again tmmw morning.

Scott<>

newaukumdon · Nov 26, 2006, 01:04 PM

Below the red rubber primer button is the sediment bowl or "cup" it is silver and has a small lip all the way around it. This is held on by one bolt recessed in the middle coming up from the bottom 7/16 Head maybe 1/2. by removing this bolt you can drop the "cup" try not to disrupt the rubber seal for the "cup". You have a situation were you are not getting proper air/fuel mixture. We ultimately would like to increase the amount of fuel to air mixture by cleaning things, choking or reducing the amount of air can accomplish the same thing (although with much less HP)

You choke by restricting the air coming into the carburetor with a rag or something that can be easily removed. There will be vacum at the carb while it is running so be prepared to continue the cycle until it runs on its own.

Hope this helps

ScottGem · Dec 11, 2006, 09:19 AM

Thanks again to everyone for their help here. Just wanted to give you an update.

After everything I tried, I finally took it to a repair shop. They replaced the carb, spark plug and did a tuneup of the OHV. I got it back Saturday (took them over almost 2 weeks to fix it). But I must say its never run smoother. It use to take a couple of pulls and a lot of pumping of the choke. Now, one press of the choke and one pull and she starts up. I used it Sat for about an hour, then when to use it again yesterday. Of course something jammed in the blades and I had a heck of time (finally had to remove the hopper) to clear it. But once I did she ran smoothly.

I have the feeling, though, its going to take me most of the winter (especially if it snows) to clean my yard out.

DUCHESS044 · Jan 9, 2007, 10:07 AM

I have the same unit. My husband was trying to start it, he put gas down the carb, pulled the spark plug out and cleaned it, etc. and was pulling the string, and next thing you know, the string is stuck. He pulls, and it like jams and won't go any further. He thinks it's something stuck in the blades. I think it's some kind of safety feature where if something is seriously wrong with the unit, the pully will stop. I don't know if either of us is right, but this chopper is brand new (almost) and we would really like to get it running.

If anyone has either the owner's manual or any suggestions, I would really appreciate it.

Thanks!

Duchess

ScottGem · Jan 9, 2007, 12:11 PM

Hi Duchess. That actually happened to me the 2nd time I went to use it after I got it out of the shop. You are almost exactly right, but its not a safety feature its how the starter works. When you pull the cord it starts the motor turning which in turn, turns the blades. So if something is stuck in the blades, the motor can't turn and the cord won't move.

The first thing to do is use a long stick to see if you can turn the blades through the hopper (where you put leaves not branches). You may see or dislodge whatever is jammed in the blades. If that doesn't work, you will need to take off the hopper. There are 6 or 8 nuts holding the hopper on. Once you take it off you should be able to dislodge what's jamming the blades. If you can't find anything jamming on the hopper side, you may have to remove the chute (where you put branches) to get at the other side of the blades.