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K_3 · Oct 28, 2006, 05:45 AM

In your original post you said you wanted some good advice. You also said he helped you get over your past relationship as he helped move you out. No, he did not help you get over your past relationship, he replaced the person you were with. You are still as helpless as you were when you were in the bad relationship(certainly not saying this one is good).

You wanted some good advice without attacking you. You have gotten some good advice and reasons not to continue as you are. You have heard from those who have been in your situation and those who have been in the wife's. You still feel you are right. I see that you are saying you are looking at the whole picture but you are definitely not seeing what you are doing to his wife. You skirt that issue. You touch base with it as you do not want to hurt her. Do you not get it? You are hurting her each time you are with her husband. He should be spending that time with her not you. You think what she does not know does not hurt her? That is so NOT true. She is hurt because her husband is not home with her and she is sitting at home alone, lonely want someone to share her time with, someone to hold her. She is sitting waiting because she believes whatever lie he has given her to be with you. You are robbing her of the person she chose to live with. She will find out and the devastation she will feel will be incredible. Her heart will hurt, she will cry like you have many times. She will feel used, betrayed, stupid, abused(Yes abused) heartsick, she will feel her life is over. She will feel she has wasted so much time and wonder how many times he lied to her as she sat home waiting. She will say"What a fool I have been." She will hate you. If there are children involved they will hate you. They will hate their father. They will feel betrayed. THen... depending on the outcome. He will go to her, lie some more and they will get back together. He will hate you. OR she willnot take him back, he will be with you, resentment all around the two of you and he will cheat on you.

Now, I have not attacked you. I have tried to reason with you in other posts. This is reality. You do not want to look at reality. Remember there is the Golden Rule.. Do unto others as you would have them do unto you. Never, do you steal anything or anyone that it will not be taken from you. Anything gotten at anothers expense will not be blessed.

From here, you make some decisions. Your life is a lie. He lies to her, the two of you lie about sleeping together, you know you will again. You lie to yourself saying it is OK. NO do not say you know it is not OK. If you felt that in your heart, deep in your heart, you would not be there. If you want to live in God's light, you have to be willing to live by All of his rules, not just a few select ones.

valinors_sorrow · Oct 28, 2006, 06:02 AM

I agree K-3, she is "helpless" and choosing to perpetuate that helplessness by using her "victim status" as justification. It's a sick, vicious circle she constructed. This is what living in your own confused head instead of reality yields. She needs professional help a thousand times more than she is aware of. Denial = don't even notice I am lying (to myself). I hope for her sake and the sake of others that she wakes up and smells the coffee (takes appropriate actions) one day. Pain and damage continue to follow in her wake otherwise.

talaniman · Oct 28, 2006, 07:22 AM

Originally Posted by valinors_sorrow

I agree K-3, she is "helpless" and choosing to perpetuate that helplessness by using her "victim status" as justification. Its sick vicious circle she constructed. This is what living in your own confused head instead of reality yields. She needs professional help a thousand times more than she is aware of. Denial = don't even notice I am lying (to myself). I hope for her sake and the sake of others that she wakes up and smells the coffee (takes appropriate actions) one day. Pain and damage follow in her wake otherwise.

I couldn't rep you, but I can quote you. I read this post and it is so heart-breaking to see the results of a human being so abused that they can no longer see reality or help themselves. The bad part is she is still being abused and thinks her friend is her savior. This ,folks is so sad and all we can do is sit by and watch as she just lives in her own head as the abuse continues and is sure to spread and affect others who have no choice(kids) and those who will be abused by this abuser.(Yes she is at this point an abuser). The only thing I can suggest is a collective prayer for her to get help and break this vicous cycle.

K_3 · Oct 28, 2006, 08:05 AM

She is living in a illusion of what she sees as reality. She has had so many problems in her life she does not know what love really is. She just wants someone to care about her that does not physically beat her. There are many other means of abuse. She is abusing herself and does not have a clue. I am not candy coating what is happening. I am being real. As Val said she needs serious counseling. Yes,Tal, a good prayer for her and his wife is all we can do. She has heard enough, if none of it sinks in now, when she is sitting crying because all has fallen apart and she is thinking of going back to the X because she cannot be alone, I hope she rereads all of this again and it may sink in. I pray she gets counseling.

K_3 · Oct 28, 2006, 08:09 AM

Originally Posted by valinors_sorrow

I agree K-3, she is "helpless" and choosing to perpetuate that helplessness by using her "victim status" as justification. Its a sick, vicious circle she constructed. This is what living in your own confused head instead of reality yields. She needs professional help a thousand times more than she is aware of. Denial = don't even notice I am lying (to myself). I hope for her sake and the sake of others that she wakes up and smells the coffee (takes appropriate actions) one day. Pain and damage follow in her wake otherwise.

Could not rep you, here's your excellent

Wildcat21 · Oct 28, 2006, 12:57 PM

Please, please get counseling.

And end it with the married guy. He's just another user.

CHAYOTE23 · Oct 29, 2006, 07:57 AM

Valinors Sorrow and J 9 you are both right, but the reason for a married man cheathing could be several reason and his cheating may not have anything to do with sex. His relationship may not be what it use to be 9 years ago and if so he needs to have a better communication with his wife and let her know how he feels and he needs to make a logical decision by remaining married or getting a divorce.

Wildcat21 · Oct 29, 2006, 01:39 PM

Well - he has to DIVORCE FIRST!! Before you ever get involved!!

talaniman · Oct 29, 2006, 02:25 PM

Originally Posted by CHAYOTE23

Valinors Sorrow and J 9 you are both right, but the reason for a married man cheathing could be several reason and his cheating may not have anything to do with sex. His relationship may not be what it use to be 9 years ago and if so he needs to have a better communication with his wife and let her know how he feels and he needs to make a logical decision by remaining married or getting a divorce.

I think the man is irrelevant here and the issue is her staying in a relationship with a married man , that is her problem an unhealthy relationship.

Skell · Oct 29, 2006, 04:26 PM

Way to go J_9.
I'm so with you on this one.
Yes you have had it tough. Ansd yes that is unfortunate.

But don't justify this disgraceful act you are committing here because of it. And don't for aminute think you or him are good people. At the moment you aren't. You can be a good person but leaving him and fnding help and we will all give you the support and credit when / if you do. I promise you that.

But he isn't a good and loving and compassionate man. If he was he wouldn't even think twice about you.

He is a lying cheating pig.

Again, I can't feel the sligtest bit of sympathy for you. All my sympathy at the moment is tied up elsewhere... At his wife and kids place!

ordinaryguy · Oct 29, 2006, 04:30 PM

My heart goes out to you. Being raped for three years beginning at age 11 is an unbelieveably heavy load to carry. All the relationships you've been in since then, including the present one, reflect the damage done by that original crime. The most important advice you have gotten here is to get professional help. There may be people who could recover from what you've suffered without extensive counselling, but it's more than most of us could do on our own. The brave and intelligent thing to do is stop seeing the married cheater and get help immediately. A couple of things you've said caught my attention:

Originally Posted by marisa_franklin

I am happy with the way we are and I dont believe in female friends I only have male friends

Originally Posted by marisa_franklin

I am open/searching for new relationships and when I find one I will be able to understand his feelings and actions.

At this stage in your healing, I think it will be impossible for you to have a relationship with a man that won't be terribly distorted by your history. You need female friendship and support to help you put yourself together to the point where you have the inner strength necessary as the basis for a healthy relationship with a man. Find a female counsellor. Make some (preferably older) women friends. Take a break from men for at least six months, preferably a year or more. That may sound like an intolerable sacrifice, but if you don't do it, it will probably be much longer than that before you can do anything more than repeat the unhealthy patterns of your past.

marisa_franklin · Oct 30, 2006, 06:39 AM

I seem to be misunderstood when I made the statement of the friends I prefer, men not meaning sexual partners. In my life I have had only one consensuous sexual partner (my son's father) and now the second. These friends are my buddies, my cousions, co-workers and such. Females are to touchy and dramatic I can't stand it. I see I have been hated and cursed by you all. The whole notion is that I leave this married man. Here's my take
We are friends and nothing is going to change it, he has problems and so do I.
We don't have sex now because I took a few of your advice and guess what it didn't change anything. Everything is not just only about sex. The friendship that we have is not based on him using me (for sex or anything), he's just compelled to help me and didn't want anything to happen for me. There is people out there who'll truly care for someone. I am though sorry that we became sexually connected and he feel that way to. I can call on him for anything not only materially but emotionally. For the wife who thinks she is hurt maybe you should have given your husband more attention than only study bills and whatever they feel tired to and you probably stressed him. Not condoning his actions but sometimes men feel pain and they don't show it as a woman might or can. They feel ashamed to so if someone else sees this they might draw to that action and want the warmth and love of another.

K_3 · Oct 30, 2006, 07:22 AM

You have not been hated and cursed by all here. Reread the posts.

I know physically abused women feel they deserve the punishment and that it is their fault, that is why they stay in the abusive relationship. They often go from one to another.
I see you have more empathy for men than you do women. You can justify what a man does, but women are touchy and dramatic. Is that how you see yourself? You are a woman. You are not unique. Not all women are touchy and dramatic. Just as not all women have abusive relationships. Every person is different, to lump them all into one category is absurd.

Val was right on when she said you needed an older woman in your life, women are nurturing and caring and thoughtful.

I can see you will say and do anything to justify what you are doing. If in fact, it is an innocent relationship, invite his wife to dinner with you, will you have a topic of conversation then? The three of you could all be friends IF this is all innocent.

I feel I have said all I have to say on any of this subject. You are not hearing anything anyone is saying. You are reading that we are all condeming you. No, we just care about a person we did not know that asked for help. You had some very understanding answers, read them. Yes, you had some that were not, that is what this site is all about. You seem to see the nonunderstanding and say "all of you", just as your mother was non caring, so all women are dramatic and touchy. I think you are dramatic and touchy about these answers.
If you stay with this forum, I will read in a few weeks or months you asking for help to get over this man. Til then, good luck.

marisa_franklin · Oct 30, 2006, 08:18 AM

Yes I can sit and have dinner with the wife but for what reason. I can't face her I will feel worse than I already have felt. So because this man is married I cannot be friends with him. I have tried to reach out to older women (my aunts, cousins, friends, mothers) but I feel a sense of insecurity and jealousy within them when it comes to there men. I don't know why but I always experienced that. I don't even study there men but there men study me and they want to get involved so I usually stay away. Same on my job the older women refrain from me because all the men might be attracted to me and I don't know why. I try to make them my friends but they are always staring and making comments to others. I prefer my own age group to be my friends. I have girlfriends but I just prefer to lime with my brother and my/his boyfriends. I am not saying all women are like that but mostly the older ones.

talaniman · Oct 30, 2006, 10:41 AM

I really don't think this is about jealousy or fidelity or fear . This is about a very unhealthy person ,sick if you will, and in need of help. Until the steps are taken to at least seek help to get healthy, then your whole life and all it touches will be tainted by the sickness you will spread. Get HELP and stop trying to convince everryone how hard your life is. Isn't that why you're here on this site?

K_3 · Oct 30, 2006, 12:01 PM

You really do need some help. I used to model (not professionally) and took some beauty contests and had people that did not know me tell me how beautiful I was. I still get comments now that I am older. I have always believed it was more the love inside me towards others that brought that about. Every place I have worked, I have gotten along with my female co-workers. Older and younger. I have gotten along with the males there also. Some of the men became friends with my husband and I. I do not know how you conduct yourself that every female does not like you. I really feel you need some help. I do know women who were sexually abused as a child have issues on how they deal with men. You may be quite flirtatious with them and not know it. There has to be a reason for their acting that way. OR you are imagining it. That is such a cop out.

acmikkilineni · Nov 3, 2006, 06:51 AM

Every in the world is one way or the related to you. The food you take is grown by somebody who is not related to you or he is related to you? I hope you understand the importance of being a human being. The time (may be 0.000000000000001 % - please calculate for your self) we spend on sex is not at all significant in our lives. Try to do justice for taking birth as a human being.

Be independent. Do something for the less fortunate.

shygrneyzs · Nov 8, 2006, 03:07 PM

You do not need a man to abuse you in this relationship - you are abusing yourself. Yes, this comes from a history of low self esteem, bad choices (based on low self esteem), things out of your control such as being raped and then being subjected to both physcial and verbal abuse... but do you see where the buck has to stop NOW? For yourself and for your children - your children will adopt the same behaviors as you because that is what they see as normal. You want this cycle to repeat and repeat and repeat, because it has and it will. That is why the other respondents have said - very well - that you are in serious need of a good therapist, one who is experienced in issues with co-dependency, self-destructive behavior, and self esteem. Even contacting a women's shelter for advice would be helpful, as they would know of professionals.
You really do need to stay away from this man you say you are in love with. I can understand why you love him - he was kind, caring, generous with his time and affection and emotionally supportive. But he is married! And not to you. That is not healthy, not healing, not supportive of constructive change for you.
I had a life of co-dependent behavior, I am what professionals call an ACOA (adult child of an alcoholic) and have all the scars to prove it. Married someone just like my Mom and spent another 23 years in much the same relationship, just traded the gender. When I finally developed the insight as to the reasons I behaved the way I did and the responses I had to what was done to me, it did not take me long to make the changes. But the first step was a long one and most difficult, because admitting that I enabled others to continue in their horrid treatment was near impossible to admit. But I had to start healing. I still continue to heal, and it has been 6 years since the divorce. We are all works in progress. Thankfully, the Lord understands it all.
I truly wish you the best of all things - put yourself first for once and make a commitment to be healthy in body, mind, and soul.

Amythest · Nov 8, 2006, 06:35 PM

I think you need to take a year away from men... seriously... Learn to do all the htings you relied on men for, change your water, learn to do an il change, open your own jar... take a whole year away it will not be easy... do not seek a relationship, instead all the time you would sepnd with a wman sepnd with professioanl help and in the word of God. Get a new hobbie one that doens consist of some other wowmans man. Or else find some woman and man in ne of those open relatiponships... still bnot a great idea...
But seriosuly for you just take one year... if you can't go a year then 6 months but seriously after 8 years of dependcy you need a year by yourself with just friends not the married man of learning to things yoruself, learning to live by yourself sleep by yourself. etc.

marisa_franklin · Jan 12, 2007, 05:18 AM

Hi everyone,

This is marisa, long time no hear, ehh, but I have some good news. First of all I would like to thank all of you who have made comments and given advice. It was all very appreciated. I have found God in my life, I have dumped the married man three months ago, lost all strings from him. I have found a God sent helper who I am going to marry in the next 6mths. He is studying to be a pastor, his dad and mom are pastors and they have accepted me as there own daughter. I am given love, counselling, prayer and hope for a brighter and better future. I am so happy that I have forgotten you all but today. He is three years older than me, kind, gentle, single, ambitious and has a calling on his life to fulfill the purpose of God and I have to counsel and spread Gods word. I have never given up on God and he has brought me up and away from all evil and unrighteousness. And I leave you with a word of hope that God is most merciful and a forgiving God and he will take away your fears, burdens and tribulations, once you accept him as your lord and saviour, no man can put asunder, and your life will be fruitful in his word do I pray and praise. God bless and thank you very much. Faith is the substance of things not seen nor heard and victory is mine today because I choose God and he answered my prayer.