[cadillac59]

Also My fiance's mother wants to know if she can do anything about this. She has all the paper work. She also writes all the times that the mother drops him off. So my question is...Is there anything a grandmother can do?

The only thing that comes to mind would be the possibility of a guardianship if you and your fiancé were unable or unwilling to have custody; but a guardianship requires a hightened showing of need and urgency. Most commentators/family law experts will tell you that if you are a non-parent and the child does not live in your household a guardianship will probably fail. To get one you have to show that it would be detrimental to the child's welfare to remain in the custody of the parent and that a guardianship is essential to serve the child's best interests, and I believe you have to show this by clear and convincing evidence (the next higher standard of proof beyond mere preponderance of evidence). This is a heavy burden. So, unless you have facts justifying CPS intervention and removal, a guardianship will probably fail. And if you have those compelling facts, then it's usually easier just to let CPS do its thing and ask for temporary placement of the child with the person seeking the guardianship. Now if the child has resided with a non-parent for a substantial period the rule is relaxed considerably and there is a presumption in the law that a guardianship should be granted (our oddly-written statute says that in cases of a "de-facto" parent, i.e. one with whom the child has resided for a substantial period and has assumed the day-to-day parenting role for the child, it is rebuttably presumed that changing custody to a parent would be detrimental to the child and that remaining with the de facto parent is necessary to serve the child's best interest--but, this presumption is rebuttable by preponderance of the evidence.. see how fun some of this family law stuff can be ! :)

[rhiannahunt]

Loads of fun! :) My fiancés mother writes everything down. Dates that the child has bruises, dates that the mother "forgot" to pick him up. She writes everything down that he says bad about his mother and step father. We have all the check stubs for sending her money ( replacing child support, when it wasn't in place) We had her sign a paper saying she was not asking for child support for some of the months because my mother in law always had the child. We have things that she has posted on her myspace saying she isn't happy with her husband and he controls her, to things like she thinks she is a bad mom. Can we use all of this?

[cadillac59]

Wow. Thank you so very much. I Learned so much. I feel so much better now. So should we get the child support handled first or just start fighting for custody!?

I would seek custody and at the same time ask the mom pay child support and attorney fees. You probably won't get a cs order or attorneys fee order ex parte (i.e. on shortened or no notice) but you could get the custody change ex parte. Once you get custody ex parte (or even if you don't) the case will be set for a follow-up hearing down the line and you can review the case then and ask for support.

[rhiannahunt]

Loads of fun! My fiancés mother writes everything down. Dates that the child has bruises, dates that the mother "forgot" to pick him up. She writes everything down that he says bad about his mother and step father. We have all the check stubs for sending her money ( replacing child support, when it wasn't in place) We had her sign a paper saying she was not asking for child support for some of the months because my mother in law always had the child. We have things that she has posted on her myspace saying she isn't happy with her husband and he controls her, to things like she thinks she is a bad mom. Can we use all of this?

[cadillac59]

Loads of fun! My fiances mother writes everything down. Dates that the child has bruises, dates that the mother "forgot" to pick him up. She writes everything down that he says bad about his mother and step father. We have all the check stubs for sending her money ( replacing child support, when it wasnt in place) We had her sign a paper saying she was not asking for child support for some of the months because my mother in law always had the child. We have things that she has posted on her myspace saying she isn't happy with her husband and he controls her, to things like she thinks she is a bad mom. Can we use all of this?

I think you can use this stuff. You have to keep the rules of evidence in mind but if the mom has made admissions that she's got parenting problems you can use that against her. Sure. The judge will decide what weight to give it.

Mediation is mandatory in disputed child custody matters so much of these details come up in mediation and the mediator makes a recommendation to the judge of what to do (in most CA counties--a little different in a few others). You don't have mediation in true ex parte requests (the request for emergency orders-- we ought to re-name them "emergency requests" or something like that because everyone in our courthouse uses the ex parte calendar for silly non-emergency matters and the judges get mad and throw them out all the time --I've seen stuff on the ex parte calendar like someone asking to modify a visitation schedule because Sally wants to go to her friend's birthday party this weekend and it's dad's time and he has other plans!. that sort of junk).

[rhiannahunt]

What are the rules of evidence again? Can we use things like : April 21st. I watched sally (mom) pinch Luke (son) because he was crying and did not want to go home.? Then we took pictures the next day and there were bruises.

[cadillac59]

What are the rules of evidence again? Can we use things like : April 21st. I watched sally (mom) pinch Luke (son) because he was crying and did not want to go home. ??? Then we took pictures the next day and there were bruises.

Well, the rules of evidence are in this great big book you buy in law school and spend a year studying, or at least a semester anyway. And yeah, there's a bunch to know. But, many judges sort of give you a break on it in some family law cases (because there are no juries and things can be a little less formal). But keep in mind you can't use hearsay at a trial (we use some things at short-cause law and motion hearings that you couldn't use at trial, like written declarations because the local rules allow it).. Pictures are always okay if you authenticate them (who took them, when, where , under what circumstances). Forget about letters, and most written materials, even police reports are inadmissible hearsay (you have to call the police officer who wrote the report). Again, you have to check local rules. The easiest thing to keep in mind is to use live witnesses and have them relate what they saw, heard, that sort of thing.

[rhiannahunt]

OK. SO when the abuse happened the only people that were there was the father, our son and the step father bio son. They boys are the same age. Now the mother was apparently at the park with friends. Down the street. She got a call saying that she needed to come home right away and hung up. She got there and the paramedics and police were there. The police would not allow the mother to see or talk to the step father. The child had been bleeding from his nose, couldn't get the bleeding to stop for awhile. Then the mother took the soon to my mother in law. Where they called us, and we went to see the boy right away. We took pictures. And the child said that he was punched, then pushed. We took him to the hospital, and the nurse told us to take all his cloths off so we can see if there were any other marks. There were. There was a handprint on his bottom, and prints around his neck and back. We took pictures, and even the mother said, she ignored signs like her husband treating her son a lot different then his. Like disciplining worse and more often. CPS got involved. Made a no contact order, and caught them not following it. By the time his court hearing, the CPS Investigator guy didn't even go to the hearing and let the court know that they have been breaking it.

Then we had a conference with CPS and family. But we were on the phone. And they gave the mother 20 hours of free daycare. And my mother in law offered to watch him over the weekends. Ok so you are probably wondering why they gave her this because she is not even working. Well she is pregnant. So that day she asked the fathers mother to watch her son because she was arguing with the step father, so of course she agreed. The mother left the son there over night so she can calm her husband down. The next day she came to pick her son up, and was acting very weird and a argument occurred with the fathers mother and her. Make a long story short. She took the son away and would not let the gma see him. Wouldn't let any side of our family see him for 2 months.

About 2 weeks after this incident th court just gave him parenting classes and probation. Because of this the step father can't even see his bio son now. The mother of that son, says that they neglect him.

About 3 weeks ago from today, I tried talking to the mother of the abused child and got her to let her son see my fiancés side of the family. So all is OK there. Then we went to visit about 2 weeks ago and she wouldn't even let us have the child over night, because she is scared we will kidnap him!

When her son was around 2 in a half years old. She dropped him off with "of course" my mother in law to stay the night. Because she had to go to a different city to meet some guy she met on the internet.

Now she has been emailing me because we "owe" her back child support. The only court papers we had for child support lasted 3 months and SHE is the one who ended that.

Long story I know! But you are GREAT :)

[Sabbylynn]

I would be contacting the courts and a lawyer... for four kids I get 298 ( was 589) in child support in the state of Kansas.. I would also push four full cust of his son.. with the Abuse going on I would recommend it

[cadillac59]

That's quite a story and I feel sorry for this poor kid. You really have to intervene and not let this situation get any further out of control than it already is. That step-father should never have any contact with this child again (he has no parental rights anyway so why in the world is he even in the picture! ). The boy needs to be with his father (your fiancee) with the mom having supervised visitation at a licensed visitation facility. There should also be a no contact order with the step-dad. If she disagrees then custody still should temporarily switch to dad, supervised visitation to mom, and a full blown custody evaluation ordered to figure what is going on.

Gosh, I wish you the best with this but this is unfortunately a not-too-uncommon case in family law. Messy.

[rhiannahunt]

My Fiancé is going back up there in a month. So should he just get a lawyer, when he's there, or go to the courts and get paper work? This will most likely be my last question! :)

[cadillac59]

My Fiance is going back up there in a month. So should he just get a lawyer, when hes there, or go to the courts and get paper work? This will most likely be my last question! :)

I think he should find a lawyer first. Try to find one that only does family law, if possible. Avoid the ones who have a combination of things they do. If your lawyer's practice is limited to family law he will most likely like what he does and be good at it (we tend to be good at things we enjoy).

All the best.:)

[rhiannahunt]

Thank you very much. My fiancé wants to pay her money still, just so we all get along. Should we still do that?

[cadillac59]

I don't think there's anything wrong with that. Everyone has a legal duty to support his kids whether there's a support order in effect or not.

[rhiannahunt]

Ok thank you. So when he sees his lawyer does he tell him that he wants to do the emergency exparte. And I know it may take awhile to get this going, but with the "emergency" do they take that in consideration?

[rhiannahunt]

Can you refer me to someone in Washington?

[rhiannahunt]

Around the vancouver area?

[cadillac59]

I don't think they allow that on this board (maybe in a private message). There is someone who is in Vancouver, WA who is pretty well-known and well-respected but I won't say who it is unless the board's moderators say it's OK.

[JudyKayTee]

around the vancouver area?

Can't do it publicly or privately - check with your local Bar and see who is on their recommended list.

(Attorneys advertise on these boards and it would be unfair to refer to someone who does not.)

[rhiannahunt]

OK. SO when the abuse happened the only people that were there was the father, our son and the step father bio son. They boys are the same age. Now the mother was apparently at the park with friends. Down the street. She got a call saying that she needed to come home right away and hung up. She got there and the paramedics and police were there. The police would not allow the mother to see or talk to the step father. The child had been bleeding from his nose, couldn't get the bleeding to stop for awhile. Then the mother took the soon to my mother in law. Where they called us, and we went to see the boy right away. We took pictures. And the child said that he was punched, then pushed. We took him to the hospital, and the nurse told us to take all his cloths off so we can see if there were any other marks. There were. There was a handprint on his bottom, and prints around his neck and back. We took pictures, and even the mother said, she ignored signs like her husband treating her son a lot different then his. Like disciplining worse and more often. CPS got involved. Made a no contact order, and caught them not following it. By the time his court hearing, the CPS Investigator guy didn't even go to the hearing and let the court know that they have been breaking it.

Then we had a conference with CPS and family. But we were on the phone. And they gave the mother 20 hours of free daycare. And my mother in law offered to watch him over the weekends. Ok so you are probably wondering why they gave her this because she is not even working. Well she is pregnant. So that day she asked the fathers mother to watch her son because she was arguing with the step father, so of course she agreed. The mother left the son there over night so she can calm her husband down. The next day she came to pick her son up, and was acting very weird and a argument occurred with the fathers mother and her. Make a long story short. She took the son away and would not let the gma see him. Wouldn't let any side of our family see him for 2 months.

About 2 weeks after this incident th court just gave him parenting classes and probation. Because of this the step father can't even see his bio son now. The mother of that son, says that they neglect him.

About 3 weeks ago from today, I tried talking to the mother of the abused child and got her to let her son see my fiancés side of the family. So all is OK there. Then we went to visit about 2 weeks ago and she wouldn't even let us have the child over night, because she is scared we will kidnap him!

When her son was around 2 in a half years old. She dropped him off with "of course" my mother in law to stay the night. Because she had to go to a different city to meet some guy she met on the internet.

Now she has been emailing me because we "owe" her back child support. The only court papers we had for child support lasted 3 months and SHE is the one who ended that.

About a week ago I found out that I can get the paperwork started at the court facilitator office. I went online and looked at all of the packets. I have no idea which one to use. These are the ones that popped up-

# Dissolution (Divorce)
# Paternity (Support and/or Custody-Parenting Plan when parents are not married)
# Modification of Child Support and/or Custody-Parenting Plan
# Contempt
# Step-Parent Adoption
# Non Parental/Third Party Custody
# Relocation

They were never married, and she lives in Washington and we live in Nevada.

Can someone help me! We don't have the money right now to hire a attorney, but we WANT to get the paperwork going. And when we sit down and do this at the court, what paper work must we have. I know we need the proof of the abuse, but is there anything else?