[Wondergirl]

You sound like a treasure!

An idea for your social life, join an ongoing program at your public library. At the library where I work, there's a gamers' group, a book discussion group, twice-monthly travel film viewing, and a new group for writers. At my home library, there's a chess group, a book discussion group, and a group that chooses and watches films of all kinds and then discusses each after viewing (sort of a local Siskal and Ebert thing). Most of these groups meet once a month.

There are also one-time events at public libraries -- tea or wine tasting, cultural dances and music, performances by people who dress up as historical figures, pet care presented by vets or groomers, resume workshops, investment presentations, and so on.

Many park districts and Ys do similar programs, but will usually charge a small fee. Classes may be offered, such as dog grooming/training or swimming. And I haven't even mentioned special programs/concerts/films/performances offered by churches, community colleges, and universities.

Those are some of the places to meet people and try out your socializing wings, as well as places to take a date for an inexpensive but fun time.

[qwerty108]

Ok, it's been awhile so here's a quick update...

I recently found a girl that I've kind of grown to like. She has a kid and the dad used to live with them. (trouble, I know) He recently moved out, and she's back looking for another boyfriend. I told her I was interested but she just saw me as a friend. Before she knew I was interested, I thought to myself that I shouldn't even be interested in the first place because of the kid. As time passed it didn't really bother me much anymore, and she seemed like a fun and easy going person.

Now she goes to the clubs/bars very often... like most weekends at least once, sometimes twice. We've met there a few times, and she is always dancing with some guy, or kissing someone. I get upset because I care! I get that she's a nice person, and I just see things blowing up for her. Maybe I'm wrong because I still sort of like her, but it just makes me upset that she is so unclassy when it comes to her going out. And on top of it, she talks to me about how her night went, and how much fun she had... but really, I was there and saw just enough to see how unclassy it was.

I try to just try to stay away and right now am just trying to not care. She's says we're friends, but she just isn't talking a friends advice. :(

[a la king]

I'm convinced sex is evil... It's like tattoo's or cocaine.. once you have it you never want to stop.. It's TORTURE! In a way waiting for the right person will be great because you'll hopefully be in a situation where you can have it on a somewhat regular basis..

Do yourself a favor (im sure you know this already)... take the little fella for a spin or a thousand the day of.. because once you're "in" you'll last about four seconds... you may even want to try some of that numbing gel... the biggest bummer for the guy is not that you're a virgin... but how quickly the "fun" is over.

And about worrying what the ladies will think.. I really doubt many will care much.. you're like a diamond in the rough! All these men looking for a quick lay... and there you are wanting something genuine!
And depending on the situation (you may end up just being drunk at a bar and go home with someone.. hopefully this doesn't happen) you don't even need to divulge that you're a virgin..

[a la king]

Ok, it's been awhile so here's a quick update...

I recently found a girl that I've kinda grown to like. She has a kid and the dad used to live with them. (trouble, i know) He recently moved out, and she's back looking for another bf. I told her I was interested but she just saw me as a friend. Before she knew I was interested, I thought to myself that I shouldn't even be interested in the first place because of the kid. As time passed it didn't really bother me much anymore, and she seemed like a fun and easy going person.

Now she goes to the clubs/bars very often...like most weekends at least once, sometimes twice. We've met there a few times, and she is always dancing with some guy, or kissing someone. I get upset because I care! I get that she's a nice person, and I just see things blowing up for her. Maybe I'm wrong because I still sorta like her, but it just makes me upset that she is so unclassy when it comes to her going out. And on top of it, she talks to me about how her night went, and how much fun she had...but really, I was there and saw just enough to see how unclassy it was.

I try to just try to stay away and right now am just trying to not care. She's says we're friends, but she just isn't talking a friends advice. :(

Blah! Forget about her! We've all been there.. lusting after a dirty girl... NEXT!

[starbuck8]

Ok, it's been awhile so here's a quick update...

I recently found a girl that I've kinda grown to like. She has a kid and the dad used to live with them. (trouble, i know) He recently moved out, and she's back looking for another bf. I told her I was interested but she just saw me as a friend. Before she knew I was interested, I thought to myself that I shouldn't even be interested in the first place because of the kid. As time passed it didn't really bother me much anymore, and she seemed like a fun and easy going person.

Now she goes to the clubs/bars very often...like most weekends at least once, sometimes twice. We've met there a few times, and she is always dancing with some guy, or kissing someone. I get upset because I care! I get that she's a nice person, and I just see things blowing up for her. Maybe I'm wrong because I still sorta like her, but it just makes me upset that she is so unclassy when it comes to her going out. And on top of it, she talks to me about how her night went, and how much fun she had...but really, I was there and saw just enough to see how unclassy it was.

I try to just try to stay away and right now am just trying to not care. She's says we're friends, but she just isn't talking a friends advice. :(

Bad news buddy! Don't settle for someone like that. First off, her baby's daddy just moved out, and she is already onto the next guy. Not good! She is hanging out at clubs every weekend and asks you to meet her and then dances with other guys and kisses them? Why would you want to put yourself in the middle of all of drama? You said it yourself... "unclassy." This girl will do nothing but hurt you, so don't invest a lot of time and energy into this. You may be missing out on someone that is good for you, and it's not her. Do be in such a hurry that you settle, because in the meantime you are missing someone. Trust your gut on this one. Your gut instinct is rarely wrong. I think you already know. You can't save her from herself. Move onto better things, and save yourself the hurt.

[expat2009]

Stay away from this "unclassy" mum. She will bring you more heartache than you can handle. You can't save her from herself, only she can.

Keep working on yourself and eventually you will meet a girl that is perfect for you.

[qwerty108]

Bad news buddy! Don't settle for someone like that. First off, her baby's daddy just moved out, and she is already onto the next guy. Not good! She is hanging out at clubs every weekend and asks you to meet her and then dances with other guys and kisses them? Why would you want to put yourself in the middle of all of drama? You said it yourself..."unclassy." This girl will do nothing but hurt you, so don't invest alot of time and energy into this. You may be missing out on someone that is good for you, and it's not her. Do be in such a hurry that you settle, because in the meantime you are missing someone. Trust your gut on this one. Your gut instinct is rarely wrong. I think you already know. You can't save her from herself. Move onto better things, and save yourself the hurt.

Good points here. It all makes sense and I know my gut is in the right place. It's just that it's harder for me to look past her since I don't really come in contact with a lot of women that I find attractive and someone I would want to hang out with. I'm a very shy person, but once we hang out and I know that she likes me, then I'm a fun, easy going, outgoing person. I basically work and hang out with my friends who are mostly single and not really looking for anyone. Me, on the other hand want to find someone. My friends are great, but when it comes to picking up women, or even starting up a conversation, it's down-right sad. Most of my friends are also years older than me... 25-28 years of age, and they aren't even worried about finding just someone to be with and care about. I hate to say it, but it worries me that some of my friends may be bringing me down at times. They'd rather stay home and play board games/video games/watch movies with each other than go out and meet new people.

[starbuck8]

Good points here. It all makes sense and I know my gut is in the right place. It's just that it's harder for me to look past her since I don't really come in contact with alot of women that I find attractive and someone I would want to hang out with. I'm a very shy person, but once we hang out and I know that she likes me, then I'm a fun, easy going, outgoing person. I basically work and hang out with my friends who are mostly single and not really looking for anyone. Me, on the other hand want to find someone. My friends are great, but when it comes to picking up women, or even starting up a conversation, it's down-right sad. Most of my friends are also years older than me...25-28 years of age, and they aren't even worried about finding just someone to be with and care about. I hate to say it, but it worries me that some of my friends may be bringing me down at times. They'd rather stay home and play board games/video games/watch movies with each other than go out and meet new people.

What worries me is that since you are thinking there is something wrong with you, and that you might just settle for someone that will hurt you badly. Then you will end up feeling worse than you do now! I know you want to meet someone and have her be the "one" for you. It would be great if it happened that way! But if just go for the first one that pays attention, I can guarantee you will be back here asking what to do about your broken heart. We see it all of the time here!

If you meet someone you "like," then get to know her. You've waited this long, and if you want someone who will likely stick around, don't jump into it! Wait a few months at least! There are other things to do other than intercourse to do in the meantime. If you meet a girl that you like, and you get a vibe that she likes you too, treat her special. Don't smother her or cling to her though. You are still young, and have lots of time! No rush, and don't let the other horndogs tell you that there is!

I think maybe you need to get involved in other activities too. If all your buddies want to do is stay home and play, then you will meet no one! It will get you NOWHERE! There will be no girl knocking at the door for help with her broken down car! ;) Get involved in something you like to do where there are girls!! Seriously, there are a ton of things you can do to meet people that have the same interests as you. The more people you meet... male and female... the better your chances of meeting a whole bunch of girls!

[qwerty108]

What worries me is that since you are thinking there is something wrong with you, and that you might just settle for someone that will hurt you badly. Then you will end up feeling worse than you do now! I know you want to meet someone and have her be the "one" for you. It would be great if it happened that way! But if just go for the first one that pays attention, I can guarantee you will be back here asking what to do about your broken heart. We see it all of the time here!

If you meet someone you "like," then get to know her. You've waited this long, and if you want someone who will likely stick around, don't jump into it! Wait a few months at least! There are other things to do other than intercourse to do in the meantime. If you meet a girl that you like, and you get a vibe that she likes you too, treat her special. Don't smother her or cling to her though. You are still young, and have lots of time! No rush, and don't let the other horndogs tell you that there is!

I think maybe you need to get involved in other activities too. If all your buddies want to do is stay home and play, then you will meet no one! It will get you NOWHERE!! There will be no girl knocking at the door for help with her broken down car! ;) Get involved in something you like to do where there are girls!!! Seriously, there are a ton of things you can do to meet people that have the same interests as you. The more people you meet...male and female...the better your chances of meeting a whole bunch of girls!

I'm not looking to find "the one" really. I'm looking for some fun, and someone to share some time together with. I've never really had a girlfriend that involved kissing, late night phone calls, going out on dates and stuff like that. I want to get my feet wet that way and then I'll know what I want.

And with getting to know someone, I've tried that a few times, and it just ends us being friends. Or they get bf's and then have me to talk to all the time about their problems. So if I sit around and be goody goody friendly to them, I end up just becoming a friend. I'd like to be friends, and then move into more, but it hasn't happened.

[Wondergirl]

I'd like to be friends, and then move into more, but it hasn't happened.

You have to kiss a lot of frogettes before you find your princess.

[qwerty108]

Stay away from this "unclassy" mum. She will bring you more heartache than you can handle. You can't save her from herself, only she can.

Keep working on yourself and eventually you will meet a girl that is perfect for you.

I love this quote about saving her from herself, and that only she can.

This past weekend was a perfect example... Me and a few friends go to the club to play darts and pool. It was her birthday that night so she wanted me and some friends to stop by. She's "seeing" some guy who also frequents the clubs and bars a few times a week. That night he wasn't even hanging out with her, yet he was talking to other girls and pretty much ignoring her. She complained most of the night, but ended up hanging with us most of the night. We were all having a good time, and then she goes and hangs out with another bar rat. Long story short, me and my buddies went to play another round of darts and talked it over. As we left, I figured I should say goodbye, and when I went over there, her "bf" was all over her. I just shook my head and left.

Next day we talked a little bit, and she complained about him again. I spoke my peace about the situation and said "why are you wasting your time?!" Thing is, I was getting upset!! :confused: I know I shouldn't feel this way! Yet she just kind of didn't care too much about it all.

I'm f'in done with this sh it. It's seems pretty clear that she is the only one that can help herself! I just need some help getting over all this drama.

[ashley1693]

Well, for starters, there is absolutely NOTHING wrong with you. Just because you're a virgin doesn't mean your not a good person or there is something wrong with you. And you know your good qualities, one for example being funny. That's always good, ask any girl what she looks for in a guy and about 9 out of 10 girls will have "can make me laugh" or "good sence of humor" on their list.

But I can't really tell if your looking for a girl you want to have sex with or someone you actually want to be with. But if it's someone you want to be with I really don't think a bar is somewhere you'll find her. Usually, and I'm not saying all the time but usually, women who you constantly find at bars on Friday and Saturday aren't the classyest of women or most poliet.

To me, I know it's easier said then done, I think you should just work up the confidence to talk to a girl you would be intersed in and let the chips fall where they may. You will surprise yourself.

Good luck, and I hope I helped:)

[cadillac59]

I'm not saying there is anything wrong with you and there probably isn't, but if you ask a general question about what woman (or men) think of a 23 year old virgin male, the answer is they think it is odd.

And I'm sorry but it is.

[cadillac59]

Not to belabor the point, but it seems the tendency is to either laugh about or applaud the 23 year old virgin. But let's face it, you haven't a lot of company and I think you know that and there is probably something about that that bothers you.

What does being 23 and a virgin mean? It can mean a lot of things, many of which are not good. But there is a reason for it, that's for sure.

I don't want to throw cold water on all the accolades you've been receiving, but if you ask me I'd look at this more seriously and ask what's going on and why.

Just my humble opinion.

[starbuck8]

Not to belabor the point, but it seems the tendency is to either laugh about or applaud the 23 year old virgin. But let's face it, you haven't a lot of company and I think you know that and there is probably something about that that bothers you.

What does being 23 and a virgin mean? It can mean a lot of things, many of which are not good. But there is a reason for it, that's for sure.

I don't want to throw cold water on all the accolades you've been receiving, but if you ask me I'd look at this more seriously and ask what's going on and why.

Just my humble opinion.

Where is there a problem with having respect for your body, and wanting to wait for the right woman? You are making it sound like something is wrong with him because he is choosing to wait, and not be a player like so many of the men out there these days are! At least he knows that he hasn't got any kids running around that he doesn't know about, or that he does know about and now has to be paying for them. He can also be assured he doesn't have an STD! There is NOTHING wrong with someone's decision to remain a virgin until they find the right person. I disagree that he hasn't a lot of company. You would be surprised! There are more people, both male and female, that have made this decision. To imply that he must have something wrong with him because he's still a virgin, at a relatively young age I may add, is very misinformed thinking.

[cadillac59]

Where is there a problem with having respect for your body, and wanting to wait for the right woman? You are making it sound like something is wrong with him because he is choosing to wait, and not be a player like so many of the men out there these days are! At least he knows that he hasn't got any kids running around that he doesn't know about, or that he does know about and now has to be paying for them. He can also be assured he doesn't have an STD! There is NOTHING wrong with someone's decision to remain a virgin until they find the right person. I disagree that he hasn't alot of company. You would be surprised! There are more people, both male and female, that have made this decision. To imply that he must have something wrong with him because he's still a virgin, at a relatively young age I may add, is very misinformed thinking.

I understand and I'm not trying to put the OP down on a personal level. But, he already said religion plays no part in this. So if that's true, what does?

Why is it "disrepectful" of your body to have sex? Sex is a normal and essential part of well-being. Unwanted kids and STDs are not an inevitable part of being sexual (in fact both are easy to avoid), so I don't see that as a very strong argument.

When I said that not all that being an older virgin might indicate is good, I meant it could mean, for example, 1) low self-esteem and social anxiety; or 2) being gay but deeply in the closet. This is not an exhaustive list but I think you know what I mean.

All I'm saying is I wouldn't be so quick as to pass this off as something wonderful.

Speaking from experience, I waited a while before having sex with a woman but that was because when I was young I was a deeply closeted gay man who was afraid of coming out, didn't want to be gay, didn't understand I didn't have a choice in the matter, had no positive role models, no support and thought that my only option was to have sex with women. But I didn't find women sexually attractive so I put off seeking sex with them for a long time. And if someone had handed me kudos for "waiting" it would have sent the wrong message and compounded the problem. See my point?

[talaniman]

It its not very fair to project your own feelings on others, as what may seem odd to you, may be normal to others.

That's like saying because I'm not attracted to those of the same sex, theirs something odd with those who are.

That's not fair. Humans have a very wide range of attitudes, and behaviors, and its all in line with being unique human beings. That one is different from you, should not erase the fact of being human, therefore like others, and part of the whole, but unique unto themselves.

Bottom line, its all good! And at 23, presuming an identity crisis its premature to assume that he has any problems at all, lacking more facts, but I can understand the thinking.

[cadillac59]

It its not very fair to project your own feelings on others, as what may seem odd to you, may be normal to others.

Thats like saying because I'm not attracted to those of the same sex, theirs something odd with those who are.

Thats not fair. Humans have a very wide range of attitudes, and behaviors, and its all in line with being unique human beings. That one is different from you, should not erase the fact of being human, therefore like others, and part of the whole, but unique unto themselves.

Bottom line, its all good! And at 23, presuming an identity crisis its premature to assume that he has any problems at all, lacking more facts, but I can understand the thinking.

Let me share something personal, that I've never shared with anyone, so why not tell the world now?:)

When I was about the age of the OP I lived in Southern California (Pasadena) and I went to an internist for a physical exam. There was nothing wrong with me--I was healthy, but I had a lot of anxiety.

Well, it was the late 1980s, the worst time of the AIDS epidemic, and during the exam the doctor (who I absolutely hated at the time) asked me a question as part of my health history. He asked, "Now, are you gay, straight or bisexual?" I was really taken back by the question and assumed he asked it as part of a screening of risk for HIV. But that's not why he asked the question. I looked at him, and (being deeply closeted) I lied and sheepishly uttered, "straight..." (almost in the form of a question, like I was trying to guess the correct answer on a game show). He then asked, "Now are you heterosexual or asexual?" I asked, "asexual, you mean, having sex with women?" He said, "yes." My reply was, "no." I'll never forget the almost baffled and very concerned look on his face, with the stethoscope hanging around his neck. Then he said, "why not?" I answered, "I don't know, is that unusual?" He said, "for a man your age, ahem, YEAH." (The look on his face at that point was almost complete shock.)

When the exam was over I asked him, "Why the question about sex earlier?" He said, "You're a young man with a lot of anxiety-- in my experience when people have that level of anxiety it almost always has something to do with sex."

To this day I wish I had listened to the guy, or delved further into this, or been honest and said I was gay. I would have saved myself a lot of grief. He was the only one who wasn't willing to buy my pathetic "I'm straight" line at the time and probably saw right through it. He had been probing at the closet door, trying to peek in and I wouldn't let him. Something didn't pass the "sniff test" with him and he, being a very intelligent (as much as I didn't like him) and very thorough medical examiner, knew something just didn't seem right. But he knew he couldn't take it further than he did because he was not a psychiatrist, or psychologist and I wasn't there for that sort of exam.

He got close to helping me with what was the largest problem of my life and source of my anxiety. To this day I regret not answering him with an honest, "I'm gay."

So, as I said, all the kudos to the OP may or may not be helpful in the long run. Still waters run deep and all of that...

[starbuck8]

I understand and I'm not trying to put the OP down on a personal level. But, he already said religion plays no part in this. So if that's true, what does?

Why is it "disrepectful" of your body to have sex? Sex is a normal and essential part of well-being. Unwanted kids and STDs are not an inevitable part of being sexual (in fact both are easy to avoid), so I don't see that as a very strong argument.

When I said that not all that being an older virgin might indicate is good, I meant it could mean, for example, 1) low self-esteem and social anxiety; or 2) being gay but deeply in the closet. This is not an exhaustive list but I think you know what I mean.

All I'm saying is I wouldn't be so quick as to pass this off as something wonderful.

Speaking from experience, I waited a while before having sex with a woman but that was because when I was young I was a deeply closeted gay man who was afraid of coming out, didn't want to be gay, didn't understand I didn't have a choice in the matter, had no positive role models, no support and thought that my only option was to have sex with women. But I didn't find women sexually attractive so I put off seeking sex with them for a long time. And if someone had handed me kudos for "waiting" it would have sent the wrong message and compounded the problem. See my point?

I do understand your point, I truly do. But you are looking at this from your own experience. I don't believe this is the case with Qwerty, from everything I've heard him say. Please correct me if I'm wrong Qwerty. I didn't mean to imply that there is anything wrong or un-natural about sex. What I meant was respecting your body by waiting for the right person is a redeemable quality. Too many young people have sex, just because they feel the pressure to do it. Many times they regret that choice, and other problems come from that. Come on this forum on any given day, and see how many girls and guys are so heartbroken, because they thought their "first" was the love of their life! Some use that as a ticket to sleep with anything that walks afterwards, because their first time was a very bad experience! So my point is, is that justs because you decide to remain a virgin for whatever length of time, isn't such a bad idea! Now if a man (or woman) was like the 40 yr old virgin, then I might be questioning other things. But 23? No! There is nothing wrong with that. Qwerty has already stated his interest in women. My understanding is he just doesn't want to give it up to just any girl! He's fine!

[cadillac59]

Starbuck8:

I don't know if you posted your answer before my last post about my personal experience, but my last point serves to point to the basis for my concern.

No, 23 is not old, but where's the right age?