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frebeckil · May 21, 2006, 05:31 PM

My husband of 30 years has fantazied with every woman he comes in contact with, even as we are together. He sneaks winks, touchs and speical connections with any woman, regardless if he knows her or not. It seems to be a challenge to see if he can get them to respond. When we are in public he is constantly browsing for a woman. It is his sneaky nature that nauseates me. No telling how he acts when I am not present. I never travel with him anywhere because his energies are so overwhelmed with the possibilities that it is like I am not even there... not a fun guy, but he sure thinks he is Don Juan!

aqua@home · May 21, 2006, 05:47 PM

What exactly is your question?

frebeckil · May 21, 2006, 05:54 PM

Sorry, I needed to vent... just wondering how to psycologically remove myself from this irritating situation. It has a serious affect on my attraction to him and that is not good for our relationship. I lack respect for him when he is so sneaky and foolish! I guess I need to know how to overlook this habit.

aqua@home · May 21, 2006, 06:07 PM

No problem, I just wasn't sure what you needed. I am in awe that you have been able to tolerate this for 30 years. I can't imagine. I really don't know what you can do. He is being really disrespectful and needs to know how hurt and bothered you are by his actions. I can understand you not being attracted to him because of this, as it would be a complete turn off for myself.

Besides marriage counselling I don't know what else is possible. What would his reaction be if you acted the same way? Have you ever tried? It might make him see how it feels. I know that is probably the immature thing to do but it might open his eyes.

Do you know what he gets out of it? He keeps doing it for a reason. You could really embarrass him and I'm sure it would stop cold turkey. You could respond in public with a loud remark like "why don't you bring her home for us?" or "would you like me to go and ask her out for you?" I may be way out to lunch here but I really wouldn't tolerate these actions. It is a little fun to think about doing it anyway.

I hope you get some great answers. Take care.

valinors_sorrow · May 21, 2006, 06:08 PM

I can appreciate the strange situation you are in but pease bear in mind I am not a doctor, nor should a doctor on a website take the place of your real doctor.

It may ease your mind to realise this may or may not be within his ability to control and I would personally want that to be established first. Compulsive flirting is an entirely different problem than simply an insensitive spouse.

As you suggested, it would be very interesting to know what he does when you aren't there... is there anyone you could discreetly ask about that?

Also, has he done this a long time and at the same rate of intensity, apart from the fact that it increases when you travel (which may be a reaction to the stress more than anything)?

And for the obvious question, have you tried talking to him about it?

The reason I am asking all this is because what you are describing sounds similar to behaviors found in delusional disorders, which is cause for talking to his doctor about it.

Although some might argue that acting out a mild delusion hardly makes for a mental illness (just look that the movie "Don Juan De Marcos") losing track of the line between fantasy and reality might be.

And it is something that is making you uncomfortable. It would me too.

Here is a link with more information on delusions: Delusion - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

After learning about delusional disorders, I would suggest it being your call as to who you talk to and how to proceed.

Tommyp!972 · May 21, 2006, 06:11 PM

Reverse the situation... time for you to have some fun... see what he does then and tell him if it bothers him that much how do you think you like it after 30yrs...

aqua@home · May 21, 2006, 06:12 PM

That is a good point valinors... I didn't even think he might not be able to control it. Frebeckil?

milliec · May 21, 2006, 08:25 PM

my dear,
first of all, you state yourself that he has no respect for you. Beside this intolerable behavior, is he being disrespectful in any other ways?
my guess is, he is.
respect is something you must have in any relationship, a marriage can't do without it.
you haven't mentioned if you ever discussed it with him, but even if you haven't, he must know how you feel, because you can't hide such strong resentful feelings - they'll show through your expression, through your body language, through your voice intonations.
he might find this a way to annoy you, and by this he feels he has a power over you.
I don't think you should deal with the question of why he's doing it - if it'd because of a delusional prob;em, he badly needs care.
but: you can't make him do anything about himself if he doesn't want to.
the only thing you can do, is understand why you've put up with it, and how can you change yourself so as to stop this.
it doesn't really matter so much what he does behind your back: the issue here is that he makes you suffer,and there's no reason under the sky for you to go on taking this in.
you must take care of yourself and stop this suffering. For this you'll need a very good counselling help.
remember that people change only if they really suffer the way they are - you can't change him, and if he doesn't suffer, he won't even think about changing.
please write again,
and take really good care of yourself - your feelings are your first priority,
millie

fredg · May 22, 2006, 04:44 AM

Hi, frebeckil,
Is this the only thing in your 30 yrs of marriage that bothers you?
I've been married now for 29 yrs to a wonderful woman (the second marriage for both of us).
I personally still look at a pretty woman, am not dead yet! I am 64.
Looking is normal, but that's all there is to it. Ever thought your husband might be cheating on you? Actually having an affair?
I seriously doubt it. He is trying to prove something to himself; that he is still attractive to others. I know he shouldn't be going to these "extremes", but if this is all you have in your long marriage that bothers you, I would try overlooking it.
I think your marriage is "stable" enough, at this point, that you don't have to worry about him actually "following through" with any of his Don Juan approach. If you have talked with him about it, and he still does it, then you can either just accept him the way he is, or keep worrying about it. "Worry" only makes for more worry, and more "nauseas" feelings.
Best wishes.

frebeckil · May 22, 2006, 06:57 AM

WOW! I really appreciate all the responses and it is amazing how every single response hit on exactly my thoughts! The most benefit I have received from all of you is to assure me I am not totally crazy... I already know I am very insecure.
In response, yes, I am a communicator by nature and have talked this and explained in various forms how much all this has always bothered me. He more then knows and I do not think he is doing it to bother me because of his sneaky nature. He just gets caught once in awhile. No, he is a peace lover, he would much rather get away with it. I realize it is a strong need for him and have tried to overlook it by saying it helps him feel better about himself. That is the delusional part, he thinks he is attractive to all women. His flirting has had different degrees of seriousness through the years. No, Fredg, this is not the only problems we have had... do you consider lying for the best part of 25 years a marital problem?? In the last few years with us having serious problems with his dishonesty and sneakiness he finally did resolve to work on his lying and I do give him credit, he has done very good. It was a lifestyle for him and I believe in impeccable honsesty so we were not matched in heaven! Do you consider "looking" at a pretty woman the same as making eye contact, smiling, saying hello and brushing against them if he is so lucky? I came to a point where I simply asked him to refrain when I was with him, because I feel embarrassed and put down for another woman... yes, I know I am too dependent on him for myself esteem and that is where I agree with Tommyp... I need to do the same and not for the reason of spite , but to make myself feel good. I have done that and it works since I am an outgoing person. I just think that in a good marriage you build each other up and you don't need outsiders to make you feel good... oh, that's in a GOOD marriage! That is kind of the solution I am taking... I am jumping out of his pool of charmed women and throwing in the towel.
I really appreciate the support from all of you and I know I cannot change anyone except myself and that has been my biggest mistake, thinking if I talked to him about it he would honor me and stop it but, I am a slow learner, 30 years of talking hasn't helped! OK... plan B!

valinors_sorrow · May 24, 2006, 02:47 PM

I found this here, for what its worth and thought of you when I read it.
Welcome to CyberShrink.org

Can Flirting Be A Problem That Requires Therapy?

Question submitted December 21, 2003: I have a "problem" to share, and I hope you can help me with it. I am a 28 year old, single, man. The problem is flirting. Whenever I'm with a girl, I flirt. It doesn't have to mean anything. I do it just for fun, and it doesn't bother me. What makes me call it a "problem" is the reaction of others. My ex-girlfriend left me because of this. I've had some fights with jealous husbands or boyfriends, and even my 20 year old sister says that I embarrass her when I flirt with her friends. Considering the facts and that I'm aware of it, you might ask, "Why don't you just stop?". The problem is that it has turned into a habit, and I find myself doing it naturally. Another problem is that I still can't see what's wrong with flirting. So, do you think it is a problem? If so, do I need therapy?

CyberShrink's answer posted 12-22-03: Flirting, in some circumstances, and when one senses that others find it acceptable, may be "natural". However, compulsive flirting (that is, flirting that "...has turned into a habit") is not "natural" (when "natural" means "common and generally accepted"). When one functions under compulsion, one is not in conscious control of oneself, even if one can observe oneself in the act. Compulsive behavior is a problem and, depending on the compulsion, it also can have undesirable consequences: " My ex-girlfriend left me because of this. I've had some fights with jealous husbands or boyfriends, and even my 20 year old sister says I embarrass her when I flirt with her friends." With such presumably unwanted social consequences to your flirting, your not being able to "...see what's wrong with flirting" --or what's "wrong" with how, when, and with whom you flirt-- is a cognitive problem in itself. In summary, your flirting appears to be compulsive as it is not under your conscious control, and you have difficulty appreciating the negative reactions of others to your flirting. In other words, you have a rationalization for your compulsion, that is, you think of it as "natural". You have called your difficulty a "problem". Perhaps it would make sense to start thinking of it as a problem (without the quotation marks). If you think it is necessary to change your compulsive behavior, or if you want to both change and better understand the sources of your behavior, treatment is available. Keeping a girl friend, not triggering hostile reactions, and learning to be in charge of yourself, may be sufficient reason to consider therapy.

talaniman · May 24, 2006, 04:29 PM

After more than 30 years of marriage I can tell you that making your wife uncomfortable in public after talking about it over and over is sick. This behavior is not to be put up with unless it is something a doctor needs to address! If he refuses to seek help(I think he needs it bad!) you must do whatever you need to for yourself. Personally I'm out of here till you get help! May be cruel but NESSESARY!:cool:

frebeckil · May 31, 2006, 06:07 AM

I agree with all of you but, actually it is the sneakiness that bothers me more then the flirting. It does not inspire trust. Now he has told me that I am imagining these incidents! This has been his angle on the last 2 incidents. I know that we all respond differently to the opposite sex whenever we are interacting, we naturally flirt to some level, I recognize it in myself but, like I said the sneakiness, trying to "be careful" is what bothers me. I must say that I have been convinced that MAYBE I did imagine what I saw?? Before he is finsihed he will have me convinced to commit myself!! I just would like to know if it is normal for men to want to connect with other women in a so called harmless way, without really crossing the line?? I need the point of view of other men... am I being too sensitive? Thanks.

talaniman · May 31, 2006, 06:38 PM

I am not ashamed at all to say that I have many female friends (My wife knows them all) and in the last 32 years I've never cheated on my wife! Real men know the boundries of relationships and we don't cross the line! I can only speak for myself and other REAL men! Whether you are too sensitive is a question only you can answer.:cool: :)

valinors_sorrow · May 31, 2006, 07:44 PM

Both my husband and I flirt and are flirted with but never never never to the serious discomfort of anyone, especially each other. Like good natured teasing, there is a line. Over the line is just plain unnecessary, uncouth and unacceptable.

talaniman · May 31, 2006, 08:28 PM

RIGHT ON VAL_ discomfort is the key word!:cool: ;)

Myth · May 31, 2006, 09:10 PM

Hire a private detective... if he's sneaky when your around what are you not seeing that he's being sneeky about. I would err on the side of caution.

frebeckil · Jun 2, 2006, 06:38 AM

He says it is not sneakiness, he says I put him on "pins and needles" worrying about what I will precieve him doing... am I expecting too much to keep his hands to himself?? You guys that responded, do you quietly and tenderly grasp the hand of another woman? His problem is he thinks he is god's gift to women and it is his duty to make all women feel special!! As far as I know he has never crossed the line, just played as close to the line as possible. He has limited exposure to women so I figure he is overstimulated once he gets in their presence... I am just trying to understand the male sex drive and need to feed the male ego.

talaniman · Jun 2, 2006, 07:09 AM

No! It is not too much to ask for your husband to keep his hands to himself! That's a given for a married man! He should be making you feel special and not worry about how other women feel. He ignores your feelings ignore his and see how he feels. REFUSE to go in public with him is what I would do!