[jaime90]

My sister and I have been playing video games since we were both about 4 years old
(1994; we're twins, so the same amount of years) I have yet to find any female gamers that are as hardcore into video games as we are. Most don't play Gears of War, Call Of Duty, Halo, Mass Effect, or Bioshock- they just play rock band or guitar hero (which yeah, I play too) How come there aren't very many girl gamers? I just figured it was because our culture teaches that women aren't supposed to be aggressive or competitive, and that video games are for guys, so women don't really get that chance to play and get hooked to the games like most guys do. Plus, adolesents can conform to their culture better than anyone, so it kind of makes sense to me.
What I've heard is that guys like it because they're more of what a man was built to do- to defeat the game, but there's no hormonal barrier that prevents a woman from being as or more aggressive than a man, so what's up? Why are there so few female gamers?

[albear]

They just don't appeal to many females and also you've probably experienced the attention that you receive from some people for being one, which I think put a lot of females off as well, pluss its considered kind of geeky in a way, if you descride yourself as an avid gamer.

[asking]

The sexes do differ in aggressiveness, which is one reason most of the people locked up for violent crimes are men. I think it's like 97% or similar. That's not to say that women can't be aggressive--and I don't just mean criminally. Women an be competitive and determined, which you can see in sports since we passed Title IX. (I wanted to compete in sports in the late 60s and wasn't able to because there were almost no sports for girls then). So I'm sympathetic to what you are saying. I tend to like "guy" activities myself. (I've even played grand theft auto with my teenage sons. :)) But women's willingness to take chances or do things like that is less on average, despite individual differences, and there IS social pressure against girls and women doing certain things.

It's really hard to say what's "biological" and what's social engineering, since babies/toddlers start getting trained early in what's acceptable. I see parents tell their 2 years olds "You are so pretty" if it's a girl or "You are so strong" if it's a boy, and let boys behave aggressively but get upset if a girl does the same thing. It can be very subtle, but persistent, and it's the stuff adults don't even realize they are doing that's most potent. When my older son was in grade school, the schools were just getting computers. I had taught him to use one and to make minor fixes when things went wrong. At school, the female teachers would act helpless around the computers, refuse to learn anything and ask the boys to help them. My son became the 4th grade computer guru, even though he really didn't know that much. It bugged me that the teacher was modeling helpless behavior for the kids, especially for the girls. Then people would make remarks about how it was just "natural" for my son to understand computers because he was a boy.

So sexism stories: I tried to buy a motorcycle a few years back and they wouldn't let me test drive the bike, even though I'd put money down for one and had been riding for years, had my license. They didn't say no, they just ignored me for an hour and chatted with male customers until I went away. I kept asking about riding "my" bike, and they would just say, "in a few minutes." No one ever talked to me. They weren't busy either, just guys shooting the breeze. It was a good way to get rid of me because I don't make a scene most of the time.

Last year, when I went to the department of motor vehicles to renew my driver's license, the young guy behind the counter tried to get me to not renew my motorcycle license and not take the test. He told me I didn't "need" a motorcycle license. I said I wanted to take the test and I passed with flying colors and renewed my license. Then another woman walked up to me and said he'd tried to talk her out of renewing her license too! How weird.

[bEaUtIfUlbRuNeTtE]

I love video games but only if they're Donkey Kong, Mario or Yoshis' Land. I like they older ones. My sisters and I used to be pros at them. I still remember every hidden banana in Donkey Kong, and where all of the 'bad guys' were in Mario.

Currently I don't play many video games, only because I work full time. If I could get an old Nintendo console with the games mentioned above, I would.

[jaime90]

I don't know, people say that men are more aggressive because they have higher levels of testosterone than women, but I heard that testosterone doesn't increase when a man has an aggressive out burst, or before an aggressive outburst, but after, and that if there is a link between testosterone and agression- it's a weak one. So what is the difference between men and aggression, and women and agression- it can't be anything hormonal right? I would not argue that men are more aggressive than women generally, but I think that it has nothing to do with the way that men and women are "built" but rather, what culture says is acceptable- an aggressive woman isn't much accepted in this culture, maybe that's why.
Overall, since I'm definitely more "boyish" than girly, I have to say that there is more differences between me and the average "girly girl" than me and the average guy, personally. There are more differences within the sexes, than between them, at least that's how I see.

[asking]

Men's testosterone levels go up if they win a game (or if their team wins a game). The levels go down when they lose. Women's seem to do the same thing.

But really I think there's a lot more to this than just hormones. People give themselves permission to act in certain ways. With succeess, comes a burst of confidence, and sometimes a hormone burst. So brain surgeons have higher testosterone levels than football players, who have higher levels than accountants. But it may be that the brain surgeons have high levels BECAUSE they are getting treated like gods all t he time. They aren't brain surgeons because they have naturally high levels. Not enough research in this area. (All this is from an advanced textbook I have on hormones and behavior.)

Whoops. My son is calling me. This is a fascinating subject though!

[jaime90]

I heard that women who work have higher testosterone levels than women who stay at home. So does that mean that women who have higher testosterone levels work, or work causes women to have higher levels of testosterone? Are some women just born with more testosterone?

[DanPatrick10]

The sexes do differ in aggressiveness, which is one reason most of the people locked up for violent crimes are men. I think it's like 97% or similar.

Actually, recent studies have proven that violent crimes by men are on the decline. Women are capable of being violent and hostile just as much as men. In fact, in most cases the female is more aggressive than the male.

The women's rights movement views women as not being capable of being violent while men are the sole cause of violence. Instead of having equal rights as men things have been twisted into being superior to men and ridiculing them.

The domestic violence power and control wheel (Duluth Model) is faulty and uses the "her" pronoun and addresses men as being abusive and dominating yet says nothing about women equally.

[asking]

Actually, recent studies have proven that violent crimes by men are on the decline.

Yes. Down for women too. Violent crime has been down for some time and lots of speculation about why that is so. Gamers point out that the declines in violence don't support the idea that gaming causes violence. :)

I'm finding that about 14% of convicted violent offenders are women; the other 86% being men.

[spyderglass]

HEY! I LOVE Halo, my husband thought I was the coolest when we met. I like Fable and a lot of the Star Wars based games. Oh and the Godfather game is awesome! I like Call of Duty as well. I think that there are more women who are gamers than you think. We just have better stuff to talk about most of the time.

[terellowens]

My sister and I have been playing video games since we were both about 4 years old
(1994; we're twins, so the same amount of years) I have yet to find any female gamers that are as hardcore into video games as we are. Most don't play Gears of War, Call Of Duty, Halo, Mass Effect, or Bioshock- they just play rock band or guitar hero (which yeah, I play too) How come there aren't very many girl gamers? I just figured it was because our culture teaches that women aren't supposed to be agressive or competitive, and that video games are for guys, so women don't really get that chance to play and get hooked to the games like most guys do. Plus, adolesents can conform to their culture better than anyone, so it kind of makes sense to me.
What I've heard is that guys like it because they're more of what a man was built to do- to defeat the game, but there's no hormonal barrier that prevents a woman from being as or more agressive than a man, so what's up? Why are there so few female gamers?

there are a lot of female games but they are ''casual gamers'' so may only play on the wii and DS for example and play games like mario etc where as a huge minority are hardcore gamers and play everyday and play games like gears of war and call of duty like yourself.

I consider myself a hardcore gamer but sometimes I go months without playing my Xbox 360 or PS3 but can then spend hours a day on my console and can't get off it lol

I seem to have a hibernation mode that randomly comes on when I realise I need to be studying etc

to answer your question I just don't think it's that socially acceptable perhaps to be a hardcore female gamer maybe they are out there but keep it to themselves :) even with their girlfriends around they may still not admit it I have no problem saying I love video games most people think you grow out of it when your 18 no chance here :)

[jaime90]

Violence in the media is supposed to cause more violent thoughts, but not more violent actions. Games don't murder people, people do. And if someone can't distinguish a game from real life, then they shouldn't be playing it.

[brittykitty]

I love halo and all those games. And I'm a girl. Im into it hardcore and always have been. It depends on who you talk to and how many people you know. There are a ton of female gamers I know :D

[BMI]

I'm a dude but the topic was interesting:)

Most of the girlfriends I'vehad would always want to play games when the system was on, they all loved it, but none of them were ever into it enough to actually have their own system. I always wondered why I don't see so many girls into games? Good answers.

[jaime90]

Of gaming systems I've owned a PS1, Sega Genesis, Nintendo64, Atari, Xbox, Xbox360, and multiple PC games. The people I watched play video games before getting interested, was my dad and cousins. Oddly enough, I've been desensitized to violence. Probably because the first video games I played were Mortal Kombat and War Gods, yeah, when I was 4.

[asking]

I think it helps to start when you are young. I found it hard to get good at games because first I'm older and second, I always felt funny about spending the amount of time on it that I'd need to get good enough to compete with my kids. They didn't hesitate to spend hours getting good, but I always felt like I should be working on something "useful." My job, housework, bills... So I didn't master even the mechanics. So if I play, I'm awful, even though some of the games are appealing to me, especially the driving games. I've played some shooter games and done well, but only as a beginner--not tactics. But anyway, so I don't play because it's not fun to lose constantly and my two teenage sons are massively better than I am. I am guessing a lot of girls and women get a late start on gaming and then experience that feeling of not being any good. So they don't play.

On the other hand, in my life, I've done a lot of hiking and rock climbing, ridden my bicycle all over big cities, commuted on a fast motorcycle for several years, rebuilt my motorcycle's engine, worked on the engines of several cars, built a telescope and ground my own mirror, and so on. I got a friend to teach me how to shoot a gun and even asked him to take me hunting (he never did). So I do like guy activities and toys. But all these things, I did as an adult. When I was a kid, I kept asking for toys for boys and never got anything except dolls, night gowns, and paint sets. I was super athletic as a kid, but couldn't even throw a softball well because I'd never played those kinds of games. My parents didn't even buy me a bicycle... I grew up in Girlland, before Title IX. In school, sports for girls meant being a cheerleader. Period.

I'm so glad things are different now!

[BMI]

I think the topic of violence and how it corresponds to a woman's interest in video games is a valid take.

Most video games are either sports titles or games with some level of violence. Women, majority I'd say, are not sports fanatics nor do they want to see movies such as platoon or the like. Makes sense that video games tailor towards those who do enjoy these genre's.

Alternatively, some girls I know do really enjoy the cuter games, such as Mario Golf or something similar, same as movies, less violence more substance.

Would be a very fascinating study though.

[jaime90]

I also know how to shoot a gun, and shoot a bow, and I'm pretty good at it. When I was younger I took hunter's ed and am able to hunt now.

Girls do like to play more of the games like Mario and donkey kong and such. I would definitely agree that a majority of women don't watch violent movies. My first R rated movie was "the Matrix" when I was 11, my first chickflick was "The Notebook," that was 2 weeks ago. =) For the record, I'm supposedly heartless- I couldn't find the part where I was supposed to cry, so I laughed at the end and said, "that was a good movie!"

I'm definitely drawn toward action, and suspense movies. When I was a kid, I was never into sports, and I did ask for toys from the "boy aisle" mostly G.I. Joes, action figures, and legos. My first action figures were batman and wolverine. My parents never stressed to me that as a girl, I was supposed to be into dolls and makeup, I was free to be interested in whatever I wanted to be interested in. It would be cool if more kids grew up that way without all the pressure.

[asking]

I think it's a vicious circle--positive feedback. Game makers see that games pitched at boys sell better, so they make more of those and invest more money in making those types of games better. So boys and men and parents of boys are more likely to buy those good games. Meanwhile, girls start to feel like gaming isn't really a girl thing, so they are less likely to do it; most of them feel like a fish out of water (plus haven't got good at it, from not playing). They also really are less interested in the violence and, there aren't very many good games that are NOT oriented around traditionally "male" interests. So the become even LESS likely to play. So the gaming industry is less likely to make a "game for girls."

Another factor is that the average parent spends more money on toys for boys than on toys for girls. More generally, parents spend more on their sons than on their daughters (on average, I'm not talking about individual parents; there are always exceptions). But you only have to walk around Toys R Us to see how many more toys there are that are specifically pitched at boys than there are for girls. Count the pink "girl" aisles, then count the "boy" aisles. (In fact, parents of boys are less likely to get divorced than the parents of girls, another measure of commitment. :rolleyes:)

So anyway, there's more of a market for games pitched at boys, which means more and better games, girls getting turned off and wandering off to do something else and gaming becoming a male preserve (for the most part).

[asking]

Similarly, in the early days of the computer industry, there was a much bigger percentage of young women involved than there is now. Women were not driven out, just overwhelmed by many more men coming in and then girls seeing computers as not "feminine." Kind of like the way not that many men become nurses. It's not that men can't do the work, it's just an image thing.