[ericmarcial]

When I go back to court on the 1st I'm going to ask for a court appointed lawyer... im not spending my money on some B.S. that I shouldn't have to. And I'm not laying down just yet. Anybody disagree with that? " IF " they appoint one to me and IF the lawyer is the worst possible one I could be appointed with, this should be a easy case for him to win. Right? Any opinions on this?

[traceyrco]

Eric, I sure wish you'd attempt to educate yourself some on the laws as I've given you all the resources you need. Even going to your local JP court most of them have sheets of procedures with a little legal help on them. You can't go to the judge and ask for a lawyer unless you know how to do that and secondly, you have to prove that you have no money of your own to hire one. IF you would do some reseach you could probably find grounds to have the case dismissed on your own - you have a trial on the 1st and you don't even know what their evidence against you is? You could have it dismissed on lack of evidence if you tried to help yourself even a little with the references I gave you. Is the 1st a trial or hearing? If it's the trial you may lose just because you don't have time to ask for their evidence - you need to get a continuance. Looks as though you've backed yourself into a corner and you have to have an attorney to get you out.

You absolutely must take responsibility for your own wellfare and lift a few fingers to help yourself or take the charge, pay your fee and have it on your record. That's what the DA wants so he has another conviction on his score card.

Call the Texas State Bar Association and get a lawyer referral for $20 for a half an hour. I am probably wasting my time offering that too - but I do understand your upset and would like to see you succeed.

From the looks of it you just want to pitch a fit and have this go away - I hope that I am wrong because this is not going away - it's going on your record.

[ericmarcial]

I spoke to John Roades... he is running for DA.. I asked him what happens when I go on the 1st without a lawyer. He said they will just reset it again. When I went the first time there were a lot of people there that requested court appointed attorneys... they fill out a form and then the court tells you yes or no. maybe I should have did that the 1st time around. But ill do it this time and see what happens. This is a small town I live in. there's only the local library. They mite have the books you recommended. I guess ill have to just go look.

[traceyrco]

Okay, just post on here what happens and if you don't get an attorney I will try to find a form for you from one of the books next time I go to the library. It wouldn't hurt though to spend $20 bucks to talk to a local criminal defense attorney through the bar referral program. Just Google Texas State Bar Association and call the referral number.

[JudyKayTee]

i spoke to John Roades...he is running for DA..i asked him what happens when i go on the 1st without a lawyer. he said they will just reset it again. when i went the first time there were alot of people there that requested court appointed attorneys...they fill out a form and then the court tells you yes or no. maybe i shoulda did that the 1st time around. but ill do it this time and see what happens. this is a small town i live in. theres only the local library. they mite have the books you recommended. i guess ill have to just go look.

Straight from the Texas site - some Courts want a formal financial affidavit (form), others do not. This says it all. You can (apparently) walk into Court during business hours and ask for the financial form/request for a Court-appointed Attorney. You do not have to wait until the Court date.

How to Request a Court-Appointed Lawyer
1. The following information is designed to help you through the process of requesting an appointed lawyer in Texas courts. This material is not a substitute for the advice of a lawyer — it‘s just a roadmap to help you ask for a court-appointed lawyer if you are accused of a crime and can‘t afford to hire a lawyer on your own.
Ask For a Lawyer EARLY in the process
The court system is complex and having a lawyer by your side is important. Even if you feel like you just need someone to explain what‘s going on, ask for a defense lawyer as soon as you get a chance.
After an arrest, you will be brought before a magistrate, who will read you your rights and determine your eligibility for bail. Tell the magistrate you want to request a court-appointed lawyer, and ask to fill out a written application for appointment of counsel. If the magistrate tells you that you cannot ask for a lawyer, or that you don‘t need a lawyer, politely insist on your right to request a court-appointed lawyer.
If you do not request a lawyer from the magistrate, you still may request an application for appointment of counsel — ask the jailer or court administrator for the proper forms. If you are brought to court and either have not submitted a written application for appointment of counsel by that time or have not received a response to a previous request for a court-appointed lawyer, you should inform the judge that you want a court-appointed lawyer.
Ask to Complete a Written Request for Court-Appointed Counsel
Whether you are speaking with a magistrate, court administrator, or to the judge, you should ask to make a written request for a court-appointed lawyer. The name of the form for submitting a written request for counsel varies by county, and might be called “Application for Appointment of Counsel” or “Appointment Request Form.” Ask for this form when you ask the magistrate, jailer, court administrator, or judge for a court-appointed lawyer or for help in requesting a court-appointed lawyer.
Ask to Complete a Financial Questionnaire
Most counties will require you to submit a form providing financial information that demonstrates that you cannot afford to hire a lawyer before they will approve your request for a court-appointed lawyer. The requested financial information will include information on your income and expenses. The county may ask for your financial information on the application for counsel or on a separate form often called a financial affidavit or financial questionnaire. When you ask for an application for counsel, ask if there is a separate financial form that you need to fill out in order to complete your written request for a court-appointed lawyer.
Document Your Finances
If you go to court without a lawyer and want to ask the court to appoint you a lawyer, it is useful to bring pay stubs, bank statements, and copies of your monthly bills with you to court, particularly if you have been released on bond. These documents will help the court determine whether you qualify to receive a court-appointed lawyer.
Be Persistent
Sometimes judges and other officials will put off your request for a court-appointed lawyer, usually by telling you to try to hire a lawyer. If the judge asks or tells you to try to hire a lawyer, try to speak to at least two lawyers before your next court date. If possible, have these lawyers give you a written estimate of what it would cost to hire them in your case. Be certain that the price the lawyers give you reflects the reality of your case — for example, if you believe you are innocent and want to go to trial, the cost of a lawyer likely will be significantly higher than if you want a lawyer to help you understand your plea options and plea bargain with a prosecutor. If you cannot afford the prices the lawyers quote you, you should return to court and again ask the court to appoint you a lawyer. Be prepared to tell the court about your efforts to hire a lawyer on your own.
Always Show Up for Court
Never skip court because you can‘t afford to hire a lawyer, even if the judge said that you had to hire a lawyer before your next court date and you don‘t have enough money to do that. Just keep asking for a lawyer and filling out written requests for appointment of counsel every time you go to court. Skipping court will lead to a warrant being issued for your arrest.
If you have additional questions about how to ask for a lawyer, call TFDP at 1-866-207-6532. If you have requested a court-appointed lawyer and feel that your request was wrongly denied, submit a complaint.

I mean no disrespect but I do not see that doing your own legal research will help you - most people do not know how to do legal research (which is taught in law school), don't know how to cite cases and, more importantly, don't know how to read the law and/or cases. People post what they think is case law all the time - recently two "authorities" were posted. One was in the wrong country and also on the wrong subject; the other was an appeals case and the decision concerned the right to appeal, not what the OP asked.

Anyway, this is what the Texas Law site says.

[ericmarcial]

I went to court this morning and requested a court appointed attorney.. luckily I was appointed one. The attorney is suggesting that I attend some kind of classes and by my next court date my case will be dissmissed. My next date is on dec. 3, the classes are like 25.00 a week. So id end up spending about 200 hundred on these classes.. any comments or opinions on this?

[traceyrco]

Hmmmmm... sounds like a good way for him not to have to do anything. Do you feel like these classes would be a benefit to you? Could be a really great thing - unless you're like me - then it's a really boring waste of money thing.

I guess it's worth considering - what are your other options?

From taking care of my dad's case pleading his defense and counterclaims - doing the legal stuff on your own is a real witch - of course your case is so less involved than what I've got going on. On the other hand - I used to live in a city with a really horrible - outrageous kanagroo court. They had gobs of complaints against them from lawyers and nothing changed. The only lawyers that would even take a case in that town was the new ones that didn't know better. This court was so bad, when the prosecutor could see they would lose the case as charged they would literally ask the judge after all arguments were heard to change the charge and instructions to the jury so it would stick! It happened all of the time - but not being a court of record I guess they never got in trouble. On the other hand, other Texas cities are so lax that for example the judge hearing a case on public intoxication leans over and asks the defendant - have you been drinking this morning already? The defendant says - yes sir - and the judge just carried on as if he wasn't talking to a drunk. My point is - you never know what you'll get in muny court.

So basically - you just need to ponder this whole notion and see what you come up with - and really call the state bar and get a $20 consultation. I'll tell you a secret - most of the lawyers don't want you bugging them by coming into their office for 30 min. and $20 because they know it's hard to quit at 30 min. and you're only paying $20 bucks - so - lucky for you - they will talk to you on the phone for free.

Since you don't have the time and resources and probably not the aptitude either for fighting your own case - and like I said - even with a lawyer - if you get in these kangaroo courts - lawyer or not you lose - you may want to do the classes. Call a bunch of lawyers and talk to people on the street to find out if the court you're in is a good or bad one and make your decision from there.

Take care!

[JudyKayTee]

i went to court this morning and requested a court appointed attorney..luckily i was appointed one. the attorney is suggesting that i attend some kind of classes and by my next court date my case will be dissmissed. my next date is on dec. 3, the classes are like 25.00 a week. so id end up spending about 200 hundred on these classes.. any comments or opinions on this?

If you don't take this "deal" and by some chance are found guilty, what is the sentence?

And then which would you rather face, that possible sentence or paying $200 and some time on classes - ?

[ericmarcial]

A friend of mine doesn't like the idea of the classes... he says that taking the classes makes it look like I am admitting I have a problem(family violence) and that I will be among people that I am not really in the same "class" with(people that beat up their wife and kids). I was defending myself. Now that I have a lawyer(court appointed) I find it hard to believe that a jury would convict me if they tried to put themselves in my position. What will the jury think when they are told that the other person was already found guilty of assaulting me. It was already established that I was "the" victim of family violence. If they were in my shoes would they really think it fair to find us both guilty of the same thing? If I AM the victim doesn't it make more sense that I WAS trying to defend myself? I find it hard to believe that the DA is taking it this far and really thinks I can be found guilty. On the 1st I spoke to the DA assistant. We went back and forth- I told him " if i am found guilty then that means that i could go to your house start a fight and when you swing back and hit me then your guitly too" he said "yup thats the law" I don't think so.. he's fulla . Plus I have a clean record. No priors. And I have witnesses. I feel like taking this all the way to court but with all the crookedness who knows what will happen.

[JudyKayTee]

a friend of mine doesnt like the idea of the classes...he says that taking the classes makes it look like i am admitting i have a problem(family violence) and that i will be among people that i am not really in the same "class" with(people that beat up their wife and kids). i was defending myself. now that i have a lawyer(court appointed) i find it hard to believe that a jury would convict me if they tried to put themselves in my position. what will the jury think when they are told that the other person was already found guilty of assaulting me. it was already established that i was "the" victim of family violence. if they were in my shoes would they really think it fair to find us both guilty of the same thing? if i AM the victim doesnt it make more sense that i WAS trying to defend myself? i find it hard to believe that the DA is taking it this far and really thinks i can be found guilty. on the 1st i spoke to the DA assistant. we went back and forth- i told him " if i am found guilty then that means that i could go to your house start a fight and when you swing back and hit me then your guitly too" he said "yup thats the law" i dont think so ..he's fulla . plus i have a clean record. no priors. and i have witnesses. i feel like taking this all the way to court but with all the crookedness who knows what will happen.

Somehow I suspect a fair number of the other people taking classes have the same concern - they don't want to be in a room with alleged criminals, like you.

You obviously don't believe the advice that has been given to you so go with a jury trial, see what jurors do or don't believe, see if the DA is kidding and come back and let us know what happened.

I think this has turned into a message board and should be closed.

[ericmarcial]

This is what's bad about taking the classes- lets say they don't dismiss the charge after I take these classes--they will have the opportunity to say --" so you admit you have a problem..you have been taking classes for it" then I'm screwed even more than before. People on this "message board" have been telling me not to lay down. Taking the classes would be a way of laying down. The system/DA is trying to screw me and get this win. Its wrong that their win is more important then screwing up someone's life with a criminal record.. someone that only tried to defend himself in his own home AGAINST SOMEONE THAT WAS FOUND GUILTY OF ASSULTING HIM.

[excon]

Hello again, eric:

If you take the deal, you are going to plead GUILTY!! That means you are admitting that you assaulted somebody. That means you ARE a criminal and you'll be in class with OTHER criminals, just like you.

So, don't get hung up on the class. You're only doing it because it's part of your deal. You don't have to pass. You don't have to agree with anything they say.

But, let me say again, one last time, because you want the law to be the way YOU want it to be - and it AIN'T.

You say, that if you swing back, you're NOT guilty of anything. In fact, you are. It would be MY thoughts, that if you go to trial, you'll be found guilty, and you'll spend some time in the gray bar hotel.

But, I like people who don't lay down. I like people who fight the good fight... I DON'T like people who put their heads inside the noose for their executioners, and I think that's what you're doing.

excon

[ericmarcial]

EXCON: what would you do?? Take the classes or fight in court? Because I'm not understanding your post. Its conflicting with it self.

[ericmarcial]

Self defense law says you can use force against another if unlawful force is being used against you. So I think I can swing back and not be guilty in this case. I was hit with a bottle before I swung back. Before I swung back I told the person to leave my house.. instead of leaving this person attacked me.. thats when I swung back once and then it ended.

[ericmarcial]

Post guilty or innocent

[excon]

Hello again, eric:

Don't be mislead by the CLASSES. They're going to be over SOON. A conviction on your record, however, will last FOREVER, and will cause you MUCH more trouble than a few lousy classes. So, I would start thinking a little longer term.

Look. I don't know what happened. I don't know ANYTHING other than what you've said. I wouldn't and couldn't tell you how to plead given the limited information that I have.

That's WHY you have a lawyer. HE knows what happened. More importantly, HE knows what THEY know. HE knows the laws. HE knows the prosecutor. HE knows the judge. HE'S the one who you should listen to. If you don't trust him, get one that you do.

I know that's not going to happen... I'm sorry you're choices aren't good. But, they're YOUR choices.

This ISN'T rocket science. The law they're charging you with is VERY specific, and contains certain elements. If you DID what the law says you CAN'T do, then you're guilty. If you DIDN'T do what the law says you can't do, then you're not guilty. There's no in between. You COULD read the law all by yourself, you know.

excon

[ericmarcial]

excon you say my choices aren't good but I haven't really made any chioces yet. The only thing I've done so far was managed to get myself a court appointed lawyer. (that saved me a lot of money) that wasn't a good choice? I'm trying to decide what to do. You make it sound like the class is the way to go but that seems like laying down to me. And you don't like people who lay down. You sound more confused than me.

[excon]

Hello again, eric:

There's no confusion over here. I LOVE people who make the RIGHT decisions. If you're NOT guilty, and can beat the charges in court - YOU'RE da man.

If you're GUILTY, and take the deal - YOU'RE da man.

If you're GUILTY, and you manage to beat them in court - YOU'RE REALLY da man.

But, if you're GUILTY, and you're offered a good deal, and you turn it down, and they CONVICT you, and you go to the slam - you AIN'T da man.

If I was there, I could tell you what to do. But I wasn't - and I won't.

excon

[Alty]

Eric, you cannot change the law, it is what it is no matter how you feel about it.

You are either innocent or guilty according to the law. You have a lawyer who knows the law and is recommending that you take this course. If you decide not to and want to fight this in court then you may be found guilty according to the law.

It doesn't matter whether you think you're guilty, it's whether you are guilty according to the law.

You don't want to lay down, would you rather be pushed down?

You have a lawyer, you either trust that he knows the law and is giving you good advice, or you find one that you do trust.

Good luck.

[ericmarcial]

Now my lawyer is saying if I will take an anger management class (1 class for 75.00) my case will be dissmissed. This might be my best bet. Its still messed up though... I guess a man's home isn't his castle after all... and I'm not saying that a man should have a right to beat up whoever in his home.. thats not what happened. That one man got away with shooting a man in the back for robbing his neighbor but I'm not supposed to hit someone in self defense when I'm being assulted in my own home. (one swing is what happened and it was over)what does anger management have to do with that? Go figure.