[asking]

Originally Posted by inthebox
Yes, I'm glad that to be a citizen in a country that respects a person's achievements based on merit. Not on gender or race.

You must be a white male.

Hahahaha! This is one of the funniest things I have read here in ages. :)

[Wondergirl]

Obama can deny it all he wants to ;but the principal reason he left "community organizing " was because it was a waste of time.

Ummm, he's still doing it.

[Wondergirl]

You must be a white male.

Hahahaha! This is one of the funniest things I have read here in ages.

So? Are you?

[bushg]

You must be a white male.

Wondergirl, I believe you will find the answer to the above in this post that I am attaching.


Jul 10, 2008, 04:27 AM #35 Report Inappropriate Post
inthebox
Senior Member



Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 630
Gringo - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia




Quote:
Gringo (feminine, gringa) is a term in the Spanish and Portuguese languages used in some countries of Latin America to refer to white foreigners from different cultures, particularly English-speakers, and especially from the United States, although it can also refer to people from Canada, the United Kingdom, Australia, New Zealand, and other countries, including in some cases other countries of Latin America itself.[1][2][3]




I have lived in multiple places east of the Mississippi River never been called a gringo by a person of Hispanic origin... could be because I'm not Caucasian. I wonder if blacks get called gringo?

[inthebox]

You must be a white male.

What would make you think that?

[Wondergirl]

What would make you think that?

Your comment that included the phrase "respects a person's achievements based on merit. Not on gender or race" flies in the face of reality. I know of so many instances where honest and skillful work hasn't gotten excellent workers anywhere.

[inthebox]

Is that not the ideal?

To judge a person "by the content of their character" [ MLK ]

Why wallow in the ideology of victimitology?

[BTW I'm male but not white]

My parents, and I found out quickly in elementary school, taught me that you have to be better than average to prove yourself. They did not teach me that the majority population [ US gov ] owes me anything.

"respects a person's achievements based on merit. Not on gender or race" flies in the face of reality.

This kind of reality?

Acceptance of Blacks, Latinos to UC Plunges - Los Angeles Times
...
Because African American and Latino high school students on average have lower scores, Berkeley’s tougher standards meant fewer of them were admitted.

Second, UC Berkeley last year relied more heavily on affirmative action to boost its numbers of African American and Latino students, while UCLA had for years incorporated race and ethnicity in a more elaborate formula that gave extra consideration for underprivileged backgrounds.

...

Admissions officials said they have no explanation why whites and Asians are more inclined to opt out of stating their race.

[ETWolverine]

You'll make yourself sick again, Elliot... Did you "forget" he serves in the US Senate??

No, I just wish I could.

In the Senate, he has accomplished NOTHING, as his own resume above demonstrates. But because he speaks well, the Dems have somehow decided that he's the Messiah.

Exactly what part of Obama's senate career qualifies him to be President, Chou? Can you name anything he has accomplished? I have named several things that Palin has accomplished. Can you name a single thing Obama has accomplished?

Sorry, but sitting in the Senate, failing to get anything you propose enacted, failing to vote on 45% of the issues that come up, failing to accomplish ANYTHING, and then not even completing your first term in the Senate before announcing your presidential candidacy does NOT qualify you to be president. Can you point to any accomplishment of Obama in the Senate... or for that matter in the Il State Senate? You're a Chicago girl, if I remember correctly. What has Obama accomplished for the State of Il in his State Senate career that qualifies him for the office of President?

Intelligence and rationality and a calm disposiiton count for a lot in a President; that's Obama.

Calm disposition? Here are a few statements from Obama that illustrate his "calm disposition".

"I cannot swallow whole the view of Lincoln as the Great Emancipator." (So let's rewrite 143 years of history.)

"I've got two daughters. 9 years old and 6 years old. I am going to teach them first of all about values and morals. But if they make a mistake, I don't want them punished with a baby." (Since when is a baby a punishment? I thought that babies were a blessing.)

"If the people cannot trust their government to do the job for which it exists - to protect them and to promote their common welfare - all else is lost." (Gee, and I thought that promoting the welfare of the people was the job of individuals, and that the job of the government was simply to protect their right to do so. I had no idea that the government's job was to make me happy.)

"It's not surprising, then, they get bitter, they cling to guns or religion or antipathy to people who aren't like them or anti-immigrant sentiment or anti-trade sentiment as a way to explain their frustrations." (Yeah. Very calm disposition.)

"Over the last 15 months, we've traveled to every corner of the United States. I've now been in 57 states? I think one left to go." (Need I say more.)

"We can't drive our SUVs and eat as much as we want and keep our homes on 72 degrees at all times... and then just expect that other countries are going to say OK." (Why not? We drilled for the oil, we built the SUVs, we created the wealth, and we created the technology that uses the resources. Why shouldn't we utilize what WE created?)

"We need somebody who's got the heart, the empathy, to recognize what it's like to be a young teenage mom, the empathy to understand what it's like to be poor or African-American or gay or disabled or old - and that's the criterion by which I'll be selecting my judges." (Unless that teenage mom is named Bristol Palin. And I thought that the job of judges were to enterpret the law, not to be 'compasionate'. Why bother with judges that have laws degrees if compasion is the criterion by which judges should be selected.)

"When we think of the major threats to our national security, the first to come to mind are nuclear proliferation, rogue states and global terrorism. But another kind of threat lurks beyond our shores, one from nature, not humans - an avian flu pandemic." (Well, it's nice to know that this man with 'calm disposition' has his priorities straight.)

"Why can't I just eat my waffle?" (Unfortunately, the rest of the country has to eat his waffle too. His waffle on the issue of Jerusalem, on the issue of campaign finance, on the issue of abortion and human rights, and on many more issues.)

"Race is still a powerful force in this country. Any African American candidate, or any Latino candidate, or Asian candidate or woman candidate confronts a higher threshold in establishing himself to the voters ..." (Unless that woman candidate is named Sarah Palin.)

Is this the calm disposition to which you refer?

We all have seen what little intelligence and LACK OF RATIONALITY can do to a country in 8 years... that Bush Presidency was a DISASTER.

Really?

Let's see.

Lower taxes than 8 years ago, but with greater federal government income.
Lower unemployment (even now) than 8 years ago.
50 million people in Iraq and Afghanistan freed from tyranical rule.
Higher average incomes per family.
Real estate prices higher than they were 8 years ago (yes, even now).
More federal money being used for ecological and environmental purposes than ever before.
More free medicines being distributed by the USA to African countries than ever before.
No terrorist attacks on US soil since 9/11 (compared to an average of 2 per year for the 40 years prior).
Iraq has a 78 billion dollar economic surplus, and is taking control of it's own security, slowly but surely.

Yeah, it's a complete disaster out there. And it's all Bush's fault.

And keep in mind, that in the 2 years that Congress has been in Democrat hands, we have seen
a doubling of the price of oil and the price of gas at the pump,
a weakening real estate market,
the fall of several major mortgage lenders (Thank you Chuck Schumer)
a decrease in the value of the dollar,
higher unemployment than under a Republican controlled Congress,
several major airlines have gone under,
Airlines have started charging for baggage, food and basic ameneties that used to be free,
Russia has begun to rear its ugly soviet head again,
and several terrorist groups and communist world leaders have endorsed Barrack Obama for President.

Yep, Bush is a complete disaster, ain't he. Good thing those Dems have everything under control.

Gee, it's just like old times... Grrrrrrrr

Watch your blood pressure. :(

Elliot

[Wondergirl]

failing to vote on 45% of the issues that come up

What has Obama accomplished for the State of Il in his State Senate career

In the IL Senate, Obama:
* worked across party lines for the good of the state
* helped deliver what is said to have been the first significant campaign finance reform law in Illinois in 25 years
* brought law enforcement groups around to back legislation requiring that homicide interrogations be taped
* helped bring about passage of the state's first racial-profiling law
* was a chief sponsor of a law enhancing tax credits for the working poor
* played a central role in negotiations over welfare reform
* successfully pushed for increasing child care subsidies

ET, do you understand what is meant by the "present" vote in Illinois legislature sessions?

"I cannot swallow whole the view of Lincoln as the Great Emancipator." (So let's rewrite 143 years of history.)

from historynow.org:
...the Great Emancipator legend has had a decidedly distorting effect on our understanding of Lincoln's position, confusing him with those who openly advocated the abolition of slavery. In fact, Lincoln was always keenly aware that slavery, though morally wrong in his eyes, was sanctioned by law, and he frequently acknowledged that the rights of slave owners, both to retain their slaves and to have fugitive slaves returned, were clearly guaranteed in the Constitution. Before the outbreak of civil war, he advocated nothing that would directly challenge those rights. This position sharply distinguished him from abolitionists, many of whom were actively involved in supporting runaway slaves, and all of whom viewed the returning of fugitive slaves as unconscionable, whatever the Constitution might dictate. The most radical abolitionists openly denounced the Constitution for its protection of slavery and repudiated its authority.

Lincoln, by contrast, never put his antipathy for slavery ahead of his allegiance to the Constitution. He admitted privately that he hated to see slaves "hunted down, and caught, and carried back to their stripes," but he classed himself in 1855 with "the great body of the Northern people [who] do crucify their feelings, in order to maintain their loyalty to the constitution and the Union." 2 His public support of the Fugitive Slave Law moved the implacable Boston abolitionist, Wendell Phillips, to label him "the Slave Hound of Illinois."3 While the common goal of abolitionists was to put an end to slavery everywhere, Lincoln ran for president in 1860 on a platform that promised to leave slavery undisturbed in the states where it already existed.

"I've got two daughters. 9 years old and 6 years old. I am going to teach them first of all about values and morals. But if they make a mistake, I don't want them punished with a baby." (Since when is a baby a punishment? I thought that babies were a blessing.)

Babies are a blessing when one can care for them properly. Thank God, Obama's older daughter is not pregnant.

"If the people cannot trust their government to do the job for which it exists - to protect them and to promote their common welfare - all else is lost." (Gee, and I thought that promoting the welfare of the people was the job of individuals, and that the job of the government was simply to protect their right to do so. I had no idea that the government's job was to make me happy.)

I thought the (Republican-led) government has been promoting our welfare and protecting us in all sorts of ways since 9/11.

"It's not surprising, then, they get bitter, they cling to guns or religion or antipathy to people who aren't like them or anti-immigrant sentiment or anti-trade sentiment as a way to explain their frustrations." (Yeah. Very calm disposition.)

I grew up in a small town and saw exactly that--something worth ranting about. "Small-town values" my foot!

[ConfusedInAK]

I like Sarah... she's a nice lady, but politicians are ALL the same!

I now "vote for Pedro"

[ETWolverine]

In the IL Senate, Obama:
* worked across party lines for the good of the state

To do what?

* helped deliver what is said to have been the first significant campaign finance reform law in Illinois in 25 years

What law was it. What did it do? Was it passed?

* brought law enforcement groups around to back legislation requiring that homicide interrogations be taped

And that is significant because..

* helped bring about passage of the state's first racial-profiling law

There were already FEDERAL racial profiling laws on the books. What did a state law accomplish that the federal law didn't already do? Except create issues of jurisdiction between federal and state law enforcement agencies?

* was a chief sponsor of a law enhancing tax credits for the working poor

How about sponsoring a law to lower their taxes, along with everyone else's?

* played a central role in negotiations over welfare reform

Which side was he on... pro welfare reform or against welfare reform? And how successful was he?

* successfully pushed for increasing child care subsidies

Again, why not just lower taxes.

ET, do you understand what is meant by the "present" vote in Illinois legislature sessions?

Yep. It means I don't want to vote "yea" because I disagree with the motion, but I can't vote "nay" because of the political risk involved, so I'll vote "present" so as not to stick my neck out and take responsibility for my position on the issue.

All in all, I don't see anything in your summary that can be defined as an accomplishment that makes him qualified for the presidency. For all the description of what issues Obama supposedly supported, you still haven't told me what he ACCOMPLISHED. He's the candidate of change. What change did he bring to Illinois? He's the candidate of reform. What reform did he bring to Illinois? What did he DO?! What accomplishment can he point to and say "I did that, see? That's why I should be President." Nobody seems to be able to answer this very basic question.


[/quote]from historynow.org:
...the Great Emancipator legend has had a decidedly distorting effect on our understanding of Lincoln’s position, confusing him with those who openly advocated the abolition of slavery. In fact, Lincoln was always keenly aware that slavery, though morally wrong in his eyes, was sanctioned by law, and he frequently acknowledged that the rights of slave owners, both to retain their slaves and to have fugitive slaves returned, were clearly guaranteed in the Constitution. Before the outbreak of civil war, he advocated nothing that would directly challenge those rights. This position sharply distinguished him from abolitionists, many of whom were actively involved in supporting runaway slaves, and all of whom viewed the returning of fugitive slaves as unconscionable, whatever the Constitution might dictate. The most radical abolitionists openly denounced the Constitution for its protection of slavery and repudiated its authority.

Lincoln, by contrast, never put his antipathy for slavery ahead of his allegiance to the Constitution. He admitted privately that he hated to see slaves "hunted down, and caught, and carried back to their stripes," but he classed himself in 1855 with "the great body of the Northern people [who] do crucify their feelings, in order to maintain their loyalty to the constitution and the Union." 2 His public support of the Fugitive Slave Law moved the implacable Boston abolitionist, Wendell Phillips, to label him "the Slave Hound of Illinois."3 While the common goal of abolitionists was to put an end to slavery everywhere, Lincoln ran for president in 1860 on a platform that promised to leave slavery undisturbed in the states where it already existed.

[/quote]

Which means what, exactly?

Who made the emancipation proclamation?

Who fought a war to end slavery in the USA, because doing so meant the unification of the North and South and of Whites and Blacks?

Who AMENDED THE CONSTITUTION because he felt the Constitution was wrong on the issue of slavery. Yes, Lincoln was a Constitutionalist, which is why he followed the rules laid down by the Founders to CHANGE the Constitution. One thing he did not do was "reinterpret" the Constitution.

Babies are a blessing when one can care for them properly. Thank God, Obama's older daughter is not pregnant.

Sorry, but babies are ALWAYS a blessing. If not for the natural parents, then for some other person willing to adopt. What they are NOT is a punishment or something to be gotten rid of or avoided because someone sees the baby as a headache. And you are right... thank G-d that Obama's daughter isn't pregnant. He'd probably have the baby aborted, possibly just before birth. And if the abortion failed, he'd abandon the baby to die on its own. I'm glad his daughter isn't pregnant.

I thought the (Republican-led) government has been promoting our welfare and protecting us in all sorts of ways since 9/11.

First of all, which "Republican led government" government do you mean? Last I heard, the Dems controlled Congress, which means that Bush can't do anything without their say-so. Second, the Constitution specifically requires the government to provide security from foreign and domestic threats of war and crime. That is VERY different from having a requirement to provide us with welfare to keep us happy, for which there is no Constitutional provision.

Here is section 8 of the US Constitution. The bolded parts are the ones about defense (the stuff we've been doing since 9/11).

Section 8. The Congress shall have power to lay and collect taxes, duties, imposts and excises, to pay the debts and provide for the common defense and general welfare of the United States; but all duties, imposts and excises shall be uniform throughout the United States;


To borrow money on the credit of the United States;


To regulate commerce with foreign nations, and among the several states, and with the Indian tribes;


To establish a uniform rule of naturalization, and uniform laws on the subject of bankruptcies throughout the United States;


To coin money, regulate the value thereof, and of foreign coin, and fix the standard of weights and measures;


To provide for the punishment of counterfeiting the securities and current coin of the United States;


To establish post offices and post roads;


To promote the progress of science and useful arts, by securing for limited times to authors and inventors the exclusive right to their respective writings and discoveries;


To constitute tribunals inferior to the Supreme Court;


To define and punish piracies and felonies committed on the high seas, and offenses against the law of nations;


To declare war, grant letters of marque and reprisal, and make rules concerning captures on land and water;


To raise and support armies, but no appropriation of money to that use shall be for a longer term than two years;


To provide and maintain a navy;


To make rules for the government and regulation of the land and naval forces;


To provide for calling forth the militia to execute the laws of the union, suppress insurrections and repel invasions;


To provide for organizing, arming, and disciplining, the militia, and for governing such part of them as may be employed in the service of the United States, reserving to the states respectively, the appointment of the officers, and the authority of training the militia according to the discipline prescribed by Congress;


To exercise exclusive legislation in all cases whatsoever, over such District (not exceeding ten miles square) as may, by cession of particular states, and the acceptance of Congress, become the seat of the government of the United States, and to exercise like authority over all places purchased by the consent of the legislature of the state in which the same shall be, for the erection of forts, magazines, arsenals, dockyards, and other needful buildings;--And

To make all laws which shall be necessary and proper for carrying into execution the foregoing powers, and all other powers vested by this Constitution in the government of the United States, or in any department or officer thereof.

I grew up in a small town and saw exactly that--something worth ranting about. "Small-town values" my foot!

Then you agree that Obama was ranting, not speaking with a "calm disposition". (Ooops, I think you blundered into that one. If it was a rant, it wasn't a calm disposition, even by your own definition.)

[Wondergirl]

Yep. It means I don't want to vote "yea" because I disagree with the motion, but I can't vote "nay" because of the political risk involved, so I'll vote "present" so as not to stick my neck out and take responsibility for my position on the issue.

Then you agree that Obama was ranting, not speaking with a "calm disposition". (Ooops, I think you blundered into that one. If it was a rant, it wasn't a calm disposition, even by your own definition.)

Your personal comment regarding "political risk" skews the meaning of "present."

I rant very calmly with clenched teeth and sarcastic mien. I'm sure Obama does too.

[excon]

All in all, I don't see anything in your summary that can be defined as an accomplishment that makes him qualified for the presidency.

Hello Elliot:

The Constitution says that a person needs to be a natural born citizen and be 35 years of age. Apparently, our founders didn't think you needed any more qualifications than that. If it was good enough for them, it's good enough for me.

excon

[Skell]

And you are right... thank G-d that Obama's daughter isn't pregnant. He'd probably have the baby aborted, possibly just before birth. And if the abortion failed, he'd abandon the baby to die on its own. I'm glad his daughter isn't pregnant.

That is a ridiculous thing to say. Disgusting actually, and certainly not what I would expect from you Elliot!!

[tomder55]

Skell . The reason Elliot brings it up is because Obama blocked legislation in the Ill. Senate that specifically protected surviving babies of botched late term abortions.

[Credendovidis]

The Constitution says that a person needs to be a natural born citizen and be 35 years of age. Apparently, our founders didn't think you needed any more qualifications than that. If it was good enough for them, it's good enough for me.

How sad for those who needed assistence during birth... So if you were born by "cesarean" you have to find another job? Or more a case to prevents Star Trak's Data to become US President? What about Data's colleague Worf ? He was natural born :>)

:D :D :D

And you are right... thank G-d that Obama's daughter isn't pregnant. He'd probably have the baby aborted, possibly just before birth. And if the abortion failed, he'd abandon the baby to die on its own. I'm glad his daughter isn't pregnant.

That is a ridiculous thing to say. Disgusting actually, and certainly not what I would expect from you Elliot!!

Indeed ! Disgusting. No other words for that.

For ETWolverine : :mad: :mad: :mad:

.

[Credendovidis]

Skell . the reason Elliot brings it up is because Obama blocked legislation in the Ill. Senate that specifically protected surviving babies of botched late term abortions.

Tom : that makes Elliot's remark even worse...

:(

[tomder55]

I think it makes Obama's position monsterous. By contrast ,the Congress passed Federal Protection laws almost identical in language; and even the most radical pro-abortion Senators voted for it.

[ordinaryguy]

That is a ridiculous thing to say. Disgusting actually, and certainly not what i would expect from you Elliot!!!

Based on his record, it's exactly what I would expect from him. I had dared to hope that he had gotten bored with AMHD and moved on, but oh well.

[Emland]

Hello Elliot:

The Constitution says that a person needs to be a natural born citizen and be 35 years of age. Apparently, our founders didn't think you needed any more qualifications than that. If it was good enough for them, it's good enough for me.

excon

I think we would be better off as a nation if we took everyone who qualified and put their name in a hat and just chose one at random.