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*Judith* · Mar 5, 2006, 05:14 AM

Skinwhite You say you are of a different culture to the one in which you live... has this affected your life and relationships in any negative way? Can I ask [if its not too personal] whether you yourself are muslim?

Scaredgal I cannot thank you enough for sharing your story with me. Just reading it really made me feel more awake to the world and I truly appreciate your practical advice over what to tell him as this is one of my biggest worries! Mainly I just feel completely naïve and stupid for getting into this in the first place... and to make things worse he has a hearing tomorrow and so that really is D-Day in that it will determine whether he will be deported or allowed to stay another month.

momincali You said you felt that the age gap is too big in our relationship, can I ask why that is? Its just that when I'm with him it does truly fell that we're on the same level

kp2171 thank you for sharing your story... I do really appreciate life experience as it makes it easier for me to take on board you advice. What did you do... you say that you were glad you didn't get married but why?
You were right in saying that I fell obliged because it has got to that point now because a little while ago I said I would marry him and now he's relying on that because he may be gone tomorrow and we're both scared... but I'm not sure I can do it anymore having thought it through in more detail and form listening to the advice given me on here... what can I do?

talaniman · Mar 5, 2006, 10:41 AM

You can be honest and tel him you cannot be married before you get yourself and your life in order.If he loves you he'll understand and go by your wishes whether he stays in the country or not.If not you will find out a few things about him you didn't know before.Stick to your guns!:cool:

*Judith* · Mar 5, 2006, 01:15 PM

talaniman: I do really want to be honest with him and let him know that I'm uncertain as to whether marriage is the best option for us. But I don't see how I can as his hearing is tomorrow [March 6] and I think it would just all be too much for him to take as we are both aware that this may be the only way he can be allowed back into Britain. I did try and show him other options for him [for example obtaining a work permit] but he wasn't having any of it.

You say "Stick to your guns!" can I just ask what you mean by that?

NeedKarma · Mar 5, 2006, 01:19 PM

Dear Judith,

It would appear that you are going to do what you have been palnning to do all along. After reading all of the advice offered in this thread you don't seem to want to 'get it' and my money is that you will do nothing different that the day you first posted here. Just my opinion.

*Judith* · Mar 5, 2006, 01:20 PM

NeedKarma Im sorry but I don't understand a word of what your trying to say! Could you possibly rephrase it?

CaptainForest · Mar 5, 2006, 01:35 PM

Originally Posted by *Judith*

NeedKarma Im sorry but I don't understand a word of what your trying to say! Could you possibly rephrase it?

Originally Posted by NeedKarma

Dear Judith,

It would appear that you are going to do what you have been palnning to do all along. After reading all of the advice offered in this thread you don't seem to want to 'get it' and my money is that you will do nothing different that the day you first posted here. Just my opinion.

He said that he doesn't believe you are looking for advice, but rather for people to agree with you.

And for the record, I think he brings up some good points.

You will not listen to anyone, but rather, just want someone to agree with your original course of action

*Judith* · Mar 5, 2006, 01:47 PM

Captainforest and NeedKarma I honestly do not know what to do and so am truly searching for advice I don't know the right path to take... I.m just really struggling and so resorted to asking about it on this forum. I'm not looking for someone to agree with the original course of action because there was no original course of action! I do agree with several people here about my age and my lack of life experience and am starting to believe that I was wrong in my way of dealing with it but I don't know what I can do about that... Im just looking for practical advice about how to deal with a situation that is way beyond my control

31pumpkin · Mar 5, 2006, 03:05 PM

Hey, Judith, Talaniman means "stick to your guns!" It means stand your ground for making your point to this young man why you feel ,(& will subsequently DO)that it marriage is not" our" best option now. You have some of your own, like work permits I heard.

I am from the USA. I was 25 when I married a Lebanese man, 26. We "dated" for oh about 14 mo. Prior. He had already "used" some other poor girl to get married to & divorced . Maybe he didn't love anymore . Seemed a little of both to me. Anyway, I was naïve even at that age. I kind of loved him. But I think it was because he loved me so much. He took me travelling & bought me things. He could afford it as he owned a profitable business . His business last about 2 yrs. After I met him because it was in a predominantly Jewish neighborhood . And he being Muslim well, there was unrest in Lebanon at the time. 1975 & 1976. When things didn't go well for him that way, he changed. His jealousy was the biggest reason I left. It became violent . I coulnt stand how I couldn't even wear shorts. His relatives did help him to start another business but this didn't help. I realized I didn't love him anymore. That he was just too "foreign" for me
After 11/2 yrs after marriage. He drank some Arak 1 night & I took a beating ( don't worry, no permanent damage- but caused me to have a miscarriage. My big brother came to the rescue, & talked some good sense into me though. As for him , well he fled beforehand. So big bro didn't have to get into trouble because he came with a bat!
So I'd also stick to your guns . Be firm. If you want to keep on seeing him, remember what these people told you about the muslim religion & culture.
As for me. I'm cool. 3rd time's a charm they say. Married 20 yrs. Have a beautiful 23 y.o. & graduate student daughter from my 2nd marriage(hey we gave it a shot) Present husband & I have another beautiful daughter 19 & a computer nerd
Sorry if my input is so long. As one gets older, the more stories they get!!

Above all. I have to say stay a Christian either way & keep after your education . I certainly know I was really grateful to have a skill especially when it came time to leave.
God bless you & good luck tomorrow

*Judith* · Mar 5, 2006, 03:22 PM

31pumpkin: I am in total awe of you... how you managed to come through such a terrible situation and stay positive! To be honest a few similarities between your situation and mine scare me, don't get me wrong he has never been violent, its just the jealously that you talk about and the presents and the kind of overprotective love [correct me if I'm wrong]. Thank you for your advice and support... Im really happy that you now have the life that you deserve and that you were strong enough to overcome the bad times

31pumpkin · Mar 5, 2006, 04:21 PM

Well, it was a long tome ago & thankfully I can't remember how I "felt". But I do remember that his violence showed up when he got a lot of stress from his problems from work. It was nowhere apparent when I married him... & espec. When I first met him.
It's dinner time here in the US . Then we (2nd daughter) can't wait to see The Academy Awards on TV later. So I'm going to go.Good luck again!

talaniman · Mar 5, 2006, 04:49 PM

Originally Posted by *Judith*

talaniman: i do really want to be honest with him and let him know that im uncertain as to whether marriage is the best option for us. But i don't see how i can as his hearing is tomorrow [March 6] and i think it would just all be too much for him to take as we are both aware that this may be the only way he can be allowed back into Britain. I did try and show him other options for him [for example obtaining a work permit] but he wasnt having any of it.

You say "Stick to your guns!" can i just ask what you mean by that?

First "Stick to your guns!" make a decision and stick to it no matter what! Second the fact that he doesn't at least look at other options shows he's already made up his mind what he wants to happen,and third You don't know enough of him to make a decision to marry him,Let me ask you are you prepared for him to tell you how to run his house or raise his children or what if he decides you need to stay home with his babies and raise them to be good Muslims. What if he told you, you can't work or go to school? Are you prepared to be subservient the way Muslim women are. Stop thinking about his needs and put yourself first and do what is best for you. That's what we all have been trying to tell you!:cool:

*Judith* · Mar 5, 2006, 04:55 PM

talanimanno I am not prepared to stay at home and be subservient nor am I prepared to be a Muslim period. So I recognise that I do have to tell him I don't want to marry him as things are at the moment but you have to agree that with all this additional pressure it wouldn't be fair to let him down like that now... but when?

NeedKarma · Mar 5, 2006, 05:09 PM

Originally Posted by *Judith*

with all this additional pressure it wouldnt be fair to let him down like that now

Sure, happens all the time. It's worse to give him false hope.

talaniman · Mar 5, 2006, 06:18 PM

As soon as possible so he can weigh his other options,sounds cruel but in the long run its better for you both!

*Judith* · Mar 6, 2006, 11:12 AM

Everything went fine today at his hearing and so he is able to remain in Britain for at least another month so I suppose I have to tell him that I can't help him if things don't continue to go well regarding his immigration affairs

Skinwhite · Mar 6, 2006, 03:42 PM

No, I'm not muslim - but am aware of their culture from stories I hear from my parents as well as what I've seen. But I'm not going to get into that since you are aware of the life altering changes if you marry into it.

Now, since you seem to understand that you're by no means ready for marriage. I'd like to understand the logistics of this immigration plan. What is it that the he thinks the plan is? He has a month in Britain according to the hearing - to do what - arrange to leave? Does he think u all can marry within this month and he can stay? I remember u writing in the beginning of your post that u all were waiting until u were 18,so how does this fit into the whole plan?

*Judith* · Mar 6, 2006, 03:47 PM

Skinwhite: He recognises that it would not be possible for us to get married all within this next month, especially as in England it is illegal to get married before 18. For this reason he thinks that the most practical solution would be to enjoy what time we have together in England now and if/when he is deported then I will come to meet him when I turn 18 so that we can be married in his country and then ill come back to England to apply for his citizenship [according to his plan]

Skinwhite · Mar 7, 2006, 02:24 AM

So basically you are saying, you know it won't work out - but are afraid to make a bad thing worse for him. Maybe in the back of your mind, you're thinking if he leaves in a month then u can just end it while he's gone and won't have to face him or see his hurt... or maybe over 2 yrs time it will be easy to fizzle out. BUT, the system may take time and he may actually be here for more than a month or even a year(s). Therefore, dragging this out is just going to make it worse for everyone involved. You've gotten some pretty good wordings to use and I think it's time to communicate them to him.

*Judith* · Mar 7, 2006, 01:06 PM

Skinwhite I feel ashamed to admit it but after a little consideration I think you are right, maybe I do want it to "fizzle out" when he leaves to eliviate me of the responsibility of letting him down in person. It is not that I don't love him, I am just starting to feel that this pressure on me is too much and is ruining our relationship. At the same time I don't want him to leave or for us to break up and this is what I fear will happen when I tell him how I feel about the whole issue.

ldecook · Mar 8, 2006, 09:55 AM

Has his pressure ever been based on how much he loves you and wants to spend his life with you or simply on the fact that he can then gain his citizenship?

And besides, I made a marital decision based on my wanting to do what was best for 'him' and ended up regretting it for a very long time.