[ghettosun]

I am a Black man 48 yrs old, I just wanted to know why I should vote for democrats or support liberals, I do not like nither of the two. I really think that liberalism is dangerous and liberals are phony, but I get shouted down when I express my veiw, why is that.

[BABRAM]

You should support yourself, regardless of what you think of the Democratic party. BTW nobody should be shouting at you. If you're enjoying the recession and like Republican presidents that are hesitant to even raise the minimum wage while prices for gas, wheat, and gold skyrocket... please don't let me stop you. Vote "John McCain."

[tomder55]

Bobby the unemployment rate ? That is a subscription for increased unemployment as far as I can tell. My company has a fixed budget on wages and it will not budge just because the govermnet is mandating increases. My bosses would assuredly tell us to keep inside the budget even if it means less manpower.

I don't know how it is in Nev. But no one in New Jersey is working at minimum wage because the market dictates that to get employees we have to pay more anyway.

[tomder55]

ghettosun.

In my view the Black community should give the Dems a shake and not vote monolithically . The way things stand now there is not much of a competition for your votes. The Democrats can take advantage knowing they will get a huge majority of the voting block and the Republicans don't make a serious effort to woo the Black vote because they know it is fruitless.
The Hispanics in my view have better utilized the competition for their vote and it is reflective in the gains they are making .

[BABRAM]

Bobby the unemployment rate ? That is a subscription for increased unemployment as far as I can tell. My company has a fixed budget on wages and it will not budge just because the govermnet is mandating increases. My bosses would assuredly tell us to keep inside the budget even if it means less manpower.

I don't know how it is in Nev. But no one in New Jersey is working at minimum wage because the market dictates that to get employees we have to pay more anyway.

It was Bush that said we were going to be the nation of the "haves and have mores." Have more of what? Recession. Nevada, for example, got tired of waiting on Dubya and took the initiative of raising a minimum wage increase. Fact is nobody can or should have to live on Bush dreamt minimum wage anyway. The inflation rate buzzards of Bush Repubnomics are coming home to roost. I don't care if we are talking Jersey or the bayou, wages for the lower and middle class are not keeping up with the cost of living.

[tomder55]

So you think the answer is government intervention ? Who is employed at minimum wage in Nevada ?

[George_1950]

I am a Black man 48 yrs old, I just wanted to know why I should vote for democrats or support liberals, I do not like nither of the two. I really think that liberalism is dangerous and liberals are phony, but I get shouted down when I express my veiw, why is that.

Welcome to AMHD. It takes a certain amount of intelligence and guts to be a conservative; most liberals lack either or both, so welcome to the party. You probably appreciate the ideas of individual liberty and responsibility, two ideas never expressed by Democrats. We will never hear Hillary or Obama advocate them. By the way, the definition of a 'bigot' is someone winning an argument with a liberal. Get used to that, too.

[BABRAM]

so you think the answer is government intervention ?

Well that depends on who's running the Government, doesn't it?

Who is employed at minimum wage in Nevada ?

Ninety percent of Casino dealers in Vegas, many fast food employees, and some retail outlets. Dealers are by far less effected because they make their living off tips. However with the recession, the tourism has slowed such that some have lost their jobs.

[Dark_crow]

Today in America Liberalism (Which dominates the Democratic Party) is a belief that the purpose of government is to fix the wrongs of society. Liberals tend to believe that it is the job of government to extend equality in health care, in wealth, and in the level of success. Liberals believe that if everyone is equal in every way, there will be no reason for war, crime, poverty, etc.

This is brought on in part by Bourdieu's theoretical system which argues that constitutional liberalism (The Conservative philosophy) is a form of domination. The poor, pressed by the need to make a living, don't have the luxury of developing the social and intellectual skills needed to participate in political deliberation. So they believe that the government must make those decisions for people.


This is, of course, a very simplified explanation of what "liberal" means.

So unless you too believe this you should not support the Democrates' until they throw the liberals out.

[NeedKarma]

You're close DC but not quite. Today's liberals want to protect the little guy whilst today's conservatives would rather he just die out if he can't cut it.

[Dark_crow]

NK

To the contrary, conservatives, for the most part, believe in extending equality of opportunity, not equality of outcome, and that government has no place in most issues having to do with personal choices.

[NeedKarma]

To the contrary, conservatives, for the most part, believe in extending equality of opportunity

How that's working out for you?

and that government has no place in most issues having to do with personal choices.

Like religion? Seems that Mr. Bush has received orders from god himself.
Like a woman being pro-choice? Seems like you guys want to stifle that one.
As much as you want to paint a "liberal" as a textbook socialist that wants to restrict your freedoms that just not the case. To pull a page from your playbook concerning the loss of your privacy and liberties due to laws enacted post 9-11: a liberal government restricts nothing if you're not doing something wrong.

[Dark_crow]

NK

I haven't lacked when it comes to opportunity and choice, what more can I ask in life? Should I ask my neighbors to pay for my bad choices through government intervention? I now live in a third world country because I can no longer afford to live in America, but that was my doing.

Yes, even the President is free to practice his religion of choice, and I my atheistic beliefs; would you have it otherwise?

Is conservatism perfect, no, it certainly is not…but it offers the greatest opportunity and choice, something liberalism is short on.

[NeedKarma]

…but it offers the greatest opportunity and choice, something liberalism is short on.

Repeating it does not make it so.

[Dark_crow]

NK

Don't tell me I'm wrong, show me where I'm wrong.

[BABRAM]

and what do you think would be a sufficient minimum wage ? and what would the effect of raising the minimum wage have on the low skilled ;part time ,or student labor force ? I think it would be devastating]

The ideal minimum wage would be that which keeps food on the table, gas in the car, educates the children, health care, and allows us to save money toward retirement. Striving to make the cost of living, inflation, is going to be the death of the American dream if this recession keeps worsening and that 's going to be devastating!

[George_1950]

The ideal minimum wage would be that which keeps food on the table, gas in the car, educates the children, health care, and allows us to save money toward retirement. Striving to make the cost of living, inflation, is going to be the death of the American dream if this recession keeps worsening and that 's going to be devastating!

Can you imagine what the trial lawyers would do with public education if it became a target of litigation like U.S. health care? The libs would be lining up to give public schools immunity faster than Bush wants it for telecommunications.

Let's see: an ideal minimum wage; why not $30 per hour? That seems fair; if you aren't getting yours, the strike begins this Friday night at midnight. Placards will be provided.

[BABRAM]

Can you imagine what the trial lawyers would do with public education if it became a target of litigation like U.S. health care? The libs would be lining up to give public schools immunity faster than Bush wants it for telecommunications.

Let's see: an ideal minimum wage; why not $30 per hour? That seems fair; if you aren't getting yours, the strike begins this Friday night at midnight. Placards will be provided.

I honestly haven't studied a number that would meet rising inflation targeting a minimum wage. I just understand it's not in the market range for many parts of the country considering the current economics. One indicator is that although most of us are paid well above minimum age, we are still sharing in some form of financial difficulties. When I mention the subject I'm really not intending to thrash one party affiliation over the other. Anyone that's been around long, and I know you have, we realize both Republicans and Democrats have stunk up the business side of government for a long time. As far as recent society, take for example the Hollywood writers could had stayed on strike. I could had cared less. To me their burden wasn't necessary or worthwhile news. Overpaid athletes wanting more money for contracts after getting millions more than most of us would see in a life time. I have no mercy for them either. Yes, it would be a hoot to see a salary cap placed on trail lawyers. Even better yet limit them to how many frivolous lawsuit cases there permited to represent in a year.

[George_1950]

Why would you say athletes are overpaid? Just because you think so? Why are so few workers paid the minimum? In reality, it is a market economy. One aspect of the U.S. economy that is interesting is that 'globalization' is the current whipping boy for all our problems; but what about environmentalism? Does anyone know how many domestic industrial jobs have been lost to environmental regulation? How many more jobs would be lost due to health care regulation (universal health care)if the Dems were to win the presidency and 60 seats in the senate? We do not need to foster more dependency on the government; we need less dependency. I believe this is ghettosun's observation and I agree with him. A vote for a Democrat is a vote for intellectual and economic death.

[excon]

Today in America Liberalism (Which dominates the Democratic Party) is a belief that the purpose of government is to fix the wrongs of society. Liberals tend to believe that it is the job of government to extend equality in health care, in wealth, and in the level of success. Liberals believe that if everyone is equal in every way, there will be no reason for war, crime, poverty, etc.

Hello g:

I find it amazing that Republicans think they're conservative…… They're actually not. They're as liberal as you get.

Because, of course, liberalism or conservativisim has NOTHING whatever to do with what these guys says it does – NOTHING! Liberalism or conservativisim doesn't discuss the PROBLEMS of society differently, like you see these guys do. They discuss the SOLUTIONS to those problems differently!!

If you think the marketplace will solve most of society's problems, then you're a conservative. If you think the government will solve most society's problems, then you're a liberal.

However today, BOTH Republicans and Democrats think government is the solution. They're BOTH extremely LIBERAL. The one exception was Ron Paul. He was the only TRUE conservative running for president.

Indeed, what's more liberal than the DEA? It's huge bureaucracy that takes billions and billions of our $$'s to spend on a program designed to change social behavior.

The Republicans love this program. So do the Dems. But, at least they admit they're liberal.

excon