[pah4850]

I am a Christian and don't know which Church I should go to. I want to take communion but don't know if I am cleansed enough for the Lord.

[Fr_Chuck]

You can never be clean enough, but you can be forgiven.

And what church you go to, will depend on when they allow you to.
If you go to the Baptist or Methodist Church for example all you have to be is baptised.

If you are a Lutheran ( MO SYND) you have to take their classes and join their church before you can take communion.

If you are a catholic, you would have to take classes, be confirmed and then join the church.

But we are never and can never clean ourself enough

[margog85]

That's one thing I always disagreed with the Catholic Church on, even when I was Catholic. If you weren't Catholic, you couldn't receive communion. If you hadn't been to confession, you couldn't receive communion. If you didn't believe in the Eucharist as the body of Christ, you couldn't receive communion. If you were in 'mortal sin' you couldn't receive communion.

However, the Eucharist is presented as a channel of the grace of god, wherein humans are united with god in a special and unique way.

If Catholics believe there is such power in the Eucharist, why withhold it? And what gives humans the power/authority to decide who can partake in something through which another can receive grace? Isn't that putting limitations on the god you believe in? Or thinking that he puts limitations on who he allows to come to him?

According to Catholic/Christian belief, and as is said before the consecration, Jesus said 'Take this, ALL OF YOU, and eat it. This is my body, which will be given up for you.'

Jesus supposedly knew that Judas was going to betray him- kind of a big deal, don't you think? Maybe something that just might be considered a 'mortal sin'? But, as the story goes, Jesus didn't snatch the bread from his hands and tell him he couldn't have any- what gives the church the right to make that determination as to who is 'worthy' and who isn't if Jesus never indicated any kind of limitation of that nature.

And yes, I know the rhetoric about Catholicism being a synthesis of scripture and tradition- that's why change is near impossible in regard to anything of significance in the Catholic church- women priests, homosexuality, priests being allowed to marry again (because they used to be able to!)-

Idk- Just doesn't seem to make very much sense.

If you believe that communion is something you want, I'd say just go for it. Honestly. I'm not Christian, but... if you feel that receiving communion will bring you closer to god, and into a better union with god, do you really think god would refuse you if that's what you're truly seeking? If you believe in a loving god, would that loving god turn someone away who's sincerely seeking to grow closer to him?

I don't think so.

[fallen2grace]

You have to be saved first.

[fallen2grace]

desidario disagrees: Was Judas saved?

I Don't Know. Was he? I didn't really know how to explain the rest of my answer. I mean every time we take communion at chruch the paster says something. But I can't remember therefore I can't explain it. I will get it this weekend though, when we take it next. He explains it well.

[Wangdoodle]

One should be in the state of grace when receiving communion.

"Therefore whoever eats this bread or drinks the cup of the Lord unworthily, will be guilty of the body and the blood of the Lord. But let a man prove himself, and so let him eat of that bread and drink of the cup; for he who eats and drinks unworthily, without distinguishing the body, eats and drinks judgment to himself." 1 Corinthians

We should really make a good examination of conscience before presenting ourselves for receiving communion.

[smearcase]

My comment in response FR_CHUCKS answer got cut off (format for rating a comment is terrible to try and type into).
I tried to say that in my 50 years as a Methodist I have never heard of a requirement for baptism before Communion.
We have been members of several diff Methodist churches in 3 states over the past 20 years. The Meth ministers invite all those who have accepted Christ or who are considering accepting Christ to partake of Communion.
How would you enforce such a requirement? There were 541 people at two Christmas Eve services at my church this year. Communion was offered at both services. Many people hadn't been to church for a year, some for many years and prob a few-never.
I certainly don't mean to imply that Methodists don't take Baptism seriously. It is a standard ritual.
Detailed information is available at UMC.org Thank you

[Fr_Chuck]

If I am mistaken I am sorry, the several Methodist Churches I have preached out and have helped with their serices all seemed to have a notice that communion was open to all baptised individuals in their programs handed out.

But as in control, it is a self control as it is in all churches.

[fallen2grace]

One should be in the state of grace when receiving communion.

"Therefore whoever eats this bread or drinks the cup of the Lord unworthily, will be guilty of the body and the blood of the Lord. But let a man prove himself, and so let him eat of that bread and drink of the cup; for he who eats and drinks unworthily, without distinguishing the body, eats and drinks judgment to himself." 1 Corinthians

We should really make a good examination of conscience before presenting ourselves for receiving communion.

Actually, I think that is what I was trying to say. :/

[Wangdoodle]

Actually, I think that is what i was trying to say. :/

I wasn't disagreeing with you or anything. Just, you know, putting my two cents in for what ever it's worth. :)

[fallen2grace]

I wasn't disagreeing with you or anything. Just, you know, putting my two cents in for what ever it's worth. :)

Yeah, But I really think that is what I was trying to say. I mean you can't take communion and not want to be closer to God. That is a shame.

[Tertullian]

One should be in the state of grace when receiving communion.

"Therefore whoever eats this bread or drinks the cup of the Lord unworthily, will be guilty of the body and the blood of the Lord. But let a man prove himself, and so let him eat of that bread and drink of the cup; for he who eats and drinks unworthily, without distinguishing the body, eats and drinks judgment to himself." 1 Corinthians

We should really make a good examination of conscience before presenting ourselves for receiving communion.

I believe you have taken Corinthians 1:28 totally out of context to make a point. Paul's admonition was to the CORINTHIANS, not to the church in general... and it was not meant to judge them unclean, or unworthy, but to enjoin them NOT to celebrate the Eucharist unless they had grasped... internalized... the meaning of Christ's death for them. Obviously the Eucharist had been celebrated by rote, with no attention paid to its actual purpose and meaning.
Why would Paul countermand the intentions of Jesus at the Last Supper... who laid down NO conditions for sharing in his 'body and blood'. If only the ritually clean are permitted to share in Communion, how will "sinners" ever be able to benefit from the 'body and blood of Christ'? Jesus often shared a meal with sinners, prostitutes, Roman sympathizers, tax collectors: If he had no problem eating with sinners, why would he have a problem with sinners sharing a meal in remembrance of Him?

[Tertullian]

I am a Christian and don't know which Church I should go to. I want to take communion but don't know if I am cleansed enough for the Lord.

pah4850:

In order to set your mind at rest on this point simply return to the Gospel accounts of the Last Supper... read them carefully and you will find that JESUS never stipulated ANY conditions for the Apostles who shared the 'first' Eucharist with Him. Yet he knew that they were not 'sinless' or 'cleansed'... He KNEW Judas was about to betray Him... He KNEW Peter was about to deny him... He KNEW most of the rest would hide in fear at his crucifixion... YET he did not hesitate to share his 'body and blood' with them. What right does any "Christian" church, then, have to set stipulations on who IS or IS NOT worthy to share in the remembrance of Jesus life and death??

[GospelMan]

Find yourself a good Bible teaching church. *** negative commements about certain christian denominations edited out****
As far as communion goes, if you have received Jesus Christ as your Lord and Savior, then you can partake in it. May God bless you in your search for a church home.

[De Maria]

That's one thing I always disagreed with the Catholic Church on, even when I was Catholic. If you weren't Catholic, you couldn't receive communion. If you hadn't been to confession, you couldn't receive communion. If you didn't believe in the Eucharist as the body of Christ, you couldn't receive communion. If you were in 'mortal sin' you couldn't receive communion.

However, the Eucharist is presented as a channel of the grace of god, wherein humans are united with god in a special and unique way.

Correction, wherein Christians are united with God in a special and unique way.

If Catholics believe there is such power in the Eucharist, why withhold it?

Because you will commit a greater sin and harm your soul.
1 Corinthians 11 27 Therefore whosoever shall eat this bread, or drink the chalice of the Lord unworthily, shall be guilty of the body and of the blood of the Lord.
28 But let a man prove himself: and so let him eat of that bread, and drink of the chalice. 29 For he that eateth and drinketh unworthily, eateth and drinketh judgment to himself, not discerning the body of the Lord. 30 Therefore are there many infirm and weak among you, and many sleep.

And what gives humans the power/authority to decide who can partake in something through which another can receive grace?

The Church was given authority to bind and loose by Jesus Christ.

Isn't that putting limitations on the god you believe in?

No. That is obedience to God.

Or thinking that he puts limitations on who he allows to come to him?

He does: It all begins with faith:
Hebrews 11 6 But without faith it is impossible to please God. ...

According to Catholic/Christian belief, and as is said before the consecration, Jesus said 'Take this, ALL OF YOU, and eat it. This is my body, which will be given up for you.'

The assumption is that He is speaking to believers. The only ones in the room when He made that statement were His Disciples.

Jesus supposedly knew that Judas was going to betray him- kind of a big deal, don't you think? Maybe something that just might be considered a 'mortal sin'? But, as the story goes, Jesus didn't snatch the bread from his hands and tell him he couldn't have any- what gives the church the right to make that determination as to who is 'worthy' and who isn't if Jesus never indicated any kind of limitation of that nature.

Jesus gave the Church the authority.
Matthew 18 17 And if he will not hear them: tell the church. And if he will not hear the church, let him be to thee as the heathen and publican.

And yes, I know the rhetoric about Catholicism being a synthesis of scripture and tradition- that's why change is near impossible in regard to anything of significance in the Catholic church- women priests, homosexuality, priests being allowed to marry again (because they used to be able to!)-

Not so. If married they could remain married. An example is St. Peter the Apostle. But if unmarried they were not permitted to marry.

And married men are still permitted to be Priests in many of the Catholic Rites, but not in the Roman Rite. In the Roman Rite, we choose to follow St. Paul's example as a discipline.

1 Corinthians 7 8 But I say to the unmarried, and to the widows: It is good for them if they so continue, even as I.

In other words, the Magisterium has the authority to change this tradition with a small 't'.

Idk- Just doesn't seem to make very much sense.

If you believe that communion is something you want, I'd say just go for it. Honestly. I'm not Christian, but... if you feel that receiving communion will bring you closer to god, and into a better union with god, do you really think god would refuse you if that's what you're truly seeking? If you believe in a loving god, would that loving god turn someone away who's sincerely seeking to grow closer to him?

I don't think so.

Disobedience is not something which God condones.

Hebrews 13 17 Obey your prelates, and be subject to them. For they watch as being to render an account of your souls; that they may do this with joy, and not with grief. For this is not expedient for you.

Sincerely,

De Maria

[De Maria]

I believe you have taken Corinthians 1:28 totally out of context to make a point. Paul's admonition was to the CORINTHIANS, not to the church

All of St. Paul's epistles as well as the other Apostle's writings were read to the entire Church. Not simply to the one to which it was initially addressed.

in general... and it was not meant to judge them unclean, or unworthy, but to enjoin them NOT to celebrate the Eucharist unless they had grasped... internalized... the meaning of Christ's death for them.

Exactly, but we don't read the Scripture as though each verse is separate from the whole. We must understand the Scripture in unity with the entire Scriptures:

Hebrews 10 26 For if we sin wilfully after having the knowledge of the truth, there is now left no sacrifice for sins, 27 But a certain dreadful expectation of judgment, and the rage of a fire which shall consume the adversaries. 28 A man making void the law of Moses, dieth without any mercy under two or three witnesses: 29 How much more, do you think he deserveth worse punishments, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath esteemed the blood of the testament unclean, by which he was sanctified, and hath offered an affront to the Spirit of grace?

Obviously the Eucharist had been celebrated by rote, with no attention paid to its actual purpose and meaning.
Why would Paul countermand the intentions of Jesus at the Last Supper... who laid down NO conditions for sharing in his 'body and blood'.

Jesus laid down many conditions for being Christian. First and foremost, belief in Him:

John 6 29 Jesus answered, and said to them: This is the work of God, that you believe in him whom he hath sent.

John 1 12 But as many as received him, he gave them power to be made the sons of God, to them that believe in his name.

Mark 16 16 He that believeth and is baptized, shall be saved: but he that believeth not shall be condemned.

If only the ritually clean are permitted to share in Communion, how will "sinners" ever be able to benefit from the 'body and blood of Christ'?

By converting, believing in the Teachings of Jesus Christ and then receiving Communion worthily. AND persevering in this until the end:

Matthew 10 22 And you shall be hated by all men for my name's sake: but he that shall persevere unto the end, he shall be saved.

Jesus often shared a meal with sinners, prostitutes, Roman sympathizers, tax collectors: If he had no problem eating with sinners, why would he have a problem with sinners sharing a meal in remembrance of Him?

Jesus ate with nonbelievers in order to attract them to conversion. But there was only one nonbeliever there when Jesus celebrated the First Eucharist and he was keeping his identity a secret.

Sincerely,

[Fr_Chuck]

I will correct you on only one thing De Maria, acutally priests were allowed to marry at first, then it was changed that they could be married if they were already married, then that in most orders they can not be married.

** But with that said, there are married priests and bishops today in the Catholic Church, we had one bishop from one of the Independent groups go back to the Catholic Church last year, he was a Bishop and was married, and was taken back into the church. In fact before Vactian II one of the Bishops from my own line of succession went back to the Catholic Church and was a Bishop invovled in Vactian II as a married bishop. There are Anglican and independent catholic priests and Bishops ( and any church that has a valid apostilic succession) that has priests and bishops go back into the church as married priests and bishops from time to time still.

For the other posters. As for a married priests, this is merely a church rule, not doctrine, it could be changed tomorrow if and when the Pope decides to. There is no comparison between married priests and homoseuxal, which is a bibical issue as a sin,

Also the rules on communion is not merely a catholic rule, this is a rule in many churches, beyond catholic, most Orthodox, some of the Lutherans ( most of the orgainal lutheran groups)

[Donna Mae]

For the other posters. As for a married priests, this is merley a church rule, not doctrine, it could be changed tomorrow if and when the Pope decides to.

I hope I don't offend anyone, but I have a question about the above statement. It has nothing to do with the question that was asked earlier, but I would like to ask it anyway.

Does the Catholic church go by God's word? And if so, how can a 'church rule' be changed by the Pope. I don't mean to be offensive but the church was established by Jesus and the rules that we must live by are in the Bible. The Bible tells us how we should be living today, and these 'rules' do not change because the Bible does not change. We do not live by man's rules but God's rules. So how is it possible that the Pope may change the rules tomorrow? God tells us to live by His rules not by the customs of man.

[Fr_Chuck]

All denominations have their own church rules most follow doctrine, others will be man rules for administration of the church.

The issue of priest getting married is not a doctrine issue, it is merely a rule of the church on its employees. All churches have rules of all sorts and the larger the church, the more rules there has to be. Many of these come from customs,

[De Maria]

I hope I don't offend anyone, but I have a question about the above statement. It has nothing to do with the question that was asked earlier, but I would like to ask it anyway.

Does the Catholic church go by God's word?

Yes. The Catechism:

97 "Sacred Tradition and Sacred Scripture make up a single sacred deposit of the Word of God" (DV 10) in which, as in a mirror, the pilgrim Church contemplates God, the source of all her riches.
Catechism of the Catholic Church - PART 1 SECTION 1 CHAPTER 2 ARTICLE 2

And if so, how can a 'church rule' be changed by the Pope.

We believe that Jesus put St. Peter in charge of His Church.

John 21 17 He said to him the third time: Simon, son of John, lovest thou me? Peter was grieved, because he had said to him the third time: Lovest thou me? And he said to him: Lord, thou knowest all things: thou knowest that I love thee. He said to him: Feed my sheep.
Douay-Rheims Bible, Gospel According to Saint John Chapter 21

And that Jesus gave St. Peter the authority to make and change rules:
Matthew 16 19 And I will give to thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven. And whatsoever thou shalt bind upon earth, it shall be bound also in heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt loose upon earth, it shall be loosed also in heaven.

We believe this charism is passed down through Peter's successors:

Acts Of Apostles 1

20 For it is written in the book of Psalms: Let their habitation become desolate, and let there be none to dwell therein. And his bishopric let another take.

Douay-Rheims Bible, The Acts Of The Apostles Chapter 1

I don't mean to be offensive

No offense taken.

but the church was established by Jesus and the rules that we must live by are in the Bible.

Correct. But Jesus established His Church on the Rock of St. Peter:
Matthew 16 18 And I say to thee: That thou art Peter; and upon this rock I will build my church, and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.

The Bible tells us how we should be living today,

Correct. And this same Bible tells us to obey our prelates:
Hebrews 13 17 Obey your prelates, and be subject to them. For they watch as being to render an account of your souls; that they may do this with joy, and not with grief. For this is not expedient for you.

and these 'rules' do not change because the Bible does not change.

Some change and some don't. Even in the Bible we see examples of rules that changed. See the dietary laws, circumcision and the feasts.

We do not live by man's rules but God's rules.

The Church teaches God's rules. The Church also teaches Church disciplines which help to illustrate and to keep God's rules.

God's rules are not changed. Church rules are frequently changed as the Church sees fit.

So how is it possible that the Pope may change the rules tomorrow?

As explained, Jesus gave the Pope, St. Peter the authority to make and change rules.

God tells us to live by His rules

So does the Church.

not by the customs of man.

To be more precise, the Bible condemns those customs of man which contradict the Word of God. Those customs of men which are in accordance to God's Word are not condemned.

2 Thessalonians 2 14 Therefore, brethren, stand fast; and hold the traditions which you have learned, whether by word, or by our epistle.

The Bible also tells us to obey our prelates (Heb 13:17) and to obey the Church

Matthew 18 17 And if he will not hear them: tell the church. And if he will not hear the church, let him be to thee as the heathen and publican.

The Catholic Church teaches all that is contained in Scripture.

Sincerely,

De Maria