[ScottGem]

Funny...perhaps we should all answer questions we find in the threads on this forum through private messages, because I, too, should fear that someone who has never seen a car might missinterpret the answer i give on starting a Civic.

NeedKarma, aren't you afraid that someone who knows nothing about computers might missinterpret the answers you give about computer problems? Should this be a huge turn-around in the history of this board? Will we all start giving answers through private messages?

The only good thing it would do is make the rating system unneeded :D

I have always advocated keeping answers public. One of the advantages of a board like this is that other people can learn from the information. Its also important that their be peer review of answers to make sure the answers given are correct.

That being said, there are certain areas where the questions and their answers are so completely personal that private answers would be acceptable. I would include psychic readings in that category. First the answer, would be very specific to the asker (unless they were asking what the winning lotto numbers would be ;) ). Also there is not really an issue of peer review involved here.

[labman]

I have always advocated keeping answers public. One of the advantages of a board like this is that other people can learn from the information. Its also important that their be peer review of answers to make sure the answers given are correct.

That being said, there are certain areas where the questions and their answers are so completely personal that private answers would be acceptable. I would include psychic readings in that category. First the answer, would be very specific to the asker (unless they were asking what the winning lotto numbers would be ;) ). Also there is not really an issue of peer review involved here.

You are right Scott about the public answers. You have even convinced me the approval/disapproval where we could put a red flag right in a bad answer is important. I still thing the rest of the rep system makes the trolls look good at the expense of those giving better answers. To bad we have lost the only part that was any use.

When I receive questions by PM or email, I always include a note suggesting posting the question in the public forum. This is especially true in the HVAC where I am struggling and nobody is posting much better answers. We don't need people giving weak answers in forums with good people. Unfortunately, in some areas, a weak answer is better than none. I do manage to help some people in that area.

[miki]

I believe the one who was sent an email will check it's email more often than this board.

On the other hand, i've seen too many "psychics" here being overly sensitive when asked to "prove" their gift. I do not believe in psychics...it is simply against my beliefs, and i will continue not to believe in them until i get my proof, and after i get my proof that they really do exist, i will stand behind them. But until i'm proven they can really do what they say - i will continue to test them.

Some hide behind the lines like: "I do not need you to believe me." or "I will not waste my time on your childish games.". Some even offer to answer any questions, and simply overlook the questions which they don't like, or which they understand that they need to answer in a simple and ungeneralized way. I do believe that people who are doing this are not lacking intelligence, because i understand that one must have a certain degree of intelligence to not be able to do what they say they can, but however manage to force people into believing they can do it, and even draw some money out of them for doing nothing but saying generalized things which are correct 95% of the time. But if they're asked "What can you say about my granny?", they understand that they cannot say anything about her except that she is PROBABLY over 50 since she is someone's granny, so they decide to ignore it. I see that as a fraud and i will always make fun of such people. If i'm however proven to be wrong and i get an answer that i know is correct, i will honestly apologize and will stand up for such people.

Too bad i've never met someone that could answer a question to which only i knew an answer to.

CroCivic,

Did you ask Tieka about your grandma in a personal e-mail and she ignored you? If so, then I would send her a reminder. What I WOULDN'T do is to accuse her of ignoring you and not being honest because you have no PROOF of that, and it's disrespectful, especially for a moderator.

You and Need Karma (who doesn't need much more karma cause he/she is already bitter enough) like to question psychics because you have no proof that they have the abilities that they claim to have. However, you don't have any proof that they DON'T have those abilities either.

So please let's respect everyone that posts here by not questioning the honesty or the honorability of anyone. If you want to argue against psychics, then talk in general, and don't atack anyone personally. And please, before you argue against anything, get some support for your opinion. Just saying that many psychics are liers who steal the money of others is not enough support. To me that doesn't prove that no psychic in the world has a gift.

I am an educated person, and I do believe some people have the gift of clairvoyance. I believe it because I have seen it with my own eyes. You and Need Karma, on the other hand, atack something that you know very little about. Because neither of you has ever consulted a reputable psychic, and neither of you knows much about clairvoyance or mediumship, or anything related to what psychics do. So before you argue against someone, get yourselves educated about the topic. It is too easy to atack another person or another belief by throwing sarcastic comments and unsupported accusations.

Let us see some educated discussion and respect for a change. Instead of attacking people like Tieka, who volunteer their time to help others at no charge, let's thank them for their contribution. It is thanks to people like her that people like you can learn about psychic phenomena. Take the opportunity to learn; not to atack.

Sincerely,
Miki

[miki]

The adage that comes to mind after reading the previous posts here is:

"If you can't stand the heat get out of the kitchen!"

That may sound harsh, but it applies. I've been participating on boards like this for more than 20 years. Nothing has changed in that time. Some people have strong opinions and are not afraid to express them. Others have a malicious streak and the anonymity of the Net allows them an outlet they can't get elsewhere.

ANYONE choosing to participate on a site like this needs to understand this. They need to realize they will get attacked, flamed, abused, etc. Of course, they may also get lauded, complimented and praised. It all just goes with the territory.

That doesn't mean you should not object to the malicious or fight back against it. But if you can't deal with that type of reaction, then maybe you shouldn't participate.

Nor am I condoning or accepting such behavior, just pointing out that its a fact of BBS life and one needs to deal with it or get out. You need a thick skin to participate on these sties, especially in a topic like Psychics.

Hi Scott,

I disagree. If that was the case, then porno ads and spam would also be allowed here. Most forums have rules and moderators. The purpose of these is to prevent disrespect and abuse. Abuse is not freedom of expression. Remember that our freedom ends where the rights of others begin.

Besides, disrespect does not contribute to dialogue and education. When you disrespect someone soon enough the person gets offended and the dialogue becomes the resolution of a personal grievance. No more debate about different views on an issue. Only fights and disrespect. I don't think any of us is interested in witnessing that kind of dialogue. It is disturbing to see two people attacking each other.

I'm not blaming anyone. I think any of us could fall into these types of behaviors at some point. All I am suggesting is to keep the dialogue respectful, no matter how polemic the topic.

Christmas Greetings,

Miki

[nymphetamine]

You tell them.

[miki]

[

QUOTE=NeedKarma]I did not alter a message. It's called satire and is meant to show that the response is so generic that it can be applied in many circumstances.

Really? So according to you one can say the same things of a cat and of CroCivic's grandma! I'm surprised CroCivic doesn't find THAT offensive. I was a bit shocked when I read it, and it's not my grandma :).

Besides, you didn't prove anything. In that post, Tieka was talking about her cat. It was not a psychic reading.

It seems you have a lot to learn about psychic phenomena. You think psychics get crystal clear perceptions, and that is not the case. A psychic reads the energy of people, so the information they get is metaphorical, so to speak. For example, Tieka may be able to feel that the cat is close to a certain place, but her description of the place will be a general sketch, not a photograph. She may be able to specify details that show that she has a gift, but she won't be able to describe the place in full detail. A psychic is not God.

Besides, psychic ability is an ability like any other. It works better at times and worse at other times. That's why sometimes a psychic may not be able to pick the vibrations of the people or situations involved.

At no point did “the psychic” display any signs of truly psychic ability. When asked any questions he/she responds with reiterating content of the question (yes, the more you give her the more she can respond) and adding some generalities that can apply to most situations and events. (see: https://www.askmehelpdesk.com/showpo...4&postcount=12)

And you generalized this to all psychics?
So if the psychic gives a general answer, that is a proof that she has no psychic abilities? Why so? She was answering the question, not preparing a demonstration to prove her skills to you. Besides, FYI, a psychic can also use common sense and wisdom in his/her answers. They are human beings too, and they use all their skills in advising others. That doesn't mean that they don't have a gift. It just means that their answers are based both in what they perceive with their gift and in common sense.

Another example: when asked about a missing cat the response from the psychic was along the lines of: Cats are funny. “I had a cat same age as yours. It died. I do not pick up anything about your cat at all.” Where is the psychic ability there? If the response was: “The energy is strong, your cat is on Plover Street, under a red car.”, and DJ H responded by saying “Yes, I found her there, thank you!” then we have a semblance of a gift there, no one can deny that. But we have yet to have seen any specific examples of this.

I guess now you know "where the psychic ability is" in those cases where psychics don't pick much.
The energy is strong? Do you realize that you're showing that you are very ignorant when it comes to psychic phenomena? This is not computer energy. It doesn't work like computer energy either...

The gift that she does possess is more common, it's a form of social engineering. The more information you provide the more they can spin that into their answer. Doing this on a discussion board with registered users is even less of a challenge because you can view all of the posts of people that ask questions – more info for the response!

This is true of many people who call themselves psychics but don't have any psychic abilities. But you can't generalize. And certainly, you should not accuse Tieka of doing that, because you have no proof.

Hence the psychic completely bypassed the question that was asked about bearing children. The grandmother question was never answered. The date of birth request? Well you can use astrology information to help you get some variety in your generic information (“You enjoy the outdoors at times but will face some stressful situations in the near future, your faith will help you overcome it.”).

Really? Are you positive? How do you know that she didn't answer them privately? Did anyone send her a reminder? Because the lady had 3 or 4 requests at once (plus the ones she received by e-mail), and it wouldn't surprise me that she would forget to answer some, if she's not reminded.
In CroCivic's case, she missed the fact that he had sent her the date. You shouldn't accuse someone before being sure.

The reason I mention all of this is that as well as being a technical person who likes to help others I also enjoy being an ombudsman of sorts trying to protect people from being lied to, scammed, or deceived.

Thank you. Tieka wants to help too.
If you want to protect others, then ask her openly about her abilities, and respect her answer. That way you will give all the readers the information they need to make an informed decision, without resorting to personal attacks.

Now I have not attacked you in this post. I'm not sure why you started a dramatic “I'm leaving” thread instead of just leaving but you probably were trying to demean me.

I'm glad she started that thread. That way we know about the thoughts and feelings of those who post in this forum. It's all about freedom of expression, right? Besides, I think it was her way of showing her frustration with the way you attacked her.
I doubt she was trying to put people against you. You were the one that started with the personal attacks; not her. If people were against you is because most of us believe that you were wrong in the way you handled the discussion. Maybe you didn't intend them to, but your comments came across as aggressive and disrespectful. You could have said exactly the same things in a polite way.

I look forward to you enlightening me.

[/QUOTE]If you want to be enlightened, then read about psychic phenomena. Get informed, ask reputable psychics. Once you understand how it works, you can challenge respectfully those views that you oppose.

This is my humble opinion. I don't mean to judge you or offend you. I think you mean well, but your way of trying to help is not being understood as you mean it. I think we would benefit the most by having both sides of the issue (ie, yours and Tieka's), as well as the expertise and help of both of you.

Sincerely,

Miki

[tyieka]

Dear All,

I understand the feelings of those who have doubts about psychic abililities however let me tell you about myself and then you can all decide. My first encounter with psychic powers was at the age of 5 when I saw an old fashioned horse drawn hearse in a pack of cards I was playing with, I spoke to my Grandmom about it and she asked me to describe what else I could see, Now my Grandfather had died the very morning I had entered the world so I never knew him Granmom did not keep photo's round her house why I don't know but I described a man I never saw or ever knew, That was the start of my psychic journey as I learned how to develop the gifts I had been given, I started to help people, answering their questions of life problems they had but couldn't solve I would consult the Ibis for the answers to their problems.At the age of 18 I gave my first lecture on the subject of psychic abilityand my first public demonstration using the Ancient Romany scrolls belonging to the Petrelingo Family. At the age of 32 I was asked to assist if I could a family who's son had disappeared without trace Through that assistance they were able to locate the boy and bring a person to justice.
Since then I have assisted whenever I am Needed at the age of 45 I was given the Honour of the Title Her Grand Eminence through my work in the Psychic Field, Throughout all of these years I have not charged for my consultations why? Because a gift is given free and is not mine to charge anything for, Yes I run The Glasgow Psychic World where other tarot readers take readings but I teach those who wish to learn and develop their Psychic gifts. I tell the history of the Ancient Romany Scrolls that date back to the time of the Egyptian Pharohs. So you see there is a lot more to being a Psychic than reading a set of cards, or telling a fortunes. With the gift of Psychic power comes many other gift, The gift of understanding, The gift of being able to give comfort to those who have lost a loved, The gift of being able to prevent ill and many more gifts to numerous to mention.
There are lots of people who through fear of the unexplained or just a fear of the unknown will dissmiss or condem people like me but there are others who through whatever reason have consulted with us for help even though they were sceptic and found the questioned their own sceptisisms at the end of the day.
Hope this may give a little insight in to the world of Psychic powers.

God Bless.

Tyieka

[CroCivic91]

miki,

What Tyieka did is pretty obvious: a whole lot of other questions were answered, which were posted after mine, but however, mine didn't get an answer. To back up my story of being ignored - I got asked for a date of birth of my granny, and even after answering that - I didn't get an answer. Some other, however, got an answer right away.

And about NeedKarma's rephrase of Tyieka's answer... why in the world would I find that offensive? First of all, I know NeedKarma was only showing how a generic answer could be applied to all situations, and second, I'm not a sissy to get offended that easy by what someone on the anonymous internet board tells me.

If you want to argue against psychics, then talk in general, and don't atack anyone personally.

Just saying that many psychics are liers who steal the money of others is not enough support. To me that doesn't proove that no psychic in the world has a gift.

I am an educated person, and I do believe some people have the gift of clairvoyance.

I quoted this text because I find it contradictory (what is the right word for this? ).

First you say I should argue about psychics in GENERAL, then you go to say that SOME people DO have a gift.

I was just arguing this person's psychic abilities, since this person gave ME no proof to back up the story of being able to do things she said she can. I said I don't believe in psychics and I still stand by that - I do not believe anyone can do such things. It is my opinion, and for now, no one has proven to me that my opinion is wrong. As I stated earlier - I have not met anyone that could answer me a question only I knew an answer to.

Also, I'm not trying to prove no psychic in the world has a gift. I'm just arguing whether this person is a psychic. I could not try proving the opposite of "All psychics have a gift". Obviously, if one is called a psychic - they have a gift. I'm just arguing whether this person is a psychic. Also, if there are no psychics in the world, it still makes the statement "All psychics in the world have a gift" true. If there are no psychics, then all 0 of them do have a gift. I give you that.

Because neither of you has ever consulted a reputable psychic...

That's what I was going to prove here... I am saying this person is not a reputable psychic. I would LOVE to be proven wrong, and in attempt to be proven wrong, I will now send an email to Tyieka, apologizing for my behaviour, and asking her to try and prove to me that she in fact can do that. I will be honest enough to give everybody here TRUE judgement on what I got from her.

[fredg]

Very good comments, generating lots of attention. Good Post!

[ScottGem]

Hi Scott,

I disagree. If that was the case, then porno ads and spam would also be allowed here. Most forums have rules and moderators. The purpose of these is to prevent disrespect and abuse. Abuse is not freedom of expression. Remember that our freedom ends where the rights of others begin.

Besides, disrespect does not contribute to dialogue and education. When you disrespect someone soon enough the person gets offended and the dialogue becomes the resolution of a personal grievance. No more debate about different views on an issue. Only fights and disrespect. I don't think any of us is interested in witnessing that kind of dialogue. It is disturbing to see two people attacking each other.

I'm not blaming anyone. I think any of us could fall into these types of behaviors at some point. All I am suggesting is to keep the dialogue respectful, no matter how polemic the topic.

Christmas Greetings,

Miki

I agree with you up to a point. But there are ways to apply the heat (of the kitchen) without violating the forum rules.

Even when you have a site like this with a stated set of rules, that doesn't mean they are fully adhered to or enforced.

There will always be people who will violate those rules, people who will create second or third IDs to abuse. The heat will always be there. And anyone posting in such areas needs to understand that.

[bizygurl]

Tyieka, I just came back to this site after a computer virus destroyed my computer and I really enjoy this site. But I completely understand your feelings. People can't seem to have an open mind about things. I personally find psychic readings quite fascinating and really interesting. Im sorry there are people on these forums making you feel that you need to leave. But it seems to me that judging by these last few posts you have a lot of people supporting you. I hope you stay.-bizygurl:o

[dimples]

I am not starting another argument here but please, if somebody wants to leave, go ahead. I think there is no cause for drama. I am sure lots of people leave this forum everyday but they do not start a LEAVING thread. People are here to voice out their opinions & as your mom probably told you before, you can't please everyone. Some might find you valuable, others may not. Bottom line is how you deal with each & everyone. Starting this thread in my opinion is uncalled for.

[CroCivic91]

Nicely said!

[bizygurl]

I don't feel that anyone is trying to start drama, not intentionaly anyway. Im just saying that its too bad that someone feels that they need to leave based on others opinion of them. Your right, it is there opinion and that's fine. If she leaves than she does, but I was trying to tell Tyieka not to let others opinion get to her. Everyone here seems to give well meaning and helpful advice to anyone who needs it, it would be unfortunate to loose someone just based on those reasons. Just my opinion!

[DJ 'H']

I am not starting another argument here but please, if somebody wants to leave, go ahead. I think there is no cause for drama. I am sure lots of people leave this forum everyday but they do not start a LEAVING thread. People are here to voice out their opinions & as your mom probably told you before, you can't please everyone. Some might find you valuable, others may not. Bottom line is how you deal with each & everyone. Starting this thread in my opinion is uncalled for.

As I have already said in this thread people are entitled to their views and opinions - what would be the point in this website otherwise. But manner and approach should be taken into consideration when posting in threads.

Tyieka started her own thread to let those that required her help know how to contact her outside the website and to let the others know her reasons for leaving. Lucky for us she did otherwise she would have gone and no one could have persuaded her to stay.

[miki]

I agree with you up to a point. But there are ways to apply the heat (of the kitchen) without violating the forum rules.

Even when you have a site like this with a stated set of rules, that doesn't mean they are fully adhered to or enforced.

There will always be people who will violate those rules, people who will create second or third IDs to abuse. The heat will always be there. And anyone posting in such areas needs to understand that.

Hi Scott,

Yes, you're right, those things still happen despite of the rules-unfortunately. That does not mean we should allow them or promote them though.

We may warn others that these things happen, even ask them to be aware. What we can't do is justify these behaviors. If we justify them we are enabling them.

If I tell a person that is being disrespected that "it is the nature of the internet; abstain from posting if you can't tolerate disrespect", what I'm doing is justifying the behavior of those who disrespect, and inducing the disrespected to stop posting!

In my opinion, we should all promote respect and politeness because that's the best way to let every side of the story be heard.

Merry Christmas 2005!:p

Miki

[miki]

miki,

What Tyieka did is pretty obvious: a whole lot of other questions were answered, which were posted after mine, but however, mine didn't get an answer. To back up my story of being ignored - i got asked for a date of birth of my granny, and even after answering that - i didn't get an answer. Some other, however, got an answer right away.

And about NeedKarma's rephrase of Tyieka's answer...why in the world would i find that offensive? First of all, i know NeedKarma was only showing how a generic answer could be applied to all situations, and second, i'm not a sissy to get offended that easy by what someone on the anonymous internet board tells me.




I quoted this text because i find it contradictory (what is the right word for this?!).

First you say i should argue about psychics in GENERAL, then you go to say that SOME people DO have a gift.

I was just arguing this person's psychic abilities, since this person gave ME no proof to back up the story of being able to do things she said she can. I said i don't believe in psychics and i still stand by that - i do not believe anyone can do such things. It is my opinion, and for now, noone has proven to me that my opinion is wrong. As i stated earlier - i have not met anyone that could answer me a question only i knew an answer to.

Also, I'm not trying to prove no psychic in the world has a gift. I'm just arguing whether this person is a psychic. I could not try proving the opposite of "All psychics have a gift". Obviously, if one is called a psychic - they have a gift. I'm just arguing whether this person is a psychic. Also, if there are no psychics in the world, it still makes the statement "All psychics in the world have a gift" true. If there are no psychics, then all 0 of them do have a gift. I give you that.


That's what i was going to prove here...i am saying this person is not a reputable psychic. I would LOVE to be proven wrong, and in attempt to be proven wrong, i will now send an email to Tyieka, apologizing for my behaviour, and asking her to try and prove to me that she infact can do that. I will be honest enough to give everybody here TRUE judgement on what i got from her.

Hi CroCivic,

I'm glad you will apologize to Tiyeka and make sure she ignored your question before accusing her. That is the treatment and the respect that we all deserve in this forum.

You have all the right to doubt that psychic phenomena are real. What I consider inappropriate is to accuse a particular person, and without proof.

That's what I meant when I said that you should argue against psychics in general, and not point to particular people. I don't see how that contradicts the possibility that some people may have a psychic gift.

Also, I think it would be good if you could view this as a discussion or a learning experience, rather than a test or a challenging of psychic phenomena. Asking Tyieka for a proof of her skills sounds like an accusation to me. Asking her to explain the basics of psychic phenomena and give a demonstration sounds much better. With the second option you would get the same information without incurring in personal attacks.

Let us maintain the Christmas spirit! ;)

Miki

[NeedKarma]

Asking Tyieka for a proof of her skills sounds like an accusation to me.

Nah, you're just making a mountain out of a molehill. At any point you can test me on my computer knowledge, I relish the challenge and will not feel 'accused'.

[CroCivic91]

Nah, you're just making a mountain out of a molehill. At any point you can test me on my computer knowledge, I relish the challenge and will not feel 'accused'.

I second that.

If I say I'm the strongest man on earth and you tell me to prove it, should I take that as an insult? If I say I can do something well, I will find most of the tests people put in front of me easy as a 1,2,3.

[PrettyLady]

I noticed that there was a lot animosity on this thread, but I thought it would subside. But I was wrong, the fighting has continued and it's getting worse. Your admin has worked so hard on improving this board to please everyone. And he's probably disappointed to see members feuding and starting flame wars on his board. We need to stop fighting and work together to help those that come to this site for advice.

You are free to post your opinions with what you believe in, so as long as you can respect what others believe in. A diversity of people and opinion is what makes this message board interesting and informative. Everyone has something to offer, even if it's something unexpected, like a new way of looking at things, so you have to learn to respect and appreciate peoples differences. Be careful with each other's feelings and try not to criticize members. Now let's drop it and coexist peacefully on making this board a better place for you and for others. Let it go everyone.