[galan98]

Hope someone can help.

Our toilets are original to the house, 20-plus years old. When flushed, the swirl isn't strong enough to completely flush the bowl. The bowl does NOT overflow, but it has to be flushed multiple times. We have very hard water where we live, despite having a regularly serviced water softener tank attached to the house line.

I'm thinking the jets under the rim of the bowl might be clogged with material buildup from the hard water. If so, how do I clear them? And if not, how can I solve this?

Thanks in advance.

g.

[letmetellu]

There is a very good chance that the hard water deposits have built up on the china bowl. This creates a firction as the water swirls around and you would be surprised how much this affects the flush. Buy yourself a gallon of Muratic acid pour about half of it into the BOWL and do not use this any other place that in the commode. Use a little "Johny Mop" to mop it up around the under rim... do this several times in about an hour and then flush the commode... see how it flushes. If it is still slow use a allen wrench, about I/8 inch size, and try to poke the little holes out in the rim, they are on an angle, I am sure you will find that out.

[letmetellu]

I forgot to tell you what to do with the remaining acid. If you have another commode do the same to it... if not pour the rest down the commode... do not save it it is very corrosive to metal... like on cars and stuff.

[galan98]

I'll give that a try. We have three topilets in all, and have chronic flushing problems with two of them, and occasionally with the third. So I could end up using all of the muriatic acid.

[speedball1]

Hope someone can help.

Our toilets are original to the house, 20-plus years old. When flushed, the swirl isn't strong enough to completely flush the bowl. The bowl does NOT overflow, but it has to be flushed multiple times. We have very hard water where we live, despite having a regularly serviced water softener tank attached to the house line.

I'm thinking the jets under the rim of the bowl might be clogged with material buildup from the hard water. If so, how do I clear them? And if not, how can I solve this?

Thanks in advance.

g.

First let me give you a WARNING! As a rule letmetellu's answers are right on target but this time you were given bad advice (sorry letmetellu).. Not only was it bad but it is potentially dangerous to your health. Let me explain.
One of my duties at my fathers plumbing shop when I was a young boy learning the trade was to boil lime buildup out of toilet bowls with muriatic acid. This was done in the alley back of the shop so the fumes would dissipate in the open air, ( I can only imagine the concentration in a closed bathroom). My lungs are now permanently scarred from muriatic fumes. A few years ago a good friend of mine died after pouring Blast Out, a hydrochloric acid based drain cleaner so strong it's sold only to professionals, down a open toilet hole in a enclosed bathroom. DO NOT USE ACID IN A ENCLOSED AREA!!
Now let me tell you how to get those toilets working again.
For that lazy pottys. Look down at the bottom of the bowl. If there is a small hole, then that is a jet that starts the syphon action. If it's clogged the water will just swirl around and slowly go down leaving solids behind. Take your finger,(UGH! ) and run it around the inside of the opening. Over the years minerals build up and cut down on the syphon (flush) action. If it is rough or you feel build up, take a table knife and put a bend in it to get around the curve in the bowl and chip and scrap it clear. Next take a coathanger and clear out the holes around the rim. They start the swirling action. And last, check the water level in the tank. It should be 1/2" below the top of the over flow tube.
Good luck and let me know how you made out. Tom

[galan98]

WHOA! Many many thanks, Tom. As one whose lungs are already scarred from childhood asthma, I can honestly say you may have saved a life here. And to think, my biggest concern was the muriatic acid eating away at the rubber gaskets and the bolts holding the tank to the base!

QUESTION: If there isn't a jet at the bottom of the bowl, is it then just a matter of cleaning out the jets around the rim? Also, the tank has a fill line inside... should the water level be set right at that fill mark, or a little higher/lower?

Thanks again.

g.

[speedball1]

"QUESTION: If there isn't a jet at the bottom of the bowl, is it then just a matter of cleaning out the jets around the rim? Also, the tank has a fill line inside...should the water level be set right at that fill mark, or a little higher/lower?"
If there's no jet then you have wash down toilets. Clear the rim holes, scrape and chip any mineral build up that you feel and increase the tanks water level up to 1/2" under the overflow tube. A wash down toilet depends on gravity and the volume of water to start the siphon action. If you must use acid then pull the toilet and do it outside and upwind from the fumes.
Good luck, Tom

[PalmMP3]

If you don't want to pull the toilet, you can buy yourself a decent respirator (I bought an AOSafety QuickLatch Respirator at Lowe's for about $40) to protect you from the fumes. A respirator looks a bit like a gas mask; it has two filter cartridges on the sides, and an exhalation port in the middle (opposite your mouth). Make sure the one you get says on the package that it'll protect you from muriatic acid fumes. And be sure to vent out the bathroom COMPLETELY (using fans) before you or anyone else try to breathe in there without a respirator.

Good Luck!
Moishe

[letmetellu]

Sounds like speedball is the hero of the day, he saved a life according to (galan98).

[speedball1]

Sounds like speedball is the hero of the day, he saved a life acording to (galan98).

Letmetellu,
First, let me tell you that I consider you a valued and important member of the plumbing page. Your posts have helped countless askers with their problems. But every one in a while we goof and give the wrong advice. Your post about using muriatic acid hit home because decades later I'm still fighting health insurers that want to exclude any and all respiratory claims because they believed the scars on my lungs came fromTB and not the acid.
And my scars came from the very thing that you advised the asker to do.
Had I not inserted a warning with a explanation I would have felt responsible if anything had happened.
I've made bad calls on this page and have had to eat them. We all have. I sincerely hope this little speed bump won't prevent you from posting on the plumbing page because you would be sorely missed, both by me and the askers that you've helped with your answers.
And your thoughts? Regards, Tom

[fredg]

HI,
Good answers.
Would just like to add that if your toilet has an overflow plastic tube, be SURE it is placed in the overflow outlet, sticking up above the water in back of the toilet.
My toilets are 30 yrs old! Still working good.
But, at one time, I let the overflow plastic tube lie down toward the bottom of the tank, not positioned where it would run into the overflow. It would not flush, took a few times to flush it!
A coat hanger wire is excellent for pushing up through the hole in the toilet itself, and also to push into the holes beneath the toilet lid, in the bowl.
Best of luck.

[speedball1]

Hey Fred,

", at one time, I let the overflow plastic tube lie down toward the bottom of the tank, not positioned where it would run into the overflow. It would not flush, took a few times to flush it!"

If the overflow tube ever broke off the tank would never fill, the water would never shut off and the toilet would not flush no matter how many times you "jiggled" the lever. Cheers, Tom

[shunned]

If you can't unclog the little holes underneath the rim (use a mirror to check them) I would replace the bowl. I have had success unclogging them with small screwdrivers.

[letmetellu]

Speedball... The little speed bumb, as you called it will have no effect on me as to posting on this site. I understand you being wary of using acids but Muratic acid is used every day in our swimming pools and many other trades, so I don't think it is a death sentence to use the acid as it is suppose to be used. And the next time you don't agree with what I say to someone on here I wish you would phrase your disagreement a little different. Also please don't let this speedbump prevent from you posting as you always have.

[speedball1]

speedball.......The little speed bumb, as you called it will have no effect on me as to posting on this site. I understand you being wary of using acids but Muriatic acid is used every day in our swimming pools and many other trades, so I don't think it is a death sentence to use the acid as it is suppose to be used. And the next time you don't agree with what I say to someone on here I wish you would phrase your disagreement a little different. Also please don't let this speedbump prevent from you posting as you always have.

Lettmetall,

Pouring muriatic acid into a open pool diluted with 30,000 gallons of water out in the open air is quite different then pouring muriatic acid into 2 gallons of water in a enclosed unventilated space and then breathing the fumes as it boils off the minerals. I'm sorry your feelings were hurt. That was not my intention. I didn't call it "a death sentence" the asker did. This is a dangerous practice and I believe that the warning was delivered correctly. YOU DO NOT USE ACID IN A UNVENTILATED AREA PERIOD! That said, I'm not going to let this "speedbump" prevent me from posting, how about you?
Like I said we all "goof" and I'm no exception. Look at how I goofed by not suggesting the lead pipe might be galvanized. Cheers, Tom

[letmetellu]

I agree we all goof... so lets let bygones be bygones and just do the best we can answering other peoples questions.

[speedball1]

I agree we all goof......so lets let bygones be bygones and just do the best we can answering other peoples questions.

Kool!! Hugs & kisses all around!

[parzoe]

Plumber Fight! Plumber Fight!

Thanks for the help too by the way.

[speedball1]

Plumber Fight! Plumber Fight!

Thanks for the help too by the way.

Hey! No fight! Just a little misunderstanding. However, I lost a good friend amd am still paying the price 6o years later for boiling out toilets with acid. I can't stress this warning strong enough! As with ANY CHEMICALS, such as drain cleaners, ALWAYS use them in a well ventilated area. Regards, Tom

[Dajhomily]

Thank you speedball1. Thank you. Thank you. When I checked the small hole that starts the jet action it was completely blocked. You saved me lots of time and money.

You are the best.