[Barbara34691]

Hi,

I have 2 problems here, shower pan leaking, (plumber verified) also rain water coming in through same wall where the shower pan leak is. I just moved in to a one story Villa, a couple of months ago. I noticed that it was starting to smell musty, I moved some furniture and saw that the carpets were soaked, this was after a rain storm, also the wall that the shower is behind was damp. I called the plumber, he said it was the shower pan, called the tile man, he gave me an estimate. I haven't used the shower in 2 weeks, was dry, now another rain storm, water started coming through the concrete slab where the shower wall is that is leaking. I'm confused, can you please help?

[speedball1]

Not so fast Barbara,

One thing at a time. It's not the shower pan you should have focused on first. It's the rain water entering your house that should be your first concern. If this is a roof leak that's getting in from above you'll need a roofer. If it's ground water that's seeping in the slab you might need to install a french drain to dispel the seepage.
You can't even began to address the shower until the other leak's resolved.
What tests did the plumber make to tell you it was the shwer pan? Did he block off the drain, fill the shower floor with a inch or so of water and let it set to see exactly where the leak was coming from? Most shower leaks do not come from a leak in the pan or the drain line. Most shower leaks come from the shower stream hitting the tile wall where the grout has shrunk allowing the water to run down behind the lip of the pan and out onb the floor.
But the plumber couldn't know that could he? Since there was anther leak in the same spot. Unless he filled the shower base and actually saw the water running out on the floor he was just giving you a very expensive guess.

My advice would be to address the outside leak first and then turn your attention to the shower. Let me know what you decide. Regards, Tom

[Barbara34691]

Thank you for the quick response. The plumber just ran the shower for about 5 minutes or so and said it was the pan. Can you tell me more about a french drain? Who do I call to perform this work? I appreciate any help. I have the shower scheduled to be done on Wednesday, I already gave the tile guy half down. I'm confused!

[speedball1]

Hii Barbara,

I think you're making a huge, and very expensive, mistake by tearing up your shower before first checking out exactly where the leak originated from.
While the plumber could ascertain that there was a leak in your shower, there's no way he could point the finger at the shower pan unless he performed the test I described earlier. The water on the floor could have come from ABOVE the shower pan and run down behind it. I would put tearing up your shower floor on hold until two things were resolved. (1) Where's the outside leak coming from? A roof leak that's letting water leak down inside your wall or a ground water problem that's entering the slab. (BTW, is the wall where you see water a outside wall?)and-(2) Mre tests on your shower other then just running water in it. One more time, most shower leaks do not come from a bad pan or a faulty drain. They come from grout that's shrunk allowing water to enter ABOVE the lip of the shower pan and leak down behind it. Unless your plumber has performed a shower pan test he's just making a very expensive guess at your expense.

My advice? Postpone tearing up the shower until you have more information.
DEMAND that more checks be made both on the shower and the outside leak

As to the french drain,(see image)you won't knowif you need one until you know where the rain water's coming from. Have it taken care of first, and then the shower. In the meantime here's a link to click on to learn more about them.
http://landscaping.about.com/cs/lazy...nch_drains.htm

Please keep me in the loop on this. It's not that I think the plumber was attempting to: "scam" you, I just think he stopped short of doing the best job he could have. Regards, Tom

[Barbara34691]

Hi Speedball1,
Thank you again! I will put the shower on hold, and have some more tests done, I can do this test myself, I think. Also, can I call a contractor, and have him look at the roof and slab outside or do I need to contact 2 different people? Thanks again for all your advice, I really appreciate it.

[speedball1]

Hey Barbara,

No thanks necessary. That's my function. I just saw a error and brought your attention to it. To check for a leak always start at the top. ( water runs down, not up)
Check out the roof first. Make sure the water isn't entering your attic and running down inside your wall. You shouldn't have to pay a roof man for this. You or someone climb up in the attic with a flashlight and look around over where the wall is for fresh water marks. Best done after a rain but darker patches should show up anyhow.
No water marks? Then the next time it rains wait till it stops and dig a shallow trench next to the wall that leaks, (it is a outside wall that leaks isn't it?) If it fills with water or is sloppy moist then you have a groundwater problem.

Barbara, I'll hang in there with you as long as you want me to. Your plumber may be a good mechanic but I think he dropped the ball with your job. Cheers, tom

[Barbara34691]

Hi Tom,
I will call a roofer tomorrow, do I just ask him to check for holes? I don't have an attic, so I can't see any water damage. I know the ceilings aren't wet where the leaks are. But I do have a big water stain on the wall. I don't know when it will rain again, I live in Holiday, Florida. I'll keep you up to date. I know you say no need to thank you, but I really do appreciate your advice. Thanks again,
Barbara

[speedball1]

" I do have a big water stain on the wall."

Is this a outside wall? Where is the stain? Near the floor or farther on up the wall? Cheers, Tom

[Barbara34691]

Hi Tom,

This is the inside wall, where the shower is, in the corner and where the rain water enters the house.

Barbara

[Barbara34691]

Tom,

The stain starts at the bottom, and goes up about 2 feet on both walls, shower wall, and wall connected.

Barbara

[speedball1]

Tom,

The stain starts at the bottom, and goes up about 2 feet on both walls, shower wall, and wall connected.

Barbara

I'm no roof guy but that seems to indicate the water's coming in from the slab and climbing up the dry wall by capillary action. This would have to be caused by a crack in the slab letting ground water seep up after a rain.
This is just a guess on my part but I figure if it's a roof leak you would see stains farther up the wall. How wet does the carpet get? Enjoy your Sunday.
Tom

[Barbara34691]

Tom,
The carpets get soaked. But I pulled them up half way, after I shampooed and all that stuff, dried the floor and all. They are still up. The last rain storm we had last week, I think, I had to keep putting towels down to absorb the water. What to do now?

Barbara

[speedball1]

"What to do now?"

How handy are you? I can walk you through the shower pan test your plumber failed to do. It's not all that complicated.
As for the rain water leaking in you have a few options. You can open up the walls and look for signs of water damage or the next time it rains wait until it subsides and dig a trench about a foot deep and a few feet long and see if it fills up with water. If it does then chances are you have a ground water problem. Regards, Tom

[Barbara34691]

Tom,
I am handy, tell me what to do next. Also, I know there is water damage as when it rains the wall gets cold and I can see that is softening. Ground water damage? Or crack in fondation slab? Thanks Tom!

Barbara

[speedball1]

Babs! You're my kind a girl!

To test rthe shower pan you'll need a plug. You may purchase a 2" inflatable test plug, (see image) at any working plumbing company. You inflate them with a bicycle pump.**OR** you can take a balloon and inflate it in the drain and tie it off. Remove the strainer and make sure the test plug/balloon covers below the floor line into the drain pipe as there are weep holes under the tile and mortor that drains away any water that might seep past the tile into the pan. Now fill the base with a inch or so of water and let it set. Check for leaks and fresh water marks. If none then letit set over night and check again in the morning. Let me knowwhat you find. Tom
PS. You do realize that you're doing a job you've already paid your plumber tio do? Pay yourself 50$ a hour labor. Oh! What the hell! Give yoursel a 10 buck raise for being a good sport!