Pit Bulls are just like any other dog. If they are raised in a loving home then they are loving pets. My son owns two. I do fear them though.. . of being licked to death. :P

Some of it is how people train the dogs. Where we are here in New Zealand these are gang related dog and we also have a gang named sort of after them. But that's not the point, if people trained them all right then they wouldn't be such a problem. Most attacks that we have had here were by un-trained fighting guard Pit-bulls and some of the illegal fighting ring dogs. If the dog does sometimes bite mozzel it in public that should be the owners responsibility.

Also Cross breeds of these dogs are or have been more likely to attack people than a pure breed pit bull.

If this helped rate it

GREAT COMMENT bfinstad! Yes I agree 100%. I have two wonderful pitbulls that have been nothing but a joy to our lives. The neighborhood kids play with LOVE & SHEMP without one stinkin' inch of fear about our dogs. I and many have found them to be the smartest of lovable doggies I have had the pleasure to own. My husband and I LOVE our pitbulls like our own kids, and it shows. Like bfinstad said, they have been known more than enough times to SAVE LIVES. But you boneheads allow yourselves to be so brainwashed by the media. Of course they don't tell you the good stories about pits, get a clue! Cocker Spaniels have been known at times to have the highest biting rate according to statistics, but I'm sure you "people" wouldn't suggest reforming or getting rid of them as you shouldn't they are wonderful dogs. But that shouldn't be a wish for any other breed either. I am so sick and tired of these idiots that haven't a clue about anything. Rubypitbull, I'm sorry you've had a bad experience with pit bulls but remember if their vicious it's the owners you have to stay away from, and it's them that you have a bone to pick with! Starman, and anyone else that would say something so stupid as to eliminate pitbulls are just (and yes I will say it) Ignorant media brainwashed fools. Keep listening to the media and it will get you into trouble. Why don't you all develop a mind of your own? People have been mauled by other breeds as well, hello?

You don't know it yet but, you anti-pitbull goofs true wish is to eliminate the people that make them that way. What is so hard to understand about that? Like bfinstad stated and others, in so many words "hey idiot it's the owner that either loves them or MAKES them into vicious dogs which could be done to ANY breed. GET A PIECE OF BRAIN people!

Starman

starman? It is SO tragic to hear stories like these about people getting ripped apart and I'm sorry about that, truly. But we all know that it just isn't pitbulls themselves that are capable and attack people. ANY kind of dog is capable of this as Pitbulls are capable of being great dogs.

Also, PLEASE DON'T PUT YOUR NAME TO THE BIBLE. Your attitude is an embarrassment to those of us who read the Bible and do our best to live by it. The Bible is a book of love, truth, mercy, grace, and justice, CHRIST. It is not to be used by people like you to make self righteous comments about others values, that is a whole other subject. I am a Christian and love pitbulls. I have strong values, thank you. Why don't you learn about love and grace instead of pompously looking down your nose at people because of the type of dog they choose! Read your Bible for yourself! It's not about being a spiritual snob it's about the love of God. God made animals, therefore, God made dogs, therefore God made pitbulls. Before you wag your pompous tongue, whether they are a breed, whether they were bred to fight, they are here by God's allowance. Thank you very much.

I have a wondeful GOD GIVEN pit-bull myself and he would never hurt anyone. We have neighborhood children that love him, and they want to pet him and play with him. They can and they do with no problems except getting licked. He loves everyone and brings so much joy to people. Maybe that's something you haven't discovered yet. Oh, that's in the Bible too. JOY. Please stop embarrassing the name of Christ and His real followers by yourself righteous Pharisee attitude. Learn to LOVE. Read the book of John, see what is required of God above all things. Grace and Mercy.

GOD LOVES PIT-BULLS

Sugar, although I agree 100% with everything else you said, I am pulling out the above quote from your post. PLEASE, reread what I wrote back in March. I NEVER mentioned a bad experience with Pitbulls. I do rescue & foster work, rehabbing rescued dogs for new homes, and I have a rescued Pit myself who has been trained properly. What I am tired of is this thread. It is so old that hairs are growing on it! Starman posted this 4 years ago! Yet, people keep pulling it up. Since Starman's original post, there have been numerous other threads regarding the same issue in other forums. I have been vocal on at least one other occasion in which a poster really got my blood boiling, as you have experienced yourself here with Starman's post. I am very tired of reading things written by people like Starman, who have not bothered to learn anything about the breed but insist on condemning it. To remain ignorant of anything is a choice. If a person chooses not to fully inform themselves of a situation, my belief is that they should not enter into a discussion about it.

My expressions were based on a child who had recently gotten his face ripped off.
If indeed I offended pitt bull owners by reacting too strongly to thepermanent mangling, then I apologize.

Here is a pro Pitt Bull site:

Pet Pit Bull - Breed-specific Legislation


Excerpt:

While dog attacks on people are a serious concern to the authorities and the public, American Pit Bull Terriers pose no special danger, and measures against them that ignore demonstrably more guilty breeds are unjust and will be ineffective in reducing the number of attacks.

No breed of dog has an inherent temperament that automatically expresses itself, whether for aggression or any other trait. Behaviour of dogs varies more between individuals than between breeds, and the determining factor relevant to danger is human environmental input.

Reliably assessing the breed of individual dogs is all but impossible, and is out of the question for cross-breeds. Very many owners of dogs will learn they have "pit bull types" when their dogs have no American Pit Bull Terrier blood.

The costs and procedures in attempting to administer these laws will be insuperable, and will lead to patchy and arbitrary enforcement, to the additional compromise of natural justice.

Many well-behaved dogs will suffer death for having a certain appearance, and their decent owners will suffer significant grief and expense.

Endangered Dog Breeds Assoc

Sorry I offended you. My concern was more for the victims thanfor the animals. If indeed following Christ means showing more concern for the animals than for the human victims, then I guess we aren't reading the same Bible nor do we worship the same God. Furthermore, at no time did I place the blame totally on the owner or the dog. Animals will behave in a bad way for a variety of reasons. However, go tell that to the kid who is permanently disfigured and see what he has to say about your concern for the dog that ripped his face off. So again, it's a matter of priorities and ours just don't seem to mesh. As for emabarasing you by calling myself Christian, perhaps in view of your priorities that qualifies as a compliment.

BTW
God also made sharks. Does that mean that the people who show concern for shark attacks aren't Christians because they are upset about a human being getting an arm ripped off? Or if he suggests that certain sharks be aggressively discouraged from getting near beaches where humans are swimming? The original animals God made had no such tendencies and were therefor unconditionally lovable.

Also, if indeed you feel so self righteous as to level your condemnation in my direction, then you are obviously very ignorant in relation to scripture which specifically tells you not to judge.
In fact, Christians aren't supposed to put the wellfare of animals above those of humans so there too you are in grave error.

There are no bad dogs just bad owners. This has nothing to do with religion to start with. It is about arresting the dogs owners who made them mean to start with.

There are people who enjoy dog fights and the dogs are trained to do just that. There are people who take no interest in there dogs except to say how well it protects there house. These are also people who should be arrested and not allowed to have dogs.

I have never met a mean dog unless it was trained for meanness or was mistreated by the owner or others in the household. These are just the facts and there is no argument that can change that. As we all know our county or state would rather arrest or kill a mean dog rather that arrest the owner who caused the problem to start with.

Pit bull are like people. Treat them well and they are good dogs. Treat badly, then become vicious. No bad dogs. Bad owners.

Nothing can breed out of existence. Unbreeding will de-exist them.


Tom

I LOVE your sarcasm Starman. You obviously aren't reading the responses thoroughly and just insist on demonizing the wrong thing just to prove you are right. How many times do people have to post this? IT IS THE OWNERS THAT ARE AT FAULT, not the dog. I have seen what kind of damage a poorly bred and untrained chihuahua can do. It bit through and pulled off a child's cheek and part of his lip not too far from where I live. Should I state that chihuahua's are pests and should be banned? You and everyone like you are ridiculous in your insistence on not focusing on the real threats to our society. People who are irresponsible owners and breeders.

Dogs that are aggressive TOWARD PEOPLE, are either inbred, untrained or poorly trained, unsocialized or poorly socialized. It is not the fault of the dog. It is completely the fault of the owner. If you have a dog that has shown aggression toward people to an extent that it is a danger to allow them around people, it needs to be completely contained, or preferably, euthanized. Those people who claim their dog "never did anything like that before" are liars. You cannot live with a dog, day in & day out, and not notice any aggressive tendencies. We need much tougher laws against these people. Unfortunately, we live in too lenient a society. I believe training & breeding classes, along with the passing of a test and licensing, should be mandatory for all. And guess what, the same reasoning should be applied to the same idiots who insist on procreating and don't take the proper responsibility for their own children, and for those people that abuse their own kids. I have no patience for anyone who CHOOSES to do the wrong thing when it comes to being responsible for their pets and children.

FYI, I don't understand the point you are trying to make with your excerpt. It pretty much goes against your stance, not support it.

I wonder if these Pitt Lovers would be so defensive of their dogs if it had been their own face that had been ripped up. Somehow, I suspect that they wouldn't be singing the same song.

I am aware that dog owners are responsible for encouraging bad dog behavior. But in my view that is irrelevant if the dog itself has a higher tendency to bite or a lower threshold for provocation and because of it rips a child's face off. Does the Pitt Bull fit that description? Some say yes and others say no. I tend to agree with the latter. I may be wrong of course. But better safe than sorry. As for breeding them so that they become less temperamental if indeed they are, I see absolutely nothing wrong with it if it will save human lives and reduce life threatening mangling attacks. As for the choice and tone of my original question, I apologized and apologize again. I could have phrased it differently in order to avoid giving offense.


bTW

The point I am trying to make with the excerpt is that I am not as ignorant of the pro- Pitt Bull counterarguments as you claim. Neither have I suggested that they be exterminated. I meant to breed them into a more docile version for the sake of human safety. Nothing more nothing less. Anything beyond that is due to the feverish imagination of fanatical Pitt bull lovers.

I am not suggesting destruction. I am merely suggesting slight modification via interbreeding with a more docile breed. Cougers, tigers, and lions aren't in proximity to children. That's why I don't suggest that their temperaments be modified.
You say there is no temperament to modify in a Pitt Bull, despite their breeding for aggression. I opine otherwise and I am entitled to my opinion as you are to yours.


BTW

If a moderator could change the original wording in the post to: "Should Pitt Bulls be made more docile?" and remove it from the pest category and place it under Pets, or Zoology I would apreciate it.

Starman,
I understand what you are saying. But the pitbull is not an aggressive dog. They are not mean and crazy dogs. The dog fighting sport is really getting out of control. The reason you hear so many horrible things is because of those people. If you ever owned a pitbull terrier you would understand and completely fall in love with this breed. Ask any pitbull owner. I can guarantee they will always reply, I will always have a pitbull as long as I live. Unless of course they ended up with and inbred or abused dog. People should really read before getting a pitbull. I think that is one major problem. Before getting a pitbull, you should see the parents, make sure they aren't aggressive. Be extremely careful when rescueing one and make sure you work with them as soon as you get them. Back when fighting first started, pitbulls were put down if they showed ANY sign of people aggression. They wanted the dog to be dog aggressive but not people aggressive. Now adays, ignorant people just breed and breed not caring what the dog is like as long as he's tough and mean. Its really sad and unfortunately some people end up with this blood in their dogs. The pitbull is not for everyone. Unfortunately young guys love the fact of having a tough scary looking dog that will protect their house. Well if that is all that that dog has ever learned, if he gets out, who knows what it will do. It is unfortunate. You just really have to be carful with what you say about this breed. People that own pitbulls take it very offensively because these dogs are our babies. We hear it enough when we take them for walks. People will walk up to my dog and pet him and tell me what a well behaved dog he is and how cute he is. But as soon as they ask what breed, they run. That's fine. It hurts a little, but if that's how they feel about it, stay away from him. I don't care! But I can tell you that every single person that spent an hour around my dog and seen how good of a dog he is, they all say, I want one of his puppies. I plan on having a couple of litters because if you have an excellent dog, you should keep that gene going. As long as you KNOW you have good owners for the puppies. I understand your concern about this breed because it is a huge deal and needs to get under control. The government needs to change something but ending the breed is not the answer. Do me a favor and please please please turn on the discovery channel some day. Watch the dog whisperer and he will prove you all wrong about this breed. He knows everything about dogs and owns about 12 pitbulls. He knows what good dogs they are and actually uses them to train other dogs. (Nt just pitbulls) It's a goo show though, so please watch it sometime!

Just please understand that pitbulls are not mean dogs. They do not have a higher tendency to bite and they are not naturally aggressive dogs. That is all we are trying to tell you and people that feel the same as you. This breed is very strong yes! So you are going to hear about it more than if a chihuahua bites someone because they do more damage. I work with dogs all day long. I see every breed there is. I have never came across an aggressive pitbull. Not once since I've been there for 4 years. Other dogs yes, one breed in particular which I will not mention. And yet I do not think badly of that breed. You know why? Because every time I've seen an aggressive dog, I noticed that the owner chose not to do anything about it. They didn't correct that dog for his actions. And because of that for anyone to say a certain breed should be bred out of existence, I think is far from the right answer. If anyone should be bred out of existence, its
Ignorant people that have no soles and choose to make this breed or any dog, an aggressive dog! And that is impossible just like it is for pitbulls. And if it does happen (which it won't) those idiots will pick they next best dog for the job, and that breed will get the bad rep. It's a never ending cycle!

I understand what you are saying. Unfortunately, what you are suggesting is an impossibility. The majority of people who breed pitbulls for a living, don't do it for the love of the breed but for their fighting potential. They want the dog-on-dog aggression. They want winners. They don't think, or care about, the implications their actions have on society. In speaking with a veterinarian/dog behaviorist specialist friend of mine, she was complaining to me that she is seeing more and more aggressive Golden retrievers & labs that are attacking people, than pitbulls. It is due to completely irresponsible breeding. These dogs come from Puppy Mills or backyard breeders. We need to change the laws. People that want to become breeders must be properly trained and licensed to be breeders. There needs to be a recertification every few years through each State Veterinarian Office. The penalty for breaking those laws must be stiffer. It is the only way we are going to make a dent in dog aggression problems along with all the inherited genetic disorders all domesticated breeds are plagued with. I was reading something very recently that states that there are more species of dog on this planet, than any other animal. It is due to humans breeding them for specific purposes.

And, by the way, I am not fanatical about anything except for my desire that people don't believe everything they hear and read. I am fanatical about research and people arming themselves with knowledge when a problem is at hand that needs a logical resolution.

I hold KP2171's opinion on AMHD in very high regard. I understand completely what he is saying. He is being proactive in his desire to protect himself and his family. If you don't know the person walking their dog and you are at all uncomfortable, cross to the other side of the street. A dog should not be left outside unsupervised, tied up all day long and left alone every single day in this manner, or left alone in a fenced in back yard that is not completely secured (to ensure the dog doesn't get loose). Those are the people whose dogs have behavioral issues and when loose, they are prone to attack due to lack of socialization. Those people deserve to have their dog removed and fined/jail time, the maximum the law will allow. My dog is not allowed off lead and I know where she is every second of the day. The same goes for the fosters/rescues I take into my home. There is no excuse for being lax in this. Dog ownership is a major responsibility and it is a privilege not to be taken lightly.

Yes, I am familiar with The Dog Whisperer and notice that he has well-behaved pit bulls in his kennel. Based on what I have seen all dogs have a tendency to misbehave if they aren't treated correctly. As you say, since pit bulls are so strong when they misbehave it's more impressive than when say a Chiuaua does. So I agree that the solution lies in preventing the wrong kind of people getting ownership.

BTW

Four years ago I was not the same person I am now. Now I wouldn't phrase a question in that manner. In fact, shortly after posting it I sought a way to edit it but I was too late and there it sits offending people. My mistake.

O.K.
Call us smart ones fools, you do know that is a sin right? But Pit Bulls have been the subject of national media for one simple fact. They will and have attacked human beings, as well as other animals. The post say they are raised to be mean they are not born that way. Well this sounds like the same type person whom would debate over someone's sexual preferences as whether they were born that way, or grew in to it. Anyway, the pit bull is responsible for a great number of maulings, and even deaths. A lot of times you will see owner's of these dogs have there names in the paper for such things as theft , and drugs. And I am not saying all of you are thiefs, or drug dealers. And some people own them for fighting them. I have seen where these dogs have been lucky to have an old steel barrell for a house, if anything, and have a chain hooked to their collars, and hope they would be fed and watered some day. But to find the stats look at your state's health department records. I think you will see that the #1 yes I did say that pit bulls are #1 but they are going to be #1 at the top of the lists of dogs that maul, or kill people.
Thanks I enjoyed voicing my opion.