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    midwestmom's Avatar
    midwestmom Posts: 30, Reputation: 1
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    #1

    Jul 23, 2008, 04:59 AM
    Does signing over guardianship terminate parental rights?
    Hi, my sister was shown the last page of a guardianship form that only said she was giving guarndianship of her son to her sons grandparents. The grandparents convinced my sister it was only in case something medical happened to to her son while in his care. She believed them and then signed and had notorized the form. Later, she was told there was a court proceeding (she did not even know about) that had already signed the grandparents as legal guardians of her son with "No limitations" which of course the grandparents filled out. So, without her complete knowledge she now has signed over FULL guardianship to them! Does this mean she does not have any parental rights because for over 6 months, they will only let her see her son one day a week... not a day more, ever. My sister is a good Mom and is completely fit to take care of her son. Is there also any way she can petition against this or terminate the order? She is looking for full custody, as the father was in complete acknoledgement of signing over his parental rights.
    George_1950's Avatar
    George_1950 Posts: 3,100, Reputation: 236
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    #2

    Jul 23, 2008, 05:04 AM
    Welcome to AMHD. I am curious: how could there be a court proceeding involving your sister's child that she did not know about? What state is she, the grandparents, and the child in? Thanks
    midwestmom's Avatar
    midwestmom Posts: 30, Reputation: 1
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    #3

    Jul 23, 2008, 05:13 AM
    They are all in Illinois. The father was not willing to accept the responisibility of his son, so my sister thought it was OK the grandparents got involved so there would still be a strong link between her son and his father and fathers family. My guess to the question about how she did not know about the court proceeding is the grandparents prob. Told the jugde they couldn't find her or where she lived.
    George_1950's Avatar
    George_1950 Posts: 3,100, Reputation: 236
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    #4

    Jul 23, 2008, 05:23 AM
    How close are you to the court? Can you, or have you, visited the courthouse and read the file?
    midwestmom's Avatar
    midwestmom Posts: 30, Reputation: 1
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    #5

    Jul 23, 2008, 05:40 AM
    No I have not but when she told the grandparents she was going to keep her son for a couple more days, they threated to bring the police to pick him up and that she did not have that right. She asked why and they said she had signed over all of her rights. When the grandparent came to pick up her son he gave her a copy of the court preceedings granting them full guardianship, stamped by the court and signed by the judge in Feb. of this year. They just handed her this paper last week. (She Never had knowledge of any of this and was never served papers of given a court date)
    George_1950's Avatar
    George_1950 Posts: 3,100, Reputation: 236
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    #6

    Jul 23, 2008, 05:52 AM
    I'm certain you (and your sister) are frustrated and disappointed, but your sister is getting legal advice from her adversary, which is never a good thing. Is she working? And, can she afford an attorney?
    JudyKayTee's Avatar
    JudyKayTee Posts: 46,505, Reputation: 4600
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    #7

    Jul 23, 2008, 05:55 AM
    Quote Originally Posted by midwestmom
    No I have not but when she told the grandparents she was going to keep her son for a couple more days, they threated to bring the police to pick him up and that she did not have that right. She asked why and they said she had signed over all of her rights. When the grandparent came to pick up her son he gave her a copy of the court preceedings granting them full guardianship, stamped by the court and signed by the judge in Feb. of this year. They just handed her this paper last week. (She Never had knowledge of any of this and was never served papers of given a court date)


    Then she needs to go the Court that gave the grandparents custody and file for a rehearing - or a new hearing on the grounds of fraud.

    I'm a little confused that the Court would accept her notarized "authorization" and then accept a claim the grandparents didn't know where she is - who got the notary and who was the notary who verified her signature? (The notary only guarantees that the signature is that of the person bearing that particular ID but I'd like to know just where the notary came from.)

    She needs either an Attorney or she can go back to Court herself - I obviously would retain an Attorney. She should brace herself for a fight because there must be some reason the grandparents thought they were justified in taking this action.

    Is she paying support for the child? If not, that could be an issue against her.
    midwestmom's Avatar
    midwestmom Posts: 30, Reputation: 1
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    #8

    Jul 23, 2008, 06:03 AM
    The notary came from a currency exchange in Chicago
    JudyKayTee's Avatar
    JudyKayTee Posts: 46,505, Reputation: 4600
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    #9

    Jul 23, 2008, 06:05 AM
    Quote Originally Posted by midwestmom
    The notary came from a currency exchange in Chicago


    She and the Grandparents actually went into an office in person and she signed? Who prepared the document?

    Doesn't really matter, just curious.

    She needs an Attorney - or she needs to go down and talk to the Clerk of the Court. And she (as George said) needs to stop getting legal advice from the Grandparents. They've lied to her before; they may be lying to her now.
    George_1950's Avatar
    George_1950 Posts: 3,100, Reputation: 236
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    #10

    Jul 23, 2008, 06:05 AM
    Here is the best resource I've located thus far. Your sister needs a copy of the complete file concerning custody of her child; it will make everything simpler and quicker for her to take the next step. At this point, we don't know whether the grandparents have an order for 'guardianship' or 'custody'; or whether it is temporary or permanent (even the 'permanent' kind can be modified, so don't worry about that). See: DivorceNet - Illinois Child Custody FAQ's
    midwestmom's Avatar
    midwestmom Posts: 30, Reputation: 1
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    #11

    Jul 23, 2008, 06:08 AM
    My sister has never been charged with anything in her life, but has since found out that the grandparents lied in court to get custody of their children from their ex spouses when their children where younger. I believe they are crooked and controlling and they have become attached to the child and don't want to let him go and obviously would do anything to keep him. She is a good mom and this is very unfair
    midwestmom's Avatar
    midwestmom Posts: 30, Reputation: 1
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    #12

    Jul 23, 2008, 06:12 AM
    Does my sister have ANY rights to her son at all?
    JudyKayTee's Avatar
    JudyKayTee Posts: 46,505, Reputation: 4600
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    #13

    Jul 23, 2008, 06:17 AM
    Quote Originally Posted by midwestmom
    Does my sister have ANY rights to her son at all?

    Of course, she's the natural mother - she needs to get the grandparent's guardianship set aside or modified. She needs to get an order for visitation (minimally) and she needs to pay support. Did you answer that question? Does she pay support?

    If she is somehow unfit, well, then that's another matter.
    midwestmom's Avatar
    midwestmom Posts: 30, Reputation: 1
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    #14

    Jul 23, 2008, 06:20 AM
    The grandparents prepared the document, it looks like it was a copy of a legal document. She only signed one page in Feb. and never seen the other two until last week. Which those are the pages containing the court stamp and Judge signature. Also explaining both parents give the grandparents guardianship. The one she signed that was notarized said she is the above named person and she is giving guardianship to the grandparents. Which the explained to her not to worry is was only partial guardianship and it was for medical purposes only. My sister is nieve and I am not and cannot stand for this to happen
    midwestmom's Avatar
    midwestmom Posts: 30, Reputation: 1
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    #15

    Jul 23, 2008, 06:31 AM
    No she does not pay support, she wasn't aware she had signed over full guardianship until last week. They had kept that info from her until she tried to keep her son
    JudyKayTee's Avatar
    JudyKayTee Posts: 46,505, Reputation: 4600
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    #16

    Jul 23, 2008, 06:34 AM
    Quote Originally Posted by midwestmom
    No she does not pay support, she wasn't aware she had signed over full guardianship until last week. They had kept that info from her until she tried to keep her son

    So the grandparents have been supporting the child without any help from her? I don't think she needed a Court Order to realize the child needs to eat.

    Not being harsh but she needs to step up and take responsibility here and the Court will look at issues like this.
    midwestmom's Avatar
    midwestmom Posts: 30, Reputation: 1
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    #17

    Jul 23, 2008, 06:52 AM
    I do agree that she needs to step up. She never knew how much she needed to until she was given that copy last week. She will need to justify why she didn't step forward since Feb. when she did only seem him minimally. She does buy him food, clothes and toys regulary. Which I am sure they will deny without proof which of course my sister never knew she would need
    midwestmom's Avatar
    midwestmom Posts: 30, Reputation: 1
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    #18

    Jul 23, 2008, 06:55 AM
    If they make false accusations like they did with their exspouses, how will she defend herself? Will she say "hearsay" or please provide proof?
    JudyKayTee's Avatar
    JudyKayTee Posts: 46,505, Reputation: 4600
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    #19

    Jul 23, 2008, 06:56 AM
    Quote Originally Posted by midwestmom
    I do agree that she needs to step up. She never knew how much she needed to until she was given that copy last week. She will need to justify why she didn't step forward since Feb. when she did only seem him minimally. She does buy him food, clothes and toys regulary. which I am sure they will deny without proof which of course my sister never knew she would need


    Money is the answer. She needs to send money, not buy things for him - he needs food and electricity and shelter. But I'm sure you know that and now she realizes it.

    Feeding him on occasion and buying him some clothes and toys will not be considered to be supporting her child.
    midwestmom's Avatar
    midwestmom Posts: 30, Reputation: 1
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    #20

    Jul 23, 2008, 07:02 AM
    What about the false accusations question

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