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paraclete · Sep 2, 2017, 06:49 PM

Kim needs reassurance the US will not attempt to reunify Korea by force. Kim has the long held agenda of reunification by force and resents US support of the south. Right now he is reacting to US shows of force on the peninsula. There is no need for combined war games on the peninsula, it is provocative. The US should suck its scone in and stop provocative actions and see if Kim responds. Someone has to be the bigger man here

tomder55 · Sep 3, 2017, 02:45 AM

and this isn't provocation ?

https://www.theguardian.com/world/li...m-jong-un-live

He is close if not over the point of no return . The implication of Kim having missile ready nukes are far reaching . At very least the era of non-proliferation is gone. The world will regret their inability to prevent the spread of nukes to crackpots like Kim or to homicidal apocalyptic screwballs like the 12er in Tehran.

tomder55 · Sep 3, 2017, 05:12 AM

This was in April's Atlantic :We are now at an existential moment, where North Korea must be confronted with a fundamental choice: Either it will face crippling global economic sanctions (including a Chinese oil embargo) that could trigger the collapse of the regime, or it will negotiate a verifiable end to its nuclear weapons development program.

Well Kim called the bluff. Kim picked what the negotiators believed was an irrational option. Will that be the last time he takes the irrational route ?

talaniman · Sep 3, 2017, 05:52 AM

Don't be such a squish just because China is playing HARDBALL. It's in their interest that we be very afraid of Kim. Lets not forget Kim IS a threat because that's what China wants them to be.

tomder55 · Sep 3, 2017, 11:36 AM

herr Donald threatened to stop all trade with nations doing business with the NORKS . 95% of their trade is with the PRC .Now Kim is a threat to them (and always have been ......China is building a wall between the 2 nations ).

talaniman · Sep 4, 2017, 07:32 AM

China seems to be protecting itself from NK refugees, but they do nothing in regard to NK threatening others. Nikki Haley threatened them to do more to rein in their stupid pet at the UN emergency session this morning, with consequences if they don't. A trade war helps no one, but neither does ICBM's going over your head.

tomder55 · Sep 4, 2017, 01:23 PM

as you know I despise trade war . But where they can be used to influence the behavior of bad actors then I have no choice but the support sanctions (even with the poor track record of their effectiveness). The choices here are few and none of them acceptable . The one I reject out of hand is nukes in the hands of the Kim regime ,and by extension ,in the hands of the 12ers .

as you know I despise trade war . But where they can be used to influence the behavior of bad actors then I have no choice but the support sanctions (even with the poor track record of their effectiveness). The choices here are few and none of them acceptable . The one I reject out of hand is nukes in the hands of the Kim regime ,and by extension ,in the hands of the 12ers .

paraclete · Sep 4, 2017, 03:16 PM

If you don't want a hot war you may have to have a trade war. A trade war will mean you will isolate yourselves as many nations trade with China and if you sanction trade with them you are biting yourself on the A#se. The alternative is to give the sanctions time to bite, these things are are not instantaneous

talaniman · Sep 4, 2017, 03:25 PM

There's a lot of truth to that Clete, sanctions could take a while, and there may be a lot more to come. Heck we may have to sanction Australia for selling dirt to China before it's over. Surely you can see other nations may well have to chose whose side your on in this on. Go ahead choose China and Kim, and we will see who is isolated.

paraclete · Sep 4, 2017, 04:35 PM

Originally Posted by talaniman

There's a lot of truth to that Clete, sanctions could take a while, and there may be a lot more to come. Heck we may have to sanction Australia for selling dirt to China before it's over. Surely you can see other nations may well have to chose whose side your on in this on. Go ahead choose China and Kim, and we will see who is isolated.

We don't choose KIM but there are nations who trade directly with NK, such as China and India who we trade with, heck, we even trade with you. It isn't a matter of sides. Either you want China in the real world or you want to isolate them too, trade is interconnected today, as I said you isolate those who trade with China, you isolate yourselves

talaniman · Sep 4, 2017, 06:08 PM

Trade is cool, Kim is NOT!

paraclete · Sep 4, 2017, 07:31 PM

Exactly, you can't make a profit doing nothing

talaniman · Sep 5, 2017, 05:24 AM

Profit before people? Hmm. Boy we could make a mint selling nukes to people that want them.

paraclete · Sep 5, 2017, 05:55 AM

Originally Posted by talaniman

Profit before people? Hmm. Boy we could make a mint selling nukes to people that want them.

Way things are going there might be a market in the south, but then we have the technology to make our own, we just don't have the reactors, lack of foresight there, or just plain old socialist, greenie, politics as contrasted with the red kind, I wonder if our new drones are nuclear capable?

talaniman · Sep 5, 2017, 07:02 AM

I think we could cut a deal and make them nuclear capable. How much money you got? We give Island Paradise discounts you know!

paraclete · Sep 5, 2017, 03:56 PM

Originally Posted by talaniman

I think we could cut a deal and make them nuclear capable. How much money you got? We give Island Paradise discounts you know!

Let's cut a deal, I hear you have about 800,000 good hard working people you want to deport, we will swap you for 2,000 refugees and some tactical nukes for our drones. That a big enough discount for you?

talaniman · Sep 5, 2017, 04:25 PM

What are we getting in return? Cash is king and we don't need dirt.

paraclete · Sep 5, 2017, 05:38 PM

Originally Posted by talaniman

What are we getting in return? Cash is king and we don't need dirt.

Ah, people of so little vision, look at the job creation, with 800,000 less, their jobs become instantly available, solving another problem. The weapons you give us would probably be cold war era anyway, and you need somewhere to dispose of them. We will give you Aussie Dollars at a 50% discount, these will soar in value when you finally bomb Kim and cause a trade war with China and the rest of the world. But you forget, we are one of the largest gold producers in the world, so dirt in another form perhaps, lovely yellow stuff, or perhaps that other yellow stuff you are so fond of, we have plenty of that too

talaniman · Sep 5, 2017, 06:44 PM

Butter?

paraclete · Sep 5, 2017, 09:59 PM

Ah, a man of vision after all, no, we closed the butter factories when Britain deserted us for the second time (EU). I was referring to uranium, Indians love the stuff. We do a lovely line of cheese though. Maybe you could give us some nuclear reactors for our new subs and some cruise missiles to go with them, after all we have never had a Marshall plan, you spent all your money on your enemies and did nothing for your allies