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classyT · Feb 20, 2009, 08:13 AM

Originally Posted by De Maria

I can't find it. Will you post the reference.

Yes, the Bible is clear. This is what St. Paul says to believers:

1 Corinthians 4:5
Therefore judge nothing before the time, until the Lord come, who both will bring to light the hidden things of darkness, and will make manifest the counsels of the hearts: and then shall every man have praise of God.

...if we confess...

Then you understand that you must repent of sin. Good.

I kind of smile in amazement when I meet people who realize that Jesus died for our sins and yet claim they don't have to do anything. Don't you realize that anything worthwhile is worth working for? Don't you believe that Salvation, being united to God for all eternity, is worthwhile?

Romans 2:7
To them who by patient continuance in well doing seek for glory and honour and immortality, eternal life:

Hebrews 5:9
And being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him;

No one denies that. What we deny is the claim that anyone who refuses to walk in the works which God has prepared for them from all eternity will go to heaven.

That would be disobedience. Refer to Heb 5:9 above.

Does that mean that you will now refuse to do what is righteous? This is why even our works are God's gift. Because although our works are dirty rags, He rewards us for them.

Which He accomplishes through me. We are His hands, feet, mouth, eyes. It is through us that Christ works. That is why we are called His Body.

So, if you, a member of Christ's body, refuse to work, you will be cut off:

John 15 2Every branch in me that beareth not fruit he taketh away:

Have you not read in Scripture, BY FAITH HE....

Heb 11
4By faith Abel offered unto God a more excellent sacrifice than Cain,

7By faith Noah, being warned of God of things not seen as yet, moved with fear, prepared an ark to the saving of his house;

8By faith Abraham, when he was called to go out into a place which he should after receive for an inheritance, obeyed; and he went out, not knowing whither he went.

It is because we have faith in God that we work in obedience to His Word.

Genesis 26:5
Because that Abraham obeyed my voice, and kept my charge, my commandments, my statutes, and my laws.

It is lack of faith which leads us not to work. And without faith, we are condemned, because without faith, we can't please God:

Hebrews 11:6
But without faith it is impossible to please him: for he that cometh to God must believe that he is, and that he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him.

Do you not know that our works perfect our faith:
James 2:22
Seest thou how faith wrought with his works, and by works was faith made perfect?

It doesn't always.

If you say, "I invited all to my party." Did you really invite all? No, you invited all that you knew or all your friends.

In the same way, Jesus Christ cleanses us from all "repented" sin. But if there are any unrepented sins, they will not be cleansed until you repent of them completely. And repentance is more than giving lip service. Repentance is repayment.

Acts 26:20
But shewed first unto them of Damascus, and at Jerusalem, and throughout all the coasts of Judaea, and then to the Gentiles, that they should repent and turn to God, and do works meet for repentance.

It is doing you best to make things right again. Simply saying, "I'm sorry I busted your window." Is not enough. Not in this world and not in the world to come.

Sincerely,

De Maria

De Maria,

OK OK... it wasn't a direct quote. I should have said it was a paraphrase.. sorryyou asked for this earlier and I forgot to put it out... here you go Hebrews 8:

10This is the covenant I will make with the house of Israel
after that time, declares the Lord.
I will put my laws in their minds
and write them on their hearts.
I will be their God,
and they will be my people.
11No longer will a man teach his neighbor,
or a man his brother, saying, 'Know the Lord,'
because they will all know me,
from the least of them to the greatest.
12For I will forgive their wickedness
and will remember their sins no more."[a]

I believe we need to confess our sins and repent ALWAYS... please do not misunderstand me. I do not believe we can continue to live in Known sin and get away with it... there is plenty of scripture to back it up.

I do NOT believe one can lose their salvation if they are really saved andif you would like to start a discussion on it we can. Although I think all of us have discussed it and NONE are about it change their position.

I just read the "repayment comment"... sorry I know you are sincere but I couldn't my debt to the Lord the first time and I can't pay it now. That does not mean I do not think you don't need to repent. It DOES mean that it doesn't KEEP my salvation.

classyT · Feb 20, 2009, 08:33 AM

Originally Posted by cozyk

"

I don't want to be called a christian if it means I have to just shut up and accept. Accept anything the bible or christian leaders tell me when it does not resonate as truth with my heart, brain, conscience, soul, and gut. That is where my truth lies.

WEll now Cozyk,

HEY!! I FIgired it out for you!! ( I know you wanted me to)

My bible tells me this... The Heart is deceitful about ALL things and DESPERATLY wicked. It is in every translation. Jesus says HE is truth and again His word is truth. Your conscience, soul, gut, heart and brain... are part of your flesh that needed to be redeemed because it is sinful. So see, I have helped you out!! Truth does NOT lie in your flesh. Don't thank me though... I am just here on amhd to do what I can to enlighten mankind (or womankind) with all of my wisdom. (narrow minded thinking and all) :D

samdarwen · Feb 20, 2009, 10:35 AM

Dear Fred..
Thank you for the way you look and understand things the way it is..
My friend.. I have one little thing to add, and I think you agree,, Confessing means to accept and coerect your sin, to understand what wrong you've done and the want to change it.. On the other hand, Some of us think that Confessing is just going to Church and tell about your sin, and that's it...
I believe that to gain forgiveness like it is in the Bible, have more in it than telling anyone about our sin... again, To confess, is to realize our mistakes and to fix them.. It's a way for us to be forgiven that the Lord made for us, And my friend I think you know, even I'm sure you know that some of us, like to use that part as a way to sin.. That's not how it should be... The true want and the real motives in us, must be what move us to reach that level... We all are sinners, And we all ask for forgiveness or why do we ask for it in the first place?
I've been looking around, and I saw most of what you wrote, and I believe that you are a smart person, and a very intelligent one too.. I saw between the lines, some one that really can tell the different between right and wrong, and if so, I think you will not choose the wrong because you know that you will be forgiven, See, that is what some do, and that is why I wrote what I wrote,, I know I don't know a lot, and I know that I maybe wrong about too many things, and I have been... And I know that some one will use what we write out here, as a way to make their choices, That is why I try to be careful of what we say in here, because I don't want to be a part of some one else's sin..
Peace
Sam

classyT · Feb 20, 2009, 11:39 AM

Originally Posted by classyT

WEll now Cozyk,

HEY!!!! I FIgired it out for ya!!! ( i know you wanted me to)

My bible tells me this...The Heart is deceitful about ALL things and DESPERATLY wicked. It is in every translation. Jesus says HE is truth and again His word is truth. Your conscience, soul, gut, heart and brain....are part of your flesh that needed to be redeemed because it is sinful. so see, I have helped you out!!!! Truth does NOT lie in your flesh. don't thank me though....I am just here on amhd to do what i can to enlighten mankind (or womankind) with all of my wisdom. (narrow minded thinking and all) :D

You know what cozyk,

Ignore what I said I do believe it but it wasn't a kind way to say it. I'm having a bad week and I am taking it out on some woman on askmehelpdesk that isn't agreeing with me and giving me reddies. You are so entiled to your opinion and my sarcasm is not Christian like... sorry. You'd like me in real life... I'm not nearly as obnoxious. Just struggling with marriage issues... it isn't your fault. :(

cozyk · Feb 20, 2009, 12:28 PM

Originally Posted by classyT

WEll now Cozyk,

HEY!!!! I FIgired it out for ya!!! ( i know you wanted me to)

My bible tells me this...The Heart is deceitful about ALL things and DESPERATLY wicked. It is in every translation. Jesus says HE is truth and again His word is truth. Your conscience, soul, gut, heart and brain....are part of your flesh that needed to be redeemed because it is sinful. so see, I have helped you out!!!! Truth does NOT lie in your flesh. don't thank me though....I am just here on amhd to do what i can to enlighten mankind (or womankind) with all of my wisdom. (narrow minded thinking and all) :D

Once again, no original thought. You find a scripture to speak for you each time. Then you add sarcasm to the mix. And call it funny:D So... no you haven't helped me out. You have just shown me how in charge your ego is.

I think I am two parts, my flesh, this vessel that walks around this planet, it has an ego that is powerful and wants to survive and win at all times. Another word for ego is "the enemy", satin, or the flesh. It's the part that is proud, selfish, petty, needs to be right and basically looking out for number one.

The other part of me, not my flesh is my conscience. The little voice that tells me the real truth. When I speak of my soul, gut, heart , brain, they all contribute to my conscience.
It is my "inner christ" I use that term for lack of a better word. But it remains pure and it KNOWS what is the right thing to do, think, behave, etc. It is in constant conflict with my ego because the flesh is so weak, and wants what it wants, now.

I think I must have hit a nerve with that "narrow minded" thing because you continue to bring it up. I explained what I meant by that in another post. Please don't take it so hard.

cozyk · Feb 20, 2009, 12:42 PM

Originally Posted by classyT

You know what cozyk,

ignore what i said I do believe it but it wasn't a kind way to say it. I'm having a bad week and I am taking it out on some woman on askmehelpdesk that isn't agreeing with me and giving me reddies. you are so entiled to your opinion and my sarcasm is not Christian like... sorry. You'd like me in real life...i'm not nearly as obnoxious. Just struggling with marriage issues ....it isn't your fault. :(

Wouldn't you know it. After I hit the submit answer button, I saw this post. :p I'm sorry you are having such a bad week. We've all been there-done that. I absolutely accept your apology and I'm sorry for coming off less than christ like too. ( The devil made me do it) I think I'd like you in real life too. No one could ever say you were wishy washy.

classyT · Feb 20, 2009, 12:43 PM

cozyk,

I apologized for my sarcastic comment and I never once called myself funny. I do not have some great ego nor am I narrowminded. I have no other source other than the word of God and I don't want one. Man has yet to have an original thought. I will stick to the only truth I know, have or will ever need.

You are entitled to believe what you want to. I'm not going to change your mind.

cozyk · Feb 20, 2009, 12:50 PM

Originally Posted by samdarwen

Dear...
I understand your point view, and I see what is it you have in your bag.. Any one who choose to read and learn, will need answers, and when answers become the source of confused, it become harder to believe..
I did read and study the Bible, and most of it was using the Aramaic.. I believe that you are right about the way people translated the Bible to a different languages and too many believes.. But the main idea of any believe is FAITH.. And I think you have it, and because you have it, you are looking for the truth.. I will ask you to go ahead with your looking, and I hope that you will find it somewhere and understand it.. Because for most of us.. Some shadowed areas are still not easy to understand.. So I will say to you, God bless you, and good luck with your search. By the way.. I don't mean to make it sound a big thing, but if you please not use the word shaky when talking about the Bible? Some of us will not understand what you mean and will take it the wrong way... Like I said, I see your point view and I understand your looking for the truth... God bless you
Peace
Sam

Thank you Sam for your kind words and your attempts to understand where I'm coming from. And, I'm sure I can come up with a better word than "shaky" and I'll be working on that. You are right. I think a lot of good can be gotten from the bible and I don't mean to throw the baby out with the bathwater. " :o Dear Lord, please help me choose my words more carefully.:o "

classyT · Feb 20, 2009, 12:51 PM

Originally Posted by cozyk

Wouldn't you know it. After I hit the submit answer button, I saw this post. :p I'm sorry you are having such a bad week. We've all been there-done that. I absolutely accept your apology and I'm sorry for coming off less than christ like too. ( The devil made me do it) I think I'd like you in real life too. No one could ever say you were wishy washy.

cozyk,

Lol.. thanks. :)

cozyk · Feb 20, 2009, 01:08 PM

Originally Posted by classyT

cozyk,

lol..thanks. :)

You are welcome. Thank YOU. Now, peace... :)

arcura · Feb 20, 2009, 07:16 PM

samdarwen,
Thank you very much.
Fred

Fanspoman · Feb 21, 2009, 07:10 PM

Originally Posted by unknown624

from what i've heard, you won't go to heaven if you have sex before marriage. my friend and her boyfriend are really close, and she has told me she might have sex with him. they are sixteen, and i'm not sure what to tell her. she also asked me this: "if i have sex with him, will i go to hell?"

so i guess my question is, will she go to hell, and how do i stop her?!

Well first... according to the Bible, only 144,000 humans will be granted the gift of heavenly life. This is the "little flock" that Jesus referred to. Jesus also referred to the "other sheep" that he would be the shepherd over along with that "little flock". Revelation 7 and Revelation 14 show that these 144,000 are NOT literal Jews (going by the 12 tribe listed in Revelation), but they are the ones who were "bought from the earth". The "other sheep" are also mentioned in Revelation, but are referred to as the "great crowd" which is a group so large they are not specifically numbered. These are the ones who will realize God's original purpose for mankind by enjoying everlasting life in perfect health here on the earth in paradise.

Secondly, God's arrangement (as set forth in the Bible) is that sexual relations are only to be engaged in by a legally married man and woman. NO sexual activity is permissible before marriage, and it is certainly not permissible in God's sight that it be engaged in by members of the same sex. Those actions fall under "fornication" which God views as a serious sin. But remember that when Jesus was on earth, he preached to people about the need for repentance. They have to recognize that what they were doing was wrong and stop doing it. If they did that, they would have the opportunity to have their sins forgiven, and through their faith in Jesus' sacrifice, may have that hope of everlasting life.

16 year olds really have no place even dating, let alone engaging in sexual relations. You shouldn't threaten the daughter with "going to hell" if she doesn't stop her activity with her boyfriend. The threat of going to "everlasting fire of hell" is something false religion has been doing for countless centuries to keep their people in line, even though there is absolutely no such thing as hellfire. If your friend has any love for God or any sense of spirituality on her own, do your best to reason with her from the Bible showing that God has a set arrangement for when and by who sexual activities should be engaged in... and the situation she's in now is not part of that arrangement.