Ok, here is the deal: I have been married for 11 years, I love my husband and my 4 kids. I am changing mentally, from what I used to believe to what I believe to day. My husband is a strong republican, so I was one too. I can't say that I disagree with him entirely, but my views on politics have changed quite a bit since we have been together. Starts some arguments but I can handle that. This is just an example of many things that have been changing in my mind, the last 5 years it has been really hard for me to come out with my point of views to my husband, I feel like I am not the same girl he married sometimes. He is exactly the same man I married. Anyone have any suggestions to make me able to "come out" on some issues with him? He is a strong headed man and he has a hard time when people see things in other ways.

Here is my take.

You married a mature guy, your were a tad more immature in your political views and not really too worried about it because you defferred to him in most cases. Anything he said, you agreed with, at the time. Now, after having four kids you have probably matured so much more and possibly gone way beyond him in your beliefs. This isn't unusual.

Yes you have grown and probably still are.

You are and he are going to have find middle ground and its going to be hard for you to do that. I suggest you get a group of people, maybe close friends together, make it an involuntary discussion group (people who absolutely know you have matured) and bring up topics you are strong about so that he can see you have your own opinions, because I assume that is what you want him to see, right ? Think about this, maybe no in my format, but at least you will have some ground work. Good luck !

I have definitely been growing, I think I am sure of that. Not that he was mature, I was 20 he was 22. I think mostly he is too hard headed to change his view, kids, gays, parents, money, and so on. He won't budge. I am going to get that group of friends over, (when I can) and see what happens. If politics are brought up, I stop it immediately because he gets all crazy over it. He has calmed down a bit but it still bothers me. When we met, you are right I did agree for the longest time, on his views. Four kids has played a big part in that now! Thanks for the advice.

I am glad you saw my point. You are right, politics and religion are two areas I stear away from although had to get past the religion one.

By the way, if you liked my idea, rate my answer... thanks !

I just got to thinking, when we do talk there is sometimes hostility in his voice from my answers to his questions. I think I may have a harder time explaining my views than I do in believing in them. Does that make any sense?

He and I had a first heated conversation about some things last night. It was so nice because at first I thought it was going no where, then all of a sudden it was a delight to hear him hear me. We talked a lot and then fell right asleep on the couch, woke up and couldn't stop talking about stuff some more. Not the real important topics, but it was all good.

I am really glad that worked out for you, just keep up the dialogue and you will be at first base! Then you two will be conversing on the same wave length from now on :) Open communication is the most important item in a relationship, married or not. There is so much give and take to be appreciated. I am very happy that you are satisfied with the first encounter. Tiring, isn't it ?

Yes, it is tiring, but I really want to grow with him and not without him, if that makes any sense. He has always been there for me and I him. We love each other and have made a pretty happy home together. We were young and very stupid when we got married but we figured a lot of stuff out over the years. I think we are on the right path. Thanks you so much, I think just saying something about it helped me take that first step. You have been great.

I am so proud of you for understanding your growth and maturity as a woman. YOU are definitely figuring some things out for yourself that maybe before you always agreed with your husband. There is nothing wrong with changing your views on politics, religion, or anything else for that matter. That is a wonderful thing, to not stay rigid in your beliefs. I guess I won't be having any heart to heart talks regarding politics with your husband anytime soon because he would probably think I am some tree loving hippie liberal. That is o.k. though. My husband thought differently when we got together. Slowly but surely he understands more of my perspective, and he respects me for it. I guess it is difficult when things that seem so clear to you, make no sense to him A lot of issues that people make political, don't have to be. They are more human issues, like creating a country that doesn't abuse its resources, creating alternative sources of energy. Also, creating alliances around the world, instead of being a bully to it. I could go on and on about that stuff. I know the gay issue is a big one, and that is more a personal thing, than a political one. This administration has created so many problems for this country, the ultra conservative republicans who want everything run their way. They have dismantled environmental protection laws that have been in effect for over thirty years! For what? To have access to our national parks, protected reserves, so they can drill for oil! Oil that won't last and continues to exploit our natural resources. Forget about the animals, or your right of privacy. Or better yet, a war with the wrong country, no funding for our troops and the blatant lies and deceitful things they have fed the citizens of this country. Look, if there had been a decent, moderate Republican running for office that cared about global warming, poverty, education, and the Military, I would have voted for him. We got dumb and dumber. Except, Cheney isn't dumb, he is evil!! He has contracts overseas to make millions off our troops. He has support of special interest groups that are detrimental to our country. They support outsourcing our jobs, to people of other countries. Giving away our jobs to foreigners, to pay them pennies. Why? So they don't have to pay taxes. The rich get richer, and the poor get poorer. The middle class is disappearing rapidly, and this is part of it. I won't go off any more on a tanget, I just wanted you to know, my husband didn't agree with all of this when I met him, He doesn't agree with all of it now. However, because we talk about these subjects, he comes around a little more each time. I have the most conservative, religious family (except my mom and dad) and it is difficult to have discussion without them getting heated. Yet, I have to admit, it is stimulating. Not everyone will have the same views, that is what makes us unique. Discussing political issues is important, it is critical to freedom of thought and expression, it is what makes us American. Not capitalists, but Americans. I am thankful I can say what I want. You should be thankful for this opportunity you have given yourself, it won't drive a wedge in your marriage. It will create a new perspective. It will give him an opportunity to respect your thoughts and opinions and validate them, even if he doesn't agree. You can still raise your family in a happy home, there is nothing wrong with a little debate here and there. It will keep you feisty and he will admire that, even when he is saying something different. Men like a woman with her own mind. Allow it to flourish and create new meaning for you! YOur children will appreciate your thoughts also. It will give them respect for you. It will let them know how to use their mind and express their views and beliefs, regardless of what other people say.

I have one question... How in the hell do you pay your phone bill? You have so many things to say and I notice sometimes you stop yourself in the middle. What if you didn't stop? Would this go on and on and on? You are so cute. Silly. Yes, I don't agree on something's he does, but I also agree with him on lots. I feel so two sided sometimes. See you soon and thanks!

Ok, here is the deal: I have been married for 11 years, i love my husband and my 4 kids. I am changing mentally, from what I used to believe to what I believe to day. My husband is a strong republican, so I was one too. I can't say that I disagree with him entirely, but my views on politics have changed quite a bit since we have been together. Starts some arguments but i can handle that. This is just an example of many things that have been changing in my mind, the last 5 years it has been really hard for me to come out with my point of views to my husband, I feel like I am not the same girl he married sometimes. He is exactly the same man I married. Anyone have any suggestions to make me able to "come out" on some issues with him? He is a strong headed man and he has a hard time when people see things in other ways.
Dear Startover22...

I am European and I will not discuss politics on this board.
Firstly because I have not been here long enough to have a strong opinion about it and secondly because I am Dutch, we are very liberal and I am often surprised in the USA.

Having said that... I will react as a woman :)
It makes sense that you have changed and grown over the years...
The girl who married has become a woman...
You have become a mother, your view on the world has changed and with that our political view tends to be affected.

I think that the most important would be to "agree that you can disagree..."
Some people are more "hard headed" and more passionate about their political views than others and that can make it harder to communicate.

Maybe that is what you -but I am just guessing... - feel as the hostility in his voice ?
Anyway, as long as you keep communicating it's good.

And you know what...
I think that it's not unusual to feel two-sided in relationships/marriages.
Often opposites attract and that means two different meanings.
As long as we can respect eachother's view and keep communication flowing it's fine. \

All my best,


Gypsy

So if I calculated right, you're 31 and he's 33. The late twenties-early thirties is an important transition point for most people, so it's not surprising that you're changing and that these changes are being reflected in your relationship. I think it's great that you're able to express yourself more openly, and that he's apparently willing to listen and appreciate that you have something to say.

One of the biggest fictions around is that we become fully mature adults at age 21. It takes at least another 10 years. Even people who try to stay in the early twenties version of adulthood are eventually dragged along, kicking and screaming all the way. Not a pretty sight, and those who resist too long become pathetic figures. I myself narrowly escaped such a fate.

That is my problem, I have too many things to say. That is my downfall. I don't think you are two sided, you are multi-dimensional. You are not a shallow person. That is a good thing! I think you get better and better the more you continue to evolve, grow and question what is going on around you. It is o.k. to not fit into one specific box or another. Just continue to be true to yourself and your beliefs.

Thank you guys. I am feeling just that way. I am making some serious changes and baby changes as well. They seem to affect me the same though. I really appreciate the great talks, I just love them!

Shattered, please let it out babe, I love reading it and hope I did not offend you about the phone bll. It was meant with humor. Give it up girlie! And thanks for being here...

NO, you didn't offend me at all! I laughed when I read it. Thank God I get free long distance on my cell phone! LOL I enjoy everything I read from you. I just think I am wasting everyone's time with my emotional tirades. I read what I write and then I think damn, I sound like a know it all. I am a passionate person, but believe me, more often than not, people get uncomfortable with that. I guess I am trying to avoid saying too much anymore. I feel kind of stupid.

No, I don't think you sound stupid. I actually am going to take some classes on getting all my feeling in words, from you. I can't seem to get them out of my mind sometimes. I just like the fact that you recognize all that you have with what is going on and your family too. You are very very passionate and that it what brings me back to the posts every time. I love having this place as my "own" place to write things that the people around me might be offended or they just won't understand. So be it. We are hear to listen. And sometimes more. See you soon.

Gypsy, thank you, I forgot to tell you that. I am definitely changing, and it is a funny thing to see. I thought I would be "that" way forever. Thanks for the imput and hope to hear from you along my journey!

Yeah, you are right about that. IT does feel like my own safe place. I feel like I am sneaking around when I am typing sometimes, but oh well! I think you put your feelings into words quite nicely. Although it is great to want to learn to be better at anything, that is a sign of maturity. It's weird how you have all these definite ideas about the world and then something hits you and it all starts to change. I appreciate the compliment, on seeing me write with passion. I just try to speak what is true from my heart. I remember when I went to college. My prelaw classes were hard sometimes, but so stimulating and gratifying. I was nervous if I would do well, especially because my mom is a professor -same school,(English literature is one of her specialties) She is probably the one who I get my writing skills from. All of her colleagues were my teachers. NERVE WRACKING!! I got lucky and fell in love with my classes. Philosophy of Law was a great class, so many things to think about! I ended up doing pretty well. Then I graduated from college and I couldn't wait to go to law school, become a lawyer, then a judge. I looked forward to all the intellectual stimulation and debate. However, my little man came along and changed the plans a little bit. I turned my focus to everything we have been involved in. I was really involved in doing work and campaigning in the last election. It was a humbling loss. I am happy for the experience though. What I am saying is that, in whatever small way you can learn something meaningful, or find a unique way of expressing yourself is a great thing! It doesn't have to be measured in status or achievements. The fact that you give your time and energy to these people, makes you a better person every day! You continue to become more in touch with your feelings and your desire to express them becomes more strong. That is so cool! Maybe someday you will write a book, I have thought about it from time to time. I wouldn't know what to write or where to begin. Until then, we will be the authors of our lives on here.

Sounds fine to me. I willmeet you here as long as I can. I thought my husband would hate the fact that I was on here talking to people I don't even know, but I told him because I felt a little weird about it too. He's like are you talking to them again? I know he gets annoyed, but I think it is OK to him.
My 2 older kids said I was addicted and I tol them to go buy their own computer... I told them, this is like when you play your games, you just don't want to stop. They laugh at me a give me a smug smile when they walk by me. SO WHAT! If they knew how many times their name came up in so many special ways, they would give me a hug. I think!

We are going through some tough times her in the house, my husband isn't feeling well and we have many things to take care of. We just sold our house, and after almost a year of making two house payments, it has been putting us under water very quickly. We thought we would make much more on the house, but looks like just enough to almost pay everything we need too. He wanted extra, I don't blame him. It is just hitting him really hard. He will come through and so will I...

Gypsy, thank you, I forgot to tell you that. I am definately changing, and it is a funny thing to see. I thought i would be "that" way forever. Thanks for the imput and hope to hear from you along my journey!



Anything to support... that's after all what we do give each other here on this Forum, right ?

We grow...
And be grateful you are not like "that" forever.
Forever is a long time :)

We learn.
Every day.
Every single time I read an answer on this board I learn something.

Take good care,


Gypsy

Yes, every time I read a post or an answer, I seem to think a little harder, and gather up something to write that I thought I would never write. Thanks again. Start

YOu sure are a tough cookie, dealing with all that financial crap and your husband's health! That's enough to send anyone over the edge. I have my house on the market right now, not a great seller's market either. I would be freaking out with 2 payments! I know you see the other side, the light at the end so you know you will make it. Wouldn't it be nice to just enjoy your spouse without all the bull you have to endure. Bills, laundry, kids fighting, the list is endless. When does it ever get to be about just you and him? I know I have to make arrangements to get away from everything with him, or we never would. He is a workaholic, (not complaining about that) and sometimes it's hard not getting to do fun stuff as much as we would like. We do spend time together at night when the kids are in bed, but we are exhausted a lot times. I can't wait for things to get better for you, you deserve a break. I hope your husband gets better too. That must worry you!! Does he take care of himself? Works a lot of hours? I know my husband doesn't do much to take care of his health. I worry that will catch up with him. Well, I have to get my daughter at dance, so we will talk more later.

Geez Startover22... that's a lot you are going through.
It's a lot to be a mother of 4, dealing with your hubbies health and the financial juggling. The house market is tough... we are looking to buy and well, the question when you buy is also: will it keep its value. So yes, I can imagine that this is a tough time for you and your family.

I think it's great to have the Forum.
It feels like just "me" time.
It's a great way to vent and to share with others !

Speak soon !

Thanks guys, he is not THAT ill, but it definitely could be an ulcer. Everything will be working out fine, it is just working it out is sooo stressful. Poor me, yeah right! We are strong...

Ulcers are painful and they are caused by stress. It would be great if he could find an outlet for himself. I know yoga and stuff probably wouldn't interest him, but maybe you guys could start walking together at night, with the kids or without. I don't know what the weather is like where you are, but here in South Florida it's nice out in the evenings. (Not too hot or humid) Or we go down to the beach and walk on the boardwalk. Even the park is nice. Anything outside with nature seems to have a very calming effect. Paying attention to the sights and sounds around you. Even watching a sunset. I am just throwing out examples that have helped us relax a little. Until the kids fight or something! Or maybe you two should take turns going for walks by yourself or with a friend. Whatever works for you! However, I am sure all the financial issues are weighing him down, they are the biggest source of stress for most couples! If you stay calm and positive I am sure that will help. This place is a stress reliever for me, but my husband would never talk to people about his problems. He is way different than me on that subject. Although he does have to listen to me, and you know how long I can go on and on... Have a great evening!

Yes, he is in pain for the last 2 weeks, thought it would be the flu, but Doc says it could be ulcers or even just a pulled muscle. I am leaning on the ulcers. Only because Dustin knows his body and doesn't think it is a muxcle thing, it is deeper than that. I feel bad for him, being depressed about our situation and feeling like crap can really take a toll on someone. He could lose a few pounds, that is not to say I couldn't get in shape either. I am pretty thin, but it all just sags on me so I could get my muscles in shape and he could shed a few pounds. We are going to do some walking in the evening. Thanks, hugs, Start

I think you will definitely benefit from walking at night! I am sure you are beautiful and just very hard on yourself. Well, you can always walk with little weights and build muscle at the same time.! You have four kids, and no one is perfect. If they are, they put way too much emphasis on it and are probably so self absorbed the are a holes anyway. Ya know? I think he will be fine, its just that guys usually define themselves by what they do, what they make, etcc. (Not all, but a lot) Well, if he hasn't been able to control the situation financially, he probably feels that he is a failure on some level. He isn't, and I am sure you try and give him so much love and support. Just remember, how you deal with the tough times will affect him too. Try and stay positive and when he gets down, look for ways to get his mind off it. Get out with him and forget about all the stuff at home. I think you two are going through something that will ultimately bring you closer together. You are a very loyal wife who loves him dearly. That is obvious. Yet you are both growing, changing and dealing with the financial woes of life. If you take it as a learning experience and try new things to handle it better, I promise things will be o.k. I see you also do a lot for others, taking care of foster kids and stuff. Make time for you too. Maybe you and your friend go to lunch and get a pedicure. Or maybe get a massage for you and your husband, or a friend if he isn't into that stuff. ( My husband won't go get one, so I have a little spa day with the girls) Maybe plan a trip to somewhere you've never been, something to look forward to. This will give him an opportunity to see past where you are now. YOu are always going to have bills to pay and a house to clean, life is here to enjoy. I say grab it by the horns and get out there! I sound like a stupid Royal Caribbean commercial! I am so cheesy! LOL Anyway, we went to Costa Rica a few years ago. We went with a couple that we are friends with. We spent a couple months planning, worrying and figuring out what to do with the kids. It was nerve wracking leaving them at first, but once we got there, we had the time of our lives!! We went swinging on ropes in the rain forest, rode ATV's in the mountains, the guys went deep sea fishing, we had so much fun!! I don't think you have to go that far to have fun, but plan something different to experience together. It is important to nurture each other as a couple and to create time to do things alone. Family trips are fun too, just different. Just some suggestions! I hope you have a great day- talk to you soon! XXOO

Thanks Shattered, there are some really good points to consider here. This is already bringing us closer, because instead of arguing over money or pretending there isn't a problem, we have been talking A LOT lately. He is definitely a man's man. He has an ego and to tell you the truth, I think a mans ego is very important. Dangerous at times but important... He is a good , honest, hardworking, man and he deserves to beable to pay the bills. The last two years are the first years that we haven't had two jobs each, me taking care of the kids in the day and working at night, and him working days and part time at night. Crazy, but that is how we made things work for a while till we could get ourselves together. I am pleased to say that we are proud of each other for making it this far. As for the walking, we haven't gone yet but we will. I threw out my back so we will have to see when I can get out there. I think I will make reservations for the both of us somewhere cool and get Nana to babysit. Great idea. Thanks guys, I am growing, I love it!

Hey Start! How is your back doing? That really sucks! I am glad to hear you are going to try and get out with him. You two are such hardworking people, you need to give yourselves a break. SOmetimes you have to initiate and plan it, but in the end everyone wins. You probably don't like to impose on people a lot and you don't want to leave your kids with people for a long time. Guess what, you need to. YOu will be happier spending time alone w your hubby and happier when you get back to your kids. I don't want to sound like I am nagging, but you two need a release from all the pressures. I can't wait until you have a great night out and I get to hear all about it!! I have to get back to work now... xxx000

My back is feeling better thanks! I go again to the chiro today but I really need to find a regular doctor and some time to go there. Sheesh how busy can I be from 7am to 6pm?? Ok MOM, I will plan a date. We tried to go out last night but it ended really bad, I said some things I shouldn't have but things that I wanted him to know. He gets angry easily and I know when to stop, I just didn't I just kept going on and on like I didn't even care about his feelings and oh my gosh I really feel bad today. Not because he heard the words but how I said them, you know what I mean. Any way we have a lot of talking to do AGAIN. Poor guy. Poor me. I love him just the same and I know he does too. Hurtful words can hang around and I just want them to hurry and get out of here. Hugs to you. Start

What's Up??

Nothing... Whats up with you? Hee hee

Good Morning sunshine!! Another beautiful day in paradise! Talk to you soon