(https://www.google.com/url?sa=i&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=images&cd=&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=2ahUKEwjLhuaCze3cAhXmV98KHdkeCuwQjRx6BAgBEAU&url=http%3A%2F%2Fliberalvaluesblog.com%2F2018%2F08 %2F12%2Fscifi-weekend-the-100-season-5-finale-star-trek-news-space-force-humor%2F&psig=AOvVaw08LTXi-aJZ_5qlRc6YkKnf&ust=1534372404956844)


https://scontent-lga3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/39181488_10212854565621097_1448461000268316672_n.j pg?_nc_cat=0&oh=02c12245f7ac2801ac4e725df8de6c4a&oe=5BFE5EB1

(https://www.google.com/url?sa=i&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=images&cd=&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=2ahUKEwjLhuaCze3cAhXmV98KHdkeCuwQjRx6BAgBEAU&url=http%3A%2F%2Fliberalvaluesblog.com%2F2018%2F08 %2F12%2Fscifi-weekend-the-100-season-5-finale-star-trek-news-space-force-humor%2F&psig=AOvVaw08LTXi-aJZ_5qlRc6YkKnf&ust=1534372404956844)

Eerily quiet around here these days. I guess everyone is worn out.

Get you tribbles at the White House

Get you tribbles at the White House

Or at the Dufus website, and a MAGA hat with every order... while supplies last. Proceed go to the Dufus charity.

If we get serious about having our own means to getting to low earth orbit without relying on the Ruskies I'll be happy ;even if Elon Musk gives us the blue prints . In all seriousness ;the Chinese have already blasted sats. out of orbit . And a military truth has always been own the high ground. I expect his idea could be accomplished with the resources the Air Force has . But this is a SERIOUS national conversation we need to have .

But this is a SERIOUS national conversation we need to have .

Roger that.

What conversation would that be? You have been exploring space since the sixties and what, really do we have to show for it?

You really can't be serious . You do realize that the computer you wrote that on came from technology developed for space travel ? The innovations that came from space exploration are almost too numerous to mention . You ever have an MRI or a CT scan ? NASA's Jet Propulsion Laboratory developed digital image processing . You know someone who has has LASIK surgery ? Thank NASA . Do you use GPS ?

I would sure hate to have somebody besides us have a dominant space force, and I don't doubt those somebody's are trying to be dominant in space as we speak.

I would sure hate to have somebody besides us have a dominant space force, and I don't doubt those somebody's are trying to be dominant in space as we speak.

Wait! Stop the presses. We agree on something. It's a miracle.

Wait! Stop the presses. We agree on something. It's a miracle.

<--------Ever see my avatar? TREKKIE since 1965!

<--------Ever see my avatar? TREKKIE since 1965!

I hope you are watching some of the new series, somewhat more wild that the original

Can't afford CBS Access, the only way to see it where I am, but I'm scheming on streaming! The trailers and previews blew me away!

Can't afford CBS Access, the only way to see it where I am, but I'm scheming on streaming! The trailers and previews blew me away!

Yes get Netflix

I have Netflix, both DVD's and streaming. What? You think I just sit watching the Trump Show?

I have Netflix, both DVD's and streaming. What? You think I just sit watching the Trump Show?


Well yes

Naw, I just like blasting on the lying cheating Dufus... it's FUN...and so EASY!

We know, I know you think it never gets tired, but it does. Actually I'm over it. I agreed with you long ago, the man is an idiot. It says a lot about those who voted for him, but then I thought the same about his predecessor. Nothing changes except the names over the door

Sitting here in the middle of it as I do Clete, it matters to me both in policy, and affect whose name is over the door. That probably doesn't mean much on a world view of things and for an international reaching site its not all that diverse as far as posters go. Personally I respect highly your views being outside the usual circle, even though I have blasted away at will on you at times. I hope you don't take it personally, as by now you know what an obnoxious a$$hole I can be.

What? You didn't know that?

Trying to focus on the positive Tal, It's difficult, but maybe we both have the same objectives we just have different opportunities in reaching them

I am going to be positive and hope the American people drain the swamp of those feckless Dufus GOP sycophants.

You are obviously a man of great faith, Tal, Like Tom you have faith in the system. I hope it is not misplaced but I think all you have is hoipe

I am going to be positive and hope the American people drain the swamp of those feckless Dufus GOP sycophants.







As opposed to the feckless, Dufus democrat sycophants?

Name one, and say WHY. You threw it out there so back it up. Me I hope for the best in November to get us on a better path, but for sure I'm planning on the worse. Repubs stay in power in all the branches of our government. The drunk on power Dufus needs to be checked.

1. Mr. Obama.
Why? Lied about Benghazi so he could get reelected. Lied about keeping your doctor and policy under Obamacare. VA scandal for which NO ONE was ever held accountable. IRS scandal for which NO ONE was ever held accountable. Only two term president who never had a single quarter of GDP growth over 3%. Said Obmacare would result in lower insurance premiums... they went up instead. Fast and Furious gun running scandal for which, again, NO ONE was held accountable. The Obama administration paid ransom to Iran for hostages, and lied to the American people about it.

If you want to read some more, then go here. https://www.politifact.com/personalities/barack-obama/statements/byruling/false/

https://www.dailywire.com/news/10982/obama-says-hes-had-scandal-free-administration-aaron-bandler

I threw it out there, and I backed it up. The really astonishing thing is that you have been drinking the Kook Aid so long that you actually seem to believe that the dems are a bunch of high-character, well meaning philanthropists. Most politicians will say about anything to get reelected if they think they can get away with it.

Obama is GONE, The Dufus is here and has Obama beat in one way at least... MORE LIES IN JUST TWO YEARS. My guy wasn't perfect, but your guy is off the chart bad already, so now it's my turn to blast your guy! You had your 8 years of fun blasting Obama! They're gone too.

MY TURN!

Do you really want a link to the Trump Scandals (https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2017/05/donald-trump-presidential-scandals/522468/) so far? Not wise to bring pebbles to a rock fight.

This is tiresome. You asked for an example. "You threw it out there so back it up." So I back it up, and now you want to complain that Obama is gone. And your lame excuse is, "My guy wasn't perfect." That is the understatement of the decade.

Your link is a joke. Nothing there to see.

This is tiresome.

You know you are right. Some people want to rehash the past thinking it was better, some people have blind hope in the present thinking this has to be better

You know you are right. Some people want to rehash the past thinking it was better, some people have blind hope in the present thinking this has to be better.

Very true. But then we could rehash the past and try to learn from our mistakes so that our hope for the present would not be a blind hope.

A closed mind learns nothing, and unwilling mind is STUCK on its own BS, and a slave to feelings devoid of facts.

A closed mind learns nothing, and unwilling mind is STUCK on its own BS, and a slave to feelings devoid of facts.


Now you distilled the essence of politics

Sometimes it helps to break things down to it's simplest terms to better understand what's really going on to identify the problem and hopefully get a solution. It appears we are still enthralled with the rich and powerful, so much so we sell ourselves cheap to what they want. I can certainly understand those that choose to listen, obey, and serve such a powerful entity, as the consequences are quite real and fearful, and overwhelming to some. Isn't that the problem though, being told by a rich guy how we should be governed?

Sometimes it helps to break things down to it's simplest terms to better understand what's really going on to identify the problem and hopefully get a solution. It appears we are still enthralled with the rich and powerful, so much so we sell ourselves cheap to what they want. I can certainly understand those that choose to listen, obey, and serve such a powerful entity, as the consequences are quite real and fearful, and overwhelming to some. Isn't that the problem though, being told by a rich guy how we should be governed?

Ok we want to get into problem solving, so WHY?

I think stopping the flow of money from donors to politicians would be a step in the right direction. Are you familiar with the citizens united ruling?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Citizens_United_v._FEC

As well as anonymous huge donations to lobbyist, corporate, and political groups supposedly from other countries that are passed on to politicians.

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/nra-accepts-foreign-donations-but-not-for-election-purposes-it-claims/

And

Employer Political Coercion: A Growing Threat (http://prospect.org/article/employer-political-coercion-growing-threat)

That would be a place to start. I don't know if you guys have such a problem but its a long growing one here.

And

Employer Political Coercion: A Growing Threat (http://prospect.org/article/employer-political-coercion-growing-threat)

That would be a place to start. I don't know if you guys have such a problem but its a long growing one here.

No, we are actually a free country. You see we have compulserary voting so every one is politically savvy enough. It is a given there are things not disgussed in the work place and there are no massa-slave relationships. Our politics doesn't have the razzle dazzle yours does

we have other ways of changing unsuccessful leaders

https://www.news.com.au/national/politics/malcolm-turnbull-faces-threat-of-leadership-challenge/news-story/b13bf07d192d3079e118c75be87616a8

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-08-21/politics-live-malcolm-turnbull-in-partyroom-meeting/10146280

The smaller party system that must form coalition and cooperate, melding different agendas to govern has always been a fascination, but I doubt compulsory voting would go over very well here. Then there is that money thing hanging over everyone's head every few years. You can never be free serving that agenda. It's in too few hands, and who wants it to freely circulate?

Supply siders surely don't since they would have no more leverage to control wages or opportunities... or the flow of capital. Nor kill the competition with a bigger stick.

Well I'm glad you are fascinated, we live with a different form of political turmoil here and until there is some blood letting or an execution it is going to go on. What it says is we might be getting close to a change in government election time. Rearranging the deck chairs on the titanic. The not so faceless men are working on an Ides of March scenario

No, we are actually a free country. You see we have compulserary voting

Can you see the massive contradiction in those two statements?

Can you see the massive contradiction in those two statements?

Not at all, we feel the best expression of democracy is to canvas the will of all the people. Now I know you would criticise that view from within your constitutional republic but the reality is you don't live in a democracy, you live by the will of people who long since left this Earth. There is a difference between freedom and liberty. We can of course not vote and be penalised in some small way but our ethos demands that those elected have the support of all the people, not just the few who can be bothered

I'll paraphrase your statement: "We are so free that the government forces everyone to go vote no matter what those people might prefer to do." Wow. What a statement of freedom.


those elected have the support of all the people Except, of course, for the people who voted in favor of the guy who did not get elected.


you live by the will of people who long since left this Earth.
So you mean that your country has no constitution, or no written rule of law as to how the country is to be governed?

How are freedom and liberty different?

You think you know what freedom and liberty are yourself? A few bucks more than those lazy welfare people and you think you are free?

You think you know what freedom and liberty are yourself? A few bucks more than those lazy welfare people and you think you are free?



As is usual, you don't know the answer to the question.

You don't want answers. You ask questions to attack. When you give your opinion you attack.

Says the man who won't/can't answer questions. You feel I am attacking when I ask a question?? Weak response.

Just an observation of your reaction when you disagree. Very dismissive. Not my fault you don't agree, or don't understand the logic, or math.

You have presented no math. If I understand your logic correctly, it goes like this: Some Americans have a right to the income of other Americans. Therefore, the feds should extract this money in taxes and give it to the deserving Americans.

I don't agree with that logic. Not attacking, just observing. But if a person wants other people to be compelled to help poor people, it says nothing about that person's charitable nature.

When you are part of a larger group, it seems natural that you support group members until they can support themselves. Is that not part of the value we place on our duly elected government? Nobody makes you do anything except while you blame liberals for this or that, your state government makes the rules and are they not conservatives like yourself?

So are the Prez and the congress so don't blame liberals for not giving you what you want. Oh wait, you can't since you are but a part of a larger group, and not everyone agrees with your way of doing things. Wonder were we do agree, and can find CONSENSUS?

I'll paraphrase your statement: "We are so free that the government forces everyone to go vote no matter what those people might prefer to do." Wow. What a statement of freedom.

I have yet to decide whether you are an idiot or a rabble rouser but it is obvious logic it is not your strong suite


Except, of course, for the people who voted in favor of the guy who did not get elected.

The guy who did not get elected knows and abides by the rules, so back to my original remarks


So you mean that your country has no constitution, or no written rule of law as to how the country is to be governed?

My country has a constitution one that corrected the mistakes that you had made and which stands with few amendments


How are freedom and liberty different?

Didn't they teach you that in this utopia of good governance of yours?


liberty is differentiated from freedom by using the word "freedom" primarily, if not exclusively, to mean the ability to do as one wills and what one has the power to do; and using the word "liberty" to mean the absence of arbitrary restraints, taking into account the rights of all involved. In this sense, the exercise of liberty is subject to capability and limited by the rights of others

Clete, I'm done with you. When you start advocating for heads to come off, you are way off into the lunatic, asylum fringe. You really should be banned from this board.

Clete, I'm done with you. When you start advocating for heads to come off, you are way off into the lunatic, asylum fringe. You really should be banned from this board.

See how you attack when you got NOTHING. Anyone else would have understood the figure of speech. So relax and get back to the subject of freedom and liberty. I thought Clete's response was spot on about setting boundaries of good behavior that give equal freedom to all.

I thought Clete's response was spot on about setting boundaries of good behavior that give equal freedom to all.

"liberty is differentiated from freedom by using the word "freedom" primarily, if not exclusively, to mean the ability to do as one wills and what one has the power to do;"

Evidently, the "ability to do as one wills" does not extend to choosing whether one intends to vote. Freedom and liberty are synomyms.

His comment went too far.

You are not free to holler fire in a crowded theater, so everything probably has boundaries even in what you are free to do. Australia obviously values compulsory voting, and there doesn't seem to be a big movement to change the law, even with the penalty for not voting.


Australia penalty for not voting
Electors who fail to vote at a State election and do not provide a valid and sufficient reason for such failure, will be fined. The penalty for first time offenders is $20, and this increases to $50 if you have previously paid a penalty or been convicted of this offence.

I agree the terms freedom and liberty are interchangeable, even if they are defined by the LAW>

Seems rather strange. I'm not sure how much a coerced vote matters, but I do like Australia. Not too sure how the governance of Australia is better than the U.S. but maybe so.

I don't think its better or worse, probably just different, and that's cool even if the weather isn't. 8D It's a big freakin' island.

So I hear! Still, they seem to have a certain toughness about them, and that's a good trait.

I don't think its better or worse, probably just different, and that's cool even if the weather isn't. 8D It's a big freakin' island.

I can testify the weather is cool here too, - 3C to 9C with reports of snow right now so watch out for the disinformation, politically it is freezing with Turncoat Mal about to be knifed. As far as being an island, it has water around it, which is convenient. As to being coerced, the fine doesn't coerce really because we are brought up to do our civic duty, like not littering really. You won't be dragged before a court or imprisoned unless you behave like an idiot