The underground water supply line from my well froze last winter when I was away during February - a very cold month. Someone suggested that I dig down to the tube and surround it with 2" thick Styrofoam insulation to prevent this happening again. The well is about 40' from the house and he suggested insulating at least the first 6' from the well.

Does anyone think that would work? What kind of Styrofoam?

Thanks

Does anyone think that would work? What kind of Styrofoam?

I don't know but I don't think that will work. Styrofoam is a good insulator but you have to have a heat source. The earth is your heat source.

If I were going to dig the line up I would just bury it deep enough so that it doesn't freeze even in an extremely cold weather.

If the depth where it is presently buried works in a normal winter, put it another 12" deeper and you shouldn't have a problem in extreme winters.


he suggested insulating at least the first 6' from the well.
That makes no sense to me. If you are going to insulate you must insulate it all.

I agree with HKStroud. Just remember Global Warming may not be true. So dig it down like he said.

Insulation without a heat source will not help. If it gets extremely cold just leave a tap slightly open, moving water will not freeze as easily as standing water over night.

In addition to the above posts: Find out how deep is the freeze line in your area - and bury the pipe (well) below that...

Milo

Thanks all for the responses.

I was doubting whether the Styrofoam would work if there was no heat to hold in. I haven't dug down to the pipe but I think it might be resting on solid rock since they had to blast to build the house foundation. I have been here 10 years without this problem but last winter was really cold and being away in February the well wasn't being used. I might try leaving a tap open when I go away this winter. In the spring I'll dig down to find out for sure.

Where are you located and do you know the frost line for your location? Last year was a real bear, my septic line between the house and the tank froze twice, way less fun than a frozen water line.

Where are you located and do you know the frost line for your location? Last year was a real bear, my septic line between the house and the tank froze twice, way less fun than a frozen water line.

So what you are saying is "No S#*t", at least in the tank!

You are on solid rock and you have a well"

Is this a dug well or a drilled well?

How deep, what kind of pump?

Do you have a pitless adapter?

Where are you located and do you know the frost line for your location? Last year was a real bear, my septic line between the house and the tank froze twice, way less fun than a frozen water line.


I'm in eastern Ontario - I don't know how deep the frost goes. I think the freezing had a lot to do with not using the water for a month. I don't really like the idea of leaving a tap open slightly while I'm gone that long but it might do the trick.

Yeah, I know about frozen septic lines - my in-laws were snowbirds coming back in March and they used to put a lot of hot water down the drain.

You are on solid rock and you have a well"

Is this a dug well or a drilled well?

How deep, what kind of pump?

Do you have a pitless adapter?

Yeah, I have a drilled well 140' deep through granite. I'm not sure what kind of pump but it is down the well. Don't know about the pitless adapter.

Ontario, no wonder. It gets cold up there.

The logic behind leaving a faucet dribbling works to some extent, not because moving is harder to freeze. It works because the water in the pipe is constantly being replaced. If the water in the pipe is being replaced with a higher temperature water, faster than it can drop to 32 degrees, the pipe will not freeze.

Water coming out of the ground at 140 feet is probably at about 60 degrees. It takes time for the water to loose that heat and drop to 32 degrees. How long depends the surrounding temperature. As winter progresses the ground looses heat. At you latitude, the normal winters are long enough and severe enough for the earth to drop to 32 degrees at some point above the level of your piping. In a winter where the temperature drops unusually low or the winter is unusually long, the freezing point drops down to or below the level of the piping.

The danger of a pipe freezing is not the inconvenience of a frozen pipe, but the risk of a pipe bursting. PVC and other types of flexible pipe are more tolerant of freezing without bursting, as opposed to metal piping, because their ability to expand slightly.

A pitless adapter is a type of connection, inside the well casing, between the well pipe and the pipe to the house. Google pitless adapters to see what they look like. They enable making the connection far below the level that a manual connection can be made. You almost certainly have a pitless adapter.

Here is the plan.
Pull the well pipe. You don't have to pull it completely. You just have to pull it high enough to drill a 1/8" hole in the well pipe below the frost line of extreme conditions. Reinstall the well pipe.

Inside the house, cut the line and install a tee with a hose bib in the side port. Or cut the line and install a stop and waste valve with the bleeder valve on the well side. Then install a check valve. Reconnect the piping to the tank. I would chose the hose bib.

Then, when you are going away, or you think the temperature is so low that the pipe might freeze, turn off the pump. Open the hose bib or turn off the stop valve and open the bleeder valve. The water in pipe between the well and the house will drain. If the pipe is lower at the well than at the house the water will drain back down the well. If the well is higher it will drain out the hose bib or the bleeder valve.

Important.
When you turn the pump back on, do so with the hose bib or the bleeder valve open to purge the air out of the pipe. Close after all the air has been purged. Repeated failure to do this will result in air filling your tank bladder (assuming you have a bladder tank).

Yes, you will loose a little water back down the well, out that 1/8" hole in well pipe, but that will not affect either the water pressure or the volume of the pump. This procedure is used when you have a bladder less tank and an air volume control (AVC) valve to maintain proper air in the tank. With the AVC valve the purpose of the hole in the well pipe is to drain the pipe and pull air in which is later pumped into the tank. In your case it is just so you can drain the line to prevent freezing.

Pulling a pump with a 140 feet of 3/4 or 1" pipe, filled with water, is not for the faint of heart. Probably best left to the professional with proper equipment..

Ontario, no wonder. It gets cold up there.

The logic behind leaving a faucet dribbling works to some extent, not because moving is harder to freeze. It works because the water in the pipe is constantly being replaced. If the water in the pipe is being replaced with a higher temperature water, faster than it drop to 32 degrees, the pipe will not freeze.

Water coming out of the ground at 140 feet is probably at about 60 degrees. It takes time for the water to loose that heat and drop to 32 degrees. How long depends the surrounding temperature. As winter progresses the ground looses heat. At you latitude, the normal winters are long enough and severe enough for the earth to drop to 32 degrees at some point above the level of your piping. In a winter where the temperature drops unusually low or the winter is unusually long, the freezing point drops down to or below the level of the piping.

The danger of a pipe freezing is not the inconvenience of a frozen pipe, but the risk of a pipe bursting. PVC and other types of flexible pipe are more tolerant of freezing without bursting, as opposed to metal piping, because their ability to expand slightly.

A pitless adapter is a type of connection, inside the well casing, between the well pipe and the pipe to the house. Google pitless adapters to see what they look like. They enable making the connection far below the level that a manual connection can be made. You almost certainly have a pitless adapter.

Here is the plan.
Pull the well pipe. You don't have to pull it completely. You just have to pull it high enough to drill a 1/8" hole in the well pipe below the frost line of extreme conditions. Reinstall the well pipe.

Inside the house, cut the line and install a tee with a hose bib in the side port. Or cut the line and install a stop and waste valve with the bleeder valve on the well side. Then install a check valve. Reconnect the piping to the tank. I would chose the hose bib.

Then, when you are going away, or you think the temperature is so low that the pipe might freeze, turn off the pump. Open the hose bib or turn off the stop valve and open the bleeder valve. The water in pipe between the well and the house will drain. If the pipe is lower at the well than at the house the water will drain back down the well. If the well is higher it will drain out the hose bib or the bleeder valve.

Important.
When you turn the pump back on, do so with the hose bib or the bleeder valve open to purge the air out of the pipe. Close after all the air has been purged. Repeated failure to do this will result in air filling your tank bladder (assuming you have a bladder tank).

Yes, you will loose a little water back down the well, out that 1/8" hole in well pipe, but that will not affect either the water pressure or the volume of the pump. This procedure is used when you have a bladder less tank and an air volume control (AVC) valve to maintain proper air in the tank. With the AVC valve the purpose of the hole in the well pipe is to drain the pipe and pull air in which is later pumped into the tank. In your case it is just so you can drain the line to prevent freezing.

Pulling a pump with a 140 feet of 3/4 or 1" pipe, filled with water, is not for the faint of heart. Probably best left to the professional with proper equipment..




.

Thanks for the detailed plan. I don't want to try that myself but I'll talk to my plumber about it.