16 years ago my narcissist exboyfriend broke up with me, after only seven months. He was so arrogant that he tried to change me afterwards, because I was nearly perfect and he didn't wanted a next relationship of me ending for the same reasons as he broke it off with me. Of course I told him to get lost, but he was so arrogant, that he thought that I was only mad because he broke up with me. He really started to stalk me. I completely ignored him, and he couldn't accept that there was someone in this world, that didn't wanted to have anything to do with him. I informed all my roommates in the dorm that I was living in back then, to never let him inside again. I didn't needed to inform my friends, because he once called all of them, when he was in my dorm room and I wasn't there, so they all wanted to know why the hell he called them, to ask where I was.

Since then I have read a lot about narcissim and everything fits. He didn't even respect my no during our relationship and was very manipulative and disrespectful.

So I have been ignoring him for 16 years. We live in the same city with half a million inhabitants, so sometimes I run into him and then I always try to sneak away, without him noticing me.

I am in therapy, one of the reasons is that I am always falling for the wrong guys. Last year I switched from one mental health care provider to another. The day that I had my last appointment at the old provider, when I was leaving, he came in. So I thought, finally, he recognises that he has issues and he is handling them!

But now he send me a LinkedIn add-request accompanied by this message:
"Hi MP,

Hope you are doing well.
If you feel like it, we can connect.
Fortunately you are looking very good.
Regards and hug,

his name"

This really creeps me out! Am I overreacting? Of course I will not link with him, and I will not even send him a message telling him to stay away from me, but I am really shocked by this. He is the reason why I am not in the phonebook anymore and he fortunately doesn't know where I live exactly.

Just ignore the request, you don't have to accept it or respond to it. That's the best way to deal with it and safest way to deal with it.

After 16 years you should know how to deal with this. You just ignore it. After that period you should be laughing at the audacity of him.

I see the 16 years as the shocking part. A sane person would have forgotten me by now, don't he?

You never forget people you have dated. I remember every one I ever dated since 1978. And no I haven't ever tried to reconnect with any of them.

I wouldn't get in a panic over a chance meeting, or an attempt to get back in touch by an ex. It happens. Ignore him.

Other exes contact me too. I don't mind, but this one is really scary. He came over to my dorm in the middle of the night, he came to my favourite bar, at New Years Eve, when I didn't wanted to have anything to do with him anymore, he came to the parc near my dorm, where I always was. We had a lecture together, so I always waited until he left the lecture hall, before I got out of my seat, so that he didn't see me. After a few weeks he noticed me anyway and asked me if I just started that course or something. I told him, no I always waited until you left the lecture hall, before I got up, because I didn't wanted you to see me. He wanted me to come stand with him and his friends, during the break, but I said no, and just like when we were dating, he tried to manipulate me again, by saying that I was being ridiculous, that everybody thought that I was crazy for not joining them. He really disrespected my no, over and over again. Of course I didn't give in then, I didn't care what his friends might think of me, nor did I always agree with his crazy assesions of situations, I just wanted him to stay away from me and I wanted to stay away from him.

Seems like he views your nos as a challenge. Common male stereotype, conquest by ridicule.
Don't even interact verbally.
When you were in class together, he was able to have power because you didn't get out of your seat! Guys like that need to know that NOTHING they do is going to limit you. You should NOT sneak away when you cross paths. Walk right on by and do not pause. If he walks beside you, tell him you will scream for a cop.

Seems like he views your nos as a challenge. Common male stereotype, conquest by ridicule.
Don't even interact verbally.
When you were in class together, he was able to have power because you didn't get out of your seat! Guys like that need to know that NOTHING they do is going to limit you. You should NOT sneak away when you cross paths. Walk right on by and do not pause. If he walks beside you, tell him you will scream for a cop.
This was 16 years ago.

This was 16 years ago.
"So I have been ignoring him for 16 years. We live in the same city with half a million inhabitants, so sometimes I run into him and then I always try to sneak away, without him noticing me.

I am in therapy, one of the reasons is that I am always falling for the wrong guys. Last year I switched from one mental health care provider to another. The day that I had my last appointment at the old provider, when I was leaving, he came in.

But now he send me a LinkedIn add-request.... "

Seems like he views your nos as a challenge. Common male stereotype, conquest by ridicule.
Don't even interact verbally.
When you were in class together, he was able to have power because you didn't get out of your seat! Guys like that need to know that NOTHING they do is going to limit you. You should NOT sneak away when you cross paths. Walk right on by and do not pause. If he walks beside you, tell him you will scream for a cop.


It is not about what guys like him need. It is about what I need! I don't want any drama, if I can avoid it. Why should I choose the hard way, in which he can bother me, while I can just as easily avoid him? I really don't mind sitting 30 seconds longer in a seat, it wasn't a hot seat or something. 30 seconds later the toilets would still be near the lecture hall. Telling him, 16 years ago, that I would scream for a cop, would make me look ridiculous. I could scream all I want, there are no cops in the university building, so they would never show up!

He didn't have power over me. He doesn't want me to avoid him, so I am doing something that he doesn't want me to do. He still wants contact, but I am ignoring him for 16 years now. We only dated for 7 months, in 1999, but he kept calling till 2002. He even acted as if he accidentally called the wrong number, he used the weirdest excuses to call me. I disconnected my landline in January 2003. Since then I never uttered a word to him anymore, not even the hello when picking up the phone (I didn't have caller ID on my landline back then.) I dated another guy for six years after him, he also agreed to wait till this psycho left the theatre, the few times we accidentally met him at the movies, before we would get up out of our seats, just to avoid him. Once I was sitting on a terrace, in 2011 and my friend (former college roommate) spotted him before I did. She also agreed to leave discretely, so that he couldn't notice us, but we didn't leave earlier because of him. I am really so disgusted by him. I just don't want to deal with him anymore and even telling him that I will scream for a cop, is dealing with him.

When I saw him last year, he was walking in from the station, that is next to the mental health institute and I was standing at my bicycle, unlocking it. So when I spotted him in the distance (I fortunately have very good eyes), I bend over my bicycle, as if I was really concentrating on opening the lock and I let my long hair fell in front of my face, so that he wouldn't see me. I didn't get up until he was inside the building. I don't call that giving him power of me, I simply call that avoiding drama.

BTW: he didn't like my long hair, he always wanted me to cut it off, to a bobline, because according to him, long hair was trashy. We first met in 1997, when I was still dating another boyfriend, then I had a bob. We got together in 1999 and he always wanted me to go back to that haircut, because he liked me more like that, but I like long hair better. Just to give an example of how controlling he was, that he even tried to control my haircut.

You are making a mountain out of a molehill... (which means you are making this into something more than it really is) this was just a linked in request... which can simply be ignored.

If he lives in the same part of town its possible and even likely you might bump into each other from time to time. Its something you have to live with. He does have the right to be there just as you do. You simply continue to ignore him when you do. There is only as much drama in this as you make for yourself.

I'm with Smoothy on this one. Simply put you shouldn't sweat the small stuff. Running into an ex, and a casual contact is no reason to panic, or even keep those old bad feelings alive. Unless you want to.

Feel better after your rant?

I'm with Smoothy on this one. Simply put you shouldn't sweat the small stuff. Running into an ex, and a casual contact is no reason to panic, or even keep those old bad feelings alive. Unless you want to.

Feel better after your rant?

What rant?

I didn't read 90% of what you added about stories between you because you totally misunderstood what I said.
When I said he 'needed' to act a certain way, you said no, it was about what you need. What you need doesn't obviate what he needs. He needs power.
And I clearly meant to scream for a cop on the busy STREETS, if he won't leave you alone, not in a classroom. You mix the distant past with the recent past and with the present.

You still don't get that anyone who can get you to stop your normal movements and routines to avoid them DOES HAVE POWER over you, no matter how small. He was aware of it, I'll bet anything.

You tell us how you hid your face last year behind your long hair, and then go into a story about his demands for short hair, and why, and so on, and WHAT DOES THAT MATTER NOW? It's irrelevant, yet you are making it relevant.

You need to ask yourself why you stayed with him for 7 months and waited for him to break up with you.
This whole bit about a mistaken encounter now is just ... only as big a deal as you make it. Ignore it.

I understand that you think that you have reason to be afraid now, and that's why you have to keep adding to the stories. You don't, and you don't.

I didn't read 90% of what you added about stories between you because you totally misunderstood what I said.
When I said he 'needed' to act a certain way, you said no, it was about what you need. What you need doesn't obviate what he needs. He needs power.
And I clearly meant to scream for a cop on the busy STREETS, not in a classroom. You mix the distant past with the recent past and with the present.

You still don't get that anyone who can get you to stop your normal movements and routines to avoid them DOES HAVE POWER over you, no matter how small. He was aware of it, I'll bet anything.

You tell us how you hid your face last year behind your long hair, and then go into a story about his demands for short hair, and why, and so on, and WHAT DOES THAT MATTER NOW? It's irrelevant, yet you are making it relevant.

You need to ask yourself why you stayed with him for 7 months and waited for him to break up with you.
This whole bit about a mistaken encounter now is just ... only as big a deal as you make it. Ignore it.

I know why I stayed with him for seven months. Like I stated in the question, I went into therapy years ago to figure that and a lot of other things out. It is because of my parents. They were probably both narcissists that really emotionally and physically abused my baby sister and me. Children with a childhood like that, grow up to adults with low selfesteem and someone who treats them as badly as their parents did, feels familiar. I am in therapy for years now, to break that cycle. My baby sister, also has a bad track record when it comes to men. Our parents didn't respect our boundaries, they never taught us that they should be respected. They always called me selfish, whenever I tried to set my own boundaries or had a will of my own. They taught us that we didn't matter, that we were put on this earth to serve them and that wanting something for ourselves was selfish. If you grow up like that, it is really hard to set healthy boundaries in a relationship as an adult, because you really don't know what healthy behaviour is. We were never exposed to a healthy relationship. My parents had a toxic marriage and should have never gotten married in the first place.

I saw that there was some confusion about what was 16 years ago and what was now, so I only gave a timeline hoping to end any confusion. I still avoid him in the present and not only did I not respond to his LinkedIn request, I also actively blocked him, so that he can never message me through LinkedIn again.

I really don't see actively avoiding him when I coincidentally bump into him as giving him power. He is really hard to get rid off. He doesn't seem to understand the words no and leave me alone forever, as he has just demonstrated again. I just hoped that after 16 years he would give up seeking contact with me and just finally respect that I want nothing to do with him. I find it so incomprehensible, that someone, 16 years after I told him that I don't ever want to speak to him again, still actively tries to seek contact and that is why I was wondering, do I need to worry?

The story about my hair, was just to illustrate what kind of controlling person he is, and why I don't want anything to do with him anymore, ever.

I never thought anything more of the encounters with him in class, in the theatre, at the terrace or even at the mental health institute. We live in the same city, so we accidentally meet each other, I just don't want him to approach me and having to deal with brushing him off, so I avoid him when I see him, to avoid drama.

He did stalk me back in 1999 and 2000. He came to the bar where I always was and asked my friend, who worked there, where I was. He came over to my dorm and waited hours for me, in the middle of the night in front of my dormroom (I fortunately locked it) he left (I didn't got home till 7.30 am fortunately) because it took him too long, but he then called me and argued with me about that. He came to the parc and laid his towel next to mine and when I told him go lay somewhere else in that huge parc, he asked me why he was the one who should leave. Once, after class he followed me into the bicycle cellar, I was really scared then, there was nobody around. He said that he had a flat tire and asked if he could ride me home on my bicycle and then walk the rest home of the way to his dorm. Of course I said no, I didn't wanted to be near him, I didn't wanted him to ride my bicycle! In the years 1999 and 2000 I have told him so often to leave me alone and get lost, he just didn't listen. Once I almost called the cops on him, when he didn't wanted to leave my dormroom, when a roommate let him in while I was taking a shower. As a last resort I called my best friend and asked what else I could do to get him to leave, without involving the cops. While I was on the phone he screamed that I was lying and that I never told him to leave. My best friend told me not to argue with him about that, but to tell him again to leave, with her as a witness, so I did. He finally left, but while he was namecalling me as if I was the bad guy. He is that hard to get rid of. I don't like bothering other people and I certainly don't want to have the call the Police.

Since he still keeps bothering me if he sees me, I just find it easier to avoid confrontation. He did saw me in the theatre, a couple of times when I was there with my other ex. He kept staring very boldly in our direction, while he was there with his then girlfriend (who even looks exactly like me, that was creepy, he didn't get her to cut of her long hair, either, LOL). My other ex also noticed all of that, it wasn't just something that I imagined.

But just to be sure I will address this in my therapygroup tomorrow and see what my groupmates and the therapists think about how I am handling this situation.

What might be relevant for you to know, is that last year I finally got diagnosed with autism. (That is why I switched from one mental health care provider to another, because the first one wasn't specialised in autism.) One of the traits of autism is that we find a lot of details relevant, that neurotypicals don't. It also works the other way around. I often ask people, why did you never tell me that and they answer with that they didn't think that it would interest me to know that. Unfortunately, because of this I have the tendendy to overshare, to share too many details and unfortunately, that can also lead to misunderstandings.

It is not about what guys like him need. It is about what I need! I don't want any drama, if I can avoid it. Why should I choose the hard way, in which he can bother me, while I can just as easily avoid him? I really don't mind sitting 30 seconds longer in a seat, it wasn't a hot seat or something. 30 seconds later the toilets would still be near the lecture hall. Telling him, 16 years ago, that I would scream for a cop, would make me look ridiculous. I could scream all I want, there are no cops in the university building, so they would never show up!

He didn't have power over me. He doesn't want me to avoid him, so I am doing something that he doesn't want me to do. He still wants contact, but I am ignoring him for 16 years now. We only dated for 7 months, in 1999, but he kept calling till 2002. He even acted as if he accidentally called the wrong number, he used the weirdest excuses to call me. I disconnected my landline in January 2003. Since then I never uttered a word to him anymore, not even the hello when picking up the phone (I didn't have caller ID on my landline back then.) I dated another guy for six years after him, he also agreed to wait till this psycho left the theatre, the few times we accidentally met him at the movies, before we would get up out of our seats, just to avoid him. Once I was sitting on a terrace, in 2011 and my friend (former college roommate) spotted him before I did. She also agreed to leave discretely, so that he couldn't notice us, but we didn't leave earlier because of him. I am really so disgusted by him. I just don't want to deal with him anymore and even telling him that I will scream for a cop, is dealing with him.

When I saw him last year, he was walking in from the station, that is next to the mental health institute and I was standing at my bicycle, unlocking it. So when I spotted him in the distance (I fortunately have very good eyes), I bend over my bicycle, as if I was really concentrating on opening the lock and I let my long hair fell in front of my face, so that he wouldn't see me. I didn't get up until he was inside the building. I don't call that giving him power of me, I simply call that avoiding drama.

BTW: he didn't like my long hair, he always wanted me to cut it off, to a bobline, because according to him, long hair was trashy. We first met in 1997, when I was still dating another boyfriend, then I had a bob. We got together in 1999 and he always wanted me to go back to that haircut, because he liked me more like that, but I like long hair better. Just to give an example of how controlling he was, that he even tried to control my haircut.

Almost all of this is about you causing drama in your own life. After you let the landline go, you seem to have had no contact from him either by phone, computer, or in person (until the linked in message). You may argue that you haven't had in person contact because you keep avoiding him, however, I highly doubt you have seen him first every time you happen to be in the same place. I also doubt you know every time he has seen you and kept going about his own business while you are either oblivious or panicking and plotting your escape.

I am not trying to down play any actions or words he did or said. However, I am concerned that you are now the one victimizing yourself. What has your current therapist said when you talk about hiding and running away from this person?

I never discussed him with my current therapist. I will try to do so tomorrow. Now that I am in grouptherapy, I don't see my therapist one on one anymore, it is important that the grouptherapy is all the therapy that I receive now. Since I let my landline go, I thought that the problem was over, I never saw the avoiding him as a problem that needed to be discussed. You are the first person that sees it as a problem, my friends never said something like that, when I accidentally bumped into him and avoided him with them around. The one time that I described in 2011, when my friend alerted me of him, she also understood that I really didn't wanted to deal with him, and never worried about that.

I do worry that I might be under but also overreacting, that is why I posted this question. I even discussed that with my best friend and she said that that was possible. I have a very good memory (also due to my autism) and that is why, while most people forget the details after so many years and all the emotions that come with them, I don't. Her opinion was that my ex is probably hoping that I forgot about all the drama with him, but that is simply impossible for me to forget things like that. Part of being autistic is also being very sensitive, so drama has a deeper impact on me, than on neurotypical people.

I really don't see actively avoiding him as causing drama in my life, how do you figure that? I moved on with my life after the break up, isn't that exactly what you are supposed to do? I made a huge mistake by dating him and dating him for so long, I wholeheartedly admit that. I understand now why I did that and I am doing everything in my power to not end up in an relationship like that again. After our relationship ended, he also send me some emails, I never even read those. So I am only trying to spend as little time on him as possible. My experience with him has taught me, that it really takes a long time to get rid of him. I really don't want to make a big scene in public and scream for a cop, I really rather avoid that.

It is possible that there were occasions on which he saw me, without him seeing me and that he didn't bother me, but unfortunately, I never witnessed any time where he did notice me, but didn't bother me. All that I do know, is that whenever he noticed me somewhere he always approached me, or in the theatre, very rudely and obnoxiousy stared at me. And now, when I really didn't expect that anymore, he contacts me with a very creepy message over LinkedIn. During our relationship, he was so obsessed with my appearance, that the fact that he commented that I "fortunately look very good" only affirms to me, that he is still the same looks obsessed guy. When we were dating he once forced me to a bar where his exgirlfriend worked, to show me how beautiful she was. After the break up, he asked me to cut up a student ID for him, to give him the picture in it with my hair in a bobline because he liked that picture so much. Of course I didn't, I didn't wanted to cut up an ID for him, but most of all, I didn't wanted him to use my picture to show off to a new girlfriend about how beautiful I am.

Still, making far more out of this than there really is. Most people move on.. and what happened before isn't even on their mind as they focus on the here and now, and even tomorrow. You can't move forward until you let go of the past. No physical violence occurred so there isn't good cause to be concerned.

Has nothing to do with memory....I have an excellent memory and can remember situations from 40 years ago like they were last week...in vivid color and even the smells and odors associated with them at the time in most cases.

The past is what it is....you can't change it....but you can move on from it..and in fact you have to. You can't move forward if you are clinging on to the past tenaciously.

Just like the chain on a bicycle locking it to the fence. You have to release that before you can go anywhere else.

Forgive me for mistaking all that written detail for a rant when it's apparent you have no choice but to write like an author to explain every little thing, which may be hard for me to follow or even understand the need. Most would have let the whole thing go in 10 minutes and not given it another thought, but obviously you don't have that luxury.

Just glad you are receiving help for this. Good Luck.

Thank you.

Unfortunately this is a part of me that will never change. Autistic people always think too much in the eyes of neurotypicals and I am always shocked, at all the things people do without thinking about it, it really annoys the crap out of me. I often ask: what were you thinking? And then I hear I wasn't. And I am like, how can you operate without thinking!?

My therapy is more about learning how to get along better with neurotypicals, to understand you better and to confuse you less. On the inside I won't change, I will still think as much, but I hope that I will reach a point where I know what I can share with people, without confusing them.

Autistic people always think too much in the eyes of neurotypicals and I am always shocked, at all the things people do without thinking about it
I hear ya! I live with TWO autistic people. Imagine the fun we three have!

Autism is now defined over a very broad spectrum, and Asperger's is now a subset of it. Saying you are autistic is not very meaningful.
As for the rest of us being neurotypicals, WHERE did you find that word and concept?
I sure as hell ain't no neurotypical. Sounds awful.
I had a lousy childhood too, probably at least as bad as yours, and the 51 years after leaving at 17 haven't been so hot either.
I suppose (groan) I should say that your nice neat little diagnosis that sets you apart from 'neurotypicals' is a very typical Aspy remark.

Good luck with this narcissistic threat in your life. Your best bet is to just ignore him until he completely forgets about you. Pay it no mind and do not worry. If he continues to try to contact you, call the local authorities and get a restraining order.

Autism is now defined over a very broad spectrum, and Asperger's is now a subset of it. Saying you are autistic is not very meaningful.
As for the rest of us being neurotypicals, WHERE did you find that word and concept?
I sure as hell ain't no neurotypical. Sounds awful.
I had a lousy childhood too, probably at least as bad as yours, and the 51 years after leaving at 17 haven't been so hot either.
I suppose (groan) I should say that your nice neat little diagnosis that sets you apart from 'neurotypicals' is a very typical Aspy remark.
Neurotypical is the medical/psychology establishment's word for "not autistic." The DSM-V clumped Asperger's under autism; the autism spectrum is huge. And MP77 was medically diagnosed (before DSM-V).

Maybe I'm just envious that I don't have a nice neat little diagnosis.
I'm in a bad mood anyway so I'll refrain from any more comments.

Maybe I'm just envious that I don't have a nice neat little diagnosis.
I'm in a bad mood anyway so I'll refrain from any more comments.
I knew that wasn't the real you. I finally got that same "nice neat little diagnosis" for my son after three long appointments. Now he has something to hang his hat on after I'm dead.

I really don't understand why you feel the need to lash out at me. I really wished that I didn't were autistic, my life would be so much easier if I was neurotypical! People would understand me better, I would understand others better, I wouldn't be so sensitive and I wouldn't get overstrained so easy. Autism really isn't something to be envious about.

Do you have children? I am almost 39 years old and single for more than nine years. I just don't seem to have what it takes to make a relationship work. I really love babies, todlers and children, but I really don't want to be a single mother. My friends always told me that if I want children that much, I should just do it on my own, but I always knew, that I can't raise a child on my own, being responsible for the finances and the emotional wellbeing of a child all by myself, would be overwhelming for me.

Now that I have my diagnosis my friends finally realise that I was right about that all along. Because of my autism I will probably never become a mother, time is running out for me. 11 years ago I already asked my then therapists if I might be autistic, but they said that that was impossible, and didn't even bother to take the test. I went on struggling for 10 more years, in that time I lost my boyfriend of six years and my job. When I came back, completely overstrained, jobless and single for eight years, they finally saw that I could be right about the autism and I got tested.

In hindsight I did lost multiple jobs due to my autism and my autism also complicated my relationships. People don't understand me and find me difficult and selfish. My mother even admitted, when they did the interview for the autism research, that she thought that I was selfish for the first 34 years of my life. It wasn't until my father got cancer and died after three years and she saw how much I did for my parents, that she realised that I really wasn't selfish. Unfortunately, I did too much for them, which led to me getting overstrained and losing my job because of that. On top of it all, my mother and baby sister just can't handle the fact that I am autistic. My therapists wanted to educate my mother and baby sister about what it means that I am autistic, what they can expect from me, what they can't and how they can best handle me. My baby sister wasn't even interested in meeting with my therapists. She is tired of dealing with me and my problems. When we were growing up, my parents were always disciplining me, taking me to psychologists etc. because I was so difficult and untreatable and they just forgot to take care of her. She knows that that is not my fault, but she clearly resents me for it, because she doesn't wants to deepen herself in autism, because that is all about me.

My therapists did explain things about my autism to my mother, like that I can be pushy without realising it, but the next session she complained again about that I was so difficult and pushy to my therapists. The therapists immediately ended the systemic therapy for my mother and me and in the next individual session, advised me to cut contact with my mother. I did cut contact with her, but my baby sister has always and is still rejecting me, so now I am all alone: No parents, no sister and no boyfriend. I do have friends, but they all have their own families, and my best friend lives at the other side of the Atlantic Ocean, so I have no one to go on vacation with or spend the holidays with.

If I had my diagnosis ten years earlier, I probably would have learned to deal with neurotypical people in a constructive way, so that I could have a healthy relationship, before my childbearing years were over, but now my biological alarmbells are all going off, when I didn't even kissed a guy in the last four years! My sexlife is so pathetic, that I had to throw away condoms, because they expired!

My life has been hard from the start and all the misunderstandings, all the people that rejected me, classmates and colleagues that picked on me for years, led to dysthymia. If you don't know what that is, it is is a mood disorder (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mood_disorder) consisting of the same cognitive and physical problems as in depression (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Depression_(mood)), with less severe but longer-lasting symptoms.[2] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dysthymia#cite_note-Schacter-2)[3] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dysthymia#cite_note-3) The concept was coined by Robert Spitzer (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Spitzer_(psychiatrist)) as a replacement for the term "depressive personality" in the late 1970s.[4] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dysthymia#cite_note-brody-4) (From Wikipedia)

So really there is no reason to be envious or to be so demeaning about my diagnosis. Just because I have a diagnosis, doesn't take anything away from your struggle. And by the way that you are behaving right now, I must honestly say, that you should get yourself tested, maybe you will get a diagnosis as well! In over a year, you are the first person ever that reacts that mean to me honestly trying to explain what my struggles are. So maybe there is also a "nice neat little diagnosis" that you could get, I am thinking about narcism personally, but hey, I am not a psychologist and even a psychologist can't diagnose you over the internet based on a few reactions. But really, that you find it necesarry to act so demeaning about my diagnosis, doesn't come across as very mentally healthy to me! I never did anything to hurt you, so why are you acting so mean towards me!

I never called myself an Aspie or said that I have Asperger's, because I don't. If you must know, I am diagnosed with PDD NOS.

Neurotypical is the medical/psychology establishment's word for "not autistic." The DSM-V clumped Asperger's under autism; the autism spectrum is huge. And MP77 was medically diagnosed as an Aspie (before DSM-V).

I am diagnosed with PDD NOS. DSM V is formally not translated yet in Dutch, so here in The Netherlands, everybody still works with DSM 4. Although my therapists do know about what DSM V says of course and they are already anticipating for it.

I am diagnosed with PDD NOS. DSM V is formally not translated yet in Dutch, so here in The Netherlands, everybody still works with DSM 4. Although my therapists do know about what DSM V says of course and they are already anticipating for it.
I apologize. I edited that post. The hyperlexia diagnosis (on the autism spectrum) fits my son like a glove, but because of the doctor's training, she diagnosed him as having Asperger's. DSM-V says that no longer is a diagnosis, so apparently the U.S. and the APA are quite confused.

Don't worry about that. I knew that that was an honest mistake:-). I just don't feel comfortable using a label that I didn't formally receive:-).

But my friends and even the parents of a friend that I discussed this with, and that already possesed some lay men knowledge about autism, also assumed that if I am autistic, it automatically means that I have Asperger's. Because I am clearly highly functioning, but people with classical autism, like Temple Grandin for example, or PDD NOS can also be highly functioning. Exactly because of all the overlay, between the different labels and because it is hard to differentiate between then, the DSM V only speaks about , instead of all the sublabels.

Because I am clearly highly functioning, but people with classical autism, like Temple Grandin for example, or PDD NOS can also be highly functioning.
I've read that it's genetic (often through the male genes) for about 90% of people diagnosed with autism. My husband has never been diagnosed but knows he's an Aspie. Nearly everything fits. His father (now deceased) also manifested many characteristics as does his daughter (my husband's sister). Do you know of other family members like your dad or an uncle who may be/have been on the spectrum.

Be sure to value all of the pluses autism gives you. That's a big topic at my house.

I've read that it's genetic (often through the male genes) for about 90% of people diagnosed with autism. My husband has never been diagnosed but knows he's an Aspie. Nearly everything fits. His father (now deceased) also manifested many characteristics as does his daughter (my husband's sister). Do you know of other family members like your dad or an uncle who may be/have been on the spectrum.

Be sure to value all of the pluses autism gives you. That's a big topic at my house.

I read the part about it being 90 % genetic as well. I also suspect that both my parents are/were autistic, I suspect it of two uncles and of my grandmother.

Once I was complaining to my psychiatrist about my mother and she said that maybe my mother is a little autistic too. I replied with: A little! I think a lot! She lacks any empathy and I even told my mother that I suspect that she is autistic as well, but since she also lacks any self reflection, she didn't want to hear any of it. According to her all our problems are my fault, she finds it very convenient to use my autism as a scapegoat for everything that goes wrong and refuses to take a critical look at herself:-(.

I really don't see much upsides on being autitistic. They really don't outweigh the downsides. The people in my autism supportgroup told me that it will get better, now that I got diagnosed, I really hope so. Now I see my life as hopeless, that I am destined to die lonely and poor, but I am doing whatever I can to change that, through my therapy.

I really don't see much upsides on being autitistic. They really don't outweigh the downsides. The people in my autism supportgroup told me that it will get better, now that I got diagnosed, I really hope so. Now I see my life as hopeless, that I am destined to die lonely and poor, but I am doing whatever I can to change that, through my therapy.
An Aspie on Quora wrote, "Aspies are literal minded and rule oriented. That is why there are so many in the computer and software related trades. Aspies tend to be overly logical (if that is possible) by not inferring context in an intuitive way."

My son asked me, "Is autism a bad thing?" I told him no, that his brain is wired a bit differently than mine. When he uses his eidetic memory to remind me when we bought our refrigerator and help me with crossword puzzles plus when his supervisor praises him for work well done and when our cats (who also are autistic -- all cats are) hang around him and sit on him and follow him from room to room, I remind him of the advantages of having an autistic brain and nature.

Good luck with this narcissistic threat in your life. Your best bet is to just ignore him until he completely forgets about you. Pay it no mind and do not worry. If he continues to try to contact you, call the local authorities and get a restraining order.

Thank you for your advice. I blocked him on LinkedIn now, but I will certainly contact the Police if he contacts me again. Better save than sorry!

An Aspie on Quora wrote, "Aspies are literal minded and rule oriented. That is why there are so many in the computer and software related trades. Aspies tend to be overly logical (if that is possible) by not inferring context in an intuitive way."

My son asked me, "Is autism a bad thing?" I told him no, that his brain is wired a bit differently than mine. When he uses his eidetic memory to remind me when we bought our refrigerator and help me with crossword puzzles plus when his supervisor praises him for work well done and when our cats (who also are autistic -- all cats are) hang around him and sit on him and follow him from room to room, I remind him of the advantages of having an autistic brain and nature.

Being autistic is a lot easier and nicer with you as a mother or spouse, than with the people that I am surrounded with! But unfortunately I can't change my family and at my age it is not that easy anymore to find a boyfriend as back when I was still in my twenties. Most good guys are taken by now.

I also believe that you can't be too logical. Unfortunately neurotypicals are very emotional, I don't understand that and they don't understand me. It sometimes works to my advantage, when exes tried to make me jealous and I was too rational for that, but usually it works against me. People perceive me as arrogant or icecold because I often don't get why they make such a big fuss about the littlest things or even worse, how they can be so mad at me for what they perceived that I said, instead of what I literally said. My words don't have hidden meanings. Even after my diagnosis my baby sister often got mad with me and accused me of saying things that I never said, just because she perceived them like that.

I just come from my therapy group where I shared this story. None of my five group members, nor the psychiatrist or psychologist that lead the group said anything bad about my avoiding behaviour towards my ex.

We dissected why this had this much impact on me. I didn't realise it myself, but because my parents always emotionally neglected me and now he does again, by not respecting my wishes to leave me alone, this has an emotional impact on me.

I acted as a responsible adult by ignoring and blocking him and if he leaves me alone now, I can probably be at ease:-).

I just come from my therapy group where I shared this story. None of my five group members, nor the psychiatrist or psychologist that lead the group ssaid anything bad about my avoiding behaviour towards my ex.

We dissected why this had this much impact on me. I didn't realise it myself, but because my parents always emotionally neglected me and now he does again, by not respecting my wishes to leave me alone, this has an emotional impact on me.

I acted as a responsible adult by ignoring and blocking him and if he leaves me alone now, I can probably be at ease:-).

Sorry to tell you but you are still OVER reacting. You can't expect the rest of the world to bow to or follow your every wish. Expecting otherwise is only going to cause yourself more drama and aggravation. Because that's how the world works... and how the world is always going to continue to work. Doesn't matter what anyone's disability or sensitivity is... the fact remains the world doesn't conform to you... you conform to the world. Those who do not... or can not... find themselves having problems of their own creation.

Based on what you have said.. all he has done in the years since you broke up was be cordial. And civil. If he had done otherwise, it would be different. Ignoring someone you know when you bump into them is rude, Saying something kind to them as a greeting when you see them is not, even if it is very brief... you don't have to take them to dinner or engage in a conversation, but it is totally unreasonable to expect them to cross the street if they see you, or change their direction from where they were headed just because you happened to be there or to move someplace you are not. It is of course up to you if YOU wish to do that... but you would only be continuing and reinforcing a behavior that you would be best served by modifying and reducing. Because the rest of the world is not subservient to any one individuals demands.

I take the time to say that because the better you understand how the rest of the world thinks..and reacts...the better you will be able to fit in to it. Because fighting the rest of the world is a battle you can't win, and will only cause you stress trying.

This is why holding grudges hurts yourself more than the people you have the grudge against. It diverts energy you could best be using in positive pursuits.

WHOA, I wasn't that mean. And no more so than any of the men here, who in shorter comments told you to dispense with the drama.
No, I never had children, a wise choice that hurts once in a while, especially now that I am in my late 60s.
I have had 37 jobs.
I have had much therapy and many diagnoses all revolving around depression (and if otherwise, I ignore them).
I am not narcissistic. I don't know how to emphasize enough how little regard I have for diagnoses. I was being facetious about being wistful.
I am often sarcastic and facetious. I don't consider myself very mean. You came here to total strangers, opening up about all sorts of details that you find fascinating, and most people don't.

WHOA, I wasn't that mean. And no more so than any of the men here, who in shorter comments told you to dispense with the drama.
No, I never had children, a wise choice that hurts once in a while, especially now that I am in my late 60s.
I have had 37 jobs.
I have had much therapy and many diagnoses all revolving around depression (and if otherwise, I ignore them).
I am not narcissistic. I don't know how to emphasize enough how little regard I have for diagnoses. I was being facetious about being wistful.
I am often sarcastic and facetious. I don't consider myself very mean. You came here to total strangers, opening up about all sorts of details that you find fascinating, and most people don't.

I don't find the details fascinating, I only thought that they might be relevant, that is a huge difference.

I don't know how long you are active on the internet, but you must have figured out by now, that it is hard to get sarcasm over the internet, because you don't hear the tone of voice of someone nor is it possible to see the facial expression. And as an autistic person, I am totally disadvantaged, we have difficulty with sarcasm to begin with. I think that in real life I mostly get sarcasm, but according to my baby sister, I also miss it in real life sometimes. Unfortunately I don't know what I don't know.

37 jobs, from what you are telling me, there is even a possibility that you are autistic too! If you are interested in finding that out, it is something that you could look into. Before my diagnosis I was misdiagnosed with personality disorder Not Otherwise Specified with narcistic and borderline traits. Autists are often misdiagnosed as narcissists because of our lack of empathy and with borderline because we tend to think in black in white. Also with schizoid personality disorder, because we avoid people but fortunately that never came up with me.

I admire that you made the wise choice to not have children, my parents should have made the same choice as well, now they messed up my baby sister and me. I always wanted to undo their damage before I continued the cycle myself. I am still making that same choice for myself. Like a lot of autistic people, I wish that I was never born at all, I really don't want to put children on this earth with the same wish. I only want to have children if I am able to give them a sense of belonging. Since you simply can't give your children what you don't have, I have to find that myself or at least find them a father that has that, to prevent them feeling like me when they grow up.

I totally get that it hurts once in a while, I feel the same pain.

About the men that are way meaner, I only have that opinion about one man in particular. It seems as if he is bound to always twist my words around to my disadvantage, if you read the entire thread back, you can see that I didn't even responded once to all the nonsense that he uttered. I experienced his mean streak before on another thread, where he called me naïve, delusional and all kinds of things and since then, I just ignore him. On other forums I would have blocked him, but since that isn't possible here, I just ignore him. I really don't understand why he even bothers to still respond to my posts actually, that is just a waste of his time.

But there is no reason for you to think that I am harsher to you than to him and that that is unfair. I feel like conversating with you is still worth my time, it is still constructive, while with him I only see him as a waste of my time:-).

The men weren't 'way meaner.' I said I was no meaner.
I do NOT want a diagnosis. I did a ton of reading about borderline about 45 years ago, back when I was interested. Other than being perpetually depressed or just disaffected, I could fit the definition. But the only really USEFUL thing I took away from it was that I was good at talking circles around both myself and any therapist.
I only care about usefulness. Too often diagnoses are used as crutches. Trite but true.
That's where my sarcasm came in - being wistful about not having a nice neat crutch oops I mean diagnosis.
If you find it helpful (and I don't discount that!), then that's wonderful.

Well... You are the one with some personal issue, and can't seem to let go of anything that ever happened in the past, I'm a bigger person than that. I work with people all day, every day... people all around the world. I am VERY good at it. If you would get over whatever problem you have listening to others... you would only be helping yourself by learning from them.

Nobody is twisting around anything you say. If your perspective and viewpoint is wrong to others... then its wrong and you need to consider that.

If I was a mean person... I'd let you wallow in your problems. Rather than take time out of my busy day pointing out things you need to hear if you expect to be able to function better with the rest of the world.

I am a little late responding to this, and my first thought is, you have pretty much a messed up life, and the 'stalking' boyfriend, who you dated for only 7 months, 16 years ago, is not the problem.

It often happens that people post a sort of cover story, something concrete indicating the problem, and then the original question/problem, turns into very long narratives, that come with a hint of distain at not being understood. Yet, the information provided in the original post, eventually becomes dust, and the real issues, are far more serious. But, like your 'question', it is much more an issue of how you cope with all the problems in your life, and quite often includes others for your own disappointment- your parents, friends not understanding you, difficulty in relationships, etc. etc. etc. The brief relationship has nothing to do with any of it, other than you can't get over him, even now. Somehow you allow him to keep filtering through your thoughts, and becoming larger than life.

It's like a bait and switch. First the question, then it gets all switched around to your multitude of problems, ranging from your parents, to your autism, to your lack of relationship success, to time is running out for you to have a baby.

You put a lot of meaning into events that should, by now, have no consequence. As to the relationship of so long ago, it seems that you ruminate about it, and that is the starting point for everything else that is wrong in your life.

If he were a threat to you in any way, after 16 years, and you haven't got over figuring him out, and you are still fearful (?), you need far more advice than can be offered here. I don't know how many years of therapy you need before you can stand on your own two feet, and live a productive, happy life, but I wish you some success, that doesn't seem apparent right now.

Getting back to the original question, you put far too much in your analysis of him, even when he's mostly been no more than a blip in your radar, and ghost-like in your thinking. To carry on thoughts of him, in which everything else seems to bring out more and more troubles, really is, as I've said, more than can be dealt with here.

I think that, from what YOU have said, he is only one of many problems you have, that you seem unable to deal with, settle with, or get over. It would be a shame to think another 16 years could go by, and you'd be in the same place as you are now.

I wish you success in your therapy.

Geez guys, the lady has trouble with the concepts of social norms. Not her fault. Half the humans on the earth have the same problem... heck most of us have undiagnosed issues we struggle with.

If it were so easy to get over ourselves we would have done it. My whole point is sometimes you cannot force others to see your point which while OBVIOUS to you, may not be as obvious to others. We... all of us, can only cope with the nuance of our lives through the lense of our perceptions.

Some see the world differently, and the first law of self preservation is applied differently. You have to be VERY PATIENT when a human struggles to cope with whatever circumstance they face. Without patience you lose the ability to understand or have empathy for the struggle of others.

In this case, ignoring someone who has disrupted your security is not rude but the logical thing to do. Coping emotionally with the most recent instances takes longer, and fortunately MissP, you have a support group for that. Maybe your group can help you through the logic of others, that is not an attack, but their own logic, which doesn't apply to you. You have already acknowledged your awareness of the effect of YOUR logic on others, as well as your own sensitivity.

Can you acknowledge the logic of others now, and not be INSENSITIVE to it?

Dear Talaniman, I am really confused now. What do you mean by me not acknowledging the logic of others? What logic didn't I acknowledge? People have stated that I was wrong for avoiding my ex and I verified it just in case today in my therapy group, how much more can I acknowledge other people's logic?

I really don't want to be insensitive towards others, but some things I really don't get. So if I have been insensitive on this thread, please tell me where and how, because I am really not aware of that. I am not denying that it could have happened, there are things that neurotypicals can sense that I really can't. Before I am getting accused of using it as a crutch again, well too bad, this is reality for me. Sometimes I hurt people unknowingly and unwillingly and I don't understand why and how, until someone explains it to me. Being insensitive is also part of autism. I really wished that I could cure that part of my character, but unfortunately I can't. These reproaches, that I have been receiving all my life and really can't understand, are the main reason why I say that I rather be neurotypical and that although being autistic as some advantages they do not outweigh the disadvantages.

I am a little late responding to this, and my first thought is, you have pretty much a messed up life, and the 'stalking' boyfriend, who you dated for only 7 months, 16 years ago, is not the problem.

It often happens that people post a sort of cover story, something concrete indicating the problem, and then the original question/problem, turns into very long narratives, that come with a hint of distain at not being understood. Yet, the information provided in the original post, eventually becomes dust, and the real issues, are far more serious. But, like your 'question', it is much more an issue of how you cope with all the problems in your life, and quite often includes others for your own disappointment- your parents, friends not understanding you, difficulty in relationships, etc. etc. etc. The brief relationship has nothing to do with any of it, other than you can't get over him, even now. Somehow you allow him to keep filtering through your thoughts, and becoming larger than life.

It's like a bait and switch. First the question, then it gets all switched around to your multitude of problems, ranging from your parents, to your autism, to your lack of relationship success, to time is running out for you to have a baby.

You put a lot of meaning into events that should, by now, have no consequence. As to the relationship of so long ago, it seems that you ruminate about it, and that is the starting point for everything else that is wrong in your life.

If he were a threat to you in any way, after 16 years, and you haven't got over figuring him out, and you are still fearful (?), you need far more advice than can be offered here. I don't know how many years of therapy you need before you can stand on your own two feet, and live a productive, happy life, but I wish you some success, that doesn't seem apparent right now.

Getting back to the original question, you put far too much in your analysis of him, even when he's mostly been no more than a blip in your radar, and ghost-like in your thinking. To carry on thoughts of him, in which everything else seems to bring out more and more troubles, really is, as I've said, more than can be dealt with here.

I think that, from what YOU have said, he is only one of many problems you have, that you seem unable to deal with, settle with, or get over. It would be a shame to think another 16 years could go by, and you'd be in the same place as you are now.

I wish you success in your therapy.

I totally agree with you that I have bigger problems than my exboyfriend. That is what I am in therapy for, I thought that this little problem was something for which I could get an easy answer from strangers on the internet.

I never said that my friends misunderstand me. Fortunately they understand me. I only tried to explain to Joypulv that my friends have families of their own and therefore less free time to go on vacation with me or spend the Holidays with me and that that makes me feel lonely at those occasions. Yes, I can join a group travel with a bunch of strangers, I looked into that, but there are no grouptravels in which you can just lay around at the beach and just visit one village or city a day if you want to. All of them are packed real fully and I find that exhausting. I just want to relax on my vacation. I went by myself to Aruba and Curacao and lying alone at the beach, when all other people on the beach have company just ain't fun for me!

I only told the story about how hard autism is, because joypulv acted so demeaning and said that she envied me, so I wanted to make clear to her that autism is nothing to be envied. But I don't see any connection with my ex boyfriend for that whole story. I was born this way, I don't blame that on my exboyfriend from 16 years ago. I had a relationship of six years after him, so I really don't blame him for me not finding a suitable mate or whatever, all of that was just to explain to joypulv what life is like with autism.

I hadn't think about my ex before in 2015, until I received the LinkedIn request. I ignored it and blocked him. All I really wanted was some assurance that that was enough and that I shouldn't worry about being in danger.

But then I got misunderstood, so I tried to explain some more. I didn't wanted to come across as if I blame others for things that go wrong, so I disclosed that I am autistic and that that can lead to misunderstandings.

You totally misunderstand me. This is the first time since 2001 that I discussed this exboyfriend with a therapist, because I really thought that he was of no relevance. I always and still only see my relationship with him as a symptom of my deeper issues, he is a symptom not a cause. Today in the group I also said that I suffer from submission and that that is the reason why I stayed so long with him. I really hate it that I always get so misunderstood.

Years and years of therapy, in which I am trying to learn how to communicate with others, so that they don't misunderstand me, but it still happens. That is really disheartening.

The men weren't 'way meaner.' I said I was no meaner.
I do NOT want a diagnosis. I did a ton of reading about borderline about 45 years ago, back when I was interested. Other than being perpetually depressed or just disaffected, I could fit the definition. But the only really USEFUL thing I took away from it was that I was good at talking circles around both myself and any therapist.
I only care about usefulness. Too often diagnoses are used as crutches. Trite but true.
That's where my sarcasm came in - being wistful about not having a nice neat crutch oops I mean diagnosis.
If you find it helpful (and I don't discount that!), then that's wonderful.

OK, I misunderstood what you said, I apologise for that. If you do not want a diagnosis, that is your prerogative, but the way that you reacted yesterday came across as very demeaning towards me. I have some problems. I could chose to denie them and blame everything on everybody else but me, but I chose to find out what exactly is the matter with me and I searched professional help, to learn how to deal with all the people on this world that just keep on misunderstanding me. Often when people try to insult you, they say that you need professional help, but that insult doesn't work on me: yes I do need it, I acknowledge that and have it. I read books that can help me, I talk to my friends, that do understand me, I never said that they didn't, all that I said is that they don't have time to go on vacation or spend the Holidays with me, because they have their own families.

Now you say that you don't discount that knowing that I am autistic can be helpful, but from the way you reacted yesterday, it seemed as if to you, psychology is just nonsense and that autism doesn't even exist. There really are people that don't believe that autism is a real thing and that call it just the latest fad or something and you came accros as one of those.

Thank you that was very honest and I can understand the confusion you feel. My point was NEVER take the perceptions of others personally. It's NEVER about you, even though it may affect you adversely. Does that make logical sense?

In the case of your EX, he can only act as he does, like your own parents, they are stuck being themselves, like your own sister who can only act as she can. Like you can only act as you do. Is that logical? I don't know what it says about me, but while I can see your acknowledging the gaps in your understanding and perception, others outside your group CANNOT always see that, especially here on an international public site. It's like WG says, even locally in the US, the differences between "normal" and different is vastly misunderstood (A fact you have acknowledged).

Is it accurate to say that you have "normal" friends outside your support group? What make them your friend? What makes ME your friend?

Never mind, I know the answer... they UNDERSTAND you. LOL, we all chose our friends that way no matter what our issues may be. That's human nature, and in this you are the same as any human.


These reproaches, that I have been receiving all my life and really can't understand, are the main reason why I say that I rather be neurotypical and that although being autistic as some advantages they do not outweigh the disadvantages.

You are human, and your logic can be flawed, as the logic any human has can be flawed. Autism is no better or worse than any other human condition. All humans have something they would like to change about themselves, things they don't understand, things that others don't understand about them.

No logical reason to envy the neurotypical, that's like wishing you were someone else. Like me wishing I was RICH instead of just HANDSOME. We all want everyone to love understand and support us... but it is illogical to expect it from EVERYONE.

Can you not be grateful for who you are, and what you have and what you have accomplished? If so you can accept and deal with the illogic and frustrating actions, and words of others, and cope with this crazy world. You are unique, and confusion is human. I think you are a good human, albeit rather wordy, but hey that's cool too!

Thank you that was very honest and I can understand the confusion you feel. My point was NEVER take the perceptions of others personally. It's NEVER about you, even though it may affect you adversely. Does that make logical sense?

In the case of your EX, he can only act as he does, like your own parents, they are stuck being themselves, like your own sister who can only act as she can. Like you can only act as you do. Is that logical? I don't know what it says about me, but while I can see your acknowledging the gaps in your understanding and perception, others outside your group CANNOT always see that, especially here on an international public site. It's like WG says, even locally in the US, the differences between "normal" and different is vastly misunderstood (A fact you have acknowledged).

Is it accurate to say that you have "normal" friends outside your support group? What make them your friend? What makes ME your friend?

I totally understand this. I first thought that you meant in this thread. I have known for a long time now, that the way people treat you, says more about them than about me. Unfortunately, there are some people that blame others for the way that they are behaving and always point fingers at others. For my parents I was always the scapegoat for example. That was unfair of them and I resent them for that. When I lived at home food disappeared from the fridge for example. It was never me, but I was always blamed for everything. I heard from my baby sister that after I moved out, food still disappeared from the fridge (I suspect that it was my father) but my parents never took the effort to vindicate me, and this is just one small example, there are lots and some far worse. Those were blatant lies and blatant lies aren't logical.

Yes, I fortunately do have some normal friends that understand me. My best friend, who now lives in Suriname, but we Whatsapp and talk on WhatsApp or Skype daily and I also send her the message that my ex send me for example. My former college roommate, who has the cutest 21 month year old daughter, that I really adore and love to babysit for, 2 friends I met through salsa dancing and some other friends, that I see less often. They are my friends because we understand each other and we appreciate eachothers company. Unfortunately one of my friends even has a 13 year old autistic son, also PDD NOS, that just a few months ago, tried to commit suicide. So we understand each other all too well!

I also joined a club online, where you can place appeals (?) for people to do something together. Now that lots of my friends have a family, I use that club to go to the movies with for example. I am not a mother, so I don't like being forced to stay indoors at my friends houses after 7 pm, because the children have to sleep at that time and their husbands or boyfriends aren't at home to stay with the children. But I don't feel a connection with those people and some of those people are really weird. If I want I can spend the second day of Christmas (in The Netherlands Christmas is two days and so is Easter and Pentecost/Whitsun) with those people, but I think that I prefer to stay at home then. For now only two guys are going, one of them I don't even know.

For now, I see you as a nice, friendly person, I don't consider you my friend yet. I do consider Wondergirl my friend, but that is because I know her real name, already had a lot of private chats with her and we are also Facebook friends, I have no idea how old you are where you live etc. I do know those things about her. But I hope that I can consider you a friend someday! (I really hope that I haven't offended you by saying that I don't consider you a friend yet, lying just felt wrong.)


Never mind, I know the answer... they UNDERSTAND you. LOL, we all chose our friends that way no matter what our issues may be. That's human nature, and in this you are the same as any human.



You are human, and your logic can be flawed, as the logic any human has can be flawed. Autism is no better or worse than any other human condition. All humans have something they would like to change about themselves, things they don't understand, things that others don't understand about them.

No logical reason to envy the neurotypical, that's like wishing you were someone else. Like me wishing I was RICH instead of just HANDSOME. We all want everyone to love understand and support us... but it is illogical to expect it from EVERYONE.

Can you not be grateful for who you are, and what you have and what you have accomplished? If so you can accept and deal with the illogic and frustrating actions, and words of others, and cope with this crazy world. You are unique, and confusion is human. I think you are a good human, albeit rather wordy, but hey that's cool too!

I know that wishing that I am not autistic would make me someone else, but I suspect that that other person would be happier. She might even have a family, she wouldn't struggle this much. Autism really is a disabilty, even so much that I am on disabilty income because of it right now. I just want to be someone who is fully functioning with a job, a homeowner and a car, just like my neurotypical baby sister for example. I really don't have much to be proud of.

Our marriage has worked out for over 48 years because a quirky guy with undiagnosed autism married a woman who's 100% German heritage (my family of origin tends to be pragmatic, ultra-logical, not huggy-kissy, very focused, black-or-white thinking, very literal, insists on having a "stiff upper lip," says to fix the problem and stop complaining about it). Now, MP77, certainly there are NTs like me in your world, aren't there? :) Maybe you and I should hang out together on WrongPlanet.net!

MP, you have been a wonderul help to me in getting my son diagnosed. You patiently explained how it worked out for you and how a diagnosis has helped you. Every morning I whisper thanks to you that you inspired courage in me.

I DO believe:
that there are psychologists who are full of nonsense and there are those who aren't.
that there are some 'patients' who fall too easily into a diagnosis for all the wrong reasons.
that diagnoses are designed for pretty much one reason: to put a code number on insurance forms.
that good, smart doctors realize this, and downplay them, in favor of working on ways to handle life instead.

(Wondergirl, isn't your husband a successful scientist? Career, wife, children, a quirky guy who handles life, whereas misspurple struggles? That to me is the ONLY subject worth discussing. A diagnosis might be a framework for working on ourselves, but that's about it.)

Joypulv, my husband is a retired telecom installer, the perfect job for him -- few people to deal with and no social life at work, lots of mechanical and electronic things to work on and repair, a place to use his logical thinking skills. I've been the one who raised the kids, kept the household accounts paid, acted as social secretary while keeping in mind Husband's aversions and preferences.

With a solid medical diagnosis of autism, our son will now have mentors and a place to live once my husband and I are in nursing homes or dead. He doesn't drive, is smart but doesn't have a lot of common sense, and would possibly become homeless without that diagnosis.

My point was a person with autism can succeed, especially with willing helpers and understanding people nearby.

IF that person really is autistic.

The US and perhaps the world are awash in the diagnosis. I have never encountered such a talkative one. Nor one so willing to hand out diagnoses to others. Nor one whose older posts don't fit any autism characteristics either.

I have a psychologist friend whose specialty is evaluating students for special needs and testifying in court, if need be. She knows how much it goes on.

Our marriage has worked out for over 48 years because a quirky guy with undiagnosed autism married a woman who's 100% German heritage (my family of origin tends to be pragmatic, ultra-logical, not huggy-kissy, very focused, black-or-white thinking, very literal, insists on having a "stiff upper lip," says to fix the problem and stop complaining about it). Now, MP77, certainly there are NTs like me in your world, aren't there? :) Maybe you and I should hang out together on WrongPlanet.net!

MP, you have been a wonderul help to me in getting my son diagnosed. You patiently explained how it worked out for you and how a diagnosis has helped you. Every morning I whisper thanks to you that you inspired courage in me.

Hi Wondergirl, I have friends that are comparable to you, but they are all busy, busy, busy with their families and or careers. In my family I unfortunately don't know people like you. I was completely shocked when I found out that my uncle and aunt from my fathers side disowned a cousin of mine for being lesbian! My uncle died of cancer, but refused to talk to his daughter! An uncle (from whom I suspect that he is autistic as well) and aunt from my mothers side (the Muslim side) threw my cousin out on the streets, when she got pregnant at seventeen! She was literally living in the streets for a while together with her boyfriend and miscarriaged. My uncle told us that my cousin had ran away from home. But I come from a family with backwards people like that. I don't speak to another brother of my mother, because he considers me a whore, because I had multiple boyfriends. My mother and baby sister reacted badly, so I really don't have much confidence in my family.

But thank you so much for that wonderful compliment:-D!


I DO believe:
that there are psychologists who are full of nonsense and there are those who aren't.
that there are some 'patients' who fall too easily into a diagnosis for all the wrong reasons.
that diagnoses are designed for pretty much one reason: to put a code number on insurance forms.
that good, smart doctors realize this, and downplay them, in favor of working on ways to handle life instead.

(Wondergirl, isn't your husband a successful scientist? Career, wife, children, a quirky guy who handles life, whereas misspurple struggles? That to me is the ONLY subject worth discussing. A diagnosis might be a framework for working on ourselves, but that's about it.)

The right diagnosis can give you the right tools to work on yourself. Without the right diagnosis I was still in the dark, I tried and tried, but couldn't fixed my problems without understanding why. Now that I have a diagnosis I unfortunately realised that some of my problems will never be solved, but at leastI know understand myself, my problems and I do know what I can remedy.

IF that person really is autistic.

The US and perhaps the world are awash in the diagnosis. I have never encountered such a talkative one. Nor one so willing to hand out diagnoses to others. Nor one whose older posts don't fit any autism characteristics either.

I have a psychologist friend whose specialty is evaluating students for special needs and testifying in court, if need be. She knows how much it goes on.

So you doubt my diagnosis. Okay, well that is your problem. I tried to explain things to you, because you didn't understand them, but I was right all along, you just don't understand that autism can appear in a lot of different ways. Yes I am not a stereotype autist, but have you ever watched The Big Bang Theory? Sheldon also annoys everybody arounds him because he is so talkative. I told my therapists that he reminds me of myself and that my sister was ashamed to admit to me that he also reminded her of me. That finally made them realise that it was worth testing me. If I was a stereotypical autist, I would have gotten my diagnosis a lot earlier on.

Are you calling me liar? Do you think that I suffer from Munchausen syndrom or something? Or do you doubt the skills of my former and my current mental health provider! They went to medical school and they studied psychology, why you didn't. Whatever it is, your kind of ignorance is what makes the world extra difficult for people like me! The slogan from the Dutch Association for Autism is, you can't cure autism, but you can cure ignorance. But really, since I have my diagnosis and I see how people react to it, I seriously doubt that!

Anyways, I am back to thinking that you are narcisstic, narcisstic people also have difficult personalities that can lead to them losing their jobs and in addition to that they are huge know it alls. Without having any expertise, you think that you know more about autism than Wondergirl professionals or me and you also seem to think that you know everything better than your own therapists, regarding you, so you also suffer from wilfullnes, just like a real narcissist, but what is really the most narcistic part about you, is your arrogance.

I really tried to give you the benefit of the doubt, but you really have an attitude problem. You are in our late sixties, got fired 37 times, but instead of trying to improve your life, all you can do, is put someone down who is trying to improve her life. Putting others down, in order to feel better about yourself is another narcistic trade!

Since I see this word Narcissist thrown around incorrectly and freely... here is what it really means so everyone gets it right.


What is Narcissism?
A pattern of traits and behaviors which signify infatuation and obsession with one's self to the exclusion of all others and the egotistic and ruthless pursuit of one's gratification, dominance and ambition.
Most narcissists (75%) are men.
NPD is one of a "family" of personality disorders (formerly known as "Cluster B").
Other members: Borderline PD, Antisocial PD and Histrionic PD.
NPD is often diagnosed with other mental health disorders ("co-morbidity") - or with substance abuse, or impulsive and reckless behaviors ("dual diagnosis").
NPD is new (1980) mental health category in the Diagnostic and Statistics Manual (DSM).
There is only scant research regarding narcissism. But what there is has not demonstrated any ethnic, social, cultural, economic, genetic, or professional predilection to NPD.
It is estimated that 0.7-1% of the general population suffer from NPD.
Pathological narcissism was first described in detail by Freud. Other major contributors are: Klein, Horney, Kohut, Kernberg, Million, Roningstam, Gunderson, Hare.
The onset of narcissism is in infancy, childhood and early adolescence. It is commonly attributed to childhood abuse and trauma inflicted by parents, authority figures, or even peers.
There is a whole range of narcissistic reactions - from the mild, reactive and transient to the permanent personality disorder.
Narcissists are either "Cerebral" (derive their narcissistic supply from their intelligence or academic achievements) - or "Somatic" (derive their narcissistic supply from their physique, exercise, physical or sexual prowess and "conquests").
Narcissists are either "Classic" - see definition below - or they are "Compensatory", or "Inverted" - see definitions here: "The Inverted Narcissist (http://www.healthyplace.com/personality-disorders/malignant-self-love/the-inverted-narcissist/)".
NPD is treated in talk therapy (psychodynamic or cognitive-behavioral). The prognosis for an adult narcissist is poor, though his adaptation to life and to others can improve with treatment. Medication is applied to side-effects and behaviors (such as mood or affect disorders and obsession-compulsion) - usually with some success.
Please read CAREFULLY!
The text in italics is NOT based on the Diagnostics and Statistics Manual, Fourth Edition-Text Revision (2000).
The text in italics IS based on "Malignant Self Love - Narcissism Revisited", fourth, revised, printing (2003) (http://www.healthyplace.com/personality-disorders/malignant-self-love/malignant-self-love-narcissism-revisited-the-book/)
An all-pervasive pattern of grandiosity (in fantasy or behaviour), need for admiration or adulation and lack of empathy, usually beginning by early adulthood and present in various contexts. Five (or more) of the following criteria must be met:


Feels grandiose and self-important (e.g., exaggerates achievements and talents to the point of lying, demands to be recognized as superior without commensurate achievements)
Is obsessed with fantasies of unlimited success, fame, fearsome power or omnipotence, unequalled brilliance (the cerebral narcissist), bodily beauty or sexual performance (the somatic narcissist), or ideal, everlasting, all-conquering love or passion
Firmly convinced that he or she is unique and, being special, can only be understood by, should only be treated by, or associate with, other special or unique, or high-status people (or institutions)
Requires excessive admiration, adulation, attention and affirmation - or, failing that, wishes to be feared and to be notorious (narcissistic supply)
Feels entitled. Expects unreasonable or special and favorable priority treatment. Demands automatic and full compliance with his or her expectations
Is "interpersonally exploitative", i.e., uses others to achieve his or her own ends
Devoid of empathy. Is unable or unwilling to identify with or acknowledge the feelings and needs of others
Constantly envious of others or believes that they feel the same about him or her
Arrogant, haughty behaviours or attitudes coupled with rage when frustrated, contradicted, or confronted

Some of the language in the criteria above is based on or summarized from:
American Psychiatric Association. (2000). Diagnostic and statistical manual of mental disorders, fourth edition, Text Revision (DSM IV-TR). Washington, DC: American Psychiatric Association.
The text in italics is based on:
Sam Vaknin. (2003). Malignant Self Love - Narcissism Revisited, fourth, revised, printing (http://www.healthyplace.com/personality-disorders/malignant-self-love/malignant-self-love-narcissism-revisited-the-book/). Prague and Skopje: Narcissus Publication.
For the exact language of the DSM IV criteria - please refer to the manual itself !!!


Narcissistic Personality Disorder (NPD) Definition - HealthyPlace (http://www.healthyplace.com/personality-disorders/malignant-self-love/narcissistic-personality-disorder-npd-definition/)

Wow, do you EXTRAPOLATE!! No, I didn't call you a liar. At most, I'm thinking your doctor got exasperated and gave up and said here, by my guest.
The Sheldon character is a self-centered genius. I have to laugh - if that's you, then you aren't a narcissist (minus the genius)? You seem determined to make me into one.
I could care less about my future because of my age. I'm retired. I own my own home. This isn't about me. I'm not the one here asking for help.

Wow, do you EXTRAPOLATE!! No, I didn't call you a liar. At most, I'm thinking your doctor got exasperated and gave up and said here, by my guest.
The Sheldon character is a self-centered genius. I have to laugh - if that's you, then you aren't a narcissist (minus the genius)? You seem determined to make me into one.
I could care less about my future because of my age. I'm retired. I own my own home. This isn't about me. I'm not the one here asking for help.

I never said that you called me a liar. That was just one of the many options that I mentioned. Sheldon isn't a narcissist, he really is that much smarter than other people are and he also really lacks social skills, selfreflection etc. He doesn't realise that how he treats everyone else is unacceptable and I am fortunately not as clueless about that as he is. Unfortunately I am not a genius either, otherwise I might have had a job as a scientist as well, in which people skills aren't that important.

What help am I asking for? All that I wanted to know was if ignoring and blocking my ex was enough. I wasn't understood right, so I tried to ellaborate in order to clear up some things, which led to follow up comments and questions to which I also tried to reply and unfortunately people lost track about what my question is really about.
I don't need help with any of the other issues, that is what I am in therapy for and also in a autism support group. There are also things that I do and say that my fellow autists in the group recognize as being autistic, from which I never even realised that those traits are autistic. There is so much recognition in the group, that it is clear to me and to the other autistic people in the group that we really are autistic. Yes, I am verbally very strong, unfortunately I am very bad at math, my capacaties are the exact opposite of the most wellknown autistic people, but I read Aspergirls by Rudy Simone and there are other woman like me.

I really don't mind educating people about my autism, and no I am not being arrogant, my therapists and the Dutch Association for Autism clearly mentioned that everyone who is autistic is automatically an ambassador for the autistic community. The Dutch Association for Autism actually already said to me that I can explain autism so well, that I would be suited to inform people about autism. Google someone like Birsen Basar, she is a very talkative young autistic woman, a professional autism speaker in Turkey and The Netherlands of Turkish descend. Or do you think that she got her diagnosis as well, because her psychiatrist wanted to get rid of her! She also wrote books about autism. Rudy Simone also wrote multiple books, so why do you question my autism based on my writing skills? There are lots of autistic authors BOOKS BY PEOPLE WITH AUTISM SPECTRUM DISORDERS (http://www.ont-autism.uoguelph.ca/books-by-ASD-authors.html). They suspect that Jane Austen was autistic, the famous in The Netherlands writer Judith Visser has Asperger's syndrome.

Psychiatrists don't give labels like autism to patients just to get rid of them. In this case, giving me that label, only means that they will have to see more of me. I am on disability income now, the Dutch government agency in charge of that, wanted a letter from my mental health care provider, including my diagnosis, if I wasn't really autistic that would be fraud, for which a psychiatrist can lose their license and end up in jail! So do you really consider that a logical option! If it were that easy, lazy people would have themselves declared autistic, so that they can get benefits!

You're the one that out of the blue attacked me, by calling my autism a "nice neat little diagnosis" that you envied. You're the one that took offense by me calling most people that aren't autistic by the proper name for them.

I tried to give you some background information, because I gave you the benefit of the doubt, you said that you weren't having your day. But that was yesterday, and you are still lashing out. The way you are lashing out towards me, really says more about you than about me. You do have either a neurologcal disorder, like autism or something else or a personality disorder, which would make you neurotypical, but something is off with you, if you feel the need to lash out like that, got fired 37 times, suffer from depressions and got all kind of labels that you aren't willing to accept. It could also be borderline, borderline means that you are on the border of being neurotypical, it is the most severe psychological disorder that isn't neurological. Autism, bipolarity, epilepsy, ADHD, schizophrenia, dyslexia, learning disorders are all examples of neurological disorders, which makes people like us not neurotypical, we are called neurodiverse.

You were the one who was annoyed by me calling myself autistic and started to lecture about the broad sprectrum that autism is, as if I didn't know that. You wanted to know what I was exactly, while calling something an aspie trait, when I never used the word Aspie myself. Then after proclaiming that the autism spectrum is very broad, you did proclaim that it wasn't broad enough to include me. You acted all high and mighty as if you were some kind of expert on autism, but then you exposed yourself as a fraud, because you weren't even familiar with the word neurotypical. You tried to ridicule me with that. But I am the one that knows what I am talking about, you clearly aren't. Acting as if you know it all, is yet another narcistic trait. If you hadn't acted so ridiculous towards the word neurotypical, I would have taken you a lot more serious, but the moment you did that, you lost all credibility as a socalled expert.

This really has been a nice debate even if it has gone far beyond the original question.