We just moved into a 21yr old home. I replaced the receptacles in the 2nd and 3rd bedrooms up stairs. After replacing them, all the ones in bedroom 2 work fine. But, only one is working in bedroom 3.

As you walk into the room, to your left is the light switch and receptacle bow and to the side of that. That one is the only one that works. I have figured out that the wiring runs counter clockwise in this room. I did a continuity test with a volt meter from the first receptacle (that is working) to the next. I have discovered that I am not getting current through the black (hot) wire.

What I do not understand is how changing just the receptacles would cause a break. I have look, pulled, pushed and twisted the black wire in each receptacle box and can not find any breaks. All of the receptacles in rooms 2 and 3 are on one breaker. The breaker works and has never tripped. I have climbed up into attic and looked at wire and it looks fine, no signs of breaks or tears.

Any help of what could have happened and how to fix!!

Did the receptacles work before you replaced them?

Is there a ceiling light in this room?

You said you did a continuity check. I'm betting you mean you did a voltage check.

How were you able to determine that the circuit runs counter clockwise?
Assuming you mean counter clockwise when you are standing in the door and the working receptacle is to the left, that would mean that the working receptacle is the last in the circuit. That means power is passing through all the other receptacles to get to it.

Describe the wiring in each receptacle box.

1) Yes, the receptacles all worked before replacing them.2) Yes, there is a ceiling light that is ran from the light switch by the door. (It is also on a separate breaker.)3) I did both a voltage test and an Ohms (continuity) test. 4) Room layout... Walk into the room and it is open to the left and a wall to the right. The receptacle to the left of the door is the first outlet in that room. It is the only working one. It has four wires (2 black and 2 white plus the ground). Volt meter shows power coming into that outlet but it is not getting to the others. So, naming that as number 1 and going counter clockwise. 2nd outlet has fours wires. 3rd outlet has four wires. 4th outlet has four wires and 5th (last) outlet has two wires. (which tells me it is the last outlet of the circuit) So, I turned the breaker off and on outlet one I connected the black and white wire leading out (since I have established which wire is the hot coming in) to outlet number 2 and I checked the ohms (continuity) at outlet 2 and had none. I then connected the black and ground wire at outlet 1 and again checked it at outlet 2 and had none. I then connected the white and ground wires at number 1 and checked it at number 2 and had connection. So that told me I had a break or something in the black wire. I did the same test from outlet 2 to outlet 3 with the black and white wire and it works. So, I sure that the problem is from outlet 1 to outlet 2 and in the black wire.Harold, I hope this helps.

I then connected the white and ground wires at number 1 and checked it at number 2 and had connection

If that means you ran a neutral (white) and a ground (bare) from outlet 1 to outlet 2 and everything works, that would mean that there is a break in the neutral in the wall.
That in it self would be highly unusual.

First, note that the ground wire is for certain safety purposes. It is not part of the circuity. Next, note that when you do a voltage check you are measuring the difference in voltage between the hot conductor and a grounded (neutral) conductor. You are not measuring the voltage on the hot conductor. If the neutral is not grounded, you will get a reading of 0 even there is really 120 volts on the hot. When doing a voltage check, double check by doing a voltage check between the hot and the ground. A 0 reading between the hot and neutral and 120V between the hot and ground indicates a break in the neutral.

At times it is desirable to have one half of a duplex outlet hot all the time and have the other half controlled by a switch. That allows a lamp plugged into the switched half and be turned on and off by the switch. That is the reason I ask if there is a ceiling light.

To do that you separate the hot terminals by breaking tab between the two screws.

There is almost zero chance that you had a break in the neutral in the wall, at the same tine you decided to replace the outlets. I am willing to bet a pizza that someone screw up and broke the tab on the neutral side of an outlet. Then returned it and you had the misfortune to purchase it.

Check outlet number one to see if the tabs between the screws have been removed. Check both hot and neutral sides.
Better check outlet number two also.

I had already checked the tab on the side of the receptacle and it was still in tack. But, to take the receptacle out of the equation, I took it out and wired the black to black and white to white on outlet number 1. I turned the breaker back on and went to outlet number 2 and checked the voltage on both the black to ground and white to ground. Both shoed zero (0)

If I understand correctly

You have 120 volts black to white at outlet 1.
You connected black to black and white to white at outlet 1.
You have no voltage, black to white or black to ground at outlet 2.

What is on the other side of the wall? Could there be another outlet in a room on the other side of that wall?

That is correct. There is nothing on the other side of that wall. This is an upstairs bedroom. On the other side of that wall is open air to the downstairs living room.

You said that you went into the attic. Are there any wires on this circuit in the attic?


We just moved into a 21yr old home.
Are you sure that outlets 2, 3, 4 and 5 worked before you changed out the outlets.

Yes, I found the wire and looked at it. It looked fine. I did not see any signs of break, tears, rubs or anything else that would lead me to believe there was a break. The wire was under the blown in insulation and when I pushed the insulation back to inspect it, I did not see any signs of rodents…aka, mouse or rat droppings nor signs of squirrels being in there.

Also, Yes I’m sure they all worked before changing them out. We lived there two weeks before I got the chance to change them out. I changed them out because the old owners had painted over them and some were kind of loose when you plugged something in. Also, one had some of the plastic broken on it and I did not feel it safe to be exposed.

Can you describe the wires in the attic? Did any come down the wall where outlet 2 is?

The wire in the attic comes up the wall from outlet #1 and then crosses over at an angle over the ceiling joists and back down the wall where outlet #2 is at. It is hard to see or get to the point where the wire goes into the top of the wall at outlet #2 because of the angle of the roof. It is a small tight space.

45634

That's a little unusual. Most of the time an electrician would run the wires through the walls. Is the door between outlet 1 and outlet 2?

Suggest you disconnect all wires in outlet 1 and outlet 2, including the ground wires. Turn power on and do a voltage check between the black and white to determine the hot cable. Run a cable from outlet 1 to outlet 2 and connect to cable going to outlet 3.
Outlets 1, 3, 4, and 5 should then be working.

Then do a continuity check between the remaining black in outlet 1 and the remaining black in outlet 2. Then do the same for the white and then for the grounds. If you have continuity through any of the wires, the black, white or ground would confirm that you are working with then ends of the same cable.

I find it difficult to believe you have a broken wire. Almost impossible to have a broken cable unless you have run a saw through the wall.

Yes, there is a door between outlet #1 and #2. I just attached a diagram. I hope it helps to give you a visual of what the room looks like.
I did a voltage check on #1 and have already determined which wires are my hot ones coming in.

I agree Harold, It is strange. I only replaced outlets in this room. I have not done any sawing, drilling or nailing into the walls in this room either.

Can't see diagram. Click on Go Advanced (next to Post Quick answer), scroll down and click on Manage Attachments, browse and find file, Open and Upload. File has to be JPEG.

It will all make sense when we find out what is wrong. Just have to keep narrowing it down. If you are certain about which is hot cable in outlet 1 and which cable in outlet 2 goes to outlet 3, do the continuity check to confirm the the remaining two ends are the same cable.

45635

Is that a bath between the two bedrooms?

Okay, I did the continuity test. I did not have anything with the black wire but I did with the white wire.

Is that a bath between the rooms?

Yes

Is there a GFI outlet in the bath?

Yes... It is on a separate GFI breaker.

Press the reset button any way.

I have checked it. In fact I went through the whole house and checked every outlet with the volt meter just to make sure everything else was working.

You had continuity on the neutral (white). How about the ground?

Yes

Lights and everything in bath work?

Yes, everything else works.

Any lights in closet?

Yes, both closets have lights. In the bedroom in question, I made a small line on the diagram right next to the door into the room and another one next to the closet door to represent light switches. I have checked the light switch at the door and it has 6wires in it. 3 black and 3 white. I have traced those and one set in the incoming hot. One set is the out going to the light in the middle of the room and the 3rd set is the out going to the light switch to the closet. The closet light switch had 4 wires. The in coming black and white and the out going to the light in the closet.

We are getting desperate here. How many wires in the closet light fixture? What wires are connected to the closet light switch? Two blacks or a black and a white?

I haven't taken the fixture down. I will have to wait till tomorrow to check because child in that room is asleep now. I will check it tomorrow but my question would be, since the light switches are on a separate breaker and when I turn that breaker off it kills the lights. So since the outlets and lights switches are on separate breakers, would they be connected? The closet light switch is a black and white wire.

Let me clarify the wires, There is a black and white wire leading into the switch and a black and white wire leading out.

As I said we are getting desperate.


The closet light switch is a black and white wire.

The closet switch is a switch loop. In other words the power is taken to the light fixture box. Then a switch loop is taken to the switch. In the light fixture box you will find a hot and neutral. The neutral will be connected to the white of the fixture. The hot will be connected to the white going to the switch. The black of the switch cable will be connected to the black of the light fixture.
That means there should only be one cable (two wires, black and white) in the switch box.
However, you said there is two cables (four wires) in switch box.

If black and white are connected to switch, what are other wires connected to?

Just saw your latest post. Are two black wires connected to the switch?

That is correct, 4 wires at the switch.

Two black connected to switch and two white connect to switch.

No, only two wires connected to the switch. You should have two white wires connect together and two black wires connected to the switch. If that is correct, forget the switch loop thing. There would be only two wires in the closet light.

I will have to double check tomorrow. That might be correct because I do remember on the light switch for the main light had all three white wires commented together and the three black wires connected to the switch.

Double check everything and let me know. If everything you have told me is correct, the only thing left is a faulty black between outlet 1 and outlet two. Something that just doesn't make sense.

Good night

Okay, I checked the both light switches and the white wires are tied together and the black wires are connected to the switch, just like you said. The faulty black wire is what I had narrowed it to but I just find it hard to believe that it would have broken at the same time I replaced the outlets. I keep thinking that I have missed something.

I keep thinking that I have missed something.
I agree but I don't know what. I'm kind of stumped. Suggest rechecking every thing. Make sure that the GFI in the bath has not tripped. I know you said it was on a different circuit, but suppose some one did something screwy like coming out of the GFI to outlets 2,3,4 and 5. Then when you were replacing the outlets you could have tripped the GFI and never have known.

Go back to the attic and make sure that the line from outlet 1 simply goes across the attic and down to outlet 2.

I checked the bathroom and GFI not tripped, still have power. Checked the attic and line from outlet 1 comes up and crosses over to outlet 2.

Nothing that linen closet is there?

The linen closet does not have a light or anything in it.

If I remember correctly, you said earlier that you had continuity between the two ends of the whites and the two ends of the ground wires in outlet 1 and outlet 2. That you did not have continuity between the blacks.

If the boxes are metal and have a cable clamp remove the cable clamp. Plastic boxes will not have the cable clamp.

Then pull real hard on the black wire. If it is broken, it should be broken near the box. If it is broken it should pull out.

Grasp the bare end of the wire with pliers, not the insulation.

That is correct, no continuity between the black wires of outlet 1 and 2. The white and ground wires do have continuity.

The boxes are plastic.

I pulled on the black wire (the bare end) real hard at both outlet 1 and outlet 2 and it would not pull out.

I am at a loss. At this point I think I would first connect the black, white and ground wires together in each box of the cable between outlet 1 and outlet 2 . Making sure that I had the right cable. Then go up in the attic and cut the cable at some convenient point. Do a continuity check between the black and white, between the black and ground, and between the white and ground on each half of the cable. Assuming that there is a break in the black, that should tell you which half of the cable it is in. Hopefully, if you have to replace any part of cable, it will not be the half that is under low potion of the roof.

That is a good idea. And yeah, I agree. Hopefully the break will be in the first half that comes from outlet number 1.