If you a member of a religion but don't believe some of the things people in that religion are ''supposed'' to believe in.. are you still really part of that religion? Or are you sinful ? Or is it blasphemy or something? O.o

I just finished a terrific book titled The Wisdom Jesus : transforming heart and mind : a new perspective on Christ and his message by Cynthia Bourgeault, an Episcopalian priest. Here's a snippet from the book --

A lot of Christians believe "orthodox" means right belief. It's all about catechisms and creeds, believing the right things about Jesus, believing the way the church teaches you to believe. And yes, the word does etymologically derive from the Greek "ortho" (right) and "dokeo" (to think) -- or in other words, it means "right thinking."

But intuitively, I prefer to derive the "dox" part from the word "doxa" which means "glory" (as in "Glory be to the Father and to the Son and to the Holy Spirit, known as the doxology). Orthodox would then mean "right glory" (or "right praise") and while this may then be, well, "unorthodox, it does come a lot closer to conveying the spiritual ambience of most of non-Roman Christianity. Particularly for the Near East Christians, there was a strong sense that belief was not something that should be pinned down too tightly, like angels dancing on the head of a pin.

People come from all different backgrounds and all different levels of spiritual maturity, and belief will fluctuate accordingly. But what should properly hold the body of Christ together is "right praise," the ability to transcend all these differing viewpoints and in one voice (though maybe varied harmonies) offer glory and thanksgiving to the Master whose life transforms the human heart.

So, in answer to your question, no. In fact, if you asked each person in your church a bunch of questions about what they believe, you will probably not find two people who totally agree.

Our pastor one Sunday morning had the ushers pass out 3x5 cards to everyone. The pastor then asked us to write down why God was going to let us into His Heaven when we die. The responses were collected and read out loud. What people wrote down was amazingly unbiblical. The most popular answer was "Because I am a good person and deserve to go to Heaven."

It depends on the religion. Different ones have different approaches to problems like yours. We'll need more information about the denomination, what specific beliefs are giving you trouble, and if you don't believe it, why does that bother you so badly. Fill in some of the gaps and we'll see if we can help.

It depends on the religion. Different ones have different approaches to problems like yours. We'll need more information about the denomination, what specific beliefs are giving you trouble, and if you don't believe it, why does that bother you so badly. Fill in some of the gaps and we'll see if we can help.
Well I'm a catholic and there are things talked about in religion class, mass etc that stories like how Adam and Eve were there when the world was first created and how they ate apples- which led to original sin.. but I think that God let humans evolve and that they are just stories to teach lessons and things and that they aren't meant to be factual.. and I just didn't know if it is wrong in the catholic religion to think what I'm saying.. If that makes sense.. I'm kind of trying to understand my religion/beliefs etc.. thanks:)

May I ask how old you are?

may i ask how old you are?

16 :)

My father was a Lutheran pastor, so I grew up in a very conservative home. All the stories in the Bible were considered to be true, and a believer should never question anything.

Now I'm older than dirt and believe that the main lesson the Bible teaches us is about love. All the stories in the Bible are about God's love for His Creation, His children. People have problems and don't always do good things, but God forgives them and loves them anyway. And Jesus told us to have that same kind of love for each other -- to be kind to each other and be willing to forgive.

Are all the stories in the Bible true? I don't know, but that message of God's love and forgiveness is the most important thing to remember and to apply to your own life. (Plus, having learned all the Bible stories, I am a Bible trivia expert -- "Who was Seth?" and "Name Jacob's two wives" and "What was Luke's profession?" and "Who sat under a fig tree?")

With Catholic, it's hard to say what might or might not set them off. A lot depends on your own parish priest and how rigid he is about things like the literal Adam and Eve and all that. As far as I know, nobody has been accused of outright blasphemy for not believing it, but don't quote me on that because the emphasis there is on "as far as I know."

If you were to switch to a different denomination such as Methodist or Presbyterian, most churches wouldn't have a problem with you asking those questions.

Well i'm a catholic and there are things talked about in religion class, mass etc that stories like how Adam and Eve were there when the world was first created and how they ate apples- which led to original sin..but i think that God let humans evolve and that they are just stories to teach lessons and things and that they aren't meant to be factual..and I just didn't know if it is wrong in the catholic religion to think what i'm saying..? If that makes sense..i'm kind of trying to understand my religion/beliefs etc..thanks:)

Have you tried asking your questions in that religion class you are attending?

No it is not wrong in the Catholic religion to think what you're thinking. Catholicism has no objecftion to evolution and has long held that the Bible stories are not always literal. Anti-evolution and literalism is generally found among sections of Protestantism.

What level class are you in? Naturally, beginners are taught somewhat differently than more advanced students. That's true of religion and a host of other subjects.

Have you tried asking your questions in that religion class you are attending?

No it is not wrong in the Catholic religion to think what you're thinking. Catholicism has no objecftion to evolution and has long held that the Bible stories are not always literal. Anti-evolution and literalism is generally found among sections of Protestantism.

What level class are you in? Naturally, beginners are taught somewhat differently than more advanced students. That's true of religion and a host of other subjects.
I suppose I am a beginner-ish can you be too young to try and figure out things like this.. or is it just natural ?

I suppose I am a beginner-ish can you be too young to try and figure out things like this.. or is it just natural ?
It's natural. When we are young, we learn the basics of our religion and, like the Bible says, drink the "milk" -- take in and learn the easy-to-digest stuff. As we get older, we start eating the "meat" -- the more grown-up stuff and begin to digest them (understand them) in ways we didn't when we were still drinking the "milk."

I'm guessing this is true in most religions.

It's natural. When we are young, we learn the basics of our religion and, like the Bible says, drink the "milk" -- take in and learn the easy-to-digest stuff. As we get older, we start eating the "meat" -- the more grown-up stuff and begin to digest them (understand them) in ways we didn't when we were still drinking the "milk."

I just talked about this in the latest episode of Bible Insights. See the link in my signature.

</shamelessplug>

I suppose I am a beginner-ish can you be too young to try and figure out things like this.. or is it just natural ?

Not only is it natural, it's a good sign that you take important things seriously and question things.

Catholicism is an ancient religion (the first Christian religion) and it has a long tradition of examining things in an attempt to find truth. Some of the best minds of the last 2,000 years have wrestled with these issues that you find yourself thinking about today.

Let your conscience be your guide and you can't go wrong. Be wary of those who have all the answers. They probably don't.

God bless you.

Thanks for all the great answers everyone^.^

Catholicism is an ancient religion (the first Christian religion)

While not Catholic myself, I've seen this referenced a few times and Im interested as to why Catholics say they were the first 'group' of christians.
Im not having a go at anyone, I just wish to be enlightened.

While not Catholic myself, I've seen this referenced a few times and Im interested as to why Catholics say they were the first 'group' of christians.
Im not having a go at anyone, I just wish to be enlightened.
I'm not sure but I think it was the original one and then when people didn't agree with it they branched off and made new religions? I'm not sure though..

While not Catholic myself, I've seen this referenced a few times and Im interested as to why Catholics say they were the first 'group' of christians.
Im not having a go at anyone, I just wish to be enlightened.
Google "Timeline of the Christian Church" (without quotes) or similar keywords to find out how the Early Church evolved int the Catholic Church. Here's one article:

Timeline of the Catholic Church - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timeline_of_the_Catholic_Church)

The Protestant Reformation (the breakaway from the Catholic Church) didn't happen until the 1600s with Martin Luther and others paving the way.

But what about the early church in Acts? They didn't follow Catholic doctrine but shouldn't they be counted as the first group of christians?

But what about the early church in Acts? They didn't follow Catholic doctrine but shouldn't they be counted as the first group of christians?
The first Christians in the Early Church (Acts) were Jews. Doctrine hadn't been formally established yet. It was a very loose groups of churches. Catholic ("universal") doctrine came about as time went on and as the Church became more organized. Please read the link I provided earlier to see the timeline.

Yes I read the link but It kind of lost me after the death of John.


Doctrine hadn't been formally established yet

But what about the letters Paul wrote? For instance, the book of 1 Corinthians has a very good outline on church doctrine. Why would Paul teach that church to conduct themselves in what he said in that letter if it was going to be changed?

Yes I read the link but It kind of lost me after the death of John.



But what about the letters Paul wrote? For instance, the book of 1 Corinthians has a very good outline on church doctrine. Why would Paul teach that church to conduct themselves in what he said in that letter if it was going to be changed?

It would help if you could say specifically what you are referring to.

Well for instance Paul talks a lot in 1 corinth 14:22- 40 about how spiritual gifts should be conducted correctly in a meeting/service. Making reference that they should be used by a group of christains when they come together and the correct way it should be done.
So why would Paul tell the church in Corinth to utilise a spiritual gift like prophesy or tounges if doctrine towards that was going to be changed? Wouldn't that make Paul's advice to that church redundant?

WSo why would Paul tell the church in Corinth to utilise a spiritual gift like prophesy or tounges if doctrine towards that was going to be changed? Wouldn't that make Paul's advice to that church redundant?
How has it been changed?

Gifts of the Spirit have not changed.

But what about the early church in Acts? They didn't follow Catholic doctrine but shouldn't they be counted as the first group of christians?

That's a great point. Whenever someone claims they belong to the purest and most true aspect of the Christian church I usually say "how do you compare to the first church?" I might also add that the modern Catholic church is one of the denominations furthest from what the first church looked like. I don't mean that to be offensive to anyone and I know many Catholics that absolutely love God.

We have to look at just about anything that comes out of the Corinthian letters through a lens of suspicion. Both letters were written because that particular church just couldn't seem to figure out how to do this stuff right, and they were getting into fights, snubbing poor people, condoning borderline incest and all the rest. Paul had to write to them and rip them a new one because they were such a mess. So everything in 1 Corinthians especially is written specifically to that one church, to address the stupid things they were doing. How much of those writings also extend to other churches, i.e. Us? Ah, there's the big question. But with Corinthians, be aware that it's always a little iffy.

How has it been changed?

Well if your saying Catholic doctrine is universal/first group of christians from the early church how come Catholics don't utilise spiritual gifts like this?

Well if your saying Catholic doctrine is universal/first group of christians from the early church how come Catholics don't utilise spiritual gifts like this?
Like what? They do.

Did you read what dwashbur had said about I Corinthinians and the Corinthian church -- and why Paul had sent them that epistle?

Like what? They do.

Roman Catholics don't pray in tounges, have them interpreted or make any prophesys at a mass.

Actually, believe it or not the Gifts of the Spitit do function in the Catholic church... even tongues. But this is not the norm. The Holy Spirit transcends denominational walls... He is looking for hungry and willing individuals.

Roman Catholics don't pray in tounges, have them interpreted or make any prophesys at a mass.
What HH said for "regular" Catholic churches, and there are Charismatic Catholic churches too that are more emotional and Pentecostal-ish..

Oh, and there are 12 gifts of the Spirit -- lots more than what you named. The Catholic Church values all of them.

What HH said for "regular" Catholic churches, and there are Charismatic Catholic churches too that are more emotional and Pentecostal-ish..

Oh, and there are 12 gifts of the Spirit -- lots more than what you named. The Catholic Church values all of them.

(I tried to give you a greenie - wouldn't let me).

It's always heartening to see a Protestant (Lutheran here) writing the truth about the Catholic Church. So many non-Catholics are misinformed about Catholicism that even a single accurate post may shed some light toward mutual understanding.

Thank you, Wondergirl.

As far as I'm concerned, the best religion is the one that gives you the most life flexibility. Ones that tell me every little point I have to believe, every little thing I had to do, how I have to dress, how I have to talk, or tell me I have to do X, Y or Z in order to be one of the elite tend to do more harm than good in the long run. That's why I have a bone to pick with most Christian denominations, because if Jesus could see all the legalistic junk that's being done in his name, and forced on people in his name, I suspect he'd say it's time for another temple cleansing and beat the daylights out of all of us.

Here's one for you, Athos. This man was my pastor until I moved too far away, and I still follow him on Facebook because he's constantly putting out amazing stuff like this.

Catholics Aren't Christian | Northwest Leader - Brian Dolleman (http://www.northwestleader.com/3599/catholics-arent-christian/)