Hi, I have a 10 week old shepherd puppy that insists on peeing her crate. We started her young in a large plastic pen with a litter tray and she was going very well, but started peeing outside the litter tray where it would go to the bottom of the tray and smell really bad. So we decided to crate train her to go outside. She has a large metal crate because she is large, and I put her food/water outside on the open patio to give to her at least 4 times a day. The large door to the crate I have facing out the patio door, so in essence to cover the patio door from her getting into the house to piss, but not preventing her from going into the crate to see us and be inside the house 3 feet or so (length of the large crate). Well, she is screaming, running back and forth, and will go and play, we go outside and play with her, she eats, etc... and then runs back into the crate and does her stuff! I tried washing it good with soap and putting her food/water there to possibly discourage her from soiling inside of it, to which she eats, drinks, screams because she can't run around in the house and then goes ty poopy, piss in it! We take her for rides with us most of the time, she has plenty of toys, gets lots of attention so I'm not sure what else to do. Right now, I took her plastic big pen outside, on the side of the patio and put her in it hoping that she will GO on the grass/dirt. Any other suggestions would be appreciated and NO, she is not an abused, unloved puppy, I believe we may have spoiled her too much and now must deal with the consequences as best as we can.

I'm not sure if I'm understand this.

You bought a crate to block off the door so she'd be forced to stay outside?

This isn't crate training. Crate training means putting your dog in the crate overnight, or when you leave. The crate should be in your home, preferably in your room, and only to be used when it's bed time or you go to work, or leave the dog at home.

At 10 weeks of age the dog should not be in the crate, during the day, for more than 2 hours at a time.

To potty train you must be with your dog. Take the dog outside, use a potty word, wait until the dog potties, praise, and then take inside. Most dogs aren't reliable with pottying until they're 4 months of age. At 10 weeks this is still a very young puppy, and she cannot be expected to fully potty outdoors, especially since she's not receiving any training, instead she's being confused.

Remember that a dog doesn't know what human being expect. They don't know that pottying inside is not okay. They have to be taught. In order to do that you will have to put in the time and effort. You cannot just leave him outside and hope that he figures it out.

This isn't a matter of spoiling. It's a matter of poor training. This part of your post says it all;


I took her plastic big pen outside, on the side of the patio and put her in it hoping that she will GO on the grass/dirt.

This is not something that the dog will figure out on its own. You have to become involved. Yes, it takes time, and effort, and it may be an inconvenience, but that's what having a puppy entails.

Thank you kindly for your reply, but I have taken care of the issue. I do apologize for not explaining myself correctly. The only option we really have right now is to let her be outside most of the time, where we can still put on her leash and walk around the yard,play with her, go for rides, etc. and she can get used to the grass and using it. If we allow her back in to continue where she was before (using her litter tray and peeing all over the floor because it's what she likes), she will grow into something large very quickly, that we have no control over and we don't want that for her or us. At least her pen setup outside, on grass right on the side of the patio floor, so she is close to us. I think we can get a better handle on teaching her where she suppose to go if she is already there!

We're going to try what we can to work with her and even bring her in for short 5-10 minute visits inside and if she pees/poops, we'll say NO, and take her outside right away. Once we get the potty down, she won't be outside anymore unless it's with us to play,etc... I feel really bad about this, as we love this BIG puppy, she is almost 20 pounds at 10 weeks of age! But we need to keep some kind of control over her and not let her get away with running amok or she could turn into something else.
Thanks!

No, you don't have a handle on this, not at all.

I'm sorry, but you don't seem to understand.

First, keeping a 10 week old puppy outside 24/7 is not okay. You knew when you got her that she'd be a big breed, why didn't you learn how to train her before you brought her home.

What you're doing won't work, because she's not learning to go outside, she's going outside only because that's where she's living. Once you bring her indoors, when she's older, she'll continue peeing inside because she was never properly potty trained. Also, she'll have social issues because she's not being properly socialized. The longer she's being sequestered outside away from the family, the worse she'll get, until she's too old to easily correct the behavior.

If you can't control her, can't train her, refuse to let her be a part of your family, which is critical at this age, then please find her a new home, one that's willing to put in the time, the effort and suffer the inconvenience of having a puppy.

I mean no disrespect by saying this, but it's very obvious that you're not cut out to care properly for this dog.

No, you don't have a handle on this, not at all.

I'm sorry, but you don't seem to understand.

First, keeping a 10 week old puppy outside 24/7 is not okay. You knew when you got her that she'd be a big breed, why didn't you learn how to train her before you brought her home

What you're doing won't work, because she's not learning to go outside, she's going outside only because that's where she's living. Once you bring her indoors, when she's older, she'll continue peeing inside because she was never properly potty trained. Also, she'll have social issues because she's not being properly socialized. The longer she's being sequestered outside away from the family, the worse she'll get, until she's too old to easily correct the behavior.

If you can't control her, can't train her, refuse to let her be a part of your family, which is critical at this age, then please find her a new home, one that's willing to put in the time, the effort and suffer the inconvenience of having a puppy.

I mean no disrespect by saying this, but it's very obvious that you're not cut out to care properly for this dog.

No to disrespect to you either friend, but I came here to ask for solutions, not to be told that I'm not cut out to properly care for a dog. Now, if you possibly have a good potty training method that I could possibly implement, I could do that. This has nothing to do with abandoning the pup outside 24/7 and I am aware that people do this. Even people who work for a living don't have all day to train a pup. Some work for 8 hrs. and then come home and want to rest for a couple more, so 10-12 hrs. a day, the animal is without anyone. I chose not to do that, and my daughter and I are home with her all the time. No where have I seen or heard of anyone leaving a pup to roam the house. Indoors, she is in the large pen when not being picked up, when not going for rides, when not being taken outdoors, etc.

For you to assume because I really don't know what to do and came here for help, that I am not fit for a dog is silly! Has it ever crossed your mind that if I did not care and if I were truly not seeking guidance, I most likely would not have bothered asking?

The man that sold her to us, did so at ALMOST a month old... wayyyyyy too young, but he was getting rid of them so we took her. She would sleep in a little box on our bed so she could hear us and smell our scent soshe knew she was not alone. Once she got too big for that, we bought the large pretty white fenced pen for her and my daughter sleep in the living room to be close to her. She has had her pen since, but just recently has decided that it's easier for her to continue pissing on the floor instead of the tub we got for her. She's extremely smart, and willful, she will knock her dishes around until you come and fill them up! We stopped catering to her for doing that and instead when she did it, we took away the stoneware and got her to sit first and then we would put down her bowls. She's got this down great and will now sit and wait until we give her her food! But the potty stuff, she is fighting us since it's easier to just bend and piss. The tile in that area can only take so much and we are still trying to fix this issue.

Since you told me it's not good for her to be left outside, I;m bringing her back in. I'll let her eat and play a bit more (maybe to poop/pee) then bring her inside to sleep in the crate with her blankey and allow her to scream until she is content!

So, yes, I guess we are just terrible people who should never have a dog. Inconvenience? Are you serious? Life is an inconvenience at times, and you don't just give up and die do you? LOL When we got her, we knew we were in this for the long haul, but it doesn't mean we would have a perfectly behaved puppy either or that we won't need guidance at times to help us to do what is best for her and so that we don't have to lose our minds over it. Considering the fact that she was taken so young from her siblings, because the breeder couldn't handle such a large litter of 10 puppies, I'd have to say we did very good and she is a gorgeous, healthy girl. So yeah, fooey on you for saying that :- )

we started her young in a large plastic pen with a litter tray

That was your first mistake. You never have a puppy learn that its OK to potty in the place where it sleeps and/or eats.


she was going very well, but started peeing outside the litter tray where it would go to the bottom of the tray and smell really bad.

Than clean it.. with an enzyme based cleaner. Besides that, puppy urine is not very smelly. It's that way for a reason.. survival. So if you were smelling something from her litter pan.. than you apparently never cleaned.


She has a large metal crate because she is large, and I put her food/water outside on the open patio to give to her at least 4 times a day.

A large crate is the wrong choice. Puppies having a hard time house training should actually be put in a smaller crate to enforce a clean environment. Maybe I'm reading this wrong, but you are giving her outside time 4 times a day? Hmmm.. Puppies at 10wks need to go out almost twice an hour every hour.


I tried washing it good with soap and putting her food/water there to possibly discourage her from soiling inside of it, to which she eats, drinks, screams because she can't run around in the house and then goes ty poopy, piss in it!

YOU created this.. You taught her its OK to potty in a crate, potty in her bed and so on. Soap and water doesn't cut it when it comes to urine and feces. You need a special soap, enzyme based soap that will KILL the smell of urine and feces. She is screaming because you are separating her from your family. She is being banished to an outdoor life because you are failing at house training a puppy. She is acting out like this because she 1. probably has developed separation anxiety due to you obtaining her at a young age, and 2. grasping for any attention you are giving her.


Some work for 8 hrs. and then come home and want to rest for a couple more, so 10-12 hrs

These people shouldn't even own a cat. You do not purchase an animal to just exist and be apart of your life when its convenient to you. If you cannot outdo the 10-12'ers.. than you also shouldn't own a puppy that needs more than normal attention. Puppies obtained at an age less than 8wks need at lot of extra care. Giving them food and looking at it is doing that dog more wrong than good. You have to actually take over as the mother dog as much as possible. I know you wanted to do right by this dog, but from what you're writing.. you're going to create a horrible dog that NO ONE wants to deal with.


So, yes, I guess we are just terrible people who should never have a dog.

I don't think you're a terrible person. I also don't think you shouldnt' own animals.. maybe you should have tried to do house training with a normal puppy instead of an emotionally disrupt puppy. These dogs are tough.. they are very tough.. People with excellent behavior skills have problems with puppies that left the litter too early.

This puppy can be house trained. You just need to buckle down and do it. Its extremely hard... its frustrating and irritating and sometimes you wish you could just lock them up outside.. Purchase a smaller crate.. It should be big enough she can turn around and lay down.. that's it.. Get her on a feeding schedule. She only needs to eat twice a day at probably 2 cups each feeding. No snacks, treats or canned food. Limit her water intake. Give her several drinks throughout the day, never let her have free access to water. Free access to food and water makes even the easiest puppies hard to house train.

At first.. tie her to you. Give her no freedoms. Not only will you know what her signals are when she needs to pee, but you can scoop her up immediately and go outside.

NEVER let your puppy see you clean up in the house. Have her come out and watch you clean up her piles in the backyard. Maybe for a few months, leave some poo piles in your yard.. a constant reminder that she needs to go outside. If she potties in the house.. correct her with a harsh "eh-eh" or "no" and take her outside. While outside, become a statue and just repeat the command "go potty" If she doesn't go potty, she comes inside and goes straight into her crate. Try it again outside in about 15-20 minutes.

House training is more than just training them to go outside. You're also training their bladder and sphincter muscles to hold it all in.

Puppies pee and poop a lot.. The amount you feed doubles on the way out.. Be prepared for that. This puppy is ONLY 10wks old. Most puppies aren't even remotely house trained until 5-6 months. And I know it seems like she should know better due to how long you've owned her.. but you need to remember she is just a baby.

That was your first mistake. You never have a puppy learn that its ok to potty in the place where it sleeps and/or eats.



Than clean it.. with an enzyme based cleaner. Besides that, puppy urine is not very smelly. Its that way for a reason.. survival. So if you were smelling something from her litter pan.. than you apparently never cleaned.



A large crate is the wrong choice. Puppies having a hard time house training should actually be put in a smaller crate to enforce a clean environment. Maybe I'm reading this wrong, but you are giving her outside time 4 times a day? Hmmm.. Puppies at 10wks need to go out almost twice an hour every hour.



YOU created this.. You taught her its ok to potty in a crate, potty in her bed and so on. Soap and water doesnt cut it when it comes to urine and feces. You need a special soap, enzyme based soap that will KILL the smell of urine and feces. She is screaming because you are separating her from your family. She is being banished to an outdoor life because you are failing at house training a puppy. She is acting out like this because she 1. probably has developed separation anxiety due to you obtaining her at a young age, and 2. grasping for any attention you are giving her.



These people shouldn't even own a cat. You do not purchase an animal to just exist and be apart of your life when its convenient to you. If you cannot outdo the 10-12'ers.. than you also shouldn't own a puppy that needs more than normal attention. Puppies obtained at an age less than 8wks need at lot of extra care. Giving them food and looking at it is doing that dog more wrong than good. You have to actually take over as the mother dog as much as possible. I know you wanted to do right by this dog, but from what you're writing.. you're going to create a horrible dog that NO ONE wants to deal with.



I dont think you're a terrible person. I also dont think you shouldnt' own animals.. maybe you should have tried to do house training with a normal puppy instead of an emotionally disrupt puppy. These dogs are tough.. they are very tough.. People with excellent behavior skills have problems with puppies that left the litter too early.

This puppy can be house trained. You just need to buckle down and do it. Its extremely hard... its frustrating and irritating and sometimes you wish you could just lock them up outside.. Purchase a smaller crate.. It should be big enough she can turn around and lay down.. thats it.. Get her on a feeding schedule. She only needs to eat twice a day at probably 2 cups each feeding. No snacks, treats or canned food. Limit her water intake. Give her several drinks throughout the day, never let her have free access to water. Free access to food and water makes even the easiest puppies hard to house train.

At first.. tie her to you. Give her no freedoms. Not only will you know what her signals are when she needs to pee, but you can scoop her up immediately and go outside.

NEVER let your puppy see you clean up in the house. Have her come out and watch you clean up her piles in the backyard. Maybe for a few months, leave some poo piles in your yard.. a constant reminder that she needs to go outside. If she potties in the house.. correct her with a harsh "eh-eh" or "no" and take her outside. While outside, become a statue and just repeat the command "go potty" If she doesnt go potty, she comes inside and goes straight into her crate. Try it again outside in about 15-20 minutes.

House training is more than just training them to go outside. You're also training their bladder and sphincter muscles to hold it all in.

Puppies pee and poop a lot.. The amount you feed doubles on the way out.. Be prepared for that. This puppy is ONLY 10wks old. most puppies arent even remotely house trained until 5-6 months. And I know it seems like she should know better due to how long you've owned her.. but you need to remember she is just a baby.

Thank you :- ) will do and come back with good news... at least I'm hopeful.

You are doing your best and aren't a thoughtless, uncaring owner. Advice here can be like boot camp, tough. Learn from it without taking it personally.
Pets aren't taught the same way human children are. They need simple, direct, and consistent directions. And they need to know that you are alpha dog.
Pets aim to please for the most part, even if they are willful about certain things. If they aren't doing what the owner wants, it's a reflection on the owner, who needs training on how to train.
I'm sure your puppy's confusion over the mistake in what crate training is all about will be solved soon with enough patience and work on your part.
One way to ease the burden of house cleaning smelly spots is to close off most of the house to the pup for now.

So, yes, I guess we are just terrible people who should never have a dog. Inconvenience? Are you serious? Life is an inconvenience at times, and you don't just give up and die do you? LOL When we got her, we knew we were in this for the long haul, but it doesn't mean we would have a perfectly behaved puppy either or that we won't need guidance at times to help us to do what is best for her and so that we don't have to lose our minds over it.


I can't decide what is more offensive - the "LOL" teen-age text OR the passive/aggressive "... we are just terrible people."

If the only answers you want are the answers you agree with, ask your friends.

If you want advice from trained experts, post on AMHD.

Is the moon full?

If she potties in the house.. correct her with a harsh "eh-eh" or "no" and take her outside. While outside, become a statue and just repeat the command "go potty" If she doesnt go potty, she comes inside and goes straight into her crate. Try it again outside in about 15-20 minutes.

I agree with what Lucky and Alty have said.

My addition to what Lucky said: Correct her only if you catch her in the act of starting to or going potty. If you find a mess later and scold her, she won't know what you are upset about. If you find a mess, take her outside and tell her to 'go potty' (or whatever your command is.) Make it a team effort if possible and have your daughter watch her (and praise her when she goes) while you make certain the area is clean. (As for letting her see you clean up, I can tell you a cute story about a Doberman who had an accident and tried to clean it up herself. I was glad it was only pee.)

Understand that it may take a half an hour or more for her to potty so don't give her five minutes and then come back inside. Separate play time from potty time. She should learn that a bathroom break is just that a time to go potty. Attention and play come after she uses the bathroom. After rides and walks (or any stimulating exercise/play), make certain you are giving her time to potty before going inside or take her in the front door then immediately out the backdoor to potty.

The 'umbilical' method that Lucky is talking about uses a leash that is long enough for the dog to lie down and stay out from under your feet as you move around but not long enough to be able to do 'her own thing.'

Dogs are very much like children when it comes to training. Adults have expectations and they teach their children the behaviors they want them to show. Children learn a lot through interacting with their parents. Dogs learn through interacting with their humans. A lot lessons are learned without a word being said. Every thing you do teaches the dog what is expected and allowed or not allowed.

It not too early to teach her obedience commands. Best way to teach is through play and every day interaction. If she is jumping up and over-excited, back off and don't give her attention until she settles down for a few seconds. Then calmly praise her. She will quickly learn how to behave. When you take her outside to play, tell her 'play time'. When playing tell her to sit and when she does give her a toy and praise. When she gives it to you give her the command for 'give'. To her it isn't a 'command', yet. By keeping your words and actions constant, she will learn what you want.

Make certain that everyone in the house (and visitors) use the same commands for the same action. Such as decide on the word you want to use to get her to lie down and have everyone use that word. People using different words for the same action or the same word for different actions are as confusing to her as this sentence may be to you.

I am not certain what you mean by 'litter tray' or 'tub', but it sounds like you are referring to cat litter boxes. Most dog breeds are too big even as puppies for litter boxes so it is no surprise she was using the bathroom where you didn't want her to go.

Marilyn, you are a genius! Luna... named after the moon, is doing great! We put her in the crate last night, allowed her to throw her fits, and she settled down for the night and slept until almost 7 this morning. She had peed in the crate (which was a cinch to clean up rather than the tiles) if anything, maybe once, and followed me outside on her leash unwillingly for the first time,only to understand that she is to stay very close to me, and so WE went to the grassed area, told her "go potty", and she went pee/poo with no issues! I must admit, I made a big issue of it and praised her for such a great job! We stayed outside for a while, maybe 40 minutes just walking around and getting her used to the leash, she ate/drank, and to tire her out a bit for the crate.

Coming in to the house, I told her to sit at the door, she did and held her leash behind me so I could come in first and then her. I led her to her crate and in she went, cried just a few this time and then went off to sleep. I noticed that if she can see us, she's fine and feels secure. I'm not leaving her in the crate very long though like you mentioned. Overall, I am thrilled to see a dramatic improvement in such a short amount of time. She is much happier and so is our family! If you can recommend an excellent book that would be great! Thank you soooooo much! I'll ignore the rest of you that have nothing better to do than to criticize or have something stupid to say about a family who loves their puppy, but are not very familiar on how to train her and train themselves to keep it all going well for them and their pet. Get a life! Learn to be kind to others. Stop being a thorn in the flesh to somebody else and be something you want to see more of. You know who you are!

Here's a pic of Luna Ariel, but not sure if I added it correctly.
41192




That was your first mistake. You never have a puppy learn that its ok to potty in the place where it sleeps and/or eats.



Than clean it.. with an enzyme based cleaner. Besides that, puppy urine is not very smelly. Its that way for a reason.. survival. So if you were smelling something from her litter pan.. than you apparently never cleaned.



A large crate is the wrong choice. Puppies having a hard time house training should actually be put in a smaller crate to enforce a clean environment. Maybe I'm reading this wrong, but you are giving her outside time 4 times a day? Hmmm.. Puppies at 10wks need to go out almost twice an hour every hour.



YOU created this.. You taught her its ok to potty in a crate, potty in her bed and so on. Soap and water doesnt cut it when it comes to urine and feces. You need a special soap, enzyme based soap that will KILL the smell of urine and feces. She is screaming because you are separating her from your family. She is being banished to an outdoor life because you are failing at house training a puppy. She is acting out like this because she 1. probably has developed separation anxiety due to you obtaining her at a young age, and 2. grasping for any attention you are giving her.



These people shouldn't even own a cat. You do not purchase an animal to just exist and be apart of your life when its convenient to you. If you cannot outdo the 10-12'ers.. than you also shouldn't own a puppy that needs more than normal attention. Puppies obtained at an age less than 8wks need at lot of extra care. Giving them food and looking at it is doing that dog more wrong than good. You have to actually take over as the mother dog as much as possible. I know you wanted to do right by this dog, but from what you're writing.. you're going to create a horrible dog that NO ONE wants to deal with.



I dont think you're a terrible person. I also dont think you shouldnt' own animals.. maybe you should have tried to do house training with a normal puppy instead of an emotionally disrupt puppy. These dogs are tough.. they are very tough.. People with excellent behavior skills have problems with puppies that left the litter too early.

This puppy can be house trained. You just need to buckle down and do it. Its extremely hard... its frustrating and irritating and sometimes you wish you could just lock them up outside.. Purchase a smaller crate.. It should be big enough she can turn around and lay down.. thats it.. Get her on a feeding schedule. She only needs to eat twice a day at probably 2 cups each feeding. No snacks, treats or canned food. Limit her water intake. Give her several drinks throughout the day, never let her have free access to water. Free access to food and water makes even the easiest puppies hard to house train.

At first.. tie her to you. Give her no freedoms. Not only will you know what her signals are when she needs to pee, but you can scoop her up immediately and go outside.

NEVER let your puppy see you clean up in the house. Have her come out and watch you clean up her piles in the backyard. Maybe for a few months, leave some poo piles in your yard.. a constant reminder that she needs to go outside. If she potties in the house.. correct her with a harsh "eh-eh" or "no" and take her outside. While outside, become a statue and just repeat the command "go potty" If she doesnt go potty, she comes inside and goes straight into her crate. Try it again outside in about 15-20 minutes.

House training is more than just training them to go outside. You're also training their bladder and sphincter muscles to hold it all in.

Puppies pee and poop a lot.. The amount you feed doubles on the way out.. Be prepared for that. This puppy is ONLY 10wks old. most puppies arent even remotely house trained until 5-6 months. And I know it seems like she should know better due to how long you've owned her.. but you need to remember she is just a baby.

[QUOTE=virginiarey;3255379]Marilyn, you are a genius!"


Who is Marilyn?

Love the photo - looks a lot like my GSD when she was a puppy. As she's gotten older she has a lot more beige than black.

Great looking dog.

Thanks Judy... Marilyn is the one who told me about the large crate, the problem of having her in with her water/food/and tub all together in the pen. Before I just free fed and gave her water all day long whenever something was empty. Not anymore and the we are all doing good now! Marilyn helped me to solve the issues and quickly! Was nice getting some constructive criticism instead of telling me I wasn't fit to have a dog. I know we are an exceptional family and are trying our best to raise this pup without knowledge of how to, but are willing to learn to. We try our best with everything this pup needs, even the best of spring water and Blue Wilderness for her. So I did find some of the posts offensive since they don't know me, but I also got some very important posts and encouragement that I needed to not give up.

So, overall, it's been a good experience here posting. We just got to remember that we don't know most of these people here, so be a bit more kinder. Could be that some here are into rescuing animals and why their reactions are so defensive. Hopefully we keep this area open and continue helping those who are truly searching, like I was.

Thanks!


[QUOTE=virginiarey;3255379]Marilyn, you are a genius!"


Who is Marilyn?

Love the photo - looks a lot like my GSD when she was a puppy. As she's gotten older she has a lot more beige than black.

Great looking dog.

Thanks Judy................Marilyn is the one who told me about the large crate, the problem of having her in with her water/food/and tub all together in the pen. Before I just free fed and gave her water all day long whenever something was empty. Not anymore and the we are all doing good now! Marilyn helped me to solve the issues and quickly! Was nice getting some constructive criticism instead of telling me I wasn't fit to have a dog. I know we are an exceptional family and are trying our best to raise this pup without knowledge of how to, but are willing to learn to. We try our best with everything this pup needs, even the best of spring water and Blue Wilderness for her. So I did find some of the posts offensive since they don't know me, but I also got some very important posts and encouragement that I needed to not give up.

So, overall, it's been a good experience here posting. We just gotta remember that we don't know most of these people here, so be a bit more kinder. Could be that some here are into rescuing animals and why their reactions are so defensive. Hopefully we keep this area open and continue helping those who are truly searching, like I was.

Thanks!

[QUOTE=JudyKayTee;3255383]


I can't speak for anyone else, but you wouldn't believe the questions people post, you truly wouldn't. Sometimes the urge to reach through the monitor and strangle someone is overwhelming. And people change their story - a recent classic is a woman whose dog was jumping on her (as I recall) so she put it outside to live. When that was criticized (it wasn't being social so she took it where it would see pretty much nobody and interact with nobody) the story changed to she didn't really put it outside and, if she did (?), the dog preferred the outside. After a while...

And, yes, a lot of us are involved in rescue.

I hope you stick around. I've had GSDs all my life and find them to be loyal, smart as whips and headstrong. My puppy (I have all rescues) is a GSD/Rott mix. He's no dummy.

OMGosh, your doggies are beautiful Judy! That little one "looks" like a handful! Yes, shepherds are quite intelligent, but I think their loyalty is their weakness in that this makes them to want us to be happy too, so we can use this to teach them :- ) So far, things have been quite good today.

If tonight she makes a potty in the crate by some chance, it's not hard cleaning it off the crate floor... on the other hand, before seeing the light that Marilyn gave me on this, it was terrible!
The pee was seeping into the cracks of the tiles for some time before I knew this was even happening, so it never really got cleaned. The tray she was using was a large mixing cement tub they sold at Home depot, but what I didn't know was that she was peeing on the tile and it would be dried by morning. I didn't catch it until the day I decided to check what the hell smelled so bad arou d her area since it looked clean. It smelled the whole house, like rotten filth or dead something, and so I moved EVERYTHING out of her pen to mop the whole floor in her area, not just the area that could be seen, and voilà! Moved the tub completely to see that at least a pint or two of urine had been vegetating and permeating the tiles under there and I just about gagged! I didn't use enzymes then, but I did have odoban/soap to kill the smell, and had been mopping, sweeping and down on my knees from then on trying to keep a lid on it. A small amount of pee from her, would automatically release the crackin again! So it was terrible and I was regretting ever having gotten a pup. I couldn't just give up on her though, so I cam here in desperation and most likely didn't know what the hell I said either or made much sense :- ) Knowing that the steps I am now using was all that was needed to start and make a HUGE difference, is just amazing!

And yes, I will be visiting this place again... if just to read some of those incredible stories you mentioned, where you have no access to reach out and kill, oops, I meant touch someone :- )


[QUOTE=virginiarey;3255422]Thanks Judy................Marilyn is the one who told me about the large crate, the problem of having her in with her water/food/and tub all together in the pen. Before I just free fed and gave her water all day long whenever something was empty. Not anymore and the we are all doing good now! Marilyn helped me to solve the issues and quickly! Was nice getting some constructive criticism instead of telling me I wasn't fit to have a dog. I know we are an exceptional family and are trying our best to raise this pup without knowledge of how to, but are willing to learn to. We try our best with everything this pup needs, even the best of spring water and Blue Wilderness for her. So I did find some of the posts offensive since they don't know me, but I also got some very important posts and encouragement that I needed to not give up.

So, overall, it's been a good experience here posting. We just gotta remember that we don't know most of these people here, so be a bit more kinder. Could be that some here are into rescuing animals and why their reactions are so defensive. Hopefully we keep this area open and continue helping those who are truly searching, like I was.

Thanks!




I can't speak for anyone else, but you wouldn't believe the questions people post, you truly wouldn't. Sometimes the urge to reach through the monitor and strangle someone is overwhelming. And people change their story - a recent classic is a woman whose dog was jumping on her (as I recall) so she put it outside to live. When that was criticized (it wasn't being social so she took it where it would see pretty much nobody and interact with nobody) the story changed to she didn't really put it outside and, if she did (?), the dog preferred the outside. After a while ...

And, yes, a lot of us are involved in rescue.

I hope you stick around. I've had GSDs all my life and find them to be loyal, smart as whips and headstrong. My puppy (I have all rescues) is a GSD/Rott mix. He's no dummy.

And yes, I will be visiting this place again.....if just to read some of those incredible stories you mentioned, where you have no access to reach out and kill, oops, I meant touch someone :- )]


Laughing - and, yes, we've all been there with "I wouldn't believe what he/she just did" stories. I do think dog urine could be the USA's next line of defense. Collect it and then draw a line all around the country with it.

No to disrespect to you either friend, but I came here to ask for solutions, not to be told that I'm not cut out to properly care for a dog. Now, if you possibly have a good potty training method that I could possibly implement, I could do that.

I gave you a solution. I gave you step by step instructions on how to potty train. You either didn't want to hear it, because it was too much work, or you didn't read it.

I'm glad things are working out now, amazing, overnight potty training for a 10 week old puppy. Highly doubtful.

I'll remove myself from this thread since nothing I say seems to sink in.

Good luck.

I gave you a solution. I gave you step by step instructions on how to potty train. You either didn't want to hear it, because it was too much work, or you didn't read it.

I'm glad things are working out now, amazing, overnight potty training for a 10 week old puppy. Highly doubtful.

I'll remove myself from this thread since nothing I say seems to sink in.

Good luck.

Excuse me, but you have nothing to say about the cutest, smartest, best looking dogs in the World?

I'm confused.. who is Marilyn?

Could it be that is coming from your signature? The quote by Marilyn Monroe?

Excuse me, but you have nothing to say about the cutest, smartest, best looking dogs in the World?

I do, that is a good looking shepherd. And the puppy, well, he just looks like mischief wrapped in a fur coat, too stinking cute.

Could it be that is coming from your signature? the quote by Marilyn Monroe?

Lmao! Wow.. never put those two together...

Lmao! Wow.. never put those two together...

Took me a while too, but that's got to be it, just try to remember to watch the vents or whatever when you're going down the street there Marilyn.

Virginiarey,

I'm glad everything is working out for you. As for advising a good book about potty training.. I'm not really sure. I learned all my puppy training/house training via the book of hard knocks ;) You could try checking out any of the "for dummie" books.. they're very informative and explain things well. Go to your local pet store and see what they have available

Now that you have her going in the right direction, stick to your schedule. Things typically get worse before they get better. It wouldn't be a bad idea to start her in obedience training either. Not only will it give you a structured learning environment, but it will also start her down the road of socializing.

Please keep us updated :)

Beautiful pup, by the way... GSD's are smart dogs! She'll catch on faster than you think!

Your encouragement is appreciated :- ) So far, so good and NO mistakes have been made today. Could be she's an extremely intelligent puppy. Tonight she may just go in the crate while we're sleeping, but that's okay as well, it's easy to clean up now and we are here for her to keep working at it throughout the day. So... much love to you Alty!


I gave you a solution. I gave you step by step instructions on how to potty train. You either didn't want to hear it, because it was too much work, or you didn't read it.

I'm glad things are working out now, amazing, overnight potty training for a 10 week old puppy. Highly doubtful.

I'll remove myself from this thread since nothing I say seems to sink in.

Good luck.

(grin, grin) imagine the possibilities!! Hilarious!


Laughing - and, yes, we've all been there with "I wouldn't believe what he/she just did" stories. I do think dog urine could be the USA's next line of defense. Collect it and then draw a line all around the country with it.

Thanks Marilyn :- ) so sorry about the name, it showed up in the quote, so I just thought it was yours, and didn't look further down on the post to see Monroe! Today has been good, and we will take it one day at a time. Obedience training will be I was told at 16 weeks of age, guess they want them to be fully vaccinated, etc. at Petsmart.

Well, thank you so much again!


Virginiarey,

I'm glad everything is working out for you. As for advising a good book about potty training.. I'm not really sure. I learned all my puppy training/house training via the book of hard knocks ;) You could try checking out any of the "for dummie" books.. they're very informative and explain things well. Go to your local pet store and see what they have available

Now that you have her going in the right direction, stick to your schedule. Things typically get worse before they get better. It wouldn't be a bad idea to start her in obedience training either. Not only will it give you a structured learning environment, but it will also start her down the road of socializing.

Please keep us updated :)

Beautiful pup, by the way... GSD's are smart dogs! She'll catch on faster than you think!

Thanks Marilyn :- ) so sorry about the name, it showed up in the quote, so I just thought it was yours, and didn't look further down on the post to see Monroe! Today has been good, and we will take it one day at a time. Obedience training will be I was told at 16 weeks of age, guess they want them to be fully vaccinated, etc. at Petsmart.

Well, thank you so much again!


The Petsmart trainers have minimum training - I had a terrible experience with them.

Look for a private instructor in your area.

Someone more knowledgeable about "formal" training will come along with more to say.

Yea, petsmart training isn't that great. If you like dogs and want to train them, Petsmart will send you to a crash course in dog training.

I would suggest to find a trainer through the kennel club if you have one or talk to other dog people so see who they recommend.

That may be best Judy, thanks! She is still doing great today, though she did peepee in the crate because I hadn't put her in the smaller crate until today.
What I'm going to try to do now is to set the alarm for 3 a.m. and take her out and see if that helps.
It's kind of creepy out this time of the morning for me, since we're in a rural area on two acres, and have had racoons, possums, and other critters here... the deer, we don't mind. I believe what got me concerned, is the man we bought Luna from. He has 120 acres (beautiful place), and has had to find, hunt down and kill a mountain lion that came too close to the house when the wife was outside, and she she saw it coming and took off indoors. He's had to kill and scare off wolves, and a bear on his property, so all this "excitement" kind of freaked me out! We went over to where he housed the puppies, and had to crossover this "walk over de plank" type setup, to get to the other side and open the locked door, where they were housed in a very large, solid, house-like chicken coop, that had the floor off the ground. All 10 pups were able to walk all around, lots of food, play,etc. and all very sweet, yet their poop/pee would fall to the bottom, which was at least 6 feet down or so, so they were not on dirt and had fresh, if you want to call it that, air, that easily went up through the grate that almost was the whole floor. Pretty cool setup for protection, but the pups didn't know what dirt or earth was. With all this protection, I had to ask further, and the man told us more...

He said that he and his wife are also doing rescue whenever the need came, from people either dumping their dogs somewhere close to his area and he happens to be able to "get to them" in time (I'll explain), or because they knew he and his wife took in animals to they would even call him and bring him their dogs, etc. and he would take them in and find homes for them. We were like, "wow, how nice", what a kind thing of them to do.
Then he went on informing us, that he also has had to come out, mostly at night, and shoot wolves off his calves like 20 feet on the side of his of door, because they were out for a kill! That he's been out in the woods, many times with his guns, trying to find where the most excruciating screaming and the noise of some dog/cat getting ripped to shreds out there that had been caught by the wild wolves. He would try and get to them to save it, but most times, it was just too late! Lost dog posters would be placed by people on the poles around the area, and he said you just knew that the screaming and noise you heard the night before, was most likely that lost pet, getting ripped to shreds! At daylight, all he would find is remains only.

So, you can just imagine hearing that, along with my imagination, scared the out of me! Now, I can't help, but look towards the small portion of our woods in the backyard if it's dark outside, to see if there's anything there, just waiting, and me having to hightail my back inside should something come out! I'm from California, where you don't ever have to think about things like this, but here, it's different! So early hours or darkness are not going to be something I look forward to.

I had also asked him the reason why he was letting the pups go so early and he said because momma dog didn't want to feed them past 3 weeks, it was just too many of them for her. So momma dog was still allowed to stay in the coop area with them, but they had started on moistened puppy kibble/water earlier. So when we picked out our little Luna from the litter, she was one of two girls who were the smallest of 9 girls! She was the one that kept following us around all the time, so we had to have her!
Her parents... were very large, mom was 90 pounds, but the father... an all solid black, took the cake! We had never seen such a gorgeous sweet animal, extremely intimidating by his look, but that massive in size. Like a beast only missing his red contact lenses and you would have sworn that "IT" had come to take you away for all the bad things you've ever done!

I figured since we picked the smallest and a female at that, most likely she would never get really large... now, I'm not so sure, time will tell.






The Petsmart trainers have minimum training - I had a terrible experience with them.

Look for a private instructor in your area.

Someone more knowledgeable about "formal" training will come along with more to say.

That may be best Judy, thanks! She is still doing great today, though she did peepee in the crate because I hadn't put her in the smaller crate until today.
What I'm going to try to do now is to set the alarm for 3 a.m. and take her out and see if that helps.
It's kinda creepy out this time of the morning for me, since we're in a rural area on two acres, and have had racoons, possums, and other critters here....the deer, we don't mind. I believe what got me concerned, is the man we bought Luna from. He has 120 acres (beautiful place), and has had to find, hunt down and kill a mountain lion that came too close to the house when the wife was outside, and she she saw it coming and took off indoors. He's had to kill and scare off wolves, and a bear on his property, so all this "excitement" kinda freaked me out! We went over to where he housed the puppies, and had to crossover this "walk over de plank" type setup, to get to the other side and open the locked door, where they were housed in a very large, solid, house-like chicken coop, that had the floor off the ground. All 10 pups were able to walk all around, lots of food, play,etc. and all very sweet, yet their poop/pee would fall to the bottom, which was at least 6 feet down or so, so they were not on dirt and had fresh, if you want to call it that, air, that easily went up through the grate that almost was the whole floor. Pretty cool setup for protection, but the pups didn't know what dirt or earth was. With all this protection, I had to ask further, and the man told us more......

He said that he and his wife are also doing rescue whenever the need came, from people either dumping their dogs somewhere close to his area and he happens to be able to "get to them" in time (I'll explain), or because they knew he and his wife took in animals to they would even call him and bring him their dogs, etc. and he would take them in and find homes for them. We were like, "wow, how nice", what a kind thing of them to do.
Then he went on informing us, that he also has had to come out, mostly at night, and shoot wolves off of his calves like 20 feet on the side of his of door, because they were out for a kill! That he's been out in the woods, many times with his guns, trying to find where the most excruciating screaming and the noise of some dog/cat getting ripped to shreds out there that had been caught by the wild wolves. He would try and get to them to save it, but most times, it was just too late! Lost dog posters would be placed by people on the poles around the area, and he said you just knew that the screaming and noise you heard the night before, was most likely that lost pet, getting ripped to shreds! At daylight, all he would find is remains only.

So, you can just imagine hearing that, along with my imagination, scared the out of me! Now, I can't help, but look towards the small portion of our woods in the backyard if it's dark outside, to see if there's anything there, just waiting, and me having to hightail my back inside should something come out! I'm from California, where you don't ever have to think about things like this, but here, it's different! So early hours or darkness are not going to be something I look forward to.

I had also asked him the reason why he was letting the pups go so early and he said because momma dog didn't want to feed them past 3 weeks, it was just too many of them for her. So momma dog was still allowed to stay in the coop area with them, but they had started on moistened puppy kibble/water earlier. So when we picked out our little Luna from the litter, she was one of two girls who were the smallest of 9 girls! She was the one that kept following us around all the time, so we had to have her!
Her parents..........were very large, mom was 90 pounds, but the father.....an all solid black, took the cake! We had never seen such a gorgeous sweet animal, extremely intimidating by his look, but that massive in size. Like a beast only missing his red contact lenses and you would have sworn that "IT" had come to take you away for all the bad things you've ever done!

I figured since we picked the smallest and a female at that, most likely she would never get really large...........now, I'm not so sure, time will tell.



I'd be a little concern about always letting her out at the same time. That will become part of her routine, and when she's older she'll still be going out at 3AM.

Love the post - just love it. There are coyotes where I live, I let the dogs out a few nights ago, same thing - saw the eyes. I have a privacy fence and the coyotes dug under it. My GSD weighs between 138 and 150 (depending on the time of year). She would have no problem with a coyote but the puppy - I shudder to think about it.

I actually go out at night with my handgun.

Yes, that is frightening! We're in the Piney Woods of east Texas and I thought the wolves, etc. we're all gone, until this man told me uh uh! I may just have to lessen her water earlier throughout the day and by night time or just before it gets really dark, take her out and no more to drink, or anything, until EARLY the next morning.

That man's place, which was also Indian land way back when, was just beautiful! Very green, tree filled with lots of noises of nature, plenty of birds. They had their own veggie garden, fruit trees, and even citrus, which doesn't grow well here, but they had them growing and did their own canning and the man... um, well, he was big enough (like the size of Hulk Hogan) to tackle a bear if he wanted to! He wasn't fat and at almost 60 years of age, didn't look anything over 45-49 years. It was hilarious because I think my 5 foot 6 inch tall hubby (bless his sweet heart) felt a bit intimidated by this big man and so we asked him what the heck he was eating to stay so young... and he said he hunts wild game on his acres, nuts, and drinks from their well that is fed by some springs, along with the stuff they grew. We had a great time there with him and his wife and there whole little ecosystems that all seem to be so very natural and you just new that this was a good way of living... off the land!


I'd be a little concern about always letting her out at the same time. That will become part of her routine, and when she's older she'll still be going out at 3AM.

Love the post - just love it. There are coyotes where I live, I let the dogs out a few nights ago, same thing - saw the eyes. I have a privacy fence and the coyotes dug under it. My GSD weighs between 138 and 150 (depending on the time of year). She would have no problem with a coyote but the puppy - I shudder to think about it.

I actually go out at night with my handgun.

We live in the burbs and still have run ins with wildlife. The other day there was a skunk in our yard. Our 6 month old border collie cross went after it, tail wagging, wanting to play. Thankfully the skunk didn't seem to be threatened, just turned, went under the fence and left our pup alone. Don't know what the beagle would have done, and I'm glad I didn't find out. Skunky puppy is no fun to deal with.