First, 1991 Honda Civic Wagon 4wd 1.6L engine, auto tranny

Sorry for the long, long post, but I wanted to give all the possible details

UPDATE: Installed new dizzy cap, no start. Has fuel for sure, no spark. The car supposedly has a new dizzy, and I took off the water guard and visually inspected the ignitor and the ignition module, both looked new, as if they were replaced with the dizzy.
As detailed below, there was a prior security system install, among other things, and wires hanging out all over. After the dizzy cap didn't work, I started taking apart the electrical tape wiring loom with all the wires detailed below in it to trace them out.
All of the loose wires were spliced in to the back of the unhooked connector. Coming from the connector there were 3 wires that actually went somewhere.

Oh, and the CEL lights as expected, and the main relay clicks and the secondary in the main relay clicks...

The BLK/WHT wire coming from the connector goes through the firewall, is spliced to a BLK/RED wire that goes towards the horn where it hits a wad of electrical tape, out of which comes a red wire and a black wire going to the horn, and a BLK/RED wire screwed to the ground at the horn.
The green wire coming from the connector is spliced to a purple wire that goes to the front left corner of the car and is hooked to a little pin on a spring deal that is situated so that closing the hood pushes the pin in.
The white wire is taped to the purple wire and goes all the way to the front left corner as well, but rather than hooking to the pin or anything, it disappears behind the headlight and I can't tell where it goes from there.
Regardless I'm pretty sure they all terminate in a wire hooked to nothing under the dash at this point. Some of them may have been wired up in the absolute MESS that was under there before I tore in to it though...

Any ideas?


Hello all...
First off, last Saturday I was T-Boned in my 1997 Honda Accord coupe. NICE car. The insurance co totalled it out because of mileage and I got a measly $2k... So...
Monday I bought a super nice 1991 RT4WD wagon with 118,000 miles and ice cold air, new auto tranny and dizzy. I've put about 100 miles on it. The only issue I've noticed is the driver door hinge is wonky and sometimes if not closed softly the auto seatbelts don't work...
Well anyway today I am driving about 20mpg and the RPMs drop to 0 and jump to idle, drop to 0, jump to idle and the car dies. I push it out of the way after I determine it isn't going to start and after some cussing, have a looksee.

When turning the key to start, I can hear the fuel pump. It cranks.
My last Honda [a 1997 accord] had an issue with the starter switch in the key assy. and so I decided to take the under dash panel out.

MAN!! There is a kill switch in there [doesn't seem to do anything], a buncha wires that don't go to anything anymore, a red and orange wire that seem to be cut, and look like they should go to the center of the fuse box, stuff is spliced to a red/wht 12ga wire, there are like 22ga wires spliced in to things all over, a BIG connector that's not plugged in to anything, and it's basically a mess. I am pretty sure that's where the problem lies.

ECU throws no codes
Seems to be no spark - crammed a wire in the boot and had an assistant hold against the groundpoint on the valvecover

The nuts on the grounds on the valve cover are spakin new

There was an alarm & carphone installed, and the wiring is cheese under the dash...
The main relay seems to have been moved
There is a whole wiring harness that is totally unconnected to anything under there, it has an inline fuse...

And it won't start... Fuel pump primes though...

Another update,

OK, fuel pump fires
Main relay clicks
Seems to be no spark.
On the under-dash fuse-box, there are terminals labeled 3 4 5 with spade connectors on them
#3 has an orange wire that goes to nothing connected to it
#4 nothing
#5 has a red wire that goes to nothing connected to it.

If I touch #3 and #5 I hear a loud relay somewhere under the radio click

The under-dash ground near the left driver knee area is connected to nothing

There was an old alarm glass break sensor and some other crap like a relay with 4 terminals and a socket and a diode wired in, a kill switch of some sort, etc I removed everything that I know didn't beloing. There were wires spliced in on the WHT-RED wire and the WHT-BLK wire, and the BLK-WHT wire had been cut and had all sort of crap spliced in. They now just go to themselves.

There is a zip-tie around a BLUE-GREY and another tiny thin wire in one of the harnesses that was all taped up weird, like it was noting something, but nothing seems cut.

And the big mess... There is a whole BIG plug plugged in to... nothing! Right by the left foot, driver side.
It says ACX 07B on it, and PN 1502-0092 and the wires coming out, in order are:
BLK-WHT, ORANGE, PURPLE, GREY, BLK, GRN, YEL, BROWN, WHT-BLK, WHT, RED-WHT, RED

And there is a buncha wires taped in a bundle hooked to nothing as well [some of them were hooked in to the alarm and relay crap] the are colored:

GREEN, GREY, BLK, BROWN-ISH GREY, RED, ORANGE, YELLOW, BLK-WHT

Tomarrow morning if my car is still there [dead in a bad part of St. Louis city... ] I'm going to check the dizzy... It's a new one, supposedly, and looks it, not just the cap either... But I suppose the rotor could be off...

HELP!!

Replace the Ignition Control Module (ICM) and coil:

https://www.askmehelpdesk.com/cars-trucks/faq-how-troubleshoot-repair-maintain-hondas-selected-other-vehicles-46563-4.html#post265896

The BLU wire from the ICM goes directly to the tachometer. Erratic rpm is usually a dead giveaway that the ICM is bad. If the problem persists, it's because the "new" distributor is not a genuine Honda product. Over 50% of new aftermarket distributors for Hondas don't work at AMHD.

Thanks, I've of course been reading like crazy on here, and was pretty sure you were going to suggest that..

As far as erratic RPM... It was bouncing around for about 5 seconds tops before the engine died, guess that still points to coil/ICM ?

Also, I pulled the negative bat. Cable before tracing the wires, and of course reset the ECU. It's not showing codes now, should it be if the ICM or coil is out? CEL is lighting/going off as expected etc...

I'm just trying to avoid spending $100 I don't exactly have on parts and an hour in the 100+ degree heat... forget about a junkyard today, I'd die, I think...

Also, upon visual inspection the coil & ICM look brand new, fairly shiny plastic. If a new dizzy was installed, could it have come with a coil and ICM? If not, would the old coil/ICM still look rather new, being inside the dizzy with the seals etc. in there?

As I mentioned, the problem may be that the distributor is not a genuine Honda product. Replacing the ICM and coil may not solve the problem, in that case. After that, I normally recommend buying a new genuine Honda distributor housing and installing your new aftermarket ICM and coil. Then, no money is lost. I can only give general direction, from afar. You have to take it from there.

WHAT? You can't see my engine bay from Texas? Well then... you're useless! Hahaha

I guess basically what I am asking is: It's likely not something to do with the under-dash wiring mess I've described then, huh?

Any way to tell if the dizzy is genuine honda?

There should be a Honda Part No. on it, if it is. Otherwise, there may be a tag.

I think you have a standard distributor problem.

Also: The relay I removed from under the dash had a red, orange, black, and wht/blk wires coming out of it, a diode from red to orange. It's a relay with a bracket on it, and a connector/plug with the wires coming out.
The relay says on it: Potter & Brumfield VF4-45F11 12VDC 40/30A
The side says: 910931 and the other side has a diagram: 85 - 86 87 - 87A and 30 under it

The plug says:

N.T.K. UC-3003 7&U Taiwan

Well, as luck has it, the place I got it from [as-is, no warranty] came and got it on a flatbed yesterday. I talked to their mechanic this morning and he was going to look at it around 10, I told him everything, and he seems to agree with the most recent diagnosis: It's the dizzy, coil, or ICM. He's going to pull the dizzy and get it tested. I pulled all the alarm wire, and the few things that I didn't pull 100% are wires for horn honker and headlight flasher - I removed the flasher relay and wired everything straight under the dash.

I'm just afraid they'll get another non OEM reman... The mechanic mentioned O'Riley to get it tested, makes me think that's where the dizzy came from... Also, no honda tag or p/n in evidence when I looked...

Oh yea - thanks a million, txgreasemonkey. I used your advice in my 97 accord when it wouldn't stay running after they key was out of the III pos - starter switch. And since in 97 a whole new ignition was required, I used your test of jumping two yellow wires to another wire to hook up a DPDT switch and avoid the $300 ignition.
Here's to hoping I get my baby back today.

Reman ACDelco dizzy and she fired right up!

Thanks grease monkey!

Nice job. Many people are skeptical about replacing distributors on Hondas. They just don't realize how problematic they are.