I'm asking about the Shroud of Turin.
Here's the report about it being the real burial cloth of Jesus.

New mysteries of the Shroud unveiled (http://www.wnd.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=116126)

:confused:Do you believe it?:confused:
:)Peace and kindness,:)
Fred

YES! I do believe.
It is wonderful news.
I would love to visit next year.

Roland.

Roland,
I also would like to see it but there is no way that I can go even if I could afford the trip.
Peace and kindness,
Fred

Hi, Fred!

Are you asking about it being the real burial cloth of Jesus or that the new, supposed findings, as mentioned by clicking on that link, are real, please?

Thanks!

Clough,
I am asking if YOU believe that it is the real burial cloth of Jesus considering the evidence that is presented in that entire site.
Peace and kindness,
Fred

Wow.. amazing fact..!
I really do believe it!

ChildOfGod_1,
Thank you.
So do I.
Peace and kindness,
Fred

Who are the experts? And in what? And how have they interacted with the Shroud?

If this were reliable and valid information, it would not be put on a DVD that is available from only one company, but would be shouted from the rooftops. Methinks someone is trying to sell you a bill of goods that will line his pockets with gelt.

Wondergirl,
That depends on which news channel you are watching.
It has been on Fox News, EWTN, and ABC, perhaps others,
But it has not been on those channels which avoid Christianity as much as is possible.
Amazingly, one of the experts who worked on the was the US Air Force.
They were picturing The Shroud of Turin with their mapping technology which raises 2 dimensional images up into 3 D to see if the shroud was indeed an image of an original 3 D object which it did turn out to be so.
Not only were he experts able to test the blood stains for what type it was (it turned out to be AB) but also they were able to get Jesus DNA.
The coins the were placed over Jesus' eyes were those minted for the rule of Pontius Pilat. The man who ordered Jesus to be crucified..
Much more information is available at the following...
The Shroud of Turin Website (http://www.shroud.com/)
Peace and kindness,
Fred

I don't see anything new on that Web site. Most of the news concerns the guy who debunks the Shroud and claims it is a 14th century creation.

The information is on the Internet, but is on UFO sites, psychic sites, disreputable newspaper sites. If the Shroud were truly authentic and proven to be so, all the news media would proclaim that. Enough of the Shroud has not been examined and tests have not been replicated, which is important for scientific proofs.

Wondergirl,
The question was do you believe that the shroud is the real burial cloth of Jesus.
Let me guess... /
You don't believe it.
I have been following the news about this for about 25 years and I have seen enough over that time to firmly believe that is is the real authentic thing.
The latest news about it has been on the sites I mentioned.
I think that a lot of the news outlets are so crammed with news about the economy, mortgages, and the war that they skip other news,
Bad news is always the mist important to them and good news is just a filler if they have room.
I off to bed now...
Good night and...
Peace and kindness,
Fred

I'm asking about the Shroud of Turin.
Here's the report about it being the real burial cloth of Jesus.


What other then curiousity caused man to imagine by speculation what they have concerning this old fabric?

The harm that can be added to this type of imagination is that mankind puts his heart of love into a falsehood. Dangerously following a desire that could be nothing more then a burial cloth of any man during that time frame.

Books, videos, and a number of other items sold that have intreged the imagination to believe in something that profits money, which is the root of all evil.

Speculations such of this can not bring us closer in faith to our Lord Jesus Christ, when it is questionable in truth. But it can cause God an emotional anger for man's foolishness.

Are we told to run and seek anything having Christ name written or attached to it? Were we told by Christ that there would be those who will attempt to deceive us by great signs and wonders?

A deception that might well be shown even by the Vatican who has announced the pope will visit the Shroud May 2.
Woe! Watch carefully is the warning we are foretold by Christ.

Let me remind you brothers and sisters in Christ Jesus, that Peter spoke of righteousness in Jesus Christ, and through the knowledge of God we do walk. And this was given to us through the power of God. We have already been given all things pertaining to life, and godliness! It is through that knowledge that we can escape corruption of this world. God's promises are what we hold to as precious and of truth. Do not seek the falsehood of man's curiousity and imagination.

2 Peter 1:3-4 According as HIS divine power hath given unto us all things that pertain unto life and godliness, through the knowledge of HIM that hath called us to glory and virtue: Whereby are given unto us exceeding great and precious promises: that by these ye might be partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust.

Remember that HIS promises add to our faith and what should be the virtuous course of thoughts, feelings and actions that we trust to follow. We sould be diligence in virtue knowledge which is moral excellence, in following the will of God in love, and giving love to others.

Romans 15:8 Now I say that Jesus Christ was a minister of the circumcision for the truth of God, to confirm the promises made unto the fathers





:confused:Do you believe it?:confused:
:)Peace and kindness,:)
Fred

We are not to chase the foolishness of this world. I find this difficult to consider, and ask why one might desire this in their path.
We are told not to bother disputing the corruptions of man and destitute of the truth . Rather, flee these things; and follow after righteousness, godliness, faith, love, patience, meekness.

So I depart from any dispute of this confusion, and proclaim only the truth that is written.

~Grace be with you all

If this were reliable and valid information, it would not be put on a DVD that is available from only one company, but would be shouted from the rooftops. Methinks someone is trying to sell you a bill of goods that will line his pockets with gelt.Agreed. WND is a *terrible* website to try to get facts.

As far as the shroud goes, I'm not 100% sure that it is yet. I agree with Wondergirl, that if it was authenticated, it would be in the headlines worldwide.

I do believe in Jesus Christ, and that He was our savior, and that He died for our sins.

I often think how magnificent it would be to have some tangible, physical, objects from Him. He was a carpenter, right? How wonderful it would be to have something that He actually made, with His own hands? It very well could exist, somewhere hidden.

Getting back to the shroud, I do believe that this are not normal staining, and transfer patterns, that would occur when a body is covered. You never see anything like that after an accident victim is covered.

Fred,

I don't NOT believe it. What I mean is... it is very possible that it is the cloth that the Lord Jesus was buried in. He was ressurrected!! We know he had to come right up out of his burial cloth. I think it is very interesting and made my boys watch a show once regarding the shroud. I suppose as a Christian I love information regarding it because it COULD be the real thing and that is totally cool!! BUT... also as a Christian I am careful not to grab hold of anything as evidence to try and prove to the unbeliever. Because Faith cometh by hearing and hearing the word of God. If we could prove anything it would no longer be faith and the scoffers would still scoff. Besides without faith it is impossible to please God. Hope that made sense and that I was positive about the topic... ha :)

sndbay,
Thanks,
Yes faith in God is essential.
But other things are important.
Yet today, thousands of years later more and more about the bible's authenticity is being discovered.
The sad part of that is it does not become national news.
To find out about it often the news is in various magazines such as Biblical Archeology Review or others or sometime on news sites on the internet.
I'm not surprise that the new news about the shroud is not on the national news. I would be surprised if it was.
Here's the web site of BAR...
Bible History & Archaeology Published by the Biblical Archaeology Society | Biblical Archaeology Review (http://www.bib-arch.org/)
As far as the shroud is concerned, as I mentioned, I have followed news about it for 25 years or more and I AM convinced it is the real thing.
I believe that God is not hiding evidence about Him and His word but allowing it to be revealed as time goes on.
That is what things like the discovery of Egyptian coins bearing the name of Joseph from the Biblical time when Joseph was an official in Egypt has been recently discovered.
I believe those event are important for they may help others who are not solid in their faith or just curious and may come to learn more about God because of it.

On a side note, I'll soon be off line for several days because I'm going to be installing a new computer and saying good bye to this old slow one.
Peace and kindness,
Fred

money, which is the root of all evil.
I agree with all you said about faith and the Shroud, but I disagree that money is the root of all evil. It is actually the LOVE of money that is the root of all evil. Money itself is innocuous.

Wondergirl,
Yes, that is right
The LOVE of money is the root of all evil.
Look at the economy of the world right now.
The love of money (greed) has caused many banks and huge institutions to go broke putting many people out of their homes and millions of people out of work.
Greed caused all that suffering.
Peace and kindness,
Fred

The love of money (greed) has caused many banks and huge institutions to go broke putting many people out of their homes and millions of people out of work.It's the greed of the individuals that is to blame fred.

I agree with all you said about faith and the Shroud, but I disagree that money is the root of all evil. It is actually the LOVE of money that is the root of all evil. Money itself is innocuous.

Agree it is the love of money, that many (reach after or desire), causing the err from faith. A desire within the heart of man whether money, or love of things of this world, we are told that it all causes man to err from the love of our Father.

1 Timothy 6:10-11 For the love of money is the root of all evil: which while some coveted after, they have erred from the faith, and pierced themselves through with many sorrows. But thou, O man of God, flee these things; and follow after righteousness, godliness, faith, love, patience, meekness.

1 John 2:15 Love not the world, neither the things that are in the world. If any man love the world, the love of the Father is not in him.

NeedKarma,
If you read again what I said you'll note that I said that greed was involved in that.
That the love of money is greed.
Peace and kindness,
Fred

A bearded man came to my door yesterday; it must have been Jesus.

I mean, he had hair and so did Jesus and he had a beard, so it must have been Jesus.

I even had Jesus appear to ne in my porridge one morning.

It certainly looked like an outline of a man's heard that had a beard, so it must have been him.

Mmm

A bearded man came to my door yesterday; it must have been Jesus.

I mean, he had hair and so did Jesus and he had a beard, so it must have been Jesus.

I even had Jesus appear to ne in my porridge one morning.

It certainly looked like an outline of a man's heard that had a beard, so it must have been him.

Mmm

So what's your point?

Are doubting that Jesus even existed?

Is this sarcastic mockery?

This thread is about the validity of the Shroud Of Turin.

It's not about visitors or breakfast.

jmjoseph,
I think that I Newton was just trying to be funny. I thought that he was so.
Actually If I look I can see something of Jesus in many different people.
It's what one looks for.
Looking for the good can be enlightening and in some cases difficult.
The same for looking for the bad.
If one watches or listens to or reads today's media it is easy to see the bad and often difficult to see the good.
For that one must look elsewhere.
I look here as one place to see much good work going on.
Peace and kindness,
Fred

My point is it is embarrassing how christians see a cloud that could be seen to look like an outline of a bearded figure and it has to be Jesus..

Same with the shroud, it may well have the figure of a bearded man and so it HAS to be Jesus.

No wonder Atheists laugh at Christians.

It is so strange that I just watched a documentary this evening on line about the shroud and the new evidence.
I found it very compelling and convincing.I think its wonderful!
Here is a link to the site if anyone is interested.
Follow the instructions on site for viewing.
NinjaVideo.net (http://www.ninjavideo.net/)

I Newton,
The image on the Shroud of Turin is MUCH MORE than just the image of a man.
It is a 3D image of a man crucified as was Jesus with all the whip marks of a Roman whipping tool and the mark of a spear thrust in his side.
The coins that were placed over the man's eyes bear the image of the coins struck for Pontius Pilate.
In addition to that the shroud contains seed and pollen from the land of Israel and images of herbs from there.
The fabric is of the type and weave used way back 2000 years ago.
As you can understand from that and much more about it you can see why so many people, including scientists, who believe it is the shroud that Jesus was buried in.
Peace and kindness,
Fred

I understand how people who want to believe, believe.

I do not trust what scientists say because another scientists usually says the exact opposite.

If and when all scientists agree on a particular matter, do I take any stock in any matter.

Let's say the shroud is real and let's say it was the one used for Jesus, (puting aside the pagan ritual of coins over the eyes, which would not have been done.) what benefir is it?

It will only take peole's focus away from worshiping God in truth and in spirit and will encourage them to worship what they see.

Churches encourages people to use statues and pictures and relics and icons to supposedly help people focus on God when the God of the Bible does not want such things.

People will chase after something that has no benefit, it does not teach, it does not show love, it does nothing but cause division between believers and non-believers.

The Bible tells us how his followers would be known, by their love for others, not by skulls, shrouds, statues, dancing, rock music, money, bells, lead lighting, cloaks and speaking in tongues.

If people read the BIble instead of wasting their time doing what religion tells them to do, they would see the truth and the truth would set them free.

In short, it (the shroud) is just a waste of time that helps no one.

I Newton,
Sorry, but I MUST this agree.
The placing of coins over the eyes to keep them shut has been going on for many centuries.
Many coins you can buy today come from graves of individuals in many lands including Israel.
Ask any professional archeologist.
Many Churches use statues, pictures, etc to help people focus their prays to God. There is nothing wrong with that. It all started with Solomon's temple as built under the direction of God.
Your dislike of churches is clouding you mind with negativity.
Jesus started The Church for we people. I go along with what Jesus did and said.
As far as then shroud is concerned you can believe as you wish and I with millions of other Christian will believe it IS the cloth that Jesus was buried in and no harm is dome with that.
The evidence that that is the case is overwhelming whether you accept it or not.
Peace and kindness,
Fred

The coins over the eys have absolutely nothing to do with keeping the eyes closed, but to pay for a safe passage to the other side.

This is something Jesus would never allow.

You can bow to statues if you want, no one is stopping you, I can only tell you what the Bible teaches.

Philosophy can prove anythng.
Enemies of God can say that because God is infiniely powerful and can d anything, he CAN lie, and because he says he cannot, he is obviously lying.

So with philosophy you can prove God a liar.

I do not hold much stock in philosophical arguments about what God accepts or does not accept.

You can believe bowing to statues is acceptable to God, but that is just philosophy.

I Newton,
No matter what you believe...
Never the less coins were placed over Jesus dead eyes.
I never attempt to prove God to be a liar and I recent your insinuation.
You have expressed what you believe as I an others here have.
There is no need for bad insinuations.
Please have peace and kindness,
Fred