This puzzles me. (I know, that's not too difficult)

Headline in Tyler newspaper: Obama declares H1N1 a national emergency.

From statistics I've heard, and comments from doctors, H1N1 is no more dangerous than the seasonal flu. So why all the hullaballoo?

Is this merely a diversion so we will not notice something else?

Will it be blown into a crisis that must not be wasted?

Evening Gal

The way it was reported over here is that when the order was signed for the national emergency, it was to get the system working for rolling out the services required to administer the vaccine

Aparantly they were no other way og getting the vaccine to be delivered in your constitution

So why all the hullaballoo?

"Health authorities say more than 1,000 people in the United States, including almost 100 children, have died from the strain of flu known as H1N1, and 46 states have widespread flu activity.... a level comparable to the peak of ordinary flu seasons, but far earlier and with more waves of infection expected.Officials have also declared that Canada is in its “second wave” of the H1N1 pandemic."

^
That.

I've got a real headscratcher for you Galveston:

If there really IS a pandemic going on then WHY doesn't Obama have his two girls vaccinated for the H1N1 virus? Huh? He's just declared a pandemic in the USA and won't have his own kids take the shot. Guess he and his family don't have to. That really gets my BS meter working overtime thinking that there really is no pandemic after all.

won't have his own kids take the shot. Guess he and his family don't have to.
Where did you hear or read that, that "he won't" let his kids get the shot?

He and Michelle probably don't need to get the H1N1 shot, but because of their public contact will get the seasonal one.

Evening

I thought it was W.H.O. that declared a pandemic and not a givern country?

Where did you hear or read that, that "he won't" let his kids get the shot?

He and Michelle probably don't need to get the H1N1 shot, but because of their public contact will get the seasonal one.

Where did I read this?

Well, it seems that the blabbermouth in the White House said this. He's known as Robert Gibbs, White House Press Secretary.

Just Google this and you'll get pages and pages about this. That's where. Let me guess. You don't think Robert Gibbs, White House Press Secretary, is a reliable source either? Why don't you be a good Obamatron and send him a letter telling him his daughters need to be protected from this vile flu pandemic along with everyone else's children. Let them take the risks of being permanently neurologically messed up. And be sure to remind him to have his 2 darlings "protected" with that wonderful Guardasil vaccine at the same time. I'll even happily pay the postage for that letter for you.

It's called poison the peasants. The richo's and elite don't need this poison or get this poison.

be sure to remind him to have his 2 darlings "protected" with that wonderful Guardasil vaccine at the same time. I'll even happily pay the postage for that letter for you.
No postage needed. I got direct connections to him.

The Centers for Disease Control recommend that children ages 6 months through 18 years of age receive a vaccination against the H1N1 flu virus. At this time only children with chronic medical conditions are receiving the vaccination because their immune system is not strong enough to fight off the strain. The CDC also says a regular seasonal flu shot does not protect against the virus.

The CDC also says a regular seasonal flu shot does not protect against the virus.
No, it doesn't. The two are as different as apples and oranges.

Let them take the risks of being permanently neurologically messed up.
The newspapers and Internet news should soon be full of stories of the serious illness and deaths of those children who received the H1N1 vaccine.

From abovetopsecret.com --

President Obama's school age daughters have not been vaccinated against the H1N1 flu virus. White House Press Secretary Robert Gibbs says the vaccine is not available to them based on their risk.

The Centers for Disease Control recommend that children ages 6 months through 18 years of age receive a vaccination against the H1N1 flu virus. At this time only children with chronic medical conditions are receiving the vaccination because their immune system is not strong enough to fight off the strain. The CDC also says a regular seasonal flu shot does not protect against the virus.

Simply stated ;this is a preemptive move anticipating the worse case scenario. It allows emergency rooms to move off site to treat patients without infecting other patients.

And no ;it doensn't mean those imaginary concentration camps are in operation .And no ;it doesn't mean RF chips are to be implanted .

FYI Guilford High school in Connecticut is shut down until at least Wednesday because 1/2 of the student body was out sick Friday.

Here's my understanding...

WHO declared an emergency back in March regarding H1N1. At that point, the US Department of Health and Human Services still didn't have a head because Obama hadn't appointed one yet.

In April 2008, Kathleen Sebelius was nominated and approved for DHH Secrertary. At that point she started the government's program to get the H1N1 vaccine made and into circulation. At that time, she predicted that there would be 120 million vaccine doses available by the beginning of October. To date, 1.6 million have been made available.

Between April and now, there has been serious debate about just how bad H1N1 is.

WHO is calling it a pandemic, which it is according to the definition of pandemic (a disease that has been observed in multiple countries on multiple continents). "Pandemic" merely means that it is widespread, but it does NOT address the deadliness of the virus. Technically the common cold is a "pandemic", as is the seasonal flu.

WHO also called it a "threat to the entire world", which would SEEM to be a statement of the deadliness of the disease.

In the USA, doctors have stated that there is little difference in terms of mortality between the seasonal flu and the swine flu. Swine flu hits harder and lasts longer, but survival rates are roughly the same.

So why call a "state of emergency"?

There are certain actions that the HHS Secretary is allowed to take during a state of emergency that cannot be taken during a state of normal affairs.

Because Subelius' original predictions of vaccine availability were so far off, she needed to take certain actions to correct that problem and get more vaccine made and out to the public. She could only take those actions if there was a state of emergency. So Obama granted her that ability by making the declaration.

So the bottom line is that the "declaration of a state of emergency" is merely a poilitical/administrative fiction to allow Sebelius more flexibility to do her job.

The PROBLEM with that is that it dilutes the concept of "state of emergency", which is usually applied to natural disasters, serious military attacks and anything that actually threatens the lives of large numbers of Americans. The idea of using a "state of emergency" in order to allow administrative activities to take place to me seems a frivolous and an agregious abuse of emergency powers.

In a way, Obama made the declaration to save himself embarrassment... after all, if Sebelius turned out of be incapable of doing the job she was appointed to, it would make HIM look bad for appointing her (just like Bush's appointment of Bron as head of FEMA made Bush look bad after Katrina). Giving her the necessary flexibility to fix her mess was in Obama's best interests. But it had nothing to do with the actual deadliness of the virus.

Because the WHO made their pandemic alert, Obama was technically within his legal authority to make the declaration. But I think it was wrong to do so for something that is clearly NOT that sort of life-threatening emergency.

Elliot

So, bottom line,

H1N1 is hyped as a "national emergency" on the basis of what it MIGHT do?

Okay, so then when it turns out to be nothing serious, team Obama can claim to have saved us from disaster.

Right!

Plans could certainly be put in place to provide vaccine, just in case, without the scare tactics.

I still think the hype may be a red herring.

So, bottom line,

H1N1 is hyped as a "national emergency" on the basis of what it MIGHT do?

Okay, so then when it turns out to be nothing serious, team Obama can claim to have saved us from disaster.

Right!!

Plans could certainly be put in place to provide vaccine, just in case, without the scare tactics.

I still think the hype may be a red herring.

Hey, at least yours only saved you from disaster - our prime minister has saved the world

YouTube - gordon-brown-save-the-world.flv (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7iPaiylUYW0)

:D

This puzzles me. (I know, that's not too difficult)

Headline in Tyler newspaper: Obama declares H1N1 a national emergency.

From statistics I've heard, and comments from doctors, H1N1 is no more dangerous than the seasonal flu. So why all the hullaballoo?

Is this merely a diversion so we will not notice something else?

Will it be blown into a crisis that must not be wasted?

It's the first crisis of his presidentcy so he might be inclined to over react particularly since his predecessor was criticised for being slow to react. H1N1 is being closely watched by the media and every death will undoubtedly be reported where as the flu is old news and hardly noticed. There is a report suggesting 98% of flu cases this season have been H1N1. What puzzles me is the supply of vaccine will not keep up with demand so why keep pushing people to be vaccinated

So, bottom line,

H1N1 is hyped as a "national emergency" on the basis of what it MIGHT do?

Hey... if he can win an Nobel Peace Prize based on what he MIGHT accomplish sometime in the future, then he can just as easily declare a national emergency based on what H1N1 MIGHT do. Same logic.


Okay, so then when it turns out to be nothing serious, team Obama can claim to have saved us from disaster.

Right!

Yep... just like if Corzine wins in NJ next week, he can claim that it's because of the popularity of his policies.


Plans could certainly be put in place to provide vaccine, just in case, without the scare tactics.

What... and not have Obama make media appearances to hype himself for his swift action in dealing with the crisis?


I still think the hype may be a red herring.

I still think you're right.

Elliot

it's the first crisis of his presidentcy

Aside from the recession, the failures of the banks, the failures of the auto makers, 10% unemployment (17% real unemployment), a $3.6 trillion budget deficit, and a $12+ trillion national debt.

And didn't he also declare a "health care crisis" as the reason he needed to force health care reform down everyone's throats before the August recess?

And wasn't there an "environmental crisis" that he needed to address which was an excuse to force "cap & trade" through the House?

And wasn't there a "budget crisis" used as an excuse to rush through the omnibus spending bill?

Frankly, this President keeps declaring national emergencies for things that really aren't that important or pressing. For him EVERYTHING is a crisis. And he overreacts to ALL of them.

Elliot

Hello:

You guys are bonkers. If the part of government you DON'T like says there's a pandemic, you go - wait just a minute here...

But, if the part of government you ADORE says we need to search everybody's emails WITHOUT a warrant, you're right there...

Silly Republicans.

excon

Hey... if he can win an Nobel Peace Prize based on what he MIGHT accomplish sometime in the future, then he can just as easily declare a national emergency based on what H1N1 MIGHT do. Same logic.


Yup he's ahead of the curve
http://t3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:SWSvYzs0Wo-GvM:http://farm1.static.flickr.com/106/289981080_4008fa579a.jpg (http://images.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://farm1.static.flickr.com/106/289981080_4008fa579a.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.flickr.com/photos/goopymart/289981080/&usg=__6pPemIDexNKEhG05YXSUDhsPJKk=&h=500&w=500&sz=115&hl=en&start=14&um=1&tbnid=SWSvYzs0Wo-GvM:&tbnh=130&tbnw=130&prev=/images%3Fq%3DROFLmao%26hl%3Den%26sa%3DX%26um%3D1)

Hello:

You guys are bonkers. If the part of government you DON'T like says there's a pandemic, you go - wait just a minute here....

But, if the part of government you ADORE says we need to search everybody's emails WITHOUT a warrant, you're right there....

Silly Republicans.

excon

Hang on

Ex, are you saying that the very people who value feedom of choice at any cost, welcome the idea of intrusion of privacy?

Hello:

You guys are bonkers. If the part of government you DON'T like says there's a pandemic, you go - wait just a minute here....

But, if the part of government you ADORE says we need to search everybody's emails WITHOUT a warrant, you're right there....

Silly Republicans.

excon

Real concerns over national security...

False alarms over H1N1...

Yeah... it's all the same.

Hee hee

Elliot

Hang on

Ex, are you saying that the very people who value feedom of choice at any cost, welcome the idea of intrusion of privacy?

It comes back to those three areas that the Constitution says the Government is there to deal with...

1) National security - protection from enemies both foreign and domestic,
2) physical infrastructure - maintenance of roads, tunnels, bridges and highways,
3) Economy - maintaining an environment that allows people to conduct business, gain wealth and produce products without interference.

The USA Patriot Act, which allows the government to listen in on phone calls between US nationals and foreign terrorists, falls within #1 above, and is therefore a legitimate function of the government.

Again, the Constitution is the ruling document.

Elliot

It comes back to those three areas that the Constitution says the Government is there to deal with...

1) National security - protection from enemies both foreign and domestic,
2) physical infrastructure - maintenance of roads, tunnels, bridges and highways,
3) Economy - maintaining an environment that allows people to conduct business, gain wealth and produce products without interferance.

The USA Patriot Act, which allows the government to listen in on phone calls between US nationals and foreign terrorists, falls within #1 above, and is therefore a legitimate function of the government.

Again, the Constitution is the ruling document.

Elliot

I understand that, and as for me I would want my government to have the ability to listen in on potential threats to national security, but ex stated "private" emails - so it is a case they have this right now or is it only in connection with national security?

Again, the Constitution is the ruling document.Hello again, Elliot:

It is, and I can read. Slowly, every so slowly, those laws that the dufus pushed through, including the misnamed Patriot Act, ARE being adjudged UNCONSTITUTIONAL by a very right wing Supreme Court...

So, as it turns out, the parts of government you ADORE are as UNCONSTITUTIONAL as those parts you decry.

In terms of what phlanx is interested in, they are collecting ALL our emails and ALL our telephone calls and running them through a program looking for certain key words. It's as UNAMERICAN, and UNCONSTITUTIONAL as you get.

excon

I understand that, and as for me I would want my government to have the ability to listen in on potential threats to national security, but ex stated "private" emails - so it is a case they have this right now or is it only in connection with national security?

Under the USA Patriot Act they only have the right to listen in on private conversations between foreign sources and domestic sources. This includes phone and electronic communications, including e-mail. They cannot tap purely domestic communications (between two domestic sources) without a warrant.

Elliot

Under the USA Patriot Act they only have the right to listen in on private conversations between foreign sources and domestic sources. This includes phone and electronic communications, including e-mail. They cannot tap purely domestic communications (between two domestic sources) without a warrant.

Elliot

Cheers mate

Yes the Patriot Act restricts this activity . Prior to that the Echelon system the Clintonoids used with it's blanket electronic snooping was perfectly acceptable if I was to judge the reaction of the left.

Swine flu deaths higher in older kids - Swine flu- msnbc.com (http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/32674615/ns/health-swine_flu/)

1918 Influenza Pandemic | CDC EID (http://www.cdc.gov/ncidod/eid/vol12no01/05-0979.htm)




JAMA -- Critically Ill Patients With 2009 Influenza A(H1N1) in Mexico, October 12, 2009, Domnguez-Cherit et al. 0 (2009): 2009.1536 (http://jama.ama-assn.org/cgi/content/full/2009.1536)





As of August 30, 2009, the World Health Organization reported 254 206 cases of 2009 influenza A(H1N1) and 2837 deaths, for a case-fatality rate of approximately 1%—yet this may well be an overestimate, because testing is no longer being reported in many jurisdictions.2 The case-fatality rate in previous influenza pandemics has varied widely, and all such reports may be inaccurate owing to difficulty in assessing the denominator (ie, the total number of cases).35 The Spanish flu of 1918 is reported as causing 50 million deaths in 500 million individuals infected (10% case-fatality rate), while the Hong Kong flu of 1968-1969 caused 33 000 deaths among 50 million infected (<0.1% case-fatality rate).36 The case-fatality rate of avian influenza A(H5N1) was initially reported to be as high as 60% but is more likely in the range of 14% to 33%.28



1] this novel h1n1 virus is similar to 1918 in that it effects younger healthier poplulations. Typical seasonal flu effects the very young and the very old disproportionately.

2] It is hard to determine the case fatality rate but if the seasonal cfr is half a percent and for H1n1 it is one percent; though half a percent is a small absolute amount, that difference is equal to 5000 extra deaths per million infected.


G&P