View Full Version : Airflow:possible to use heater blower in addition to A/C blower?
Muldune
Aug 29, 2009, 07:11 PM
Hello to everyone using the site,
Current setup is a coleman electric furnace and there is a carrier unit outside the home for a/c. I am in a mobile home built 1995 sized about 1780 sqft, living in Florida where the temp gets over 90 most days right now. Problem I am having is that I do not have enough air flow from the a/c unit outside. I can feel the cooling coming through all the duct work and it seems to be cooling at the right temperature however it is not getting pushed all over the home. Right now I have just switched out my thermostat to a new hunter digital display one of the $25 makes from Lowe's. I have wired this up the same as the old stat and is produced the same results as the old stat. I have been wondering how to correct the air flow problems in the home because even with constant running of the unit the house is not getting below 86 degrees during the day that's full tilt with no breaks. I have looked at the carrier unit outside and it appears to be working fine the a/c tech that I had come and look over the machine said it was in good working order and recharged abit of the coolant. I am not sure how to increase the airflow but I was considering the furnace blower to be an option since they share the same duct work... would it be possible to activate both blowers when either system is running and if so how would I go about wiring the thermostat to get this done.
Currently I have the following wired into the hunter thermostat model 42999b.
Y
Rc
White
Rh
Green- not used or connected to either of the units this confused me abit because I thought it controlled the fan relays. However the fans are still coming online when the unit is called
Tried to jumper the rc and rh to trigger the blower however the heater unit must have a sensor wired and will not just kick on the fan and not heat. So if heating is not needed the blower is inactive.
Will try a few more things in the meantime while awaiting a response but that is where I am currently.
KISS
Aug 29, 2009, 07:41 PM
If you read my sticky, G which is the Fan is controlled by the cooling circuit. In cool, the thermostat controls the fan.
With electric heat the thermostat usually controls the fan too.
Two fans, you may need a thermostat with an A terminal, if the thermostat controls a fan in heat mode. An "A" terminal is very rare.
Probably safe to say, it's beyound what our crystal ball can see.
Muldune
Aug 29, 2009, 07:55 PM
Thanks for the quick response,
I was wrong about it being two units I think unless there is a blower in the outside a/c unit I know there is a fan because I can see it but do most systems only have the blower inside the home or is there a blower in both pieces.. I know that sounds abit scattered but I don't know the language for the trade sorry.
One thing I have found to be true though is that the blower inside the house where the coleman is turns on when the heater is online but doesn't operate when the a/c is running is it supposed to trade off like that?
wmproop
Aug 29, 2009, 08:47 PM
You need to hook up the green wire to the g on your hunter
But a little warning ,you are to be better off if you take the junk hunter back to Lowe's and rane it for a good,well almost anything but a hunter,preferably a honeywell,, if you don`t trade it now you will be buying something else in the near furure, ( you was better off with the original tstat reinstalled)
Don`t think your problem was with your tstat to start with
The airflow problem doesn`t come from the outside condenser /ac unit,it comes from and is controlled from the furnace
Tell us what color wire is going to which post so we can follow along with what you are doing
KISS
Aug 29, 2009, 08:51 PM
In AC mode, the blower on the condenser outside should run AND the blower inside should run and blow air through the house.
The "G" terminal controls the inside fan. The "Y" controls the outside fan and compressor.
Some Colman's have a Heat/Cool mode that's selectible on the furnace. Causes lots of confusion as to how to wire.
What you have labeled as Rc/Rh's might be G and R.
Muldune
Aug 29, 2009, 09:19 PM
OK going to post up the wiring don't know how well this will translate to you for information.
Wall controller tstat(hunter 4299b)
g- I stripped the wire and installed however not sure if it runs to anything yet. (I have no V-meter)
W- white
Y- Yellow
RH- red
RC- blue
-------------------------------
Furnace Coleman Evcon
Starting with the fan-
Have two wires one red one black
Red wire heavy gauge is plugged into ML via a flat slide connection
Black wire heavy gauge is not plugged into anything\floating
Attached to the front of the fan there is a controller box it has 6 wires coming out of it's side and a switch on the front.
The switch on the front says auto --- off. Currently setup to auto
Two of the wires are blue they look to be attached to a vent relay either an exhuast or intake from the roof area.
Red- attached to another red wire both heavy gauge, leads into a box below that has breakers. And then there is a Low voltage wire attached which is also red, with the heavy gauge wires at the wire nut. This trend continues with white and yellow.
Light green almost white when looked at with a flash light connected to another light green wire headed into the breaks below.
Now the wiring that I am guessing that runs to the Tstat is right there as well the there are two pieces of wire that look like phone cable bith have one green wire in them and both are not connected.
One of those wires already has the red,white, and yellow connected through it. I assume that means that is headed to the Tstat. Should I connect the green wire from that cable to the light green heavy gauge I am seeing?
Muldune
Aug 30, 2009, 10:30 AM
Just did some maintanance on the coils and cleaned them out they were pretty clean to start with but now are looking like a refurb coil the temp in the house has dropped another 5 degrees but the fan in the house is still not working with the outside unit. As far as I can tell there is no advanced switches and or board on the inside equipment there is only two breaker switchs and a switch on the fan for auto or off. Really thinking this is just a wiring problem at this point and that's what I need the real help with my lack of knowledge is killing my efforts right now.
The model of the inside unit is EB15B and the fan on top of that has a sticker labeled Standard blend air II.
Any help with the wiring of the unit would be great otherwise I will have to call out a repair tech and spend abit I am thinking. I am still not even sure if I can get that fan to trigger during a cool cycle.
KISS
Aug 30, 2009, 11:01 AM
Take a pic an post using Go advanced/manage attachements.
Muldune
Aug 30, 2009, 11:25 AM
http://www.centraltrailer.com/resources/furnace/cts_style_crest/style_pdf/install_eb_b.pdf
Apperently there are a lot of people looking at this problem this is as far as I can tell the manual for install. Will upload photo soon as I dig out the digital from the move.
KISS
Aug 30, 2009, 12:25 PM
You need to connect G of the thermostat to the green wire that goes to pin #1 of the blower relay. That will make the fan work.
Muldune
Aug 30, 2009, 12:54 PM
OK connected Tstat green to the pin 1 of the blower unit and the unit is not responding. Again works fine for heat just not cooling. Is there any way to jumper the fan to an on position until I can get another relay?
KISS
Aug 30, 2009, 12:58 PM
Is Rc and Rh connected together?
Muldune
Aug 30, 2009, 01:01 PM
No they are not jumpered
mygirlsdad77
Aug 30, 2009, 01:06 PM
Is this a central ac unit, or is it a self contained ac unit(common on older trailer homes). Please post a pic of outside unit. Does outside unit sit right up against trailer skirting with its own ductwork going under trailer, or does outside unit sit away from skirting with nothing but two copper lines and electrical hooked to it?
Muldune
Aug 30, 2009, 01:06 PM
Just jumpered the rh and rc now the blower clicks once and doesn't turn over so the relay is trying to trigger at this point.
Muldune
Aug 30, 2009, 01:08 PM
The unit has it's own duct workcomes into the home at a central location on the home underside and then is distributed through the house. Already reran phones today so I had a chance to once over the duct and they are all sealed very well the installer did a good job with that at least.
Muldune
Aug 30, 2009, 01:17 PM
Very close to the solution I think just need a pointer to the right location hookup.
Muldune
Aug 30, 2009, 01:58 PM
AH HA!
figured the connections listed above were correct so with "green" hooked to pin "1" on the blower relay, went back to the Tstat and disconnected the green wire there(Location G in the hunter 42999b box) and move it to the yellow connection(location Y in the hunter 42999b). Now when the system reset the blower fan kicked on with the A/C unit. Only thing I can see from the change is that the yellow wire controls the outside unit and tell it when to turn on and stay on it should do the same for the fan. Only down side is that I can't just turn on the fan from the Tstat but for right now the airflow has increased about x5 times. Will update on the results when the unit shuts down after reaching temp. have to see if the fan will shut off or not.
KISS
Aug 30, 2009, 02:18 PM
Note this fr heat only:
Selector Switches
In order for this thermostat to control your system, the system type
Must be specified by the selector switches on the printed circuit
Board inside the thermostat. There is also a selector switch for your
Choice of Fahrenheit or Celsius temperature display.
Heating System Selector (HG - HE switch)
The factory position for this switch is in the HG position.
Leave it in this position if you have a gas furnace or an oil burner.
If you have an electric furnace, test to see whether the Heat
And Fan come on as expected after installation. If the Fan operation
Is normal, leave it in the HG position. If the Fan does
Not come on within a minute of the thermostat calling for heat,
Change the switch position to HE. The system selector has no
Effect in the cooling mode.
NOTE: HG position is for gas and most other systems. HE
Position is for certain electric systems having a fan relay.
There is usually a 1-5 minute delay with AC before the outside unit comes on. Go back to the Rc jumped to Rh (Which you have now) and G connected to Green on furnace.
Operate just the fan switch and the fan should come one.
Then operate the AC, the AC unit will take a few minutes to turn on.
Muldune
Aug 30, 2009, 06:19 PM
OK next order of business is that I have been running the system since my last post and it is still registering 87 degrees in the main living area. Is it possible with my current setup I have the heatercore running at the same time as the A/C and if so by just shutting off the heatercores breaker at the inside unit do the trick? This came to me as I was writing this post so I will be trying that next.
KISS
Aug 30, 2009, 06:47 PM
OK, W controls heat, Y controls cool, G controls fan, Rc to Rh jumped we'll call that terminal R. How the fan behaves in heat is dependent on the system switch.
Assume no t-stat
i.e. if you jump
R to G; runs the fan only
R to Y; run's the outside unit only
R to Y and G; run's the AC and inside fan like it's supposed to
R to W; runs the 1st stage heat. SINCE ELECTRIC heat, you may need t jump R to W to G; so fan and heat come on together
Note R= Red, W=white, Y=yellow and G = green