View Full Version : Light Fixtures stopped working. Already checked common causes.
joenz
Jun 27, 2009, 03:24 PM
We have 2 3-way switches controlling 5 light fixtures in our garage. About a week ago the light stopped working. Other electrical devices connected to that section of the breaker are working fine (garage door) so I assumed it was the switches. After testing a few things to no avail, I connected the hot line on the 1st switch to each traveler individually, and both times the travelers at the other switch had no voltage. I am an electrical engineering student, not an electrician... but as far as I know there is no other way to connect the switches and complete the circuit other than having the travelers connect the switches directly. I can't figure out where the travelers from the hot switch are going if not to the other switch, so any help would be necessary. I'd be embarrassed if I had to call an electrician :) Thanks.
jerro
Jun 27, 2009, 07:10 PM
Are you sure you had the hot wire at the switch and not the load wire going to the lights. If you have a continuity checker take both runners off both switches and at one end connect the wires and at the other end check for continuity between the two wires. Even if one traveler is bad you would still have power through the other one to the lights with the right combination of switch positions.
joenz
Jun 27, 2009, 10:43 PM
I am sure I had the hot wire (120v on voltmeter). No need to check continuity of travelers because what I did was connect the 120v hot wire DIRECTLY (not through switch) to the 1st traveler, then I went to where other switch is and did not have 120v between the same black traveler and ground. I tried the same for the white traveler. This clearly means that the 2 switches are not directly connected to each other, which completely baffles me from what I have read about 3-way switches. I also doubt the wiring went bad, so let me just make sure... the only way to connect 2 3-way switches so that up-up, down-down is ON, and up-down, down-up is OFF (or vice versa) is to connect the switches with power going to the 1st switch, then travelers between them, then output going to lights (in parallel). Rephrasing, both switches have to be DIRECTLY connected right? Because if that is the case, which I think it is, then I have no idea how this setup was working before it broke and I have no idea how it broke, because the switches are not directly connected.
joenz
Jun 27, 2009, 10:51 PM
I will add, although possibly irrelevant, that about a week before the lighting stopped working my father broke a light bulb off in the socket, but then removed the base with pliers and installed a new bulb which worked fine. The reason I am not considering this is because lights are in parallel so if it's shorted it would trip the breakers, and if its not shorted then everything would work fine for the other fixtures, plus like I said they were all working for about a week. If this is relevant tell me, but I doubt it. I really do appreciate any input though. I can't even get the electrician here for 5 days.
hkstroud
Jun 28, 2009, 04:39 AM
Assuming you have two 3-way switches with 3 wires, black white, red. Check voltage at first switch (presumably the red wire which is connected to the common terminal). Check voltage at each traveler terminal. One should have voltage unless switch is defective. Check voltage at traveler screws of other switch. One should have voltage. Check each traveler terminal not just one with same color wire (the electrician may have switched the color of wires in the light fixture). If you have voltage on either traveler terminal, check voltage at common terminal. If you have no voltage flip swith to other position. You should have voltage.
If you have voltage at common screw and light does not burn that would mean a bad connection of the hot wire returning voltage to the light fixture.
If you have no voltage at either traveler terminal of the second switch, flip first switch to other position. If you have no voltage at second switch after changing setting of first switch that would mean two bad connections of travelers in light fixture, highly unlikely.
Most likely, electrician switched wire colors of travelers on you in light fixture. Check both travelers in second switch box.
joenz
Jun 28, 2009, 09:14 AM
Yes I did that. The travelers from the 1st switch are not directly connected to the travelers of the 2nd switch. I realize that the chance of them going bad is very unlikely, which is why I was asking if there is any other possible explanation.
I directly connected the travelers to the incoming 120V line (one at a time) and both travelers on the other end were reading 0V each time. And yes, I tested all the wires against ground in case the electrician changed the colors. Nothing.
The last thing I can think of is that maybe there is some hidden 4 way switch behind some stuff piled in the garage but I doubt it. Any other ideas why the travelers are not connected and why everything would just stop working?
joenz
Jun 28, 2009, 09:47 AM
Found the hidden 4 way switch! Hidden behind a bunch of stuff and got stuck 1/2 way. Thanks for your time guys.
hkstroud
Jun 28, 2009, 11:59 AM
Congrats.