I found a great apartment on craigslist... to make a long story short, I stupidly sent the guy money via western union expecting the keys and documents in return. He kept asking for more money, with seemingly legitimate reasons behind them, and even sent me a fake tracking number to prove my package was on its way. Needless to say, I never got the package.
The only form of communication we had was through email. I have saved every single email we have exchanged as well as the western union receipts.
I have his full name and address (but I am obviously unaware whether this is even his real identity). He even sent me (via email) pictures of the apartment, a picture of himself, a DHL receipt for tracking my package, and a "legal" microsoftword document with a "signature" saying that after he received all my money, he would release my package to me.

I can't afford a lawyer, so if I did file a claim, I would be representing myself. Do I have enough evidence to take this to a small claims court? Can I file it in Chicago? What happens if he doesn't show? Or If that isn't his real name or address?

I filed a claim on the Internet Crime Complaint Center as well as with the FTC online... is there anything else I should do before I file the claim? Like go to western union? Or file a police report?

HELP!!

Even just answering one of my questions would help me greatly!!

You can certainly take him to Small Claims court. Whether you would win, is another issue. I think you stand a good chance, but even if you do win, then you have to collect. If this person is a scam artist, that is going to be very hard.

Have you talked to craigslist about this apparent fraud? Have you talked to the police? There are laws against taking money for something you can't deliver.

For future reference, whenever doing something like this, you should check out the address first, make sure who owns the property and contact them for confirmation that the person you are dealing with has the right to rent it out.

Well you can sue if you know where they are at. But my guess they are in a island off the US or in one of the African countries, That is the issue with western union, they money can be picked up anywhere in the world, once you send it.

So if they do live outside the US, you could never collect.

And why would you rent a place you never saw the inside of??

Sending money western union to unknown people is the biggest scam on the internet

The best thing you could do right now is this: make up a new email address and act like you are just another person interested in the apartment. Use this as an opportunity to get this guys information. You might come up with nothing usable, if the guy is not in the US obviously you can't sue him or have him arrested. Even if the guy IS in the US, for small claims you'll have to sue in the county that HE lives in. So for all you know, this guy might live in Alaska or outside of the US altogether.

Here's an idea to get his real address or at least a good idea of where he really is-tell him you can't, for whatever reason, get to a Western Union or Moneygram. You said in your post you are in Chicago, so I assume the apartment is supposedly in Chicago, so do this: make a new email, become "Bob Schmidt" or some other alias, write to him like you're interested, tell him you live in some small town in Maine or somewhere far off. You want the apartment because your sick mother lives in Chicago and you need to move there to be with her. When the guy asks you to send the money, tell him the town you live in is so small, there is no Western Union or Moneygram (scammer's second choice) anywhere near you so you'll need to send the money via FedEx. Also, get him to give you his phone number. Bingo, there you go, there's his name and address or at least a good idea of possibly where/who he is! From there you can decide if you can feasably sue him or at least contact the authorities in his area.

Keep all correspondence you have had with him and all that you have with him in the future, also save and print out his craigslist ad. You will need all of this for court to prove that you were defrauded, and as proof in case the authorities can do something about him. Check and make sure that you didn't trash any of his messages, do it soon before the trash gets emptied!

Edit: I just thought of this, unless he is using a service that blocks IP addresses, you can always check the email headers for his location. Go to this site, http://aruljohn.com/track.pl and you can trace the IP address. There is information on this site for where to obtain the IP address if you are unsure about how to do this. If you can't figure this out yourself, post the headers of his email here or PM them to me and I will check for the IP address for you.

Comments on this post
passmeby (https://www.askmehelpdesk.com/members/passmeby.html) disagrees: A country and city must be specified when sending money via WU. The money will only be available for pick-up in the specified country, and can only be picked up by the person it was sent to.

First, may I call your attention to the guidelines for using the comments feature found here:

https://www.askmehelpdesk.com/feedback/using-comments-feature-24951.html

You totally misunderstood what Chuck was saying. While your comment is technically correct, it had nothing to do with what Chuck said. The actual perpetrator of the fraud could be offshore and simply use an agent to pick up the MO.

As to your post. If this guy is a true con artist, he will spot the attempts to get his real information and break off. As for getting his IP that will tell very little. The only thing it will give is the ISP that issued the IP. But that will generally not reveal an exact location.

Scott, I read the guidelines briefly and I don't see anything wrong with my comment. I think what Fr Chuck said could leave this guy thinking that no matter where or who he sent the money to, it could have been picked up elsewhere by any random person and that's just not so. It had to at least be within the country the guy sent it to and it would have HAD to be picked up by the person named on the WU form, this person would have HAD to present their ID with the exact name written on the WU sending form. Sometimes, yes, they do have an agent to pick up the money but it's not so typical that the agent is in a different country. Usually it's within the same country.

The OP needs help in finding the person who scammed him, so far I have been the only person to give him advice on where to start looking. Checking the IP address can certainly give one a fairly good idea of the vicinity of where a person is emailing from. I apologize if I made it sound like the scammers exact address could be discerned from the email headers, although it is entirely possible, it's not possible in EVERY case. It certainly can't hurt to TRY it at this point. Most scammers are not saavy enough to hide their IP. Most scammers are not techies in the least.

I have a hobby called "Scambaiting", instead of deleting scam emails I receive I instead play along and see how far I can get a scammer to follow along. The point is to waste the scammers time so that they have less time to scam a REAL victim, so it's a sort of community service of sorts! Having dealt with countless scammers, I can say with relative certainty that the scammer will not know that this guy is "baiting" him for information as long as he plays a good act. The scammers are so blinded to the almighty dollar that they will literally do ANYTHING to get you to send them money. I have the pictures to prove it LOL ;)

I don't see anything wrong with my ideas to help this guy (hopefully) locate the scammer. I don't see anyone else suggesting anything helpful in this regard. If nothing else, it's at least a place to start. I'm curious to know what your ideas are for locating the scammer?

First, I reread Chuck's note and I apologize, I didn't see at first read where he said the MO could be licked up anywhere.

Second, I think you are wrong about many scammers. Many are tech savvy and use spoofing to mask their real locations or e-mail addresses.

If this guy was a true scam artist, not just some fly by night idiot who heard you can make money phishing and not get caught, then I doubt if the OP will ever find him.

Again, all knowing an IP will do is find the ISP that issued it. If it's a local ISP with a limited coverage area, it might indicate a location. But spoofing enables these scammers to appear to be posting from where they are not.

As for scam baiting, I would strongly advise against it. I suspect you have been lucky so far and played with some of the idiots I spoke of. But if you get involved with someone tech savvy, you could find yourself in a pack of trouble.

I'm very experienced at scambaiting... I know scammers inside and out. I frequently get their email passwords and skulk around in their email boxes, it's very enlightening! Rest assured, 99% of them are idiots that barely know how to turn a computer on. It is very easy to get information out of them, all you have to do is dangle a carrot in front of them, as long as they think a payday is coming, they will submit anything you want. These people cannot keep track of who they are scamming. They get hundreds of emails a day, a lot of them are nasty messages saying basically "I know you're a scammer, bug off", some are potential victims. These scammers are no stranger to being told off, found out, etc. It's not like you are the only person they are talking to and they're going to hunt you down for knowing they're a scammer.

But all of this is beside the point, this guy got scammed and if he wants to be able to do anything about it, he needs to find out where the scammer is. Really, the only way to do this is to investigate it through email. It's not going to do any harm to re-contact the scammer pretending to be an unsuspecting victim to try to obtain a name, address and phone number. Once the info is obtained, simply stop talking to the scammer or say that you're sorry, you've found another apartment for less money or something. If you turn the scammer in with the information you get, there's virtually no way the scammer is going to know who did it, remember they've scammed a ton of people by now, they've made hundreds, if not thousands, of enemies, it's not so bizarre that SOMEONE is going to turn them in sooner or later.

The likelihood of actually getting the money back is virtually zero, unfortunately, even if you do find the scammer. There are support forums for scam victims where you can tell your story and get feedback. You are not alone by far, it happens to even the smartest people. There are stories of US law firms being taken for millions to scammers. Hopefully, you'll never send money like this again, no matter what someone tells you. Make a rule to only deal with people you can meet face-to-face, and even then do a bit of background research. Google is awesome, but is often forgotten! Google the person's name, their email address, the address of the apartment... google everything, and if you find anything fishy, investigate further or drop it altogether. Many scammers names and email addresses are listed on scambaiting and scam awareness websites. I bet if you googled "apartment pictures" you would find the very same pics the scammer gave you. They just take pics off Google and use them. There is a site called tineye.com and it is a reverse-photo search. You upload a photo into the site and it will tell you where that picture is found on the internet. Not all pictures net results, but many do. I got a scam once for an orphanage and they were using a picture of the construction site of the UN College and claiming it was their orphanage.

Unless you have a Private Investigator's license you are also breaking the law by scamming the scammers by sending them incorrect information, leading them on, making up information.

A very dangerous practice, indeed, where the chased becomes the chaser.

99% of scambaiting is NOT illegal, 100% of scambaiting can be done without breaking any law. As with anything, there is always someone who does something against the rules, but illegal baiting activities are VERY rare and very much frowned upon by the baiting community.

It is not illegal to give a scammer a fake name, it's not illegal to use an alias or nickname at any time as long as you are not using a fake name to conduct an illegal act, or if use of the alias itself is an illegal act such as giving a false name to the police or committing identity theft. As long as you do not go a step further and create a false document such as a passport or other ID, which is obviously illegal in the US. Or using someone else's ID, again obviously illegal. But those examples do not only pertain to scambaiting, of course those rules apply to everyone at all times.

It is not illegal to lead someone on or to feign interest. If that was so, then lock up most of the worlds population.

It's certainly not illegal to ask questions or to research someone who contacts you via email. It's perfectly fine and even encouraged to find out anything you can about a person who you are doing business with.

It IS illegal to "cash bait", which means that you turn the tables on the scammer and get THEM to send YOU money. NEVER do this.

If a scammer sends you a money order or check, it can be illegal to possess those items, as most (if not ALL) are either forgeries or drawn on stolen accounts. NEVER attampt to cash any insturment sent to you from a scammer, you can be arrested. If you do cash anything, the bank will find out sooner or later that is is a fraud and hold YOU responsible. Immediately deface and destroy anything of this nature.

It is by no means illegal to ask them any question you want. They have the choice whether to answer.

Judy, regarding Fr Chucks answer, it is incorrect. Scott Gem re-read Fr Chucks answer and apologized for his comment to me, after I explained to him why the answer was wrong he then agreed with me. Please refer to my post #7 and Scott's following post, #8. You will see that Fr Chuck stated that a Western Union payment can be picked up ANYWHERE once sent. This is NOT true. It is important that the OP knows this, as it could be helpful in locating the scammer.

To the OP, if you do decide to attempt to gather information from the scammer, please do some research on scams. There are many websites, forums and online communities dedicated to helping scam victims. You can find a wealth of information on these sites, especially tips on identifying a scam so that this doesn't happen to you again. You might find it theraputic to find a supportive website where you can talk to others who have experience in helping victims. Sometimes just getting support can be a great relief, you are by no means alone!

Here is some helpful information:

http://www.craigslist.org/about/scams

This site can help you if you are afraid that a scammer has your personal information:

https://www.lucidintelligence.com/

This site is for support for victims and information on various types of scams:

http://www.scamwarners.com/

I don't know what State Laws you are familiar with. In NY if you are baiting, you are baiting, no matter what the reason.

Licensed Investigators cannot provide false info in order to get the desired result. Same goes for the general public.

These issues are discussed and covered at great length both in the ethics classes in law school and on the LPI exams, at least in my State.

I wouldn't much matter if this were posted on a discussion thread. When it's on a legal thread there is a responsibility not to mislead the OP or place him/her in physical or legal danger. Posing as someone else is illegal in some States and, in my eyes at least, not a good idea in general.

And who has the time for this stuff?

I see what you're saying Judy, and yes, anyone doing this should be careful. That is the main lesson.

Aside from the obvious that everyone already knows, (impersonating a police officer, government agent, ID theft, creating a false ID), can you please cite laws that back up your claim? You have really made me curious! This would be very helpful to know and I would GREATLY appreciate your answer, who knows, it' might make me reconsider doing scambaiting if I can get in trouble for that.

I also must disagree that one cannot use false information to get a desired result, as long as the desired result is not illegal (as in tricking someone into committing a crime, or extorting money, etc).

An example off the top of my head... bail bondsmen... they trick the people who flee all the time. They'll use any trick they can think of, such as "hey, you need to come on down and fill out some papers"... guess what, there's no papers, the goal is ust to get them in custody. Parents use the story of Santa Claus to get their children to behave. Oh, there's a million of them... Guys and girls lie all the time in order to get someone to go out with them. Guys lie when they go out to cheat on their wives... the cheating is illegal, but I've never heard of anyone being tried for the lie "You're sentenced to 20 years for telling your wife that you were working late, why you were REALLY out with the other woman!!"... again, cite an example please?

Absolutely, there are CERTAIN specific laws against lying to certain people about certain things. Bu the average person does not do anything illegal in this regard. Major rarity.

An example off the top of my head....bail bondsmen....they trick the people who flee all the time. They'll use any trick they can think of, such as "hey, you need to come on down and fill out some papers"....guess what, there's no papers, the goal is ust to get them in custody. Parents use the story of Santa Claus to get their children to behave. Oh, there's a million of them....Guys and girls lie all the time in order to get someone to go out with them. Guys lie when they go out to cheat on their wives.....the cheating is illegal, but I've never heard of anyone being tried for the lie "You're sentenced to 20 years for telling your wife that you were working late, why you were REALLY out with the other woman!!"...again, cite an example please?

Absolutely, there are CERTAIN specific laws against lying to certain people about certain things. Bu the average person does not do anything illegal in this regard. Major rarity.



Comparing telling children the story of Santa Claus and lying to "bait" a scammer is ludicrous. Same with husbands and wives who cheat. This discussion is very specifically about scammers and how to "trap" them, where private citizens can/might cross the line into criminal activity. It has nothing to do with lying to spouses or children. You are mixing apples and oranges here.

I very specifically addressed lying to "trap" a scammer. Anything else is out of that discussion and fodder for a discussion board.

I have no first hand knowledge of how bail bondsmen work, what they say, what they do - good TV but I don't know how they work in real life.

Again - it's a question of ethics, how to obtain and maintain a professional license as taught in Law School and law enforcement classes.

I also have no knowledge about whether the "average person" does or does not do anything illegal in "this regard."

Unless you can prove that iit is illegal, then please refrain from claiming that it is. It is wrong to damage someone's credibility without sufficient proof.

If you can prove it, then I will apoligize.

Now please bear in mind, I know that some instances of lying are illegal, such as perjury or to use a false identity to obtain services. What we are talking about here is giving a scammer (or anyone fro that matter) on the internet a false name/alias.

Unless you can prove that iit is illegal, then please refrain from claiming that it is. It is wrong to damage someones credibility without sufficient proof.

If you can prove it, then I will apoligize.

Now please bear in mind, I know that some instances of lying are illegal, such as perjury or to use a false identity to obtain services. What we are talking about here is giving a scammer (or anyone fro that matter) on the internet a false name/alias.


And the purpose of using a false identity or alias?

As far as the laws which prohibit the use of fake identity, I have no idea. I only know what I was taught in ethics classes. I didn't question my professors.

No need to "apoligize."

I also question why you think you have the ability to spot scammers and why it's your "job" in life to inconvenience people based on your feelings that they are scammers?