Okay, as most of you know I live with my boyfriend and he has a 9-year-old daughter. Well, lately we are having some huge issues with her, and neither of us know how to fix this. I will make a laundry list of this weeks occurrences, and hopefully someone can shed some light on why she is doing the things she's doing and how we can redirect her and make her realize she is just getting herself into more trouble.

So background-young single dad, full custody. She, who we'll call Sarah has no relationship with her mother (her mother's choice). He's had custody for 5 years, before that she lived with her grandmother.

So, this is what our week has looked like:


She cut the cat's whiskers, and trimmed the dogs tail fur. And lied about it. And is not allowed to have scissors without permission.
Took SIX hours to do a project because she was watching TV when we weren't looking. She was at the kitchen table with her back facing the tv, if she were in her room she would have just been playing with toys. She's not ADD, she's a third grader in fourth grade classes doing sixth grade work. She's in mostly advanced classes. She was procrastinating.
When she cleaned her room she shoved all toys under her bed and then put all her clean clothes in the dirty laundry.
She went into my room (which she knows she not allowed in unless invited) and played in my makeup. Wore makeup to school. And lied about it.
She told her teacher that her father REFUSED to help her with her homework and that he was mean and yelled at her when she asked for help. All of which is untrue. When the teacher called and Sarah was confronted, she lied.
She woke up in the middle of the night the other day and ate an entire carton of ice cream, and lied about it.
She wakes up before everyone else and watches cartoons, when we turn on the tv and it's on nickelodeon and we ask her why she was watching tv while grounded, she lied and said she wasn't.

I don't understand the lying. It's been explained to her many times that if she just tells the truth that she will be in a whole lot less trouble.

What's the deal, help us!!

Maybe she's lying compulsively. My brother always used to constantly lie about everything (my favorite: when he was little he hated brushing his teeth. So he would lie about it. So one day we asked if he'd brushed his teeth and he said "yes." then we asked why his toothbrush was dry and he replied "oh...i forgot to use water.") My aunt is HUGE on integrity. Since he moved in with her, his lying has lessened. She's constantly lecturing about having integrity. And the lectures just get longer whenever he's caught in a lie. We've never been able to figure out if he lies compulsively (like half of the rest of our family) or for the attention. But since it's lessened we're all leaning towards thinking he just does it for attention. That could be what she's doing.

Hey. First off, I'm a 17 year old and I used to do the same things as your daughter is doing now. If her reasoning is the same as mine, its because she is testing to see how much she can get away with and she wants attention whether good or bad. Also she could be getting influenced by kids at school.

Now as for how to deal wit her, I don't know whether or not you would be willing to try this or not, but my mom put me threw a home version of boot camp. Essentially from the moment I got home to the moment I went to bed, I was in my room. The only time I was allowed out was for washroom breaks and meals. All my toys were taken away and for every week that I behaved I got one toy back of my choice. If I miss behaved they were all taken away again. This lasted for 6 months in total. It was a hard route, but now, I am the most honest person you'll ever meet. I tell the truth whether it hurts to or not.

That's what my mom did and its always an option. Hope I was able to help. If not I'm sorry but I tried. Goodluck.

This is an issue.

You may be advised to take her to a counsellor, as she may be a compulsive lier.

She seems pretty normal, as kids do tend to rebel at some point, but...

How long has this behaviour been going on?
What was happening then?

She's been confined to her room for a month straight at this point. She has gotten off grounded for 2 days, and that was only because WE were tired of her being grounded and gave her a break, and that only made her think it was okay to get back into trouble.

She's started lying about two months ago. Nothing out of the ordinary was happening at this point. She had just turned 9, that was it.

She's been confined to her room for a month straight at this point.

That's quite a harsh punishment for a 9 year old.



She cut the cat's whiskers, and trimmed the dogs tail fur. And lied about it. And is not allowed to have scissors without permission.


What was her final reason as to why she did it? Did you tell her that there was no one else in the house, so all signs pointed to her?



Took SIX hours to do a project because she was watching TV when we weren't looking. She was at the kitchen table with her back facing the tv, if she were in her room she would have just been playing with toys. She's not ADD, she's a third grader in fourth grade classes doing sixth grade work. She's in mostly advanced classes. She was procrastinating.

Why did you leave the TV on? AND, why did you wait 6 hours for her to get it done? Was no one helping her?

[QUOTE=ChihuahuaMomma;1783513]
When she cleaned her room she shoved all toys under her bed and then put all her clean clothes in the dirty laundry.


Pretty normal for a 9 year old. She needs you for guidance.



She went into my room (which she knows she not allowed in unless invited) and played in my makeup. Wore makeup to school. And lied about it.


Didn't either one of you notice that she was wearing the makeup before she went to school?



She wakes up before everyone else and watches cartoons, when we turn on the tv and it's on nickelodeon and we ask her why she was watching tv while grounded, she lied and said she wasn't.

In all honesty, if I were grounded to my room for a month I'd do the same thing.

What other discipline techniques does your boyfriend use besides grounding?

Mine did similar things.

I don't think she is a compulsive liar. Compulsive liars benefit from lying. She is lying to avoid getting in trouble, and does not benefit from lying.

Try giving up on getting a confession. Instead, when you know she's done something, tell her that because she cut the cat's whiskers, or went to school with makeup on, or broke the TV rules, that she will lose a privilege, reasonable to the 'crime'.

If you deal with it without waiting for a confession, which you know will be a lie, and make the punishment appropriate to what she has done, you are making your point more effectively.

If you keep challenging her and expecting her to come up with a confession or reasons for her behaviour, they'll just keep piling up. She may not know why she trimmed the dog's hair, it just seemed like a good idea at the time. Don't waste time trying to get a reasonable answer to unreasonable behaviour.

At age 9, you are maybe making the reason for the behaviour more important than the behaviour itself.

Next time something happens, just tell her that you are going to have to punish her for eating the carton of icecream. Then ask her what she thinks is appropriate punishment. No discussion. Offer her a choice. No TV for an evening, doing a load of laundry, cleaning her room.

That way, she takes some responsibility for what she's done, because she's had to pick the punishment for it. She then owns it.

It's sort of like your husband comes home late from work, his clothes are a mess, he smells of perfume, and has lipstick on his collar. You ask him where he's been, and he says, at a board meeting. Do you waste time arguing with him about WHY he is lying? You already know he's lying. You would then proceed directly to the baseball bat.

Keep it simple. When she has done something, stay cool, tell her because she sprayed her baby brother with shaving cream (mine did that once), she's not going to the birthday party down the street on Saturday, or, offer her a few alternative punishments that she can pick herself.

She will eventually think before she does something, because she essentially doesn't want to have to punish herself.

That's quite a harsh punishment for a 9 year old. I'm sorry, I disagree. And it's her fault. She's had her "don't tell Daddy" trips. She's had her okay behavior days where she gets to go camping with us, or go to the mall. I don't mean she's literally faced the wall in her room for one month straight.



What was her final reason as to why she did it? Did you tell her that there was no one else in the house, so all signs pointed to her? She said she wanted to see what would happen, and yes she was told that it was obvious she was the culprit and that there was no use lying.

[quote=ChihuahuaMomma;1783513]
Took SIX hours to do a project because she was watching TV when we weren't looking. She was at the kitchen table with her back facing the tv, if she were in her room she would have just been playing with toys. She's not ADD, she's a third grader in fourth grade classes doing sixth grade work. She's in mostly advanced classes. She was procrastinating.

Why did you leave the TV on? AND, why did you wait 6 hours for her to get it done? Was no one helping her?
Because I'm and adult and I can watch tv when I want to. It took her six hours to get it done because she was whining, trying to con us into doing it for her, and doodling when we weren't looking. She had PLENTY of help from the both of us, AND our roommate. It took her so long because she realized we weren't going to just do it for her.



Pretty normal for a 9 year old. She needs you for guidance. I've talked to her about this at least 1,000 times. I even told her that the next time that she does it I'm going to wait until she picks up the dog poop from the backyard and then go behind her and throw it all back out there and make her pick it up again. I explained that this is what she is doing to me by trying to trick me into washing her laundry again because she doesn't feel like putting it away. I fold it, all she has to do is open a drawer and sit the stack inside the drawer, not that hard, and not too much to ask of a 9-year-old.



Didn't either one of you notice that she was wearing the makeup before she went to school? No, he's gone to work, and I was in the bathroom when she left for school.



In all honesty, if I were grounded to my room for a month I'd do the same thing. And that's the reason that she's grounded, she just doesn't get it. Mind you this is an example of about 6 hours of A DAY. Things like this occur all the time. And really has only been happening for about two months. Including but not limited to running away for 4 hours, getting into a stranger's car, and shaving her eyebrows.

What other discipline techniques does your boyfriend use besides grounding? Adding more chores, taking away priveleges slowly, soap in the mouth (only for cussing), cancelling field trips or things that she is looking forward to, sitting her down and talking to her like an adult, me & her girl trips and "serious girl talk", and grounding to the room is usually the last resort.

Mine did similar things.

I don't think she is a compulsive liar. Compulsive liars benefit from lying. She is lying to avoid getting in trouble, and does not benefit from lying.

Try giving up on getting a confession. Instead, when you know she's done something, tell her that because she cut the cat's whiskers, or went to school with makeup on, or broke the tv rules, that she will lose a privilege, reasonable to the 'crime'.

If you deal with it without waiting for a confession, which you know will be a lie, and make the punishment appropriate to what she has done, you are making your point more effectively.

If you keep challenging her and expecting her to come up with a confession or reasons for her behaviour, they'll just keep piling up. She may not know why she trimmed the dog's hair, it just seemed like a good idea at the time. Don't waste time trying to get a reasonable answer to unreasonable behaviour.

At age 9, you are maybe making the reason for the behaviour more important than the behaviour itself.

Next time something happens, just tell her that you are going to have to punish her for eating the carton of icecream. Then ask her what she thinks is appropriate punishment. No discussion. Offer her a choice. No TV for an evening, doing a load of laundry, cleaning her room.

That way, she takes some responsibility for what she's done, because she's had to pick the punishment for it. She then owns it.

It's sort of like your husband comes home late from work, his clothes are a mess, he smells of perfume, and has lipstick on his collar. You ask him where he's been, and he says, at a board meeting. Do you waste time arguing with him about WHY he is lying? You already know he's lying. You would then proceed directly to the baseball bat.

Keep it simple. When she has done something, stay cool, tell her because she sprayed her baby brother with shaving cream (mine did that once), she's not going to the birthday party down the street on Saturday, or, offer her a few alternative punishments that she can pick herself.

She will eventually think before she does something, because she essentially doesn't want to have to punish herself.

ALL of that makes a lot of sense, but the problem lies here: we've done that. And her answer is, "no punishment". Every time, so we were back to deciding her punishment. She is not lying because we present her the opportunity. She lies about it before we find out about the act most of the time, and that's usually how we find out. She lies about stupid things sometimes, that there is no point to lie about. We're not punishing her for not having a good reason for her behavior, she gets in trouble for the behavior itself, she knows that.

What about positive reinforcement, instead of listing everything she does/did wrong, start focusing on attention for the things she does right.

If she is getting attention for poor behavior, she will continue poor behavior for attention. Get her focus on her attention for good behavior, not just the talks about being better, after she messed up.

Keep in mind, she is still nine. You aren't going to get an adult out of her right now, be patient.

Like next time, she makes a mistake, she needs to be rewarded for NOT lying about it. Encourage the right choice, stop putting all of the emphasis on the poor choices.

What about positive reinforcement, instead of listing everything she does/did wrong, start focusing on attention for the things she does right.

If she is getting attention for poor behavior, she will continue poor behavior for attention. Get her focus on her attention for good behavior, not just the talks about being better, after she messed up.

Keep in mind, she is still nine. You aren't going to get an adult out of her right now, be patient.

Like next time, she makes a mistake, she needs to be rewarded for NOT lying about it. Encourage the right choice, stop putting all of the emphasis on the poor choices.
Oh we do! She gets 50 cents for every extra chore, she gets a "parent day" when she has two or more A's on her report card or big tests.. She gets plenty of positive reinforcement for good behavior whether she is grounded or not, and she DOES get a day knocked off grounding or completely off grounded if she doesn't lie or confesses to something. But the thing is, she never does these things anymore. She does still get really good grades. So she still gets her parent days. We aren't trying to make her an adult, just make her a responsible kid. When we're in public she's a flipping princess, I swear. She always says "ma'am and sir, thank you, please." And that's all the time. So, she's very well behaved, but she just keeps getting herself into trouble. That's why we are so confused.

Chi, I don't mean to sound harsh, and I'm sorry if I do... but I have raised 4 kids, so I'm pretty experienced.

An entire month grounded to her room IS wayyyyy too long of a punishment. You deal with the particular problem then and there and be done with it. If not, she is going to continue to act out for attention. Kids don't care whether it's good or bad attention they get as long as someone is paying attention to them.

Also, not to sound harsh again, but you are the "intruder" in her young life. You are not her mother and she may be acting out because you are taking her time away from Daddy. You should not be punishing her at all, this is her father's job.

Don't take "no punishment" for an answer. She should be given choices for her punishment. Let her pick from the list that her father decides.

I don't doubt your experience or advice, J_9. I'm telling you what we have tried and haven't, and what has worked and hasn't. And my opinion. Like I said, it was not a month straight. She got off grounding and decided that she wanted to abuse the animals so she got grounded again.

I don't want to sound harsh here either, J_9, but you don't know the entire situation, so please don't assume you do by calling me an intruder. I've known my boyfriend and his daughter for 5 years, and have been a steady part of their lives for 5 years, so no I'm not an intruder. I am not biologcal mother, but again you don't know our situation. And for the record, I don't decide her punishments, her father does. And our agreements on parenting have nothing to do with this conversation.

I don't want to sound harsh here either, J_9, but you don't know the entire situation, so please don't assume you do by calling me an intruder.

Look Cherish, whether you want to admit it or not, in HER life you are the intruder. You are not her mother. This is how children look at step parents. It's a fact, not my opinion. I'm not name-calling only fact-stating. This is how young children view people who are not biologically their parents.

Maybe I don't know the entire situation, but you haven't posted it either. I answered according to your posting.

I won't argue with you, but you cannot state how ALL children feel about their step-parents. My step-dad has taken the place of my mother and father, and is my best friend. I thank you for all your great advice, and will put some of it into action; as well as the other advice I have received here. Thank you to everyone, I will check back in a bit, and let everyone know how things are going. Today went really well. We finished working on her project, I helped her with her chores, and she helped her Dad with dinner. No negative attention-seeking behavior, no lying. It was all-in-all a great day. Again, thanks to everyone for all the fantastic advice.

Maybe now that she's getting older its getting to her that you're the one there and not her biological mother? Is there anything at all that might have possibly triggered something?
I'm confused on the month long grounding. I get that in the end she wasn't grounded for a whole month. But in the beginng was it "you're grounded for a month."? Because I know when I was grounding up, we'd all laugh if we were told we would be grounded for a month because we knew the most it ever lasted was a week, usually less. If she's regularly getting her punishments shortened, she may not care.
My final thought, that I'm completely stealing from super nanny... have a reflection room for her. Every time she misbehaves she has to sit there for 9 minutes thinking about what she did, or reflecting, and when that's done you calmly sit with her and explain why she was sent there and have her apologize.

I don't think that's the case. Just the other day she said that she wished that I was her Mom. She doesn't know her mother. Perhaps it's nothing to do with me, maybe she's holding a secret grudge towards her mother and acting out because of it. I'm no therapist.

No, she was at first grounded for a day, and then she just misbehaved every single day so it got longer. And there was a week long grounding in there (for getting into a stranger's car).

I've spoken with her father, and he thinks it's a good idea to retry to choosing her punishment thing and giving her three choices of punishment. Mostly extra chores, cause she doesn't care if she doesn't get to watch TV. Or no playing outside, which in June is a super bummer.

The reflection room isn't a bad idea. Would the garage work, or would that be mean? LOL. We don't have much extra space. It's usually just "Go to your room and think about things."

I think this child is lucky to have you in her life, and to care so deeply for her. Remember the ones doing the parenting get the worst of it, because it is unconditional love.

As tough as it is with her now, what you have taught her during the past five years will eventually shine through.

Sometimes there is just no explaining kid behaviour. Then there are pre-teens, and the teen years to get through. Nobody gets out alive!

When you do the best you can, there are still going to be times when you're going to want to pull your hair out. I don't know any good parent who can say they did everything right, kids don't come with instruction manuals.

Keep your chin up, stick to your guns, set reasonabe expectations for reasonable behaviour, and eventually this will all work out. Hang in there.

Thank you. I'm fearing the "you're a woman now" talk. I fear it's not too far off, and her father is absolutely clueless on the matter. We already had to go bra shopping and he flipped out when he saw pre-teen padded bras. Ha. Anyway, I'm sure you'll hear much more from me.

Just a p.s. about the reflection thing. That's a great idea.

I'd give her 10 minutes, have her go to a quiet place of her choosing, with the understanding that when the timer goes, the two of you are going to sit and talk about what happened. A good opportunity too to come up with the punishment.

I've seen that technique on Nanny 911 as well, only with younger children, but worth a try.

On super nanny, it looked like it was just their den or office that they'd put a comfy couch into. The only problem I see with that particular kind of room is if there's a computer there she'd likely end up there instead of reflecting.
Resenting her own mother and acting out because of it might make sense. Have you tried talking to her about her own mother?

No, I haven't. Her father has. I don't feel that that's my place, unless she comes to me with it directly.

Have had a class room full of 9 year olds for the last 7 years and one thing that worked well for the majority when behavior issues came up was to give them a choice, when possible, when they didn't want to do something.

For example with homework: Sarah, I see you have quite a bit of math homework to get done today. You can do it after you have a snack and then go play or you can play for half an hour and then you'll have to come in and do the homework at that time. If she works on the homework first, let her know she was showing responsibility by making that choice. If she decides to play and then grumbles about having to come in to do homework (which is quite likely what will happen) remind her that she had a choice and that maybe she will make a different one next time. No arguing, no discussion... just matter of fact. Acknowledge her displeasure, but state again how she can make a different choice next time that she might like better.

In regard to homework... third graders still need supervision or at least frequent checks that they are actually doing the work, that they are understanding the work, and that they are doing quality work. Now is the time to lay the ground for good study habits and it is important to have that parental support and guidance. You or dad could sit at the table and read a book while she works, balance your checkbook, pay bills, write a letter, whatever, but be there or at least check on her frequently. Unplug the TV if need be... disconnect the cable... set parent controls if possible and block all the channels she might watch until you reset it. If possible, set up an area for homework without distractions. Maybe allow some music as some people do actually perform better with some background noise, but television if often too distracting and just prolongs the work. Some kids do well with a timer being set... maybe broken into small increments. Time management is often a learned concept... even for many adults!

With her room, show her ways to manage the cleaning and getting organzied. Does she have a hamper for dirty clothes? Does she have a place for books? Games/toys? Show her how to do a section at a time if it seems overwhelming. Then once it is all sorted, supervise while she picks up the odd items before bedtime each night. Do this for several weeks so that it can become habit for her and then you won't need to supervise... or at least not as much... :)

If grounding doesn't work for her you'll have to find out what does. For some kids being grounded is horrible and to be avoided at all costs... other kids could care less, they aren't really bothered by it, so it becomes meaningless. You need to find what is important to her.

It will take a good deal of effort on your part and on her dad's part to get things on track, but it will pay off for all of you in the long run.

Do you and her father follow through on dicsipline or do you cave? Consistency is a must when dealing with children.

I know she is young, but remmeber that some girls DO start pms this young. Certanly not all, not even half, but it DOES happen. Sit down with her, on a day that is NOT going hectic, on a GOOD day when you are getting along (and Don't include her father, daddys don't need to hear about the period issues and pms and being a 'woman' from his daughter, you can tell him about it later, I'm not saying keep him out of the loop, but it would only embarrass her to talk about it in front of him)

Talk to her about how she is feeling, and if her emotions feel out of control. Girls who start going through pms early (pms in generall not JUST their periods) have it harder because they are younger and can't cope with it as well as an older girl, and even the older girls have issues :)


Good luck hon *hugs*

Have had a class room full of 9 year olds for the last 7 years and one thing that worked well for the majority when behavior issues came up was to give them a choice, when possible, when they didn't want to do something.

For example with homework: Sarah, I see you have quite a bit of math homework to get done today. You can do it after you have a snack and then go play or you can play for half an hour and then you'll have to come in and do the homework at that time. If she works on the homework first, let her know she was showing responsibility by making that choice. If she decides to play and then grumbles about having to come in to do homework (which is quite likely what will happen) remind her that she had a choice and that maybe she will make a different one next time. No arguing, no discussion....just matter of fact. Acknowledge her displeasure, but state again how she can make a different choice next time that she might like better. We've been doing this, and it's really working great as far as her behavior is concerned. She still does those tell-tell 9-year-old things though.

In regard to homework....third graders still need supervision or at least frequent checks that they are actually doing the work, that they are understanding the work, and that they are doing quality work. Now is the time to lay the ground for good study habits and it is important to have that parental support and guidance. You or dad could sit at the table and read a book while she works, balance your checkbook, pay bills, write a letter, whatever, but be there or at least check on her frequently. Unplug the TV if need be...disconnect the cable...set parent controls if possible and block all the channels she might watch until you reset it. If possible, set up an area for homework without distractions. Maybe allow some music as some people do actually perform better with some background noise, but television if often too distracting and just prolongs the work. Some kids do well with a timer being set....maybe broken into small increments. Time management is often a learned concept....even for many adults!! Homework isn't an issue, like I said she is very advanced in school and has very good study habits. She really does enjoy the music while she does homework. This was a one time event. She didn't want to do the project because she failed to do her research at school, and didn't know what to do. So she fiddled around until we realized what the issue was. Regardless, that issue is resolved. And as far as the TV goes, she knows to plug the tv back in and learned how to disable the parental control. So, that does us no good. LOL. Sometimes I think our problem is that she's smarrter than us.

With her room, show her ways to manage the cleaning and getting organzied. Does she have a hamper for dirty clothes? Does she have a place for books? Games/toys? Show her how to do a section at a time if it seems overwhelming. Then once it is all sorted, supervise while she picks up the odd items before bedtime each night. Do this for several weeks so that it can become habit for her and then you won't need to supervise...or at least not as much....:) Hamper for dirty clothes-yes, that's where she hides the clean clothes that she doesn't feel like putting away. Place for books--yes, she has a bookshelf plus the one in the living room. Games and toys go in the hall closet. We actually did a spring cleaning on her room the day before yesterday and got it all organized and put together! Hope it helps!

If grounding doesn't work for her you'll have to find out what does. For some kids being grounded is horrible and to be avoided at all costs....other kids could care less, they aren't really bothered by it, so it becomes meaningless. You need to find what is important to her. We've done that. Not going to her Grandmother's and not hanging out with her friends or going to a babysitter when we go camping and hiking. STILL, she ate the tops of all four muffins yesterday for breakfast instead of eating one muffin. And then when confronted, she lied about it. I even constructed the question so that her first choice was to tell the truth. I said, "What did you have for breakfast? Keep in mind I already know the answer, so there's no point in lying. You won't be able to visit your granny this weekend if you lie." "I ate an apple." Then when I proved to her that I knew she ate the muffin tops, she started crying and saying, "I miss my Grandma, this isn't fair." I explained to her it was very fair, she continues to lie and this is the last one on top of the pile. I warned her not to lie before she did. And she did it anyways. What are we doing wrong here?

It will take a good deal of effort on your part and on her dad's part to get things on track, but it will pay off for all of you in the long run. Thanks for the vote of confidence. ...

Play the grandma card... tell her you understand that she misses her grandmother, and you would very much like for her to get to visit, but she knew the consequences, she chose not to be truthful thinking it would keep her out of trouble, but that obviously didn't work so now she misses out this time and that is how it is going to stand. Tell her that next time you ask her a question, you expect her to be honest and that way her consequences will be positive ones. Acknowledge that you understand her desire not to get into trouble so she decides not to be honest, but point out that it will only result in missing out on things she wants to do. Yes, she may still get into trouble if she makes poor choices in what she does, but the consequences won't be of the same level... and, you don't have to tell her this, but depending on the issue at hand, you may once in awhile let her off the hook simply because she made a good decision about being honest and showing responsibility.

You might even sit her down one night and discuss what her thoughts are regarding your actions when she isn't honest. Let her know it is your job as a "parent" or adult in charge, to be sure she knows how to make good choices and how to be responsible for her actions. What does she believe the consequences should be? If reasonable, let her have a stake it what the results of her behavior choices should be.

Play the grandma card.....tell her you understand that she misses her grandmother, and you would very much like for her to get to visit, but she knew the consequences, she chose not to be truthful thinking it would keep her out of trouble, but that obviously didn't work so now she misses out this time and that is how it is going to stand. Tell her that next time you ask her a question, you expect her to be honest and that way her consequences will be positive ones. Acknowledge that you understand her desire not to get into trouble so she decides not to be honest, but point out that it will only result in missing out on things she wants to do. Yes, she may still get into trouble if she makes poor choices in what she does, but the consequences won't be of the same level....and, you don't have to tell her this, but depending on the issue at hand, you may once in awhile let her off the hook simply because she made a good decision about being honest and showing responsibility.


You might even sit her down one night and discuss what her thoughts are regarding your actions when she isn't honest. Let her know it is your job as a "parent" or adult in charge, to be sure she knows how to make good choices and how to be responsible for her actions. What does she believe the consequences should be? If reasonable, let her have a stake it what the results of her behavior choices should be.
We've had that discussion. Every single time. We are playing the G-ma card at this point, because that is the thing that she is most excited about. This will be her third weekend in a row that she won't be able to spend with her G-ma because of her lying.

Hopefully it will sink in before too long... she may just be testing your resolve. Stay consistent... keep it all matter of fact, no arguing but it is not open for discussion either. Continue to remind her of the expectations and the benefits that go along with giving some consideration to her response before she gives it... as well as the results of not being honest. Try and catch any small incidents that you can where she makes good choices... in any area, and build her up. Being helpful by setting the table... showing responsibility by feeding the dog... coming home on time... speaking nicely to someone... whatever you can find.

We do that. Feeding the dog is a CHORE though, so she doesn't get extra incentives for that, it's expected.

But I see the point, and that's a good idea.

Good luck... it can be a rough age at times!

My husband's daughters from a previous marriage were (and to some extent still are) absolute monsters.

Something that really worked for us though, when they were about 9 or 10 was the Star System. This was drawn up on a big sheet of cardboard with columns and put near the fridge with stick on stars (gold, silver, etc)

We had them both think up a realistic list of things that they would like over a few months and then list the behaviors that would grant them the things they wanted, and the number of stars involved.

For example, say they wanted to go to the movies or sleep over with a friend. They would have to earn, say 10 gold stars. The behaviors that would earn them these stars might be - cleaning room, being polite, helping with dinner, not fighting and being truthful. Any time these actions were not done no star would be allocated, of if there were stars allocated and the behavior was bad, they would lose a star, and there would be no discussion about it.

At the end of each month, if a certain number of predetermined stars were achieved, they would get a surprise - say $10, or a toy, or a magazine.

I'm sure that you can find a better explanation of this on the internet, but we found it did work, because it rewarded positive behavior rather than focusing on the negative.

I might add, that it worked well for about 6 months and we knew the star strategy was coming to an end when they started to 'renegotiate' everything. It did shift the bad behavior to a tolerable level though!

Handipoints.com is an electronically site monitor version of the star system... and it's a wonderful tool for 7-10 year olds. They also earn clothing, furniture, and various other things for their charaters and can play their characters in a virtual world, safe for their age group. They can earn points and lost points accordingly and they cash in their points from everything from toys, sleep overs, making cookies with Mom to vacations. Points necessary valued by the parents. Everything is monitored and adjusted by the parents. It's a great tool for reinforcing positive behaviors. The site and all it's uses are free for the chore and/or behavior charts are free.

Handipoints - Print Chore Charts Free | Kids Allowances | Kids Virtual World (http://www.handipoints.com/)

My son is allowed on the computer, but my daughter is not. You don't have to do the online Virtual World, although it is a child friendly zone and I have supervised my younger daughter on some occasional use of it.

You can just use the site to monitor points with the child, once a week. I use Excel Chore Charts I created based on the website with them working the same point goals, the website just really helps track their earned points and their spent points.

Sorry to jump in now but I think one important issue has been overlooked.

The child is 9.

She has NO relationship with her mother by her mother's choice.

She lived with her grandmother until her father took custody of her.

Her father has had full custody of her for the past 5 years.

She now lives with her father and you.

Okay - now I guess this situation 'seems' normal in today's society because so many kids do have parents that are not married/no longer married. An adult can understand these circumstances and deal with them much better on an emotional level than a child can.

The kid is acting out. She is sending you and Dad a very clear message that she's not dealing with her life very well and she has some big issues that need to be resolved. Unfortunately - kids aren't very good at expressing exactly what they want or need when it comes to emotional confusion - it often comes out as bad behavior.

I'd suggest you back off a little bit and start TALKING to her. At nine years old - you'd be surprised at what a kid see and how they perceive things. Have you ever thought that maybe she's becoming attached to you and she has a fear that you are going to be separated from her just like the other women in her life? Have you ever thought that she's doing these things to see how far she can push you before she 'proves' that you're going to go away too?

She's at a really crucial age right now. Not quite a little kid but not as independent as a teenager. She needs a 'mommy' but she isn't a baby anymore either.

If you are serious enough with her father that you plan on being there permanently - then make sure she knows that and make sure she knows you are there for her too.

Don't harp on her or lecture her or tell her how you 'wish' she'd be. Tell her how much you admire all of the good things about her and the things she does well - encourage those good behaviors and talents. Ask her how she feels about things - ask her what she thinks - she needs to know she's included and she's important.

Do these things while teaching her the importance of honesty, responsibility and accountability and you will see a change in her.

BTW- why can't she use scissors? She's 9 - not 2. If you treat her like a baby - you can't expect her to act like a 9 year old. ;)

I'd suggest you back off a little bit and start TALKING to her. At nine years old - you'd be surprised at what a kid see and how they perceive things. Have you ever thought that maybe she's becoming attached to you and she has a fear that you are going to be separated from her just like the other women in her life? Have you ever thought that she's doing these things to see how far she can push you before she 'proves' that you're going to go away too?

She's at a really crucial age right now. Not quite a little kid but not as independent as a teenager. She needs a 'mommy' but she isn't a baby anymore either.

If you are serious enough with her father that you plan on being there permanently - then make sure she knows that and make sure she knows you are there for her too.



No, I never thought of that... thank you for that insight, I will take that into consideration.

BTW- why can't she use scissors? She's 9 - not 2. If you treat her like a baby - you can't expect her to act like a 9 year old. ;)She can't use scissors WITHOUT supervision. Because she cuts her hair every time she does. If she wants to act like a 2 year old, she'll be treated like one.

She can't use scissors WITHOUT supervision. Because she cuts her hair every time she does. If she wants to act like a 2 year old, she'll be treated like one.

Is she cutting it to make it shorter because she wants shorter hair - or is she doing it as a threat - like it's going to make you look like a dork? Apparently she has not thought out the consequences - she cuts HER hair - SHE looks like the dork and SHE has to deal with it. Harsh - but it is a choice and the consequence will be remembered every time she has to look in the mirror or someone asks her what the heck happened to her hair! LOL!

Ya might want to tell her that she can go right ahead and cut her hair - but SHE'S the one who is going to look funny if she does. She'll have to live with it until it grows out.

I have a 9 year old son - he pulls some of that stuff on me - well he used to but I made him LIVE with the consequences of HIS choice rather than begging or cajoling or bribing or threatening him to change his mind. He'd have a tantrum if we didn't go where he wanted to go and say he wasn't coming with us. Okay! I'll call the baby sitter and YOU can stay home - but you will not be watching TV or having 'fun' time - you can sit in your room and pout. We'll be out having fun. Without you. Only had to call him on it once. He got the message and figured out sometimes it's not always good to get what you ask for.

You're in such a tough position - it really is harder when it's not your child. But be patient and love her (trust me on this one - even birth parents can feel the same way you do at times!) - my brother went through it with his two step children. But in the end - they were his children. Both of them petitioned the court on the 18th birthday to have their last name legally changed to his. Because THEY wanted to. He could not have ever gotten a bigger present.

That's really cool about your brother. Her father has done that, and she doesn't care. She does it every time. She's trying to grow her hair out, so I don't get it.

I didn't read through everything chi, so forgive me if I'm repeating something you already answerd :(



But have you considered ADHD? Or another behavior disability of some kind?

Much of what she has done is not all that unusual for her age. Many 9 year olds won't fess up, even when you know full well that they did something. If you know for a fact that she did something, don't bother to ask her if she did, that only sets her up to want to lie about it in an attempt to avoid getting into trouble. If it is important enough to merit consequences, then deal with it matter of factly. Many will procrastinate with school work... set a time when it gets started, supervise the work, and let her know she does nothing else until it gets done. Many will shove stuff under the bed, in closets, in drawers, etc. to get it done so they can go play... thinking that you will somehow not notice. Give some incentives if you think it might help... be very specific... clean your room may not be enough, stating that you want her clean clothes put away neatly, dirty clothes in the hamper, and toys on the shelves may give you better results. Put the list on her door if it helps and have her check them off as each one is done. When finished, you can go out for a treat or do something fun.

Certainly talk to her and let her know you are there for her, but she also needs to understand that there will be consequences for her choices. Try not to catch her every time she makes a mistake... pick your battles as to what is really important. Praise the good choices that she makes.

Sit down with her and her father and the three of you discuss how you can all work together to make some changes... discuss expectations... and the importance of learning responsibility. As she sees that you take the time to work with her and guide her, she will understand that you are there for her and that you care about her and what she does.

Here's a way to entertain her:
This is a virtual worlkd for kids and is TOTALLY safe.
Www.virtualfamilykingdom.com

I don't care to explain but this post needs to be closed due to not being relevant any longer. Thanks.

You have a complex situation here that will be difficult for you to resolve without professional intervention.
First of all I have to advise you that being a step-parent is a difficult, thankless job; much harder than being a parent.
You have entered into a difficult and frustrating situation which will take up all your energies and reward you with heartache at best.
I can tell from reading this that you, and this child's father are not experienced, or skilled parents and you suffer from some misconceptions about parenting and child development. Soap in the child's mouth for example is strictly child abuse for any reason. You have a very troubled girl on your hands who needs professional help. She should be in ongoing individual and family therapy. The traumatic separation from and rejection by her mother have probably caused this child severe reactive- attachment disorder. Although many of the behaviors you describe such as lying are normal in children, they do seem fairly excessive in her case, possibly partly because she is above average intelligence. Get her some counseling and take some parenting classes. You will all be happier. But do realize that, as the step-mother/surrogate mother-figure to this child a lot of her underlying anger at her own mother, and her fear and jealousy at the threat you pose in her young mind to her security in her relationship with her father are going to be directed at you, and cause her to target you in her scheming and "trouble-making".
You've definitely got your work cut out for you. It's going to require tremendous patience , like that of a saint, for you to deal appropriately with this child who is likely to drive you crazy. And she's not even a teenager yet! Just wait! Are you sure you want to take all this on?
I warn you, it's a thankless job.
You'd better have a heart of gold!

Invicta, please refer to above post. This isn't a relevant thread any longer and needs no more response. Thanks.