Hi,

First let me apologize if this is too long or annoying, I just really need help. To sum this up my parents have been married for about 20 years now. I am their oldest child (male, 16) and there's my little sister (14).

My dad went on holiday for about 2 weeks and came back 2 days ago. He told me now that I have the choice to either stay with my mother or with him because he's intent on getting a divorce and that's it.

He says it just can't work out anymore between them and this is it. However from September to December my parents were at war about divorcing.

My dad got my mum kicked out the house by the police, he wanted to divorce her and she didn't want to. My dad was going to marry some other women but in the end he realised she was a crazy b*tch and my parents reconciled in December.

Anyway you're probably thinking my dad is a b*stard or something but that's not true and well what happened is done and it just happened so never mind.

My mum thinks that he is trying to get a divorce for another woman (who is presumably in England).

The thing is we live in Austria right now and if I chose to stay with my father I can go and live in England (where my dad's from). I'm english but I never had the chance to live there before.

If I chose to stay with my mother I have to go and live with her in Syria (where she's from).

I'm torn between the two and don't know what to do.


Can anyone help me? This isn't a funny subject and I need help from experts who know what they're talking about.

Thanks,

-Xm8

As the youngest of a bunch of 5 kids and having to walk in on my dad cheating on my mom wasn't easy and it didn't make it easier to find out they are getting a divorce. Yes its hard but for sum they just face it unlike for me I was given a decision also but I took a stand don't let them make you choose tell them strait up I'm not going to decide one parent over another you two made this decision so you two can fix it and if you think separation is really the answer then your only thinking of yourselves not others around you or how it would effect your kids so the best thing to do is just keep an open mind about it don't be afraid to talk about it to your parents and also its good to keep a good friend,brother,or even a sister to stick by you and talk to.. it helps keep your mind off things

I say don't decide. Don't let them make you decide. They are both your parents and have been there for you since you were born, the best thing to do is don't get stressed or go into depression because you can't decide. Just don't choose at all!

I would say that you need to make a pro and con list. One list with Moms name and one with Dads.

Understand what the culture is like in both places,and what be more appealing to you personally.

Look at all of your options.Language barriers ,if any,making new friends.Are you able to communicate more easily with one parent.

I would also suggest that you could do a joint custody,if your parents are agreeable.Six months with one and six with the other.

It's a tough decision and I wish you the best !

Thanks for the replies everyone.

My mother thinks that I shouldn't decide and I should make my dad understand that I shouldn't have to go anywhere or decide anything.

Damn this whole story sucks. My mother is trying to reconcile but my dad just doesn't want to and is sticking with his belief that "it just can't work anymore after 20 years of fighting".

I have to admit they ALWAYS fight, like all the time. Not everyday but very often and it got ugly a couple of times.

I'm not sure what I want to do. I guess staying here is the best because I'm used to it but I'd also like to live in England because I want to, it's my damn country.


-Xm8

Thanks for the replies everyone.

My mother thinks that I shouldn't decide and I should make my dad understand that I shouldn't have to go anywhere or decide anything.

Damn this whole story sucks. My mother is trying to reconcile but my dad just doesn't want to and is sticking with his belief that "it just can't work anymore after 20 years of fighting".

I have to admit they ALWAYS fight, like all the time. Not everyday but very often and it got ugly a couple of times.

I'm not sure what I want to do. I guess staying here is the best cus I'm used to it but I'd also like to live in England cus I want to, it's my damn country.


-Xm8

I know you are being put in a very difficult position and I hope you have good friends who can help you though this tough time.

Thanks artlady.

The thing is I don't have any good friends but whatever.


-Xm8

What has your sister decided? I think you'll be happier in England though, because that's what you seem to want.

My sister is kind of... alien to this whole thing. She hugs my mother etc when she cires and is very supportive but she basically seems to be in her own world right now and doesn't mind much I guess. If she had to take a side, she would take my mother's I think, but she loves both parents equally just as I do.

And like you said I think England would be better for me, but I'm not so keen of living with only one parent. I know I'm supposed to act my age and be cool with whatever happens but it is kind of hard.

-Xm8

I imagine it is difficult, and divorce is hard on everyone. Adjustments will have to be made. And some hard choices for sure. But you can still love your family, whether they are together or not, no matter the circumstances.

Yea that's true but my mother told me that if I decide to leave her and even accept that my parents should sepperate at all, she'll stop talking to me.

I don't think she's serious but when she says things like that I'm not sure what I'm supposed to do.

I want to become a doctor and it will only be easier for me to study in England from now, not wait until I start University to actually go there, so that is one of the main reasons I want to go to England and I told my mother buit she doesn't seem to want to understand.

-Xm8

XM8,

Here is a little more input.

As tough as it might be, you can navigate this situation.

Your dad is initiating the divorce, so it's predictable for your mum to resist and to try to get you to refuse to make a decision. Let her have time to assimilate and adapt to this change.

You love both your parents and don't want them to fight all the time, or separate, or suffer. You and your sister don't want to suffer either. So, make sure you deal with it as it is, and don't interpret any of the fault as belonging to you. Be clear that your parents are creating this, not you or your sister.

What would happen if you tell your parents that before anything happens, you insist that they see a family therapist or marriage counselor? The goal would not be to keep the family together. That would get your dad to resist. The goal would be, in fairness to you and your sister and in fairness to them, for your parents to determine the best way to create a satisfactory arrangement between them. That would include having the family as a whole devise an arrangement for the two of you. Don't be afraid of using little guilt to get them into therapy.

Tell them that it would be irresponsible to not take this step. Stand up for yourself and your sister. Counseling will give you time to figure out where you want to live (looks like England) and to work out a plan to see them both periodically. Get ready for more independence and responsibility.

You might also consider discussing it as a question of where best you would be able to obtain the sort of education and career opportunities you want. It doesn't have to be an issue of who you want to live with, but more of what location is going to give you the most opportunities.

Unfortuantely, sometimes when the idea of divorce is being raised, adults don't always think about what they say and the potential impact. They are speaking out of anger and hurt, fear and frustration. At times, the kids can almost be more of an adult in the situation than the adults will be.

Try to keep that in mind with what your mother said. Let her know you understand that she is hurt and angry, that you love her dearly and that you know she wouldn't stop talking to you because you know that she loves you too much to hurt you like that. You also know that she and your father would want you to pursue what dreams you have for your own future and that includes the sort of education and career path you want to take.

If they divorce, you will always be able to have visits between the two. It is a difficult and sad situation to have to consider, but sometimes all you can do is try to make the best of it.

Sorry about this long post.


Tell them that it would be irresponsible to not take this step. Stand up for yourself and your sister. Counseling will give you time to figure out where you want to live (looks like England) and to work out a plan to see them both periodically. Get ready for more independence and responsibility.

I'd like to stand up to them but the thing is I don't know if they'll listen to me. My dad will just shrug off the idea of seeing a marriage counselor.

Before yesterday we went for a lovely drive and we got talking. When I asked him why he just can't patch the situation up he told me he's had 20 years of "this crap" and it just won't work anymore.

My mother is.. oh well she's not taking this well and just wants everything to fall into place.

I'm standing in the middle of this because I can see the faults of both my mother and father. My mother only sees my father's faults but not hers, and vice versa. As for my sister, she's just staying out of all this and I assume she's just going along with the breeze.

I want to help but I feel like this is going nowhere. I may seem like a real assh*le for saying this but I'm not so worried about my parents getting divorced. I say to myself : What is the point of us all being together if my parents are just going to keep on fighting and maintaning a negative environment?

In the past 5 years so much crap has happened to all of us. My mother and I got into a fight, she called the police on me and my dad. Then a few months ago my dad got my mother thrown out the house by the police for a month.

I didn't talk to my mother from September until December because I was so ashamed of myself.

Pretty crazy I guess, but the point is that although all of this happened, my parents got along as if nothing had happened. And now my dad suddenly comes along with this new plan...

I'm so worried about my school work I don't really want to get involved with this. I'm just thinking that I'll finish school here and move to England at the end of this school term and that's that.


You might also consider discussing it as a question of where best you would be able to obtain the sort of education and career opportunities you want. It doesn't have to be an issue of who you want to live with, but more of what location is going to give you the most opportunities.

I know exactly what you mean. I tried telling my mother that I want to go to medical school in England and work their as a doctor anyway, so what would be the harm in moving there now?

She told me that she wouldn't mind if my father said that the whole family is moving there, but since that isn't what he's planning, it's not OK.

I told her that what she said sounds a bit selfish and she told me that me and my sister are in need of a mother and a father figure.

My dad sees it as I'm old enough to be in the armed forces now (I'm 17 in a few months) and that I should start acting like a man.

Maybe true but what about my sister? She's barely 14 and a half.

This whole situation is really confusing and I have no idea what to do.

-Xm8

Your father had the nerve to tell you to start acting like a man?? That's something he should have been thinking about himself in regard to some of his choices in the past. Hopefully he has learned some hard lessons himself from all that has gone on. Besides, I'd say you are handling the situation quite maturally... better than most your age likely would.

Is there anyway your family could move to England and if they want to divorce, do so after the move? Would your father do that much to make the transition easier for everyone else? That way you would be closer to both of them.

I know your mom would like you to stay with her, but you might point out to her that you are at an age when many kids move away for school anyway.

In an ideal situation, a child would have both a mother and father, but that obviously doesn't always work out... for a variety of reasons, and it isn't always in the child's best interest anyway.

Can she honestly say to you that having the family together, with the frequent fighting and negative atmosphere is a better environment for the children than if they separated and could find happpiness and contentment elsewhere?

She is hurt and fearful, and I fully understand that. She is facing the prospect of her marriage dissolving and not having both of her children with her. Certainly not what a woman expects to experience when she gets married and has a family.

Continue to try and talk to both of them, if possible at the same time, to discuss (not argue... and make that a request upfront!) the best ways to help you and your sister through this. Acknowledge their feelings, but remind them that they need to put those aside for a moment and consider you and your sister and your needs, wants, goals, etc.. They owe it to you both to make sure you have the opportunities you would have normally if there was no divorce looming.

Do keep an eye out for your sister. She may appear to be handling this in a quiet and reserved way, but more than likely she is scared, hurt, and confused. Sometimes being too quiet, when something so major is occurring, is a way to deal with things when they are too overwhelming. Just let her know you are there for her and she can count on you when so much else around her is changing.

I wish you well, I hope your parents will be able to put aside their anger towards each other and not lose sight of what is really important.

Don't give up on your dad. Make the case that the purpose of seeing a counselor is to get professional help to make the transition work the best way possible for all of you. Tell him clearly that it's not just the two of them who are separating. It's all of you. Tell him that you are confused and worried about your schooling and that you would benefit from a therapeutic process. So will your sister and mother. Remind him that no matter where you live, you still count on him to act as your dad and will continue to do so. He might be giving up on his relationship with your mum, but he will always be your dad.

There is nothing that will make this easy, but saying what needs to be said under therapeutic supervision and hearing what you all need to hear will make things go much better. Maybe you are old enough to take it "like a man" but there is no need to make this harder. There is no benefit in moving apart a reactive or thoughtless manner. If you succeed at getting everyone before a good counselor, you all will get time to process this change. Maybe your parents will come to terms with their divorce and get to a reasonable understanding. Maybe not, but it's worth a try.

Plus, a smart counselor will spot your parents' patterns and get them to own up to their contribution to this situation. Again, the goal is clarity, not staying together. If you can be a man, so can your dad. Since the fights have reached the point of involving the police and getting your mother out for a month, your home is not completely safe; both your parents have some work to do.

So do you. As confusing as this is, you can focus on school, take care of your body, take care of your emotions (You might insist on counseling for your sister and you to reduce the affects of this event and the years of bad behavior that led up to this event; then, seeing benefit in you, maybe your dad will become willing to participate) and refuse to be put in between them like something being used as a bargaining tool.

Your mum's argument that you need both parents falls flat. Nobody needs two parents who are fighting all the time.

Keep your head on straight. You will be OK.

Thank you both DoulaLC and Taopir for your help.


Is there anyway your family could move to England and if they want to divorce, do so after the move? Would your father do that much to make the transition easier for everyone else? That way you would be closer to both of them.

I don't think that my father would accept because he just wouldn't want to. He's pretty set on leaving, and without my mother. He's already seen someone to sell his car (I was with him) and he's leaving again for England in less than a week, so he's not joking about going there.

Even though he's leaving, my dad's still there for me as he told me that I have the choice to join him in England but I can't wait too long before telling him, meaning he needs to know in a few weeks.

I know my dad is putting me in a difficult situation, but I can't say he's a bad person, because he obviously didn't just pack up and leave. He provided us with a beautiful home and sends us to a private school so I know he works hard to support us all.

Plus, it's not as if he hates my mother, he still talks to her like he usually does, I'm guessing because he told me he wants to "part peacefully" and not by leaving a big piece of crap in everyone's hearts and minds.


Can she honestly say to you that having the family together, with the frequent fighting and negative atmosphere is a better environment for the children than if they separated and could find happpiness and contentment elsewhere?

I asked my mother that same question and she answered me by saying that "I'm not the one who makes the problems".
When I tell her that she's changing the subject, because I obviously didn't ask her who or what is the reason behind the problems, she immediately tells me to go away or to stop talking to her.

I think that she is trying to avoid the truth, the truth she doesn't want to accept. I'm not blaming her, I feel sorry for her because she has this image in her mind that all should be perfect and it isn't.


Do keep an eye out for your sister. [... ] Just let her know you are there for her and she can count on you when so much else around her is changing.

I'd like to but I think it would be a bit awkward for me. I know it's pityful, it's just one of my character flaws. I can't be straight forward about emotions, or anything personal with people I know too well - especially my family, it's kind of embarrassing.

But I'm always doing my best to have as much fun as possible with my sister and just keeping both our spirits up, so I think everything should be OK.

Taopir, I fully understand the benefits of counselling however I'm afraid seeing a counselor isn't really a likelihood for any of us, especially my dad.

My dad is so busy working and doing things that he doesn't have time for that, and wouldn't want to see a counselor anyway. For him the marriage is over and that's just the way it is. I asked him why does this have to happen and he just tells me the same thing over and over : He can't stand the fighting anymore, it's not working with my mother, the situation is giving him health problems (high pressure, back pains).

I know he's not lying to me, all of the above is true but isn't there some way to fix this?

How am I supposed to be looking at this whole situation anyway?

To be honest I think I'm being a bit selfish here. Just for my fantasies of finally being able to live in England and going to school in English, I'm doing a horrible thing of secretly being for my parents' divorce.

I haven't said it to any one of them yet that I want them to get divorced, I've said the opposite.

But what if it's a good thing for my parents to get divorced? Is that even possible? Would it be right?

-Xm8

Oddly, sometimes it is a good thing for parents to divorce. When the situation becomes so toxic that it literally causes health concerns, then it can be a very good thing. If one, or both, can't see a reason to keep trying, if they feel it is not something they want to keep working at, then they are better off separating. Chances are they, your mother in particular, will see this more clearly as time goes on and she finds she enjoys not having the arguing and tension that was there before. It is quite likely your father will experience fewer health concerns due to the change in stress level as well. Sometimes you just don't see things for how they really are until you are out of the situation.

It is not wrong of you to feel some sense of relief that they are going to divorce, or that it will be a reason to open the door for you to study in England. You didn't make the situation happen, you can't stop it from happening. Unfortunately the children of divorce are along for the ride and hopefully the parents can work towards making is as smooth as possible.

You've spoken to your mother, she knows your feelings and what you would like to do, there is not much else you can say to her. She will likely be giving it some thought now that she has been made aware. Hopefully she will come around... but she might not, at least not right away.

You are going to have to do what you feel is best for you now, your parents will have to sort their own lives out.
If you go to England, keep reminding your mom how much you love her and keep in as close of contact with her as possible. That is likely one of her greatest fears is that she will lose contact with you if you are separated.

As for your sister, maybe write her a letter. Sometimes putting your thoughts, and what you want to say, down on paper is much easier than talking face to face... look what a brilliant job you have done here!

...he told me he wants to "part peacefully" and not by leaving a big piece of crap in everyone's hearts and minds.

Sounds like he is determined just go. He might feel that if he doesn't move now, he won't have the strength and stamina to endure any more. It's complicated, what he's doing, and painful, expensive, and emotionally draining for everybody. He's got to feel serious guilt. He's probably done telling himself that he can make it work if he only tries harder, but some part of him will remain disappointed in himself. Having failed at this, and feeling awful about it, he will also feel elated, liberated, and energized. That's because it's a new start.

You're feeling some of that, too. Your secret desire to have them split so you can exchange a battleground for school in England comes as no surprise. It's not a horrible thing. You'd have to be twisted to want that way of being a family to continue. The wise thing to do is to either change it or, if you can't change it, leave it.

"I'm not the one who makes the problems".

Your mum is having a hard time with this. I don't know what you can do for her except pay attention to her, listen to her and be truthful to her. For her, as well as for yourself and the others, be present (if that term makes sense). You're right. She's in denial, and your dad appears to be on a track for which she is not prepared. My suspicion is that she wouldn't see a counselor either, but she has work to do to sort this out. But, she's waiting for your dad to actually leave.

I would advise you to go to work on your mum, too. Get to therapy. Deal with yourself. But your statement below leads to another conversation.

"I can't be straight forward about emotions, or anything personal with people I know too well."

This illuminates a piece of work that you can do to help improve the situation. The one thing that all of you will need going forward is the ability to communicate with each other, and you won't need to be communicating about the weather. Your difficulty being straightforward with people close to you is like a key that, once you resolve it, fits a lock that holds your family in a kind of mental/emotional prison. What would it be like if you made resolving this difficulty an area of study, something you take from all of this, your personal art? Can you see yourself having a good time unraveling this knot?

Right now, your dad is making a break, and it looks like you might be going with him. Teach yourself to be present.

Sorry for having taken so long to post back. School work and such..

Well my dad left this morning to England and it's been very hard on my mother. She's been cleaning the house and crying throughout the whole day. Actually, she's been doing that all week.

My parents had a huge fight 2 days ago while I was out, my dad basically smashed everything up in the house and my mother ended up cleaning it as usual.

Anyway, we're in a pretty crappy situation, one which I thought I'd never be in. My dad left my mother, my sister and I with only 150 euros and said that after 3 months he'll stop paying for the school and house and.. well what the hell is that? Plus he left his bank account with an overdraft of -2500 euros believe it or not, so we can't withdraw any cash. School fees and the mortgage payments are due in less than 2 months, what do we do?

He's basically black mailing us into moving away at the end of June. And now I'm not even sure I can go to England and stay with him because he said it "might be too late for me to enroll".

I'm busting my chops trying to get good marks at school and this situation right now is not helping at all.

Any advice? What do we do about the money? How are we going to get through, and how do I comfort my mother?

Just on a side note, I feel like I've been cheated out of a good life and this is real b*ll.

Please help me, I'm stuck.

Thanks,

-Xm8

P.S.

My mother is even more mad/sad because she told me she overheard my father on the phone, speaking to some woman about getting married and I don't know what. She thinks it's this same chick who sent my father an X-Mas card ; an old friend from high school or something.

Damn... wth is going on here?

Your caught in the middle of a very emotional battle between your parents. No child should be put in that position.

Its time for your mom to talk to a lawyer, and get some much needed help for your family.

Get a lawyer? Well I highly doubt she can afford a lawyer right now..

-Xm8

That's where the wonders of the internet can help with. You can find one that has a free consultation, and good terms.

Thanks, I'll tell my mother.


-Xm8

My dad left my mother, my sister and I with only 150 euros and said that after 3 months he'll stop paying for the school and house and.. well what the hell is that? Plus he left his bank account with an overdraft of -2500 euros believe it or not, so we can't withdraw any cash. School fees and the mortgage payments are due in less than 2 months, what do we do?

At this stage, I have to ask you a few questions:
What is your ethnic background?
What are the countries of origin for both parents?
What is your family's religious orientation? Are either of your parents religious?
Is there a history of violence in your family?
I ask all this to determine whether you or anyone in the family is in danger or not. Also, cultures are different, and my advice might work in my culture but not yours.
Finally, do you have aunts, uncles, or family friends that you can turn to now?

You didn't expect to grow up this quickly and this soon. But this is where you are. If you can muster up the courage, and this is a time for you to have courage,you should confront your father. Tell him that he is being surprisingly cruel and astonishingly selfish, and causing all of you unnecessary suffering. Get ferocious, pissed, and indignant, and tell him that as his son, you expect him to be a responsible human being. Control your anger but use it. Convince him that he can find a way to get himself out without destroying the lives of the rest of you.


He's basically black mailing us into moving away at the end of June. And now I'm not even sure I can go to England and stay with him because he said it "might be too late for me to enroll".

I'm busting my chops trying to get good marks at school and this situation right now is not helping at all.

Any advice? What do we do about the money? How are we going to get through, and how do I comfort my mother?

The advice that Talaniman gave you is sound. There are government agencies throughout the developed world that help people in situations like yours. Google up, ask around, and get help now.

The source of this crisis is your father. He's probably got a girlfriend. Maybe being with her and away from your mother is the best thing for him, maybe not. But he is just seeing what he wants, comfort, sex, friendship, a new face, no fighting (yet). This is tough for you to see your dad do, but just digest it and get used to it.

He's like a drunk and you have to treat him like a drunk: Clear, no-nuance communication about the reality of the situation, no escape from the consequences of his actions, equally inescapable feedback about the consequences of his actions, and refusal to support his addiction. You can't put consequences on him, but you can provide loud and clear feedback. If you and your sister just take it without screaming, you are helping him continue on this path.

No one is standing up to him. You are next in line, unless you have other family or close friends of his to whom you could make an appeal for help. Check in to your instincts and follow them. Some part of you will figure out the very best role for you and will know how to take care of your sister, mother, and you.



Just on a side note, I feel like I've been cheated out of a good life and this is real b*ll.

Please help me, I'm stuck.


Yep, this is tough. But you can handle your part of finding the way through it. You have to. Keep your head on straight. Trust yourself to grow into this and you will.

Awaiting your reply,

Tao

Thank you for your answer taoplr.

My ethnic background? Well.. I'm half English, half Syrian. I guess I've got a mix of both cultures, but mainly British anyway..


What are the countries of origin for both parents?

My mother is from Syria and my father is from England


What is your family's religious orientation? Are either of your parents religious?

Yes they are religious, both my parents are catholics and have been their whole lives.


Is there a history of violence in your family?

Yes there is.. My father used to beat my mother, right from the start of their marriage (20 years ago). My mother would fight back but, she's no match I guess. He used to break a lot of things in the house as well like chairs, tables, ornaments, furniture etc.

He also used to beat me - more than my mother. And he also broke a lot of my stuff : lamps, wallets, computers, watches, school bags, DVDs, computer games etc.

That all stopped about a year ago because I called the social services on my dad, so he stopped beating me. He also stopped beating my mother, but that was because she threatened him with the social services a few times.

Plus I also stood up to my father last year after he broke the top part of my bed and scabbed my whole arm with it. I punched him in the face a few times while crying and shouting and I think he got a bit scared of me after that. But even though I was kind of right to do it I still feel sick to my stomach to this day about it.


Finally, do you have aunts, uncles, or family friends that you can turn to now?


Well we're in Vienna (Austria) right now, initially because of my dad's work, so to answer your question : No, there are no aunts, uncles or such that I can turn to now. My mother's siblings are all in Syria, and my dad's brother is in England. My dad's brother and mother both support my dad fully with his idea of buggering off and "starting over" (if you can really call it that).

And no family friends either, not for me anyway. I know my mother spends a lot of time on the phone talking to the local priest and to some of her close friends but I'm a loner so..


If you can muster up the courage, and this is a time for you to have courage,you should confront your father. Tell him that he is being surprisingly cruel and astonishingly selfish, and causing all of you unnecessary suffering.

I think I've found that courage. The next time I get an e-mail from my father (if he even decides to mail me) I'll tell him exactly what I need to. At first I thought it wasn't so serious, but now that he's actually gone and my mother told me what she heard him saying on the phone and everything else, I'm just stunned. I'm not freaking out or anything but when the time is right, you can be damn sure I'll give my dad my 2 cents.


The advice that Talaniman gave you is sound. There are government agencies throughout the developed world that help people in situations like yours. Google up, ask around, and get help now.

I know it's always a solution but my mother is concentrating on getting herself a job as soon as possible. If the sh*t really starts to hit the fan I think she'll turn to a government agency that will help us.


No one is standing up to him. You are next in line, unless you have other family or close friends of his to whom you could make an appeal for help.

Yes you're right. I presume my father only really listens to me, or at least more than he does to my mother and sister, so yes I'm next in line and it's up to me to stand up to him.

I'm just wondering if I should cut all contact between me and my father. Maybe he might feel guilty, right? Or is that a fantasy?

My mother just told me it might be some mid-life crisis. My opinion, and I told her, is that anyone with a mid-life crisis doesn't just piss off and leave his wife and children behind with debts, does he?

I get the impression maybe we can all make him feel guilty by not speaking to him anymore, something I would do anyway out of disgust. But would that be wise or not?


Let me thank you once again taoplr for your lengthy and kind answer. It helps to know that someone out there gives a damn.

-Xm8

Thank you for your answer taoplr.
My father used to beat my mother, right from the start of their marriage (20 years ago). My mother would fight back but, she's no match I guess. He used to break a lot of things in the house as well like chairs, tables, ornaments, furniture etc.

He also used to beat me - more than my mother. And he also broke a lot of my stuff : lamps, wallets, computers, watches, school bags, DVDs, computer games etc.

That all stopped about a year ago because I called the social services on my dad, so he stopped beating me. He also stopped beating my mother, but that was because she threatened him with the social services a few times.

Plus I also stood up to my father last year after he broke the top part of my bed and scabbed my whole arm with it. I punched him in the face a few times while crying and shouting and I think he got a bit scared of me after that. But even though I was kind of right to do it I still feel sick to my stomach to this day about it.


OK, so he has a history of violent abuse, and when you fought back he backed off. Do you think that he might escalate his violence if he doesn't get his way? Did he leave te country for England? If you are not sure, you would be wise to talk with the police, social services, or any other specialist who can (1) Inform you if you all are in danger, and (2) intervene if he comes back and gets violent again.

I'm sure that it is hard to have this happen with your Dad. Maybe one day you can help him make things right.


My dad's brother and mother both support my dad fully with his idea of buggering off and "starting over."


Ah! A grandmother! So she is not a fan of your mother, since she supports him in leaving, but how is she with you and your sister? Can you pull some heartstrings with her? Can we leverage through her and put some serious guilt on Dad? She supports him in leaving, but does she support abandoning his children with no money? And, how do you know that she supports his buggering off?



And no family friends either, not for me anyway. I know my mother spends a lot of time on the phone talking to the local priest and to some of her close friends but I'm a loner so..


Well Dude (I'm from California) you're not a loner any more; you're the virtual head of your household, the senior male. Your mother is going to need recovery time and loving support, and some of the support will include listening to things that you would rather not hear. You're the crown prince of the castle.



The next time I get an e-mail from my father (if he even decides to mail me) I'll tell him exactly what I need to. At first I thought it wasn't so serious, but now that he's actually gone and my mother told me what she heard him saying on the phone and everything else, I'm just stunned. I'm not freaking out or anything but when the time is right, you can be damn sure I'll give my dad my 2 cents.


That will be a very important communication. Start writing notes now. You can finish the email when the school year is done.

Somewhere in all this, you will revisit the option of going to school in England. Put that whole subject on a slow cooker in your mind. Don't give it too much energy now. Concentrate on the well being of the three of you. Each will have a preferred process for healing, restarting, and making a life without him. He will always be your Dad, but he might not be an active part of your life. Do your best in school.



I know it's always a solution but my mother is concentrating on getting herself a job as soon as possible. If the sh*t really starts to hit the fan I think she'll turn to a government agency that will help us.

Yes you're right. I presume my father only really listens to me, or at least more than he does to my mother and sister, so yes I'm next in line and it's up to me to stand up to him.

I'm just wondering if I should cut all contact between me and my father. Maybe he might feel guilty, right? Or is that a fantasy?


There is a very good possibility that he will wake up one day and realize what a schmuck he has been. His new romance might end. She's a lot younger than he and he might not be able to hold her. If it's a mid-life crisis, it will end. I'd like to stimulate the guilt in him, so if you have a good relationship with your grandma, this is a good time to call her and tell her what just happened and what your finances are. Tell her you love her (if indeed you do)


I get the impression maybe we can all make him feel guilty by not speaking to him anymore, something I would do anyway out of disgust. But would that be wise or not?

I'm not sure at this point about the best way for you to deal with him. He's made a huge move. There will be a moment when the heat of all this cools down an he realizes that he's the same man with the new girlfriend as he was with your Mum. Before that, he will feel remorse about abandoning his kids. His character will be revealed by how he treats the two of you. So, trust your instincts on how and when you communicate with him.



Let me thank you once again taoplr for your lengthy and kind answer. It helps to know that someone out there gives a damn.


Some may call me a dreamer, but I'm not the only one... You've got friends on this side of the ocean.

Tao

Do you think that he might escalate his violence if he doesn't get his way? Did he leave te country for England? If you are not sure, you would be wise to talk with the police, social services, or any other specialist who can (1) Inform you if you all are in danger, and (2) intervene if he comes back and gets violent again.

Well yes he did leave the country for England, yesterday. Will he come back and get violent? No, I highly doubt that because.. Well, the other day he smashed up half the house but he didn't hit anyone, I think he's too scared of the police/social services. So I presume that he won't hit anyone if he came back..


Ah! A grandmother! So she is not a fan of your mother, since she supports him in leaving, but how is she with you and your sister? Can you pull some heartstrings with her? Can we leverage through her and put some serious guilt on Dad? She supports him in leaving, but does she support abandoning his children with no money? And, how do you know that she supports his buggering off?

The thing is, my grandmother's in England right now so in any case none of us maintain that much contact with her. Last time I spoke to her was in November. Last time I saw her was 4 years ago.

Pulling some heart strings with her won't work I'm afraid.. She's no fan of my mother, just like you said and I'm not so sure she would listen to me and my sister anyway. I'm positive that she supports my dad and wouldn't change her mind.

She obviously knows that he's leaving us here, but what else has my dad told her? I don't know. He probably lied just like he did to his new girlfriend (whom he by the way told that my mother is abusive, swears all the time, and is "disciplinary" - how ironic of him).


That will be a very important communication. Start writing notes now. You can finish the email when the school year is done.

Right - I've already started forming a letter that I'd like him to read some time soon.


He will always be your Dad, but he might not be an active part of your life. Do your best in school.

I understand. That's something we're having to face right now, all three of us. I can't say it's so easy, but me and my sister are taking it much better than my mother.

I'm just going to concentrate on school work so I can take my mind off this problem..


There is a very good possibility that he will wake up one day and realize what a schmuck he has been. His new romance might end. She's a lot younger than he and he might not be able to hold her. If it's a mid-life crisis, it will end.

Yea I really hope he realises one day that his actions are pretty crappy and didn't benefit anyone but himself.

Well the thing is his new romance, is some woman he knew back in high school, that's all I know though. To be honest, I don't feel like knowing anymore than that, it's revolting...


I'd like to stimulate the guilt in him, so if you have a good relationship with your grandma, this is a good time to call her and tell her what just happened and what your finances are. Tell her you love her (if indeed you do)

Well I wish it were that easy. You see my father took me only once to England in the past 12 years so "thanks" to him I never had a chance to get close to my grandparents over there at all. That's just great, seeing as my grandfather also died last year and I barely got to know him..

I think my grandmother would just shun us off..


There will be a moment when the heat of all this cools down an he realizes that he's the same man with the new girlfriend as he was with your Mum. Before that, he will feel remorse about abandoning his kids.

I think that the only way he will feel remorse is by showing him he's made a mistake, because, to be honest, I think that my dad has no idea of the pain he's causing us. He thinks that it's just so simple to piss off and leave us here. I'll make sure I tell him off when I write him that letter. A response is guaranteed.


Some may call me a dreamer, but I'm not the only one... You've got friends on this side of the ocean.

Good to know :) It seems this side of the ocean is full of assh*les lol

Thanks,

-Xm8

P.S.

Do excuse me if I don't answer for a day or two, I've got a chemistry and maths test coming up so I'll be busy studying. I'll post back ASAP.

It is sounding more and more as though your mother actually is better off with your father leaving, she just doesn't realize that yet.

If he stays in communication with you, do let him know your feelings regarding his lack of support. Your mother needs to see about a lawyer so that you, your sister, and she are all taken care of as you are legally entitled to be.

Your father is showing what his priorities are right now... in time, he will possibly realise that he could have handled things differently,but he likely has seen this as his chance to escape a situation he was not happy in.

As taoplr said, focus on doing well in school and taking care of yourself, your sister, and your mother.

Strongly encourage your mother to seek legal counsel very soon. She may be reluctant, as it means it is a step towards divorce, but she really needs to protect herself and you kids financially. Your father can not just leave and decide for himself what he will and won't pay.

Stay strong... but remember to lean on friends and family as well.

OK. Do well on your exams. If anything changes, let me know.

And, for that part of you that feels liberated in the midst of all this change, there is no need to have any guilt. You are becoming free from a terrible atmosphere of parental strife and now have the opportunity to grow where that atmosphere had restrained you.

"There is nothing about a caterpillar that tells you it's going to be a butterfly." -Buckminster Fuller

Hi and thanks for the answers.

As for my exams I did OK I guess.

Anyway, my mother has been reading up a lot on the internet this week and she is convinced that my dad is going through an extreme form of male mid-life crisis. This is because he spends a lot of money (which is true) and some other criteria which I kind of forgot..

Moreover, she asked me if I thought it was a good idea to send my dad these articles she's reading on the internet so he "wakes up". I told her not to because I feel that sending him that kind of stuff would be like a judgement on him and he might get all defensive.

I also told my mother I'm going to write my dad that letter, but she keeps pushing me to write it sooner. She wants it done this weekend because she fears that the longer he stays with his new girlfriend, the more he'll forget about her and us.

Maybe that's true, maybe it's not, but I'm not so keen on writing my dad a letter to be honest. It's probably school work, but I'm really tired and lazy at the moment.

Oh and dad wrote me an e-mail, addressed only to me and my sister (weird, huh?). He said "sorry for contacting you so late" blah blah blah.

Should I answer this with the letter I want to write to him?

What about my mother's ideas? Are they good or not?

Thanks for the help,

-Xm8

As for my exams I did OK I guess.

Good.It's probably a good thing to leave the insanity at home for the insanity at school for a while.


... she is convinced that my dad is going through an extreme form of male mid-life crisis. This is because he spends a lot of money (which is true) and some other criteria which I kind of forgot..
Ask her again and take notes; send me a copy. Also, if you feel comfortable posting it, send a copy of your father's email. If you don't want it shown in a public forum, send it by a private message (AskMe community: I don't mean to exclude anyone, just to give XM a chance to be comfortable with this information)


Moreover, she asked me if I thought it was a good idea to send my dad these articles she's reading on the internet so he "wakes up". I told her not to because I feel that sending him that kind of stuff would be like a judgement on him and he might get all defensive.
Good call. Anything coming from your mom will be rejected.


I also told my mother I'm going to write my dad that letter, but she keeps pushing me to write it sooner. She wants it done this weekend because she fears that the longer he stays with his new girlfriend, the more he'll forget about her and us.

There is an equal chance that the excitement will wear off and he will see the reality of what he's done. He's been riding an emotional wave that won't sustain unless his relationship with his girlfriend proves to be The One, and he's ready to dramatically change his patterns. It could happen, but it's a rare event. In any case, his relationship with your mom is bad, and nothing you have reported here says they are likely to get back together.


Maybe that's true, maybe it's not, but I'm not so keen on writing my dad a letter to be honest. It's probably school work, but I'm really tired and lazy at the moment.

Write the letter that you need to write. It's for you to unload. You will benefit from letting your anger out, and expressing your thoughts and other emotions. But you don't have to send it. Do it.

My advice is to send a carefully crafted, edited, focused letter, for which you will have a specific outcome. (a targeted response such as opening up a new level of dialog with all of you, whether he comes back or not.)


Oh and dad wrote me an e-mail, addressed only to me and my sister (weird, huh?). He said "sorry for contacting you so late" blah blah blah.

Should I answer this with the letter I want to write to him?


The content of that email is very important, as is your response. There is no "blah, blah, blah" in it. There might be BS, as your dad is in a self-convincing frame of mind, but every word in that email will tell you something about him that you need to know.


What about my mother's ideas? Are they good or not?

I don't know. She's wounded and unable to think through the possibility that her marriage is over. It won't hurt for her to do that web research, and to try to understand and influence the situation, your dad, and the two of you. She must feel helpless, and that's no good. Listen to her when she expresses herself. Your sister and you might be the only people she can confide in right now.


Thanks for the help,

-Xm8

Keep your head on straight.

Just be come and try to get them to stay together tell them how much you love them and don't want to lose them

Good.It's probably a good thing to leave the insanity at home for the insanity at school for a while.

Hell yea lol It's great getting good marks. I've become one of the nerds. Sort of...


As for the e-mails well there's not much that's private. I haven't answered any of them until now. The first message was like this : "Sorry for writing so late, accomodation problems and got the flu".

Then he wrote me another a day later "Hi, You okay (got my last email soem days ago ?) Let me know. All the best, Love, Dad

Then he wrote a third one, this time to my sister to tell her to forward him something through the mail. And he told her to get me to answer his e-mails.

A fourth e-mail arrived, before yesterday. Just the subject "you there?"

I wanted to tell him happy birthday a few days ago but I thought it wouldn't be such a good idea.

My mother has been making "draft" letters she would like to send him, but I told her not to because he might not like it.

Eitherway she got an e-mail from my dad saying that he wants her to sell the car and contact the school so me and my sister are withdrawn.

I don't care about the car but hey, I want to go to school. I'm not a position to just change, that's not fair FFS.

Anyway my mum's pressuring me to write the e-mail I want to send him. I'm going to write it and post it back here, if that's OK with everyone.

Oh and I thought I might just add. This new girlfriend of his, she was some chick who used to go to school with him like 30 years ago. She sent my dad an x-mas card a few months ago, with her e-mail on it. Apparently the got into contact and he's with her right now. He also wants to marry her. I know this because my mother overheard him on the phone.


There is an equal chance that the excitement will wear off and he will see the reality of what he's done. Well I hope soon because he wants us out of this house in 3 months so he can sell it and out of the school. I don't believe this... He told my mother he "can't spend money here and there". Well who made him go to England and rent a new flat? Damn...

Thanks once again for the help,

-Xm8

P.S.

Sorry for not posting in a while, school work.

Hell yea lol It's great getting good marks. I've become one of the nerds. Sort of...
Nerdiness is better than being at the clueless end of things.


... I haven't answered any of them until now... he wrote me another a day later "Hi, You okay (got my last email soem days ago ?) Let me know. All the best, Love, Dad

... this time to my sister to tell her to forward him something through the mail. And he told her to get me to answer his e-mails.

A fourth e-mail arrived, before yesterday. Just the subject "you there?"

I wanted to tell him happy birthday a few days ago but I thought it wouldn't be such a good idea.



Two important things here:

One, he's reaching out to you and your sister. Don't take this lightly. You need this contact with him to work out practical matters like money, where you go to school next year and where you live, and to develop your influence on him regarding how he treats your mom.

Two, no matter what happens, he will be your father forever. As much as he's being a jerk, you will have a relationship with him even after he dies. You might feel unwilling to talk with him now, but you will feel different later.

It is in your interest to keep a flow of dialog going with him, as hard as that might be.


My mother has been making "draft" letters she would like to send him, but I told her not to because he might not like it.


It is very good therapy for your mom to write these letters. Encourage her and support her in this. No, she should not send them; they are for her.


Either way she got an e-mail from my dad saying that he wants her to sell the car and contact the school so me and my sister are withdrawn.

I don't care about the car but hey, I want to go to school. I'm not a position to just change, that's not fair FFS.


What's FFS?

What plan is he proposing to your mum? Selling the car and withdrawing the two of you from school are not a plan. What are his goals? Yours? Your sister's and mum's?

The school year ends soon. Does he plan to have you move to England or something else? Your mum might know what he is thinking and planning, but she's not being candid about it.You can get a lot done if you talk with him.

Regarding your mum, you should ask her to let you read the emails he sends her, and don't rely on her report. She will select parts of his messages that support her side of the story. Just ask her and tell her you want a direct look at his words so you can understand him better.


Anyway my mum's pressuring me to write the e-mail I want to send him. I'm going to write it and post it back here, if that's OK with everyone.

Do it soon. Get everything in there, and let the extraneous or repetitive parts be edited out later. Don't hold back.


Oh and I thought I might just add. This new girlfriend of his, she was some chick who used to go to school with him like 30 years ago. She sent my dad an x-mas card a few months ago, with her e-mail on it. Apparently the got into contact and he's with her right now. He also wants to marry her. I know this because my mother overheard him on the phone.

What he does and what happens remain to be seen. He's on a high because he's got a romance without all the dull parts of marriage: paying bills, cleaning, taking care of dinner, mundane tasks, etc. He's also not fighting (I assume) which must be a big relief. But give it time. And don't be attached to anything because it could all change very quickly.



Well I hope soon because he wants us out of this house in 3 months so he can sell it and out of the school. I don't believe this... He told my mother he "can't spend money here and there". Well who made him go to England and rent a new flat? Damn...


This is why you must stay in contact with him. You are the negotiator, like it or not, for getting the resources that your mum, your sister, and you need. He has to support you through school, manage your health care, give your mum enough money to live on, and be a responsible father. Unless a big piece of the picture you are giving us is missing, he's trying to avoid that responsibility.

Please do this: Send us, by private message if you prefer, all the emails he has sent since this whole thing started. We can then interpret his intentions ourselves.

Draft your letter (school comes first) and send it to us so we can interpret, comment, and advise you. You can manage yourself, and the key elements of this situation successfully.


Thanks once again for the help,

-Xm8

P.S. Sorry for not posting in a while, school work.

Keep at it and a good outcome is assured.

tao

Has your mother gotten in contact with a lawyer yet? She needs to do this to protect you, your sister, and herself financially. All the hoping for change in the world isn't going to make it happen... she needs to make sure you all are protected. Whether she likes it or not, your father has moved on and will do what is in HIS best interest at the moment.

He can not just sell the family home or car out from under you, you do not have to withdrawl from school just because he tells her to do so.

Write him back, share your thoughts and concerns... but encourage your mother to get legal support. This responsibility should not fall to you.