Hello All,

I'm from Ontario, Canada and I'm really hoping someone can help me.

I have a court order from Family Law Courts, stating my husband is "responsible for the balance and liabiliy owing on a joint credit line and shall indemnify and save harmless the respondent" (me). I have a second order finding him in "contempt" of same order. Five months later, he claimed bankruptcy. The bank does not acknowledge the orders and finds me solely liable for the debt. Understandable, I was a co-signer. His bankruptcy trustee did not notify me as a creditor. Is there any way I can get my husband to pay this debt. Don't the orders stand for something. It has effected my credit score and I don't have the money to pay it, not that I would. Should I write to his trustee asking for a "Proof of Claim" form and oppose his discharge or will this harm me more?(That's if I get it to them on time). Should I take this to small claims court and sue him for the amount? Can I sue him for more because of damages, i.e.. Credit rating, fear of garnishments (bank), lien on property? I don't know if this is worth mentioning but he had opportunities to pay the debt (inheritance/sale of estate house). A month before claiming bankruptcy he was served court docs. By FRO to attend a "Default Hearing" for support arrears (over 11,000.) to be held 2 months later. The amount was paid immediately. Not sure if he didn't realize he could not discharge the arrears. I believe he claimed bankruptcy to cause hardship and expense to me. He works under the table and has for quite some time. Sorry this is so long but I thought the more info I put out, the better understanding of my problem. Please help!! Thanks

I would request that the credit bureau investigate that particular account. Send along your documentation showing that you are not liable for the debt. The bank isn't going to do that for you; they want to get their money.

I don't know about Canada; I'm in NY BUT in NY unless the creditor approves one party taking total responsibility (in theory the "loan" is rewritten or the credit card debt is refinanced) the bank has no legal responsibility to follow the Court's instructions or the wishes of the parties. I see you being responsible for the debt.

Then I see you going back to Court and alleging that you did get "your share" in the divorce because of this.

Good Girl this8384... when you get out of bed treat yourself and have an awesome day.

Thanks for the advice. Way ahead... already sent docs to credit bureau. Waiting for a response.

Thanks for the response JudyKayTee. I do realize the bank will not release me from this debt, however, with the court orders, I'm hoping I can resolve this issue. Were you being sarcastic re: going back to court and alleging "I did get my share"?

Any more advise from anyone would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks for the response JudyKayTee. I do realize the bank will not release me from this debt, however, with the court orders, I'm hoping I can resolve this issue. Were you being sarcastic re: going back to court and alleging "I did get my share"?

Any more advise from anyone would be greatly appreciated.


No, I'm absolutely sincere. If you settled for fewer assets, for example, because this debt was going to be taken care of by your "ex" and now it's suddenly your debt, then you were cheated and did NOT get your fair share of the assets. Your argument is that if you knew you were going to have to pay this debt you would still be in Court, trying to reach a more equitable settlement agreement.

For example, there were 2 cars. You got the car worth less money but this debt was to be paid. He got the more expensive car. Now you have the car worth less money AND the debt - you didn't get your fair share.

I think you have a really good argument.

Thank you. I didn't look at it that way. Very good point. Will look into it.

There are two obligations here. His obligation to the creditor and his obligation to you. His obligation to the creditor is discharged in bankruptcy. His obligation to may not be. S, 178 of the Bankruptcy and Insolvency Act sets out those debts that are not subject to discharge. A debt for alimony or any debt or liability under a support, maintenance or affiliation order or under an agreement for maintenance and support of a spouse or child living apart from the bankrupt are not discharged in bankruptcy.
From your explanation it would appear that his failure to pay what was ordered might fall into this category. Upon the discharge of the trustee or with leave of the bankruptcy court you could commence an action in a court of competent jurisdiction for the amount of the debt. Also, the terms of the Family Law order were based on his paying these debts. In the event, he does not you could ask the Family Court to vary the order based on his failure to comply with the earlier terms. The latter option is more expensive.

If the debt is less than $10000.00, you could sue him in Small Claims Court alleging that his debt to you was not discharged and is due. He may not wish to go to Court as his employment and under the table income may come to the attention of the Canada Revenue Agency.

Thank you IKnowalotofstuff.
I was thinking of taking one more shot with Family Court by filing another "Motion for Contempt". I'll explain in detail, the events from time of order to bankruptcy to paying support arrears. Then I'll ask the Judge to put him in jail if he refuses to fulfill his obligations to the original order.
You mentioned to ask the Family court to vary the order. What would I ask to vary the order to?

It's been a while but I did take him back to family court and the judge wasn't impressed with him at all because he had an opportunity to pay the debt when his mother's house sold back in Jan. 2007. The judge ordered that he pay the debt off through support payments. Problem is that he hasn't paid anything. I have an opportunity to oppose the discharge of his bankruptcy. His trustee said that this debt may fall under a "preferred creditor". I'm so undecided about this. It's a lot of work and normally that doesn't bother me but I'm more concerned it will do more harm than good. 1st will I get anything out of it (claims he has no money and is self employed) and 2nd if his discharge is conditioned and the trustee later becomes discharged from his bankruptcy and he hasn't fulfilled his conditions, that would mean all the creditors could come back after him for payment. In the interim FRO has just given him notice for a default hearing to be held in Oct. Please help, I'm at my wits end. The collection agency is still calling. Again, so thankful for this site and for everyone who replys!

Opposing discharge screws up his life but doesn't help you. It is obvious he does not want to pay. You need leverage. The only thing I can think of is his driver's license. Get FRO to take it away from him for non payment. That will get his attention.

Unless you can afford to pay the line of credit, do not pay anything. If you do not make payments for two years the Statute of Limitations kicks in. They can't sue you then. If they proceed to legal action, settle or seek other options.

I'm not interested in screwing up his life, just want the debt paid off so that the collection agency gets off my back. FRO has taken his licence away for a second time in April, 2009, and they took it away last year. Do you know if the Statute of Limitations kicks in from the last payment made or last admission of debt. I have requested the collection agency to provide a document signed by me relating to the debt. So far no reply. Thanks so much for responding. I don't feel so alone in this.

When you obtained the line of credit, did you sign the application form? In other words, are you sure you are legally responsible for the debt? If the creditor is prepared to sue, they must have this information available.

The SOL is two years from the last payment or written acknowledgment. Verbal acknowledgment is not enough to reaffirm the debt and start a new limitation period. Do not correspond with the CA in writing.

When you obtained the line of credit, did you sign the application form? In other words, are you sure you are legally responsible for the debt? If the creditor is prepared to sue, they must have this information available.

The SOL is two years from the last payment or written acknowledgment. Verbal acknowledgment is not enough to reaffirm the debt and start a new limitation period. Do not correspond with the CA in writing.

Their original post said they co-signed.

I assumed I signed the agreement because I was married to the guy but maybe I didn't. That is why I am now asking CA for a copy as proof. They have stopped calling for a week and I haven't received anything yet. Thanks again to all!

The fact that you were married does not make you indebted on the line of credit. You had to be at the creditor's place of business in order to sign. Spouse could not sign for you. Do nothing until you are satisfied with the information provided.

I will do just that. I do know when we first received the line of credit the amount was set at 12,000 but several years later it was increased to 28,000. I'm not sure I signed for an increase either. Again, thanks!

I will do just that. I do know when we first received the line of credit the amount was set at 12,000 but several years later it was increased to 28,000. I'm not sure I signed for an increase either. Again, thanks!

I never sign for increases; the credit issuers give them automatically.

To this8384:
You originally signed something or acknowledged something that render you subject to future credit increases.

A and B are married. A goes to the bank and obtains a line of credit for $10000.00. A requests that B have access to his $10000.00. B uses A credit facility over the years. The statements come in A's name. A goes bankrupt. There is a chance that the creditor sends the account to a CA because of the supplementary user status. B is not a joint borrower but an authorized user and not responsible for the debt unless she signed something originally making her a joint user.

What I want Letitbeover to find out is if she is an authorized user or a joint borrower.

To this8384:
You originally signed something or acknowledged something that render you subject to future credit increases.

Right; that was part of the user agreement. What I meant by my statement was that it's not unusual for an issuer to increase a line of credit, if that's what the user agreed to.


A and B are married. A goes to the bank and obtains a line of credit for $10000.00. A requests that B have access to his $10000.00. B uses A credit facility over the years. The statements come in A's name. A goes bankrupt. There is a chance that the creditor sends the account to a CA because of the supplementary user status. B is not a joint borrower but an authorized user and not responsible for the debt unless she signed something originally making her a joint user.

What I want Letitbeover to find out is if she is an authorized user or a joint borrower.

That's what we're all waiting for :) Hopefully the creditor will give her the paperwork she requested but we all know how that goes...

In the absence of Proof of Indebtedness, a debtor may take the position that they are not responsible for the debt. The burden of proof that a debt is owing is on the parting making the claim. The creditor granting the line of credit can produce this proof either before or as part of some legal process to enforce payment of the debt. One would think it less costly to provide this information voluntarily prior to any legal action as its production might avoid legal action all together.

On the other hand, some collection agencies buy write-offs, statute barred accounts, etc. for pennies on the dollar. They then try and collect or settle the larger debt. In many instances, the original creditor only provides electronic data without hard copies of documentation. If this is what happened here, it is possible that there is no proof of debt other than what appears in electronic data form. This is insufficient. Letitbeover must not cave to collection pressure and make the CA produce the evidence.

Tell the collection agency you "dispute" the debt until such time as proof is provided. The SOL may lapse while you are waiting.

If your question is whether a Family - or any other Court - Order can change an existing contract (such as a debt) the answer is no. The creditor does not have to honor the Court Order because it is/was not a party to that action.

You will be responsible for paying this and cannot sue him if his bankruptcy is in order. I question whether he had to claim this debt because there was a co-signer - you.

I would consult with an Attorney to be certain (I am in the US) but similar problems have been posted before.

Was that your question?

To JudyKayTee: No that was not the question. In Ontario as in New York, if the creditor is not a party to a proceeding in Family Court, they are not subject to the Court's ruling.

In Canada, a debt for support or maintenance is not subject to discharge (s. 178 of BIA). As such, the husband will be discharged from the debt for the line of credit. If she is responsible for his line of credit, she needs the support money to pay it. He is not paying. She does not need 2 problems - non payment of support AND payment of his or their debt.

Ontario is not a community property province like many states in the US. The question here is whether Letitbeover is responsible for a debt incurred during the marriage when she is not sure whether she signed for the debt or was simply an authorized user on her husband's line of credit. In Ontario, collectors tend to lump joint debtors and authorized users into the same group and chase them until the situation is clarified. I have seen many authorized users who think they are responsible for a debt when they are not. Letitbeover should not pay until she is certain she is responsible for payment.

So my suggestion is she do nothing until satisfied whether she actually owes the money. CA must provide written proof. Then Letitbeover can decide if she can pay OR settle OR needs bankruptcy protection herself.

You did read that she's a co-signer? That makes her responsible. I am in NY, not a community property State - very similar to Ontario.

Her question is whether there is a way to get her husband to pay this debt. I say there is not.

All the rest of this is superfluous and another lecture on Canadian Bankruptcy Law - similar to this posting where others failed to see the question: https://www.askmehelpdesk.com/current-events/bankrutpcy-laws-264725.html

If she cosigned, she owes the money. If she is not sure, she better find out. I read the material as she is not sure. It does not hurt her if she waits until the information is provided. The longer an account is with a collection agency unpaid... the better the chance of a settlement (if this is what she has to do).

Also the SOL may come into effect.

If the question is limited to finding a way to make her husband pay the debt directly, I agree with you. There is not. If the question is how do I get money from my husband so I can pay the debt, my comments may be of some benefit.