Entire story merged

New to the board. My ex dumped me two weeks ago. We loved each other, talk about marriage and kids. But the alarm bells in my head were going off. I basically couldn't believe what she was saying. There were many things she did that I could not understand. She would never introduce me to her friends, who were mostly guys. She would frequent this bar dressed in stripper attire, with one of her female friends and love seeking attention from other guys. And my ex was somewhat promiscuous, and 50% of the guys she'd slept with, hang out at this bar. Her female friend is another post altogether and a complete wretch of a woman. My ex had lied to her best friend and never told her that she had been dating me. But when it was me and her, things were fine. And I do think she did love me, but she just had an odd way of showing it.

She had her own apt. but she basically lived with me (meaning she spent every night and every day at my place). We had wonderful times, and basically, unless her wretched best friend was around, my ex was always with me. Anyway, I told her these things were bothering me. That I did feel uncomfortable how she sought so much attention from guys. That I'd love to meet her male friends, since they were people she had fun with. She'd met all of my friends. Why was she so hush, hush, about dating me? And she would only hang out with these guy friends when she was with her wretched chick friend. I said that I'd like to meet her guy friends too. But she would never let me meet any of them. She would never even mention with me with the few close friends she had. Like I was not even part of her life. My ex was indeed a private person, but I thought this was a bit too extreme.

She did this repeatedly and I would tell her that it bothered me. Then one day, I finally had it. I got really mad and just told her I hated what she was doing, and that she was driving me mad. It was awful. I've never been so upset with anyone in my life. My ex was in tears. Anyway, two weeks later she broke up with me even though she was in tears through the whole thing. Said no one had ever hurt her as much as me by the things I had said. I did the horrible thing of begging her to take me back the very next day. She said she actually wanted a "break" and was in the process of seeing a shrink. I said a break was just a break up. Despite this, she wanted to still give me a ride to work everyday. But I said no. A break up is a break up, and that meant we should never speak, see, or talk to each other again. She asked if that meant forever, I said probably, wished her good luck and walked away. Haven't spoken to her since the break up. No contact.

I did all the things I should be doing I think. I've been surrounding myself with friends, not staying at home, trying to focus on work, and also I went on a date. And actually, that's the second part of this post. I had a date on Thursday night. And I really hit it off with this girl. I was expecting nothing, but sparks flew, things are good. Made out with her, spent the night at her place after the first date, which according to her has never happened before, but who knows. Anyway, no sex, just making out and talking. I parted ways with her, saying I'd call again.

So my two questions, when should I call the new chick again? I've already kissed her (maybe a little more) and spent the night. I was thinking sometime later today. Don't know if that's too soon. I don't think it is. I think I like her, but my ex is still lingering in my head. But I don't want to blow it with the new girl. I don't know if it's just a rebound or I like her or maybe both. I think that's possible.

Second question, was my ex acting normal for a woman in a committed relationship? She's almost 30. In my opinion, someone almost 30, talking about marriage and kids, shouldn't be acting this way. What could I have done, if anything, to prevent the break up? I know getting so mad at her was wrong, but that was the culmination of months of frustration. I never yelled at her before that day. I just didn't know what else to do aside from break up with her myself. But I wanted to make things work.

Hope to hear from you Wildcat. Anyone else's advice is also appreciated.

--Cali


P.S.
I work with my ex, but she's in a different building. Also we have mutual aquaintances, but I've managed no contact.

So far, so good leave your ex all the way alone and be very careful of jumping into another relationship so soon . What's the hurry unless you need to soothe your own hurt feelings with the attentions of someone else. Not fair, and really selfish. Heal on your own time and expense not someone else's. Stay strong and away from the ex-Good luck!!

It's a well known phenomena that ending a close relationship produces a loss so great that people are very affected for some time afterwards. The period has been proved by lot of people to be best spent with platonic friends, especially ones of the same gender and reflecting on your life, taking stock, sorting out what went wrong (hopefully you'll get to ask and answer both why you were putting up with what you put up with too) and making changes where you see fit but no dating. It is also a time where you are vulnerable to striking up a rebound relationship that is almost guaranteed to fail, landing you right back here again. The time for taking a break from the romance department varies but I have seen it not work if its under a year. Funny how that one year guidelne mirrors in many cultures the same period set aside for grief work for those who lost a partner through death too. Probably for many of the same reasons. If you find a year without a romance difficult, then something else may be operating here and worth taking a closer look. Those are my thoughts that I hope are helpful to you.

There's no set time when you should contact the new girl again. Just play it cool and don't rush into things. As for your second question, no, your ex wasn't acting normal at all. I think you did the right thing by breaking up with her and I'd stay away from her for a long time. Get on with your life without her. Maybe she'll eventually try to craw back in to your life. If she does, then hopefully she'll have turned over a new leaf. If not, then it's "sorry but I'm not available".

I would definitely forget the ex. It is hard but I think there may have been more to her relationhsips with her ex's at this bar then she is letting on. Just the impression I get from your post. Leave her be and move on with your life.
You sound like a great guy so I'm sure you'll find someone worthy of you.

As far as the new girl. Be very very careful here. It sounds like a rebound relationship developing. Just take it real slow. And I mean REAL SLOW. Just call her occasionaly and keep it light and fun.

I'm 4 months into a breakup with a girlfriend of 7 years and I know I'm not near being ready for any kind of relationship. Sure I talk to girls, have a dance, coffee and whatever but as far as relationship goes I really found that I needed time to myself to sort out my life and look after No. 1 for a while.
That is just me though. But id quietly suggest that you think about a similar sort of break. This new grl may seem great, but it may just be that you are filling in that missing part left by your ex with her. And that isn't fair on anyone.

I know. What I am doing with this new girl is wrong. And it is sad. She is completely smitten on me, and she is very nice, perhaps not as beautiful as my ex, but still very attractive, very accomplished, and somehow, she has fallen head over heels for me, in two dates. I have to break it off with her because I don't want to hurt her bad. That would be god awful. I just don't know what I'm doing anymore. I am still in love with my ex. I still think about her all the time. I miss her like crazy.

I just don't know. When I was with my ex, we spent so much time together. That is why I am certain she did love me. The only time any problems occurred was when her horrible best friend was around. For some unknown reason, she let her friend control her. And most of the things she did that were objectionable occurred when her best friend was around. And my ex was in the process of seeing a shrink about what was going on in her life. It sounds stupid but it was like she was two persons. Sweet and loving when she was with me, and wild and crazy when she was with her friend. And she excluded me from the wild and crazy side of her life. I didn't mind that she had a wild side, I have one too. I just wanted to experience that side of her too. She was the woman I was going to marry. I included her in every facet of my life.

I even asked her if there was stuff I could do to improve as a boyfriend and she said she was very happy with me. Anyway, I am actually certain that my ex never cheated on me. She enjoyed having fun and getting attention from other guys. But it just seemed so odd when she was in love with someone that she thought she'd marry.

Anyway, I still miss her, despite the alarms bells that went off in my head. And I'm spending my time with friends, going out, not staying at home, even started taking salsa lessons. And like I said, I went on a couple dates with this new girl, which was wrong of me. I know with time, it will pass. It has too, but I'm going crazy. It's so hard to push through at work and keep my concentration. What else can I do?

Cali Dude - I answered you in your private e-mail. I was traveling. The Cat

Women with low self esteem for the most part have a controlling 'queen bee'.

Dude - WAYYYYYYYYYYYyy too many red flags with this gal. Stay away - The drama is what is killing you.

Ok, so some of you have read my story. I haven't contacted my ex in three weeks. I sometimes want to, but I haven't cracked and I hope I don't. She hasn't contacted me either, and I don't think she will.


However, I'm slightly confused. Wildcat, I've read in some posts when you are advising females, you say that guys will jump through hoops if they want to be with you. However, the most well documented policy is no contact, i.e.. "make them miss you." When should a guy jump through hoops and when should he employ no contact? Is it determined by who broke up with who?

If you're a guy and you broke up, you jump through hoops to get her back? If the girl broke up with you, you leave her alone?

Anyway, I'm sure my ex is never coming back. I'm really sad and also very angry. I don't plan to ever contact her. And I think I most likely won't. She should come back to me. She was the one who broke up.

Clarification: when do you jump through hoops, when to you leave it be?

Hoops don't count then... that's the early stages... after the early stages they know you... they've been to the circus...

if your cool about things... keep it mysterious... you are always the prize... don't get soft... have a total spine... be busy doing other stuff... tease her, make fun of her sometimes... suprise... PLAN SOME GREAT THINGS. Laugh... did I mention MAKE HER LAUGH?? You got to make her laugh. = YOU CANHAVE THEM JUMP THROUGH HOOPS TO BE WITH YOU.

Personally I think you surrendered too much too her... saw her too much... let her get away with too much (goingto the bar).

Guys should never jump through hoops = reeks of desperation... you want the women to jump through hoops - keep the ball in your court. Don't put complete importance in them = heartache.

Women are part of your life... not your life.

Ok, now I am confused... I totally see why this question was asked... so women are to contact the guy after a break up? Or whoever broke it off should be the one to come back?

Good question.

First... YOU CAN'T JUMP THROUGH HOOPS FOR SOMEONE IF THEY BROKE WITH YOU. That only happens in the movies. You only PUSH them away further. They made up their mind at that pont that they want to/need to move on withOUT YOU!! It would be repulsive to them if you did.

People WANT what they can't have. ALWAYS!!

Ideally - IF you give the person who broke space... they may come back. It'sthe only way- you need to make them miss you, remember what they gave up.

Of course there can't be any cheating - ever, abuse - verbal or physical, lying, drugs/alcohol abuse.

She broke up with you so if you want her to ever possibly have regrets then you need to adopt a "no contact" policy. As far as you're concerned she's disappeared from the face of the earth. After all, she can't very well miss you if you're "jumping through hoops" now, can she? There's no guarantees that she ever will eventually miss you but if you go on with her life as though she doesn't exist any more, you'll at least have a chance. In time you may even find that you don't want her back. After all, surely you don't believe that she's the only interesting woman on earth, do you? There's plenty of others out there that you can have fun with. Get out and explore your options. The results just might surprise you.

Got it! :)

If she breaks up with you... no contact.
If you break up with her... no contact.
Jumping through hoops... never.

I tried to rep you Tal but...

A breakup followed by contact is call "mind games"... sign up at your own discretion but don't be then complaining about the games.

It's been a month since my break-up. I have not contatced my ex once, nor has she contacted me. She really wants it to be over I guess.

In that time, I've hung out with friends, tried to focus on work, taken small road trips, started taking jujitsu lessons, even dated a new girl who really likes me. But today, I feel as bad as I did right after the break-up. What is the matter with me? The wound is not healing with time. It seems to be getting deeper. The reality of how badly I was played perhaps is sinking in. I don't know. But it's awful.

I finally took a day off from work today. I haven't missed any work until now. Today, I'm just sitting at home and feeling miserable. I feel like such a loser. I can't help but remember how she said she "loved me", wanted to be with me forever, wanted to have children with me. How could everything have been such a lie? And why was I not good enough for her, what was missing in me? Why couldn't she be happy? I did everything I could for her, but I wasn't a pushover. Is that such a fault? That I was unwilling to let her get away with anything and everything?

The worst part is, she's not going through any of this pain and struggle over me. I'm sure she is content, perhaps already with a new man, not even giving me a second thought. That is how meaningless I was to her. Why can't I be like her and forget and move on so easily? I was the one who got screwed, why is it harder for me to move on?

What really is my problem? Sorry for the rant. I'm just hurting really bad today and I wish the pain would stop.

Don't worry man, you'll get over it. I'm in a similar situation now myself, and I have been in the past as well. Things seem great most of the time, but there's the odd time when the pain of that relationship will slip back into your mind. Just try to put it out of your mind, and keep busy.. move on with your life and don't dwell on your ex... trust me, from experience, I dated a girl for 5 years and after we broke up (I broke up with her) it took me a year to date again. It was the biggest mistake I ever made, as so many opporutnities passed me by. Its OK to grieve, but don't let her (who I'm sure is having fun and dating other guys) stop you from being happy

"The worst part is, she's not going through any of this pain and struggle over me." - how do you know? She just doesn't forget about you.

Go for a long run. I bet a lot of money you are not working out.

This gal gave a lot of insecurities.

People Want What They Can't have.

Do me a favor and read all the free articles at:

www.lovetactics.com - read them all.

Read every article on datin gand relationships at www.askme.com

Before you take up the wise advice of the previous posts and put this out of your mind, can we take a closer look at some of what I recognise (as in it takes one to know one LOL) here?


It's been a month since my break-up. I have not contatced my ex once, nor has she contacted me. She really wants it to be over I guess.
Warped logic: It means one thing about her and another about you somehow.
Reality: Well the same could be said from the other direction about you too - NOT that I am advising anyone contact anyone here, okay? Over is over and it looks like you both are living in reality, bravo for you both.


In that time, I've hung out with friends, tried to focus on work, taken small road trips, started taking jujitsu lessons, even dated a new girl who really likes me. But today, I feel as bad as I did right after the break-up. What is the matter with me? The wound is not healing with time. It seems to be getting deeper. The reality of how badly I was played perhaps is sinking in. I don't know. But it's awful.
Warped logic: Because it feels worse it must be getting worse. Why can't this be fixed by doing all the right things? I want it fixed now!
Reality: The shock may be wearing off, the reality of it takes time to sink in, the human psyche deals with loss in layers. It takes time to see the progress and frankly one month is not that long for the depth of loss. You are in grief, so just take it easy-- including on yourself.


I finally took a day off from work today. I haven't missed any work until now. Today, I'm just sitting at home and feeling miserable. I feel like such a loser. I can't help but remember how she said she "loved me", wanted to be with me forever, wanted to have children with me. How could everything have been such a lie? And why was I not good enough for her, what was missing in me? Why couldn't she be happy? I did everything I could for her, but I wasn't a pushover. Is that such a fault? That I was unwilling to let her get away with anything and everything?
Warped logic: I didn't do anything to deserve the relationship ending even though I am sifting over and over and over only the details that make me look faultless. Hey, maybe if I make myself out to be THE BIG VICTIM here, I'll recover my totally flattened ego and feel better... never mind that means I might be stuck playing the victim forever.
Reality: Whatever I did, I didn't realise it was bad enough to contribute to it ending. This is one hard lesson to learn. The only way to feel better is to learn what I need to learn to make this pain count for something but hey, I can do that!


The worst part is, she's not going through any of this pain and struggle over me. I'm sure she is content, perhaps already with a new man, not even giving me a second thought. That is how meaningless I was to her. Why can't I be like her and forget and move on so easily? I was the one who got screwed, why is it harder for me to move on? What really is my problem? Sorry for the rant. I'm just hurting really bad today and I wish the pain would stop.
Warped logic: I know how she is and she isn't hurting one bit.
Reality: You have no idea how she is.

That was a good rant and you need to let it all out. Grief means we aren't thinking too straight so I am not calling you dumb here either -- not at all, okay? This will go a lot easier if you would do two simple things. Begin to tell yourself the whole truth as much as possible, and lower your expectations. Grief is like recovering from a really bad emotional flu and it is a time for you to be especially kind to you. Now go reread the two other posts.

Hey quit beating yourself up; you don't have a problem at all. As others have mentioned, you have no idea how she feels, but honestly it doesn't matter. If you keep thinking about what she is thinking it will only make things worse. Be aware that one month isn't that long and it may take a while for you to move one. Some people, because they love too much or become attached too much, take longer to move on. This is normal and just a sign that you need to work on yourself. Just keep doing what your doing, stay busy, work out, hang with friends, and eventually--whether you believe it or not--she will become a distant memory.

What you feel is natural and human, Your supposed to feel bad right now. Time will heal if you go on with your life. Now get off that pity pot and get back to work. Stop worrying about her and make some positive moves in your own behalf. Stop making yourself miserable.

Yeah - every time ou start to think about her, think about something else... sports, another woman, something fun or funny

First of all, you did the right thing by not letting her get away with anything and everything. Secondly, don't assume that her life is all peaches and cream because it probably isn't. If she is "content, perhaps already with a new man, not even giving you a second thought", you can be sure she's going to play him just the same as she played you. Hopefully the poor sap will realize in time what she is and give her the heave-ho and fast! If instead he's willing to take her crap she'll keep dishing it out and that's why women like that do that kind of stuff, because of men like that that let them get away with it. This is her problem, not yours. She doesn't know how to treat people properly and it will come back to haunt her if it already hasn't. Sooner or later there's going to be a guy who'll REFUSE to tolerate her nonsense and he'll let her have it and good. This is not to say that he'll harm her physically (although he might and she could be setting herself up for that sort of thing) but he'll put her in her place and her world will come crashing down and she'll probably need to spend some time in a psych ward. After all that she may eventually straighten out or she may not. But as for yourself, be of good cheer, be happy that you'er rid of her and continue enjoying your life without her. When you get to feeling down about the whole situation just remember all the bad things and only the bad things about her. Make yourself a list if it helps. That'll help you cope and not let it get in the way of the things you'er doing now.

Great awesome advice abover here.
Don't sit at home and give yourself an escuse to be miserable.
It is going to hurt mate. It will hurts for months to come.
I'm 5 months down the track and it is still hurting. But I am going good too. The hurt doesn't control my life because I don't let it.
Be strong and stay on top of it. Let it out like you have here, learn and move on bigger and better.

It will be smeall steps but you'll get there.

As I said I still feel the pain everyday. But keep up the no contact. You need to concentrate on what you can do for YOU. You can only control what you do. Not her.

Look aftr yourself and keep moving forward. Sometimes there will be setbacks but I guarenteee you'll overcome them and get so much out of the expereince.

I saw my ex for the first time in over a month this last weekend. I did not break NO CONTACT. She came into the bar that she knows my friends and I hang out in, which was odd. I never go anywhere I think she might be. The second night, at a bbq, she didn't talk to me again. I went to the bbq, because it was a school party. Even thought I didn't want to because I knew she might be there, my friends said I should go. I finally went and talked to her. Maybe a mistake in the whole "get her back" scheme, but I can't behave like that being almost 30. I just feel like a bad person completely not acknowledging someone I once was so close too. Someone who lived with me.

My ex is very immature in my opinion. And to top it off, she has not even bothered returning any of my stuff. She still has some of my clothes, and my apt. key. I finally emailed her yesterday and asked her to return my stuff. My landlord has been asking me to get the key back, so I had to email her. She still has not returned any of the stuff, nor did she reply to my email.

It is cruel behavior. It is one thing to no longer love someone, but it is another to completely eradicate them from your mind. Like you never existed to them. That hurts a lot. And that seems like what my ex has done. I've had break ups in the past, but none of them led to the ex never acknowledging me again. They'd at least say hi if they saw me and talk to me.

Do people like this ever get their just deserts? Do they ever learn that you shouldn't do this to someone else? I mean she had one other boyfriend, who cheated on her several times. But she put up with him for 3 years. Even broke-up and then took him back. I never did such things, I was always supportive of her, and she treats me so cruelly after our break-up. I acknowledge I didn't do everything right in the relatioship. If you remember, I yelled at her one day because some of the thing she was doing.

I just feel so awful and like such a loser. I don't know what I did to deserve a girl who could learn to hate me so thoroughly. I'm even casually dating a new girl now, who is very nice to me. The new girl is really good to me, and I treat her well too, but I keep it casual. I see her maybe once a week.

My ex used to be so nice to me, and now she pretends I don't even exist. How can someone who cared about, supposedly loved you, wanted to marry you, have kids with you, hate you so much? Could I have really hurt her so much? That yelling was more powerful than actions? And that was only one day that I yelled at her.

She wronged me much more than I wronged her. And she is the one who hates me. I have lost so much faith in things after my experience with her. I have never treated people badly, not even after a break-up. And the person I loved most, treats me like crap afterwards, and during the relationship, she was usually the one who was doing things wrong too.

I am at a loss. How can people be like this? I guess part of me just hopes she suffers someday because of how she treated me. And she treats me this, all with a smile, which is even worse. Do people like this ever suffer for their wrongdoings? I know that sounds awful, but she just hurt me so much, and it was not justified.

Sorry for the long post. I'm just really upset, sad, angry. I'm trying to focus on other things, but sometimes, it is very hard.

What an awful situation to be in, I am sorry to hear that. I am about 2 months into a breakup. It does hurt that you were so close to the person, I feel the same in that way, it's like how can they just cut you off?

You have gone about things in the right way. Other members like Skell and Wildcat have been giving me great advice and support. I am sure they will be able to give you good avice too. Maybe if you carry on with the no contact thing for a while, and then try to get your stuff back again later.

Dude - did you send the e-mail? I hope you left the stuff OUT about the call.

I sent this email. It's verbatim.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Hey, could you return my house key and hoodie? My landlord has been
Asking about the house key, and I miss the "Special Blend".

It was really nice talking to you Saturday night. It was awkward for me
Too. But I couldn't see you two nights in a row, and not acknowledge your
Presence. It seems retarded.

Take care, and good luck with school. I'm sure you're on you way to a
First authorship in no time!

--------------------------------------------------------------------------

How someone treats me is not a reflection on me, but rather on them. How I treat others is a reflection on me and not on them. It's a good thing to keep straight at all times. And it is sad, the poor choices and ill-mannered behaviors I see far too often these days. My only solution is to rise above. I can see what class you have in wishing her well and so does the world -- you only need to trust it will come back to you in time. It really does work that way. We reap what we sow.

Does karma exist? Well in my opinion if you treat someone badly then you'll eventually end up receiving that same treatment. So will your ex-girlfriend get what she deserves? Maybe, but if she does your likely to never know about it, so just forget about her getting her just dessert.

I understand she hurt you, and it's definitely understandable that you're angry, but don't let these thoughts consume you. Let your anger out, and after you have done that move on with your life.

Forget about this girl and don't grant her the luxury of being on your mind. You deserve better and that's what you will get. Let her go and don't ever think about her again. The way she is treating you means that she doesn't even deserve a friendship.

This situation may not look like there is a positive to it, but trust me you will be a much better and stronger person in a few months because of it. In the end you will be thanking her for what she did.

Good - glad you left the call part out - shines a good light on you. Important.

I feel your pain but when my boyfriend of 3 years "dumped" me... I would avoid him at all costs! I have not seen him in 2 1/2 years! It is easier (to me) to get over someone if I don't have to see them! I know he asks about me to our mutual friends but... I don't want to see them! (**OUT OF SIGHT... OUT OF MIND! )

I think you are the bigger person here! It is very obvious that she is immature! You are not a "LOSER"! Take this "new girl" relationship slow! You are on the rebound now and now is no time to start a new relationship!

I've always liked the saying from the bible -- "do unto others as you would want done to you"! You still treat her as a person and not a "piece of crap" like she is treating you! I wouldn't change a thing of what you are doing! Just hang in there!

Well, she needs to return the stuff she has. That's just rude and holding something over you.

I understand you want things civil, but your email, in my opinion, still shows her she has the upper hand on you emotionally too. I would just keep all correspondence basic and don't let her know you are broken up or upset at all. Your admission is getting you nowhere, and she's seemingly enjoying having the upper hand.

Glad you seem to have someone else around now. Just be sure to take it slow. Its easy to do stupid things when you are not still completely grounded.

I agree with you all. Trust me, I did not contact the ex once, in over a month. She shows up on Friday to the bar she KNOWS my friends and I go to. She sees me, walks right past me, then walks past me on the way out. Not a word. Which is fine and understandable.

But the following night, at the bbq, she is there again. This is a departmental get together as we are both in grad school together. Again, she says nothing. I will be in grad school for 3 more years, and she will be here too. I thought I should just say hi and talk to her. We're both almost 30, this isn't high school.

But why on earth does she still hold onto my stuff? It's been over a month. Shouldn't she have the decency to return my things? That should be of her own voliton, I wouldn't have to email, if she had returned them. I'm even OK with not getting all my clothes back. But my landlord does want the apt. key returned.

As for the new girl, I am taking it slow. I've seen her three times in the last month. About as slow as I can be. I'm not emotionally available to anyone at this point.

I understand most of what is going on, but my ex's behavior is just irrational. Who doesn't return someone's things after a break up? I'm just stunned and baffled.

I agree with you all. Trust me, I did not contact the ex once, in over a month. She shows up on Friday to the bar she KNOWS my friends and I go to. She sees me, walks right past me, then walks past me on the way out. Not a word. Which is fine and understandable.

But the following night, at the bbq, she is there again. This is a departmental get together as we are both in grad school together. Again, she says nothing. I will be in grad school for 3 more years, and she will be here too. I thought I should just say hi and talk to her. We're both almost 30, this isn't high school.

But why on earth does she still hold onto my stuff? It's been over a month. Shouldn't she have the decency to return my things? That should be of her own voliton, I wouldn't have to email, if she had returned them. I'm even ok with not getting all my clothes back. But my landlord does want the apt. key returned.

As for the new girl, I am taking it slow. I've seen her three times in the last month. About as slow as I can be. I'm not emotionally available to anyone at this point.

I understand most of what is going on, but my ex's behavior is just irrational. Who doesn't return someones things after a break up? I'm just stunned and baffled.

In stead of playing along with this game she is playing with you... GO TO HER PLACE AND GET THE KEY! Then you will not have to e-mail her or ask her for it! Don't act made and don't act excited when you go to her place to get it! Just be cool and say that you really need that key back!

I understand most of what is going on, but my ex's behavior is just irrational. Who doesn't return someones things after a break up? I'm just stunned and baffled.
Don't be stunned or baffled anymore-- otherwise you'll miss the lesson here, perpetuate you being naïve and sign up, unfortunately, to learn this all again later. Know that its just some very kindergarten stuff that goes like this: "you hurt me so I'm going to hurt you back because then I won't feel as hurt!" People try it with anger too in place of hurt. Its called revenge. The really screwy thing is it doesn't work, it doesn't reduce the hurt. But people foolishly attempt it anyway, at least the immature ones do. Sadly, the world has immature, ill-mannered people in it. Part of gaining wisdom from an experience is coming to the (painful) awareness that not everyone operates like you do. You will recognise them easier and avoid them more in the future, if this lesson is learned well now. It sounds like you are really applying yourself to it -- good for you! You are waking up, this is good!

As for the clothes and lock, I would give it very few chances (I like the one about go over and get them) and then solve it without her coopersation. Buy new clothes and replace the locks, if it comes to that. The loss could have been so much more, frankly.

This question you asked is something that also confuses me... my ex dumped me after 2 years together- we were practically engaged and our families were very close. I seriously thought he was "the one" and I know he felt that way too-( in the beginning anyhow). So how can someone you once loved and who loved you just up and leave and never look back and think that they are better off now? I just don't get it. My ex left and never once looked back- which is fine since he decided to end it, but how can you plan a life with someone, give yourself to them completely and be left with nothing? And how can they in return, after receiving so much from you pretend like they no longer know you and that they never did? I don't know the answer but it is something I struggle with almost every day. My ex is going on with his life as if he never knew me and although I guess that's how it is after you dump someone, it still hurts to know that he is over me and moving on and seeming to be much happier now. All I can say to you is stay strong, and remember that you are the better person in this because you cared enough to at least acknowledge her presence. And with the whole returning stuff- I returned all my exs stuff because he asked me to- and I asked him for my stuff- he said he would return it- and he never did! Since I don't want to see him right now, I'm going to wait until I'm ready to deal with it sometime in the future... but I know what its like to be like why won't he return MY stuff? Anyhow... goodluck with everything!

I'm in the same boat as you and tirednhurt.
Ex has gone and not looking back.
We just have to deal with.
We can't control their actions but we can ours.
So be true to yourself and act honestly.
Be the man you are and keep moving forward.
You have great advice here and I can't really add much other than I share your pain as does tirednhurt. We are all in the same boat.
But you can get through it. Everyone on this site is testament to that!

im in the same boat as you and tirednhurt.
Ex has gone and not lookign back.
We just have to deal with.
we can't control their actions but we can ours.
So be true to yourself and act honestly.
Be the man you are and keep moving forward.
you have great advice here and i can't really add much other than i share your pain as does tirednhurt. we are all in the same boat.
but you can get through it. everyone on this site is testament to that!
What an incredible powerful statement that is!

Thanks val,
What a great comment to receive from you in particular given some for your posts! Thank you.
Just honest and from the heart (and head)!

Hey, when you're potent, you're potent...

And you are! :cool:

I just hope everyone else catches a contact buzz off that potency too... that was really great!

For whatever reason, she is angry and hurt about something that went on between you two. I wouldn't waste time and energy worrying about what or why. It's over and that's that so what or why really isn't important. If she doesn't want to talk to you then just don't talk to her, either. Can you live without whatever she hasn't returned? Maybe your landlord would allow you to change the locks at your own expense. Not that you should have to do that but it could well be the easiest way to just put everything behind you and start over.

Don't know why you would even care how she feels ,she just does. Be glad she is an ex and pay for locks if you have to and forget anything else she may have, not woth it.

The real problem is you not being able to anticpate that she would be lame, and so you returned her stuff with out a mutual thing... really now you know for next tme ( hopefully there is no ext time though) that if a break up does occur... always giv e eactohers things back at the same time. Kind of like the hostage and the money issue in movies.
And as far as her ignoring you... maybe its too painful for her to talk to you. Or more likey the case she is just lame.
Don't have someone kick her bum though. Which you never thought aout I am sure... just When we get angry ideas arise and I wanted to squash that one beofre it may have even come up.
Good seriously . And I would do as above, try a few toiems and tehn do your best to find a new solution... you migh be able to get authorities with this I don't really know. Like call the cops and say listen I was in this relationship were broken up now and she is not returing the key.
Its kind of more drama but you may have to.

Just wanted to update. She finally replied. Her reply was a mirror of my own email. She has returned the goods to my friend. Wished me luck and all that jazz. I guess she waited until she saw her therapist and then decided how to reply. So she's not as bad as I thought.

I guess her seeing the therapist, which she had said she would do, is her way of improving. And I definitely pushed her in that direction. So that is good of her. I hope the therapist helps her.

It's somewhat sad, because I try and focus on the negatives on our relationship, to help me get over her. It's hard sometimes, because despite what I say, I am sure the closeness we felt, was mutual. I just don't understand why her actions were the way they were and I guess I wished I hadn't reacted the way I did.

I think one thing that does pain me, is that as she improves as a person, she will eventually find someone else, and be a better person and love him, without the imperfections that she brought to our relationship. And that new relationship will work.

And true, I will hopefully do the same. I haven't ever felt the closeness that I shared with her, with the countless girls I've dated in the past, or the few other girlfriends I had. There is that hope that she comes back to me, and we have our second chance as new people and make things work. I think it really could have, if we had tried.

But the odds of her returning are slim to none. WildCat knows my story pretty well. The odds seem insurmountable.

Anyway, I'm just keeping on with what I'm doing. NO CONTACT, dating some new girls, jujitsu, friends, school. I hope she comes back, and maybe, as we both compromise, and fix things, we can have a good, lasting relationship together. But the more likely scenario is she won't. I just hope she gets out of my head sooner than later.

Regaining your mind which is when one truly is over and ex, is indeed very tough. Especially if it was serious. I hope the timeline for me is not too long for this to happen.

I don't think that you should getback with her even if the opportunity presented itself personaly. Just because I fear that a drdging memory of the past would reamin and ultimatlycome up in aruments and so the second break up would be worse than the first one.

Dude - I fully disagree... give it time. Your going to have sit down with this gal one day over coffee AND MAKE HER LAUGH- STIMULATING CONVERSATION OVER COFFEE!! But not tomorrow - maybe a few weeks. No tough questions.

As you can see - she is trying to change and figure things out. She seems like a good girl and wants to learn WHY she treated you so bad on occasion.

It all about time and are you will to give it time.

I agree with the cat. But really give it a lot of time. Not just a few weeks. Id be more like a few months. But not for her sake. For yours. You really need to "regain" your mind.
Don't even consider whether she may come back Don't let that occupy your mind.
Just work on you. That's your best chance! YOU first and then her later MAYBE! And a real big maybe it is too!

You are in a hurt and confused time and the whole purpose of no contact is for YOU to heal the mind and emotion to make clear and objective decisions. To evaluate and learn about you. Take this time to have fun and enjoy yourself its about rebuilding, not isolation and feeling bad. NO pity pot stuff.

Tal is so right.
People mistake having no contact as some ploy to win them back. Wrong move. You cut contact to work on yourself and figure out things in your own head. It should be a time when you focus on gwtting your own emotions in order and coping with a new pahse of your life.
IF she decides to come back in this period and you feel it is worth trying again then well and good. But it is about you. Not some tactic. That is a big mistake and it will be seen through and only cause further pain!

I agree with talaniman and skell. I know that skell and me are going through similar circumstances to you and I def. agree that you should take this time for yourself. I tried everything to get my ex back and when I finally realized nuthing would work I gave up and I decided its me time... and now I have learned so much about myself. I want to work on myself before starting another relationship. Anyhow it's a great idea and to be truthful most of the time an ex does not want to get back together and even if they did it usually won't work out because the relationship is broken and usually cannot be fixed. Also holding onto false hope can really be a big disappointment. Goodluck with everything and it sounds like you are on the right track!

Worst combination ever. But how many have found comfort with the bottle after a terrible break-up? Honestly, I am trying not to, but despite friends, work, hobbies, excerise, I do partake to numb the pain. Plus, being in grad school, most of my friends go to the bars every night and get pretty wasted. I hate that. One, it's expensive, two, the morning after, once the alcohol has left the system, the pain is tenfold.

But in order to hang out with my friends, alcohol is always part of the equation. Otherwise, I'd isolate myself at home. Many times, I'll not hang out, because going to the bars is not the best idea at this time.

Anyone else have this problem? I actually have tried to force myself to read or watch TV, but it doesn't always help. I many times cave in to the alcohol to sooth the pain.

Originally Posted by ilovecali

But in order to hang out with my friends, alcohol is always part of the equation.

It does not have to be part of the equation if you do not want it to be.

You make the decisions for you. If you want to hang out with the guys then great do it. If you don't want to drink, you don't have to.

Pretty simple, I know. Hard to stick to it? Yes... but in the long run you will be admired for being the guy with a good head on his shoulders.

Bottom line - bad idea. Makes the break 10 times worse. I've been there. The next day it makes the thoughts of her 10 times worse.

It is a very easy thing to do. But are you drinking more out with friends or home alone? In either case, the best thing to do is plan ahead to select something else to drink. Its kind of hard to drink a beer and coffee, soda, lemonade, the latest hot brand of water, etc at the same time... shrugs?

I'm not a drinker, and I hate the bar, but every once in a while I go out with the guys to the bar and I drink... Coke or Pepsi. Yes, I initially get some ribbing about it, but fact is all I have to say was "I don't drink" and after a minute or three there's much more interesting things going on besides why I choose not to drink.

You can go out with your friends, stay sober, and still have fun... although if your friends have nothing else in their life but the desire to "get pretty wasted", you may find that after a round or two, you've had enough of those friends and would rather move on... to other friends.

There's nothing wrong with drinking... as long as it doesn't rule over you.

It's not my friend's fault for how they live. In fact, before I met my ex, I was so happy being single. I didn't go out so often. I never felt lonely. I'd go out maybe once or twice a week. I'd study most evenings, play some online poker, and go to bed, wake up, and go the gym the next morning. It was possibly the happiest I've ever been. No attachments, just school, and myself.

However, right now, I don't want to stay at home. I do feel the lonliness. She lived with me, so I was not really alone during the time I dated her. While dating her, I enjoyed not being alone in the evenings. I grew accustomed to it. So now, I am back to where I was before I met her, only, I'm not so happy. She is something I miss.

My friends do go to the bars almost every evening. I simply can't do that. But when I sit at home on the evenings, I definitely feel the lack of her presence. That's why jujitsu is so awesome. Three evenings a week. I'm actually planning on starting another class too, so another weekend is occupied. Only thing I can think of to thwart the bottle.

When it comes down to it, drinking is taking the easy way out.
1. You don't have to stay home alone.
2. You can hang out with your friends.
3. You can feel like you're part of the crowd.
4. It numbs your pain, well at least for a while.
5. It kills time.
So many reasons to drink, especially every night, I wonder why everybody doesn't do it?

Maybe it's because there are truly more cons, than pros.
1. Slowly becoming an alcoholic is not good.
2. Kills your liver.
3. Makes your breath stink.
4. It's fattening.
5. It impedes your good judgment, like drinking and driving.
6. Increases depression.
7. Robs your wallet blind.
8. The hangover pretty much makes you dysfunctional the next day.
9. It's a turn off.
10. It's only liquid courage.

I can go on, but it's not necessary. Have you considered talking to your friends about it? Maybe you're not the only one who feels this way. Maybe some of them feel the same way but think they have no way out, so they do it too. Even if that's not the case, continuing on this path is clearly not the answer. Trust me when I tell you that you are FAR better off alone at home sitting in a dark closet than continuing this behavior. Making drinking your way out won't end here. If you ever get married and have children, stress, confusion and chaos will certainly come your way, how will you handle it? With booze? Realize your mistake now, before it becomes your habit of choice.

Hang with them but don't drink booze. I think phillysteakandcheese sounds like a real cool and strong man, he's not afraid of taking some bull from his friends for a while for making the right choice. If that is too difficult, go to the nearest bookstore, the kind with a built in coffee place and hang there, even if you are alone, you'll be far stronger. The stronger you are, the more clear headed you are, the faster you will get over this break up, and the richer you will be.

Hmmm, I don't know if this will help or not but here goes. I see your post being more about loss than drinking which relieves me, frankly! It may be that you were happy before simply because you had not experienced any significant loss as yet-- you can't hardly miss what you haven't experienced, now can you?

But here's a little glimpse of my take on LOSS. Loss comes in all shapes, sizes, colors and flavors but they all have some fundemental things in common. One of the wisest things ever suggested to me is we never really get over loss, we just get used to it -- I think that is fairly accurate for how I experience it. It allowed me to give up completely on looking to be who and where I was before the loss occurred. I could now see that is just not possible. And I could also see the "getting used to it" takes time. So I became a little more willing to trudge, a little less expectant of a time table -- that helped too.

Additionally, I would like to say as someone who has experienced a great deal of loss (and I don't mean to sound sort of oddly boastful about that either, it just is how it is) what I have come to realise in all the "getting used to it" is this:

Each loss leaves a hole, a never-to-be-filled-up-again hole. A hole that if I concentrate on it, tends to grow and threatens to overwhelm me. So guess what? I don't concentrate on it! I have dozens and dozens of holes now. There is one for every person and pet I loved who I lost one way or another -- and as I age I accumulate more and more. At this rate, by the time I die, I figure I'll look like a lace doiley and just float off the planet. AND maybe, just maybe, that is a part of the plan, that perhaps that is how we were designed and how loss is meant to be properly accommodated. So do I feel "less than" for having all the holes, hell no! I know I have lived, loved and definitely experienced LOSS -- and will do so up to the day I do die. But it took some time for me to gain any kind of grace with loss... and it will you too. I know from having experienced a very huge loss early in my adolescent years that the more life you have (from growing up) the easier time you have "framing" the loss. At age 15 when it happened to me, I was very nearly pulled under by it.

I watched an interesting documentary the other night called The Gifts of Grief (http://www.giftsofgrief.com/) and it helped me a lot. It's a big topic and worth exploring and deciding how you are going to handle it from all the options you have available (drinking being just one and a poor one at that, as you can see by all the posts here).

So there is a little something to think about... I hope you find it worth the reading a long post. Phew!

Seems to me you really don't want to drink or hangout so DON'T. There has to be other ways to fill your time with out the company of your ex like a hobby or activity you enjoy. If not take the oppurtunity to FIND something new and fun or find some fun people who don't drink. It takes time for the hurts of life to heal , but because one hurts doesn't mean to sit and isolate yourself.

As you say, turning to alcohol in order to cope is never the answer. It's perfectly OK to do it to be social. But being social doesn't mean getting wasted every night, to the point where the morning-after pain is "ten-fold." Obviously, going out to bars every night does get expensive, not to mention jeopardizing study time, which is very valuable for a full-time graduate student. You're on a tight budget as it is, both financially and time-wise. Of course, you can always go out and drink non-alcoholic beverages. It's a lot cheaper and a lot safer and you'll still have the pleasure of your friends' company to enjoy.

I would suggest inviting your friends to do something... like a movie... or comedy show, or something else... You invite them to do something and see if they do it, you don't have to go where they go... talk to them, and tell them you need them to do something else, and define that "something else" as what YOU need! Try that! :)

But in order to hang out with my friends, alcohol is always part of the equation. Otherwise, I'd isolate myself at home. Many times, I'll not hang out, because going to the bars is not the best idea at this time.




No I do not have this problem and I think you are doing great. You realize this is not something you like doing and you can still choose not to! I think that maybe you should find a new place to meet people. Maybe find a couple of new friends that don't drink. Good luck.

Pssst, I hear on great authority from a personal friend that Starbucks is a great chick watching place and the only thing you might get there is caffeine buzz! Hint: just don't be ordering anything like a double espresso shot, swiss mocha cappachino with two percent milk, easy on the whipped cream and a dash of nutmeg okaaaaaaay??

:cool: Just a thought?

You are in grad school... mentor... MENTOR... there are so many people needing a support system... guaranteed not to bore you... be a Big Brother... go and build a house for humanity... go to a cooking and or wine classes... great place to hook - up... a calmer scenery ( saying it softly)... there is someone out there waiting for a person wanting a future... guess what that could be you... get up and GO GET THEM!. I am not nasty to you... great job in knowing that a no-where direction is not the way to go...

I don't know if I'm weird, but how can anyone really get involved seriously with someone new, a few weeks, maybe even a few months after a serious relationship? How can you really do that?

I'm 1.5 months out of the most serious relationship I've ever had. I have been on a few dates, but there's no way I'm ready TO BE with someone new. I don't even know how I could be. DATING is very different from a RELATIONSHIP.

I can't even get myself to like someone new, and some of the girls I had dates with, have been very nice. I still miss the ex so much. I haven't even conscientiously compared the new girls to the ex, I just still miss her very much. So much.

If anything, trying to be with someone new too soon, will make things much worse. Though I know of some people who can do it. I just don't know how they do it.

I really don't even want to be truly CLOSE or INTIMATE with someone new. I just don't care that much. INTIMACY does not mean sex. EMOTIONAL INTIMACY is what I mean.

What I miss about her is coming home, eating dinner and watching TV with the woman I thought I'd spend the rest of my life with. Being able to COMPLETELY be myself, say what I want, and be OPEN. I miss that more than anything. No one but her, can give me that for A LONG TIME. You don't GET THERE in any SHORT TIME.

And I'm a guy, and she was the only one in my life, who ever got that close to me. And I miss that, so much.

How can anyone replace such a thing so quickly?

Ditto here mate.
I have the same feelings and thoughts.
I suppose I'm somewhat satisfied to know that my ex SO FAR hasn't been able to move to a new relationship. I guess this might show that she also is healing and getting over what was a very serious love.
I think it is needy and clingy people that rush into new relationships so soon. It isn't healthy and they rarely last. It shows more of their own personality flaws that they can rush into something new so quick than any flaws in the ex partner.
These people will find out the hard way that it isn't healthy jump straight back in simply because they need someone.
As you said though it is only time.
I miss the same things. Im struggling too. Struggling badly at times but I'm sure it will get better.

I know EXACTLY how you feel.

It takes time.

And WHO KNOWS how people do it!!

And ill tell you this much. Your doing fine. Only 1.5 months. Going good mate.
I'm 5 months and I still get all those feelings. It gets better but yes it still does hurt.
But for only 1.5months down the track you are going pretty good my friend!

Skell is def. right. You are doing amazing for 1.5 months in. I'm 4 months in and I still have these feelings as well. Its funny because I was going to post a question similar to yours today on here! I was wondering if I was abnormal because I can't move on yet. I want that connection with someone again and the closeness but I know I'm not ready. My ex hasn't moved on just yet but he did once leave me a nasty message saying he liked a new girl and wanted to date her, to kind of rub it in my face. Anyhow, some people just take all their insecurities and problems from one relationship to the next- this is not fair to the new person. There must always be a healing time after a relationship- esp. a serious long term one like I had. Its OK to be single but some people want to be with someone so badly that they settle- I know you do not want to settle and that is why you are single- good for you! Just grieve your loss and forget about others. What they have so soon after a relationship ends, most likely will not last and if it did- are they seriously happy? I highly doubt that they would be. Anyhow we don't know what other feel deep down we only see what they allow us to see and most people allow only good things to be seen. Just take time for yourself and forget dating for now. If the woman of your dreams walks in to your life go for it, but for now just be alone and work on you- that's what I'm doing and its hard but it will be worth it- just think how amazing your next relationship will be because you loved and learned so you know more going in the next time. Anyhow, these people are most likely insecure people who define themselves by being with someone- be different- do not conform to what the world expects. Its hard not to compare but anytime you feel yourself comparing stop yourself and tell yourself you are not ready and that one day you will be. Goodluck and message me if you need to talk!

That you can't just jump is a good thing...

People who jump from relationship to relationship without seeming to bother to heal in between or without using the time in between to heal even though they make it look like they did are often not in the same kind of relationship as the rest of us are. Its an amazing thing to see someone attempt to use being in a relationship to "fix" things-- things that will not be fixed that way. Things like low self esteem, lack of any life, poor social status, or finances. Or they use the distraction of being in a relationship to cover other things. Things like not being grown up or not feeling like they are whole from a crappy childhood. They use their partners to imitate the skills the don't have themselves while never fixing the cause of it at the source. Some of them aren't even in love with their partners but instead are "in love with love" and the partner is a handy "excuse" for it, sad as that is. They can fool others for some period, but it never lasts-- that is the dead giveaway. How do I know this? I did this and had enough failed relationships to eventually see that it was me.

It takes two fairly whole and grown up people to have a really healthy, deep and satisfying relationship. Incomplete, damaged or immature people need work that a partner is never going to provide and in fact SHOULD NOT provide. Not ever.

That all your respective relationships didn't work out may be that you were essentially "too well" for them and they had to abandon the ship before you saw that or they sought someone more to their level and traded - a very common phenomena. They treat relationships like busses-- there will be another one along any minute, only they're cunning enough not to reveal that openly.

Please let yourselves grieve - that you can't just up and go is a good sign. It means you are real. Grieving is a process that takes time. If you feel stuck in it, let's talk about that, but only after you've let some time pass because you might see, "yes, it is getting a little easier, it really slowly is". The hurt fades, the desire for your ex fades, the anger with your ex fades, it all becomes more ordinary as you convince yourself you can survive it by well LOL surviving it. And next time, pay attention to the one you're inclined to be interested in. Listen to how she/he talks about who she/he was with, how they broke up and how long did it take her/him to recover. You'll start seeing what I mean here. You are all just fine, pain and all. It is a part of living and loving.

Many people get caught up in "rebound" relationships and that's what you're describing. I'm really not sure how or why these happen. I suppose it's a way that the "injured" party in a recently ended relationship sees to get back what they had. However, this kind of thinking is flawed for two reasons: 1.) It's a different person, not the same one they just lost and 2.) one can't recapture a relationship that was built up over many months or years in an instant upon meeting someone new. This is why rebound relationships are doomed to failure ; it's the wrong cure for the wrong disease. It's really unfair to the person being used as the rebound cushion, as (s)he is totally blameless and is just being led on even though they may be in fact ready for a meaningful, healthy relationship with someone. Of course, the usual rules of taking it slow at first, etc. apply.

I think it is needy and clingy people that rush into new relationships so soon. It isnt healthy and they rarely last. It shows more of their own personality flaws that they can rush into something new so quick than any flaws in the ex partner.
These people will find out the hard way that it isnt healthy jump straight back in simply because they need someone.

This is right on! Exactly it.

Hi all. Many of you know my story pretty well by now. My ex and I broke up 2 months ago. She lived with me, we had spoken of marriage and kids, house, the total package. Aside from when we ran into each other, there has been no contact from either party.

If you recall, many of her actions led me to explode one day on her. She was always very flirtatious, wore very provocative clothing, never introduced me to her friends, basically kept me hidden. Many times, she would go to this one bar, wearing provocative clothing, with her best friend, just so guys could hit on them. And she would never let me go with her on those occasions, and she never liked going to "her bar" when she was with me. We actually went everywhere but there. This is while she was dating me. I did everything I could for her, I cooked dinners, I took her out, I helped her with schoolwork, I introduced her to all my friends. I think I did all a man can do for a woman.

She finally broke up with me, blaming me. She said she couldn't believe I could have been so harsh that day I yelled at her. I admit, I was harsh that day. But that was months after me telling her that certain things I did not like. She would flirt with guys, and never mention she had a boyfriend. She would never talk about me with any friends at all. Like I was not even part of her life. It felt like she took me for granted. It did hurt so much.

After the break-up, she has starting seeing a therapist. What hurts the most, was she used my one day of yelling as the reason to break-up. I felt great guilt about yelling at her. But I am stunned that she has no remorse or guilt about anything she did. She just pawned it off as she never did anything wrong. And she is doing the same things she did, while she was with me. Going to the same bar, just hitting on guy after guy.

She walked through me like I meant nothing. Without a second thought for a man who did so much for her. Did I really mistreat her so much? I mean, what in the world did I do? Was she normal, and am I the one who was crazy?

She felt no loss whatsoever. I have so much grief, because despite her flaws, we did have a connection I've never had in my life. I'm almost 30, so is she. I miss that connection. I wish I could only look at the bad things, but the good things were so good. Better than anything else.

I guess I hoped she would change for me, because I would have attempted to change if she asked me to. But she never had any complaints about me. She had no heart or conscience for me at all.

Why am I the one who feels loss and pain? I don't know for sure, but I don't think she is at all. She is doing the same things she used to, without missing a step. I really meant nothing. I think that also hurts so much.

I am working on myself. But I'm so stunned people can be like this. Especially someone you thought really cared. You find out they didn't give a rats ***. I sometimes wish I could be like that. I just feel at a loss, with lot of my faith in life tarnished. She did much more wrong that I, and walked away, unscathed, undeterred. I am left with a wound that will take very long to heal from. I just don't get it.

First of all, don't feel so guilty about yelling at her. She had it coming and I'm sure she's yelled at you many times before you finally blew up at her. And don't worry ; no thinking person, including her therapist, is going to buy the story that she ended a longstanding relationship over that one single incident. Much of her behavior was inappropriate and unfair to you. Unfortunately it seems as if the two of you had different levels of involvement in the relationship, with you giving much more than her. Evidently the two of you had different ideas and beliefs concerning the standards to adhere to in a relationship. The two of you probably weren't compatible from the start. I can't say why she stayed with you as long as she did. Maybe you were a security blanket for her. Unfortunately it sounds like she wanted her cake and eat it too. It sounds like there were lots of red flags from the start that you should have been wise to. Remember, if something doesn't seem or feel right, it isn't. Her wearing provocative clothing, going out to bars with her girlfriends without you, not introducing you to any of her friends or acknowledging you as her boyfriend ; all of these signaled trouble. Giving her the benefit of the doubt was not a good move and never is. These should have been indicators for you to run like the wind!

Cali, that you are having these feelings shows you are human. A human that cares and you got hooked up with a low down dirty-well you get the picture. I'm sure after your emotions, which are running high now, come down a bit you'll be able to see the reasons to find yourself lucky that you no longer have the bee-yatch around to bring you down. You may have been in love but her behavior was driving you nuts, so a break-up as painfull as it is, was exactly what you needed. You may not have been able to do it yourself but, and tell the truth, it worked in your favor and now you just have to continue with the healing process. Venting is better than being trampled on by some immature drama queen, and I know you feel better for it.

Cali, As I've really started to look inward at myself, like you are doing I have been asking a lot of questions of myself. Why do I feel this way? Why do I behave this way? Why are those around me not living by the same standards I am? One of the things that I really started to say to myself after looking back was, “How could I have been so stupid in that situation or in that circumstance?” What's worse is that over the course of my life I've made the same mistakes with different women and never even realized it until recently. And that is what makes me most upset. It's not getting used by the woman or the break up but it's knowing that in the end, I essentially caused my own hurt and pain. The signs were always there but emotional people like you and I always make excuses for it. It's not that you and I are stupid, but we think on an emotional level that these types of woman do not. Your asking yourself “why wasn't I good enough when I did all these things for her but I bet if you follow that line of thinking and keep going your really asking yourself, “Why did I CONTINUE to do all these nice things for her when she obviously did not care.” For me the answer is that if I showed them I was different or I cared more than anybody else they would appreciate me more. God just writing it makes me cringe because I know that it came off looking just the opposite. Your answer might the same or it might be different but I urge you to explore what it is. One thing I've learned from reading these posts is that when she pulls away you pull away. Emotional people dive in when the other one pulls away like she was doing. Then when they pull farther away we dive in further. It a vicious circle and it's a dangerous circle. The further we go in when they pull away the more emotional damage they can create in the end.

By the way I am also a couple months away from being 30 so don't feel to bad. I'm a late bloomer as well, and to be honest I'm glad I'm not alone. We'll get this right one day.

Thanks for the responses guys. I know you're right. I knew you were right even when I was dating her. That is why I saw the red flags and pointed them out during the relationship. If she had listened to what I had said, or understood where I was coming from, it could have been different. She never compromised, never. She always played an air on innocence and said she didn't realize she was doing anything wrong. I could never understand how she didn't realize her actions were not right.

S_ciani, do you really think this was a personality difference? How could we have dated for so long and been connected (she did have a connection to me as well) if our personalities were so out of tune? I have has serious relatonships before, but never was I ready or willing to marry the girl until my ex. Do you really thnk her behavior would work in a committed relationship with someone else? Does that sound like a healthy relationship?

Honestly, there were multiple times I was about to break-up with her throughout the relationship because of the red flags. Every time, she would start crying and tell me how much she loved me and cared for me. I couldn't go through with it. I fell into her trap.

In the end, she didn't think I was good enough for her I guess. Which does hurt. But I am working on the healing process. Each day is not better than the last, but I am trudging through, and will make it at some point.

Sounds like codependancy, enabling, and low self-esteem (on her part). Sounds to me like she knew what she was doing from the start, kind of like a plan almost... I'm willing to bet that the way she treated you was probably how she was treated before and her way of revenge was by taking her pain out on her next man... either way, red flags are red flags so you should probably take responsibility for sticking around far too long after noticing her inappropriate behavior. There are plenty of women out there who would more than be thankful for a guy like you... :cool:

talaniman agrees: You have come a log way in seeing yourself and I think your getting it. Well said

Thanks Tal, I realize I'm in no way close to being there but I'm starting to at least understand myself and my mistakes more. The real test will be when someone becomes interested in me again and how will I react. Hopefully I will not fall into the same old trap. 30 years with this kind of personality is a lot to overcome in a short time. I appreiciate your kind words and I hope that I've been able to help you and others as I start to learn about relationships myself. I hope that people like Cali and myself also understand that there not alone.

I do agree with the above, but let me present one possible opposite point of view... just to help maintain persepctive:

Your ex was the "hot party girl" that liked being with her friends, going to "her bar", and getting attention from lots of guys. She was provocative in manner and dress, but never cheated and always came home to be with you. These were things that attracted you to her, and you accepted them.

Now, the things that attracted you to her in the first place have turned. They made you feel insecure about being with her. Partying at "her bar" invited too much competition, and you worried if you were enough for her.

She remained the "hot party girl" she was before, but you were no longer willing to accept that. It wasn't worth the connection you shared. Your lack of confidence in yourself made her loose faith in your comittment to her.

I'm not trying to fault you in any way - Just show you the other side of the coin. This girl is who she is, and does what she likes to do, and you could not accept that.

Your break up - at least in that context - was inevitable.
You two were not right for each other.

"And she would never let me go with her on those occasions, and she never liked going to "her bar" when she was with me."

Cali,
I know your struggling. You have lots of questions that you want answered. But believe me when you finally get the answers (IF you get them) they won't be the one's you are looking for. So just try and leave it all in the past. Look ahead. Not back.
You need to stop feeling so guilty about yelling at her. That happens. Not to the point of abuse but people do actually get a little angry and yell. So what!

Just give it time. Keep trudging along.
You will have days where you feel like you did when you posted this. So when you feel like that post here again if it makes you feel better.
But just give it time. That's all I can really offer. In time you will feel better to the point where you realise that you are so much better off without this person.
We have spoken about this before. YOU deserve much better then a lot of the treatment she dished out to you!
You are a good person. I don't think she is at all!

I know everyone is right. I'm just feeling so dejected these days. Not only do I feel the loss, but I also am stunned at the amount of emotional and mental abuse someone I cared so much for, put me through. And she had someone do that to her. How could she not learn from that experience and realize not to do that to another person?

She even admitted that she had never treated anyone as poorly as she treated me sometimes. And she also admitted that no one had ever treated her better.

And no matter what I do, my mental agony is just not passing. I'm working out, jujitsu, school, going out sometimes. But nothing is clearing my mind. I am having trouble concentrating on schoolwork. This whole thing is crushing my brain and having all this crap on my mind is awful. And she just left, without feeling a thing, and with no care in the world. She walked out, and feels no loss at all.

I just wish it go away. I was so happy with my life before I met her. I was on top of the world. She came from nowhere, I didn't ask for it. And now after, I'm just not the same. I don't know what I have done to have someone come and upset my life like this. It's crazy. I just feel so lost. I wish I was mentally stronger. I don't know what my problem is.

Many of you know my story by now. And I've spoken to Wildcat a bunch about it offline. Anyway, I think I'm posting more to vent than anything. There's really no advice that can be given I think.

So last Tuesday was the biggest day of my professional life. I'm a grad student and I had my qualifying exams. Basically the last big hurdle to pass in the pHD program. I passed with flying colors. Finished much faster than most people. It was incredible. Anyway, after the exam, my friends in the department asked me to meet them outside and kick it.

I go outside and meet up with my friends. I see that my ex-gfriend is about 20ft from the picnic table all my friends were at. She's smoking with one of her friends. Last time I saw her, I did say hi and was cordial. But she just was mean. So this time I didn't look at her or acknowledge her. I just went and sat with my friends.

My ex stood there having her cigarette with one of her friends. She knew that I had just passed my exam which all grad students know is the biggest thing in the program. I know she looked at me a couple times then finished her smoke and walked back into the building.

I didn't expect her to say anything. In fact, she doesn't care if I'm alive or dead. I know this. But despite knowing all this, I really felt angry at her. I mean this person took so much from me, and gave so little in return, and she couldn't even be courteous and say congrats on a very important day of my life. What is sad is, I helped her an incredible amount with her school work in every possible way.

Anyway, seeing her and seeing walk away without saying a word just added fuel to my hatred of her. But I don't like being so angry and hateful. I just wish she'd go away. I did not let my break-up with her affect my work. I succeeded. But it's hard to forget when she's still in my face sometimes.

I do everything in my power to avoid her. But last Tuesday was my day and I had no idea that she'd be at the same place I was at. My friends in the department say I have to let go of the hate towards her. I know they're right. But it's very hard. She's not even civil towards me. She couldn't care less about my exsistence. I had to be the adult when we were together and now I have to be the adult when we are broken apart. I'm just kind of sick of it and always having to take the upper hand. She doesn't deserve any kindness or civility from me.

I don't know, just ranting.

Well done! And congratulations, well at least she sees you are doing well. Who cares if she can't be civil, I find this a general thing with exes. I am lucky that I haven't come across mine YET in a public place etc. Try not to let it get to you, it's not worth it : )

That great DUDE!! Way to go on this exams!! Happy for you!! Outstanding!! This will help a ton in the long run.

It's OK to vent!! Vent away - great therapy.

I've been studying this stuff and I think made she always feels pressure around you - It's probably easier fro her t o ignore you. SHe can't be your friend right now for fear you might want to try and get back together.

I'd personally not want to be her friend - staying away is good.

Nothing like a good vent, or great rant to make you feel better. Congrats on passing your exams.

Well done on passing the exams! I'm sure you are very proud and should be, like Wildcat said, it will pay off later on.

Just one point I will make is that the very fact that you are dealing with this in a mature way (and always have by the sounds of it) should mean you can hold your head up high and stand tall with a smile on your face.

Sometimes I wonder if people really understand how they are behaving. I mean, if they were to step outside of themselves for one moment and see how they are acting, would they care or even understand that certain behavior is unacceptable? I am referring to your ex with what I am saying here.

Hey Rant away! Nothing wrong with that!

Ilov,

First, CONGRATULATIONS on your accomplishement!! WAY TO GO. I can not even imagine the effort it took to pull that off and in the style that you did... way to go again.

Let nothing or no one take the joy out of this accomplishement.! Or any for that matter.

I know you didn't ask for any advice or insight and this is just in general, but sometimes, people are unable to be happy and feel happiness for others due to their severe unhappiness with themselves.

Once again... CONGRATULATIONS!!

I agree, you really have delt with this well - and I know it's been impossible to deal with because you go to the same so school - I doubt I could handle it so well.

For someone so close to show their trure colors like that - ughhhhh!

Hey Cali,

Great to hear from you. I had been wondering where you have been. So now I know, studying hard no doubt.

Great news on the exam. Well done. I know the relief and joy of that!

I guess this proves what you, me, cat and everyone else already knew. This girl wasn't a very nice person and you deserve so much better.

So just rejoice in the fact that you didn't get caught up any longer with the horrible bi*ch she is and you are now moving forward in a healthy direction.

You will find someone one day that you deserve and treats you for the great guy you are.

Aren't you glad your not tied to this female by... babies.:eek:

Tal is right - you need to be thankful you're not with her.

Well done on passing the exams!! I'm sure you are very proud and should be, like Wildcat said, it will pay off later on.

Just one point I will make is that the very fact that you are dealing with this in a mature way (and always have by the sounds of it) should mean you can hold your head up high and stand tall with a smile on your face.

Sometimes I wonder if people really understand how they are behaving. I mean, if they were to step outside of themselves for one moment and see how they are acting, would they care or even understand that certain behavior is unacceptable? I am referring to your ex with what I am saying here.

Hey Rant away!! Nothing wrong with that!!
I want to ditto EVERYTHING in this post, and add only this. You act like an adult for YOU, not her! That she benefits by that is only incidental. I am polite to even the rudest person, because to do otherwise is to let someone else decide MY behavior for me, to make MY choices. I may be powerless over you all but there is one thing I will not be is powerless over myself -- that is a terrible place to be! You, Cali, are on your power base and that is saying A LOT. Now all you need to do is reverse this too. How poorly she behaves is a reflection on HER, not you. Repeat this to yourself--- she owes me nothing, not even the least little speck of respect, and so therefore I AM FREE AT LAST, FREE AT LAST... GOD ALMIGHTY I AM FREE AT LAST.

For some unknown reason, this week, my ex has been on the forefront of my mind. That whole 10mins of seeing her last week after my exam where she never said a word just set the ball rolling again. I have no idea why.

I'm fuming that she is so cold-hearted, and I'm also sad that I was so stupid for falling in love with her. Sounds crazy, but I honestly feel like she poisoned me. I didn't realize how angry I am and how just seeing her still hurts me, and ticks me off to no end. It's like I am still getting punished for ever dating her.

Anyway, I didn't show her any of this reaction, but jeez, I know what I'm feeling inside and it sucks. And I have upheld "NO CONTACT" like a champ. I never want to see her again ever in my life. No one has ever had so little respect for me in my life, and I did everything a man can do for their partner. I've seen boyfriends who have done a 1/10 as much for their girls and gotten 1000x in return. All I got was a jacket for my birthday which I don't even wear.

Being at school together will lead to random encounters I'm sure. It's really hard. Her presence is like a huge weight on my shoulders. I know I have to "let it go". I just don't know how. I honestly don't. I avoid her at all costs, I concentrate only on my school work, I go to the gym. I don't even go to department parties just so I can avoid her because I really can't handle seeing her.

It's hard to see someone who treated you like a nobody just waltz around feeling like they are perfect and nothing was wrong with them or that they did nothing wrong. Just makes me mad. I guess that idiotic part of me really felt that she would AT LEAST recognize that she was at fault about many things in the relationship.

Not that we would ever get back together, but at least she would realize some of the things I did not like were valid things. I guess it is totally normal for a 30yr old woman in a "committed" relationship to dress in a tight miniskirt and go flirt with her "friends" at the bar but NEVER EVER LET THEM KNOW SHE HAD A BOYFRIEND. OR NEVER BOTHER INTRODUCING ME TO ANY OF HER FRIENDS. LYING TO HER BEST FRIEND ABOUT DATING ME FOR MONTHS. NEVER LETTING ME HANG OUT WITH HER "FRIENDS". GIVING OUT HER NUMBER TO OTHER GUYS WHILE SHE WAS WITH ME.

This must be totally normal. Clearly, she did nothing wrong. She was perfect. And then after the break-up, she paid a shrink to validate everything she did so she wouldn't feel bad. What kind of friends does she have who told her this was okay? How do people like this exist? I even suggested to her we see a councelor together but she wouldn't agree to do that.

Anyway, before anyone suggests therapy, I have been there, and for me, it was pretty useless. They just repeated things I already knew.

I just know I am thoroughly frustrated. My mind is completely warped because I cannot forget the things she did and than just walked off laying all blame on me. It still haunts me. I just don't know what the hell to do. It's takes a lot to keep it all together.

Oh man I empathise completely
I had one of these situations at the very start of this year, girlfriend was totally why and just tried to destroy my reputation by spreading lies and stuff behind my back to everyone and in the whole relationship she was so completely and utterly selfish and I fell for her.. why? Lol when you look back on it, its pretty naïve huh?
Well my advice is, forget her!
She is obviously not good news and don't give her the satisfaction of knowing that your thinking about her. Keep up the no contact and find a girl who respects you, good luck!
I hope I helped
Oh and ps. If your feeling down at the moment never fear, one thing about life is that times do and always will change.

Hi Ilove,

Glad to hear from you, but so sorry under these conditions.

Okay, what to do. First, way to go with the no contact! Good for you.

Now this advice may see lame, but I am hoping it helps:

Start writing her a letter. Either on the computer, in a word doc or by hand. Write ever blessed thing you are feeling. All of it. The pain, the hurt and the anger. Write a good long one. BUT DON'T SEND IT. Write exactly what you are feeling, every syllable... but again.. DON'T SEND IT. It will at least get a lot off your chest.

Underneath it all, you are so hurt and that is so understandable. I am so sorry for your pain.

Now get writing :)... but plllllease don't send it.

And remember, We are always here.

I know its easier said than done but really don't worry about this bird.

Just have the knowledge that she'll get hers one day.

You come out of this thing such a better guy and have learnt so much that one day when you do find that someone special this will be so far in the back of your mind that you'll wonder why you let it get to you so much.

Where as she, well she will probably never be truly happy if she is how you describe.
She can seek all the validation from shrinks, friends, boyfreinds she likes. But if she isn't improving as a person then she will get hers.

So its OK to be mad. In fact I wish I had reasons to be as mad as you (I think I do anyway).

Your just continuing to heal and grow. She hasn't even begun, and probably never will because she doesn't probably even know what love is. And chances are if she keeps on acting this way, never will.

I know who's shoes id rather be in!

I know who's shoes id rather be in!

Perfect Skell!!

Yup, would not want to be her!

First of all You're normal in your feelings. Yes I agree she was the party girl when you met her and hoped she would change once your relationship grew. But if we wanted the person we care about to change then the two of you aren't really meant to be in the first place. You had so much more emotionally invested in the relationship that she did. Where you were getting serious and wanted more, she was still in the casusal stage. She didn't see things as exlcusively the 2 of you. She wanted to play the field and her provocative dressing and not wanting you around would be a red flag to me. Having you around(no offense) would rain on her sexy parade. Not too many guys are going to pay attention to another mans girlfriend.
Where you see white picket fenses and three cats in the yard, she still sees strobe lights and partying on. Its not your fault that the 2 of you are on 2 different wave lengths. And you can't worry about her now. She's living her life the way she wants and you need to heal and mend your heart.
I think in her mind that she was done with the relationship and you yelling at her was the excuse she needed to walk away without any guilt on her part. AS having been dumped many times in my life, I can tell you it does get better and there is someone out therewho'll apreciate the boy next store you appear to be. (I did fall for him and we've been married 12 years)
Keep doing what you're doing. Take time for yourself and keep thinking you're a great guy and worthy of something better. You're worthy of someone who'll love to show you off and love and repect you for the individual you are.
Don't let a bad experience ruin your faith in womankind. Think of it as a bump in the road and you basically hit a pot hole with this one.
Acknowledge the hurt and admit you deserved better and don't settle until you find THE ONE. Men have just as much right to feel heartache as we women do. Time does heal. We just need to give it time and patience. And yes a lot of faith.

First of all Youre normal in your feelings. Yes I agree she was the pary girl when you met her and hoped she would change once your relationship grew. but if we wanted the person we care about to change then the two of you arent really meant to be in the first place. you had so much more emotionally invested in the relationship that she did. where you were getting serious and wanted more, she was still in the casusal stage. she didnt see things as exlcusively the 2 of you. she wanted to play the field and her provacative dressing and not wanting you around would be a red flag to me. having you around(no offense) would rain on her sexy parade. not too many guys are going to pay attention to another mans girlfriend.
where you see white picket fenses and three cats in the yard, she still sees strobe lights and partying on. Its not your fault that the 2 of you are on 2 different wave lengths. and you can't worry about her now. she's living her life the way she wants and you need to heal and mend your heart.
I think in her mind that she was done with the relationship and you yelling at her was the excuse she needed to walk away without any guilt on her part. AS having been dumped many times in my life, I can tell you it does get better and there is someone out therewho'll apreciate the boy next store you appear to be. (I did fall for him and we've been married 12 years)
Keep doing what youre doing. take time for yourself and keep thinking youre a great guy and worthy of something better. youre worthy of someone who'll love to show you off and love and repect you for the individual you are.
don't let a bad experience ruin your faith in womankind. think of it as a bump in the road and you basically hit a pot hole with this one.
acknowledge the hurt and admit you deserved better and don't settle until you find THE ONE. men have just as much right to feel heartache as we women do. time does heal. we just need to give it time and patience. and yes a lot of faith.

I know you mean well chippers but this thread is months old now and it has been discussed and thrashed out at length.

If you want to answer thread look for one that are a little more recent. Preferably the last couple of days.

It isn't a problem and we all make similar mistakes here so I'm not having a go at you.

Just letting you know that your good advice would be better off on a newer thread.

Thanks!

Hi all,

I used to be a fairly active member on the board a while back. Been busy with life and not offering or giving much advice of late. This was my first post way back when: https://www.askmehelpdesk.com/relationships/wildcat-advice-30454.html

Much has transpired since then. For those of you in similar situations my advice is "ditch the b!tch" or for you women, "can that man" from your MIND. Never call her, seek her out, or think it will ever be the same. False hope is your worst enemy. I never gave myself any false hope. In fact, anytime I felt any of it, I thought of how nasty it is to just up and leave someone with no warning, and I used that anger to never want to be with her again. It is a tough process, it took me almost 5 months to fully get over her. But I did.

And since that time, I dated, and was intimate with some women, and I seriously dated a girl this summer. And my new girlfriend, as cliché as it sounds, was just as smart, better looking, younger and MOST IMPORTANTLY, much more affectionate and loving than the girl my original post was about.

SO WHOEVER DUMPED, MOVE ON!! YOU NEVER KNOW WHAT ELSE IS OUT THERE UNTIL YOU LET GO.

Anyway, my new girlfriend from the summer is gone now and I guess she is my new ex-girlfriend. I'm a graduate student and she was a summer student. We got very close, but I will never do an LDR, though my heart asks why, my head knows the answer to that why. And I already can feel the distance between myself and my most recent ex, even though we've been apart for only a week and a half. I think both of us would rather not get hurt, than take a chance on an LDR. And as I said, I have learned to let go based on my past experiences. Life has a way of working out if you DON'T FORCE THE ISSUE.

But I guess my point is, though I am sad she has left, I do not have any depression or anger this time. We had a wonderful relationship and it is now over. That is that. But I am grateful that I met her and we got close.

Anyway, read my first post for those of you who are in pain over an ex. It does get better, and better things await you as soon as you let go of the past.

Good luck to all of you with a broken heart. IT WILL GET BETTER.

--D

Good to have you back cali.