My boyfriend was moving in to an apartment.. the landlord called and asked for the security deposit so she can purchase a new fridge, we brought over a rent contract and asked for a receipt. A few days later, she calls to say she has sold her house (she never mentioned it was on the market) and she would have his money in two days. Today, she called to say her cat was hit by a car and needed the money... she said she would have it by the end of the month, once my boyfriend called her on it, she hung up on him!

what should he do?

Take her to small claims.

The forms and instructions are available at your county court clerks office, division of small claims.

Reply if you still have more questions.

Edited to include: Before you file, you need to make sure that you have a way to collect the judgment
If you win. Does the LL own any property other than this one? Do you have any idea of where they
Bank? How about if the LL is employed? Do you know where in case you need to garnish to collect?

If you have no way to collect, then the judgment will do you little good.

Her cat was hit by a car and so she needs the money. Tell her your boyfriend is out a place to live and so HE needs the money.
YOU can't do anything if you didn't sign anything.
I hope he has a rental agreement and proof he paid her.
He needs to take her to small claims court. I think that when landlords back out of renting to somebody they are required to return the deposit in a certain amount of days and I know it isn't any 30 days.

She obviously knew she was selling her property, so by law she had a legal obligation to tell you.. and then my next question is.. if she was selling her property, how did she expect to fulfil her end of the lease without a house as I'm asuming the lease was going to be for at least six months. I have a feeling she was scamming you and maybe others with the same ploy, I would ring the police and find out if she has any convictions for fraud or deception

My guess is she just needed some quick cash asap so she lied.

Did you get the receipt that you asked for? I sure hope so. When she sold the house, the security deposit should have been given to the new owner, not kept by the previous one; the deposit was for the property.

she obviously knew she was selling her property, so by law she had a legal obligation to tell you..and then my next question is ..,if she was selling her property, how did she expect to fulfil her end of the lease without a house as im asuming the lease was going to be for at least six months. I have a feeling she was scamming you and maybe others with the same ploy, i would ring the police and find out if she has any convictions for fraud or deception

She had no legal obligation to inform the tenant that she was selling. The lease transfers to the new owner, who have to fulfill it.

Even so it sounds like she used the money for herself rather than passing it on to the new owners. Often too the New owners evict everybody when their lease is up and rent to who they want to so if the place is being transferred within a month or so then I question her right to even be renting it at this time.

Can the police do anything? I was thinking of getting ahold of the local newspaper...

The police won't get involved, this is a civil matter.

I don't believe that this is enough of a story for the media either, unless this landlord has a history of this type of behavior, and if that is the case, and it can be proven, it might be worth a shot.

If you have the copy of the lease and deposit receipt, you need to contact the new owner and ask them how they plan to solve the situation.

Contacting the new owner might help but they are not legally responsible.

Contacting the new owner might help but they are not legally responsible.

If there is a legal lease, and receipt for the deposit, the new owner would be responsible to either honor the lease and keep the deposit, or to terminate the lease and return the deposit.

Chances are, they won't do either, and this will still need to be taken to small claims, against the LL that took the deposit.

There is no lease, just month to month so it's kind of irrelevant..

Legal aid said small claims can prove she owes the money but can't force her to pay it back... is this true?

No, but small claims may be able to force her to turn the deposit over to the new landlord. The only time the deposit is returned to the tenant is when they vacate the property.

My boyfriend was moving in to an apartment.. the landlord called and asked for the security deposit so she can purchase a new fridge, we brought over a rent contract and asked for a receipt. A few days later, she calls to say she has sold her house (she never mentioned it was on the market) and she would have his money in two days. Today, she called to say her cat was hit by a car and needed the money... she said she would have it by the end of the month, once my boyfriend called her on it, she hung up on him!

what should he do?
It sounds like a fast one. Okay the cat was hit by a car? Lets have the sympathy for the sake of it although we can assume this is a lie. First we need to raise the issue that although that is a sad thing to happen it in no way what so ever involves any of her tenets. Please take a copy of all paper work to and from the landlord to the land lord and request the money back. If there is no luck then perhaps you should try a solicitor. If there is still no luck then write to the landlord and tell him/her that If you do not get the money back then you will be contacting a local ombudsman (if you have those in your country) the police and possibly free local press. The fact that you would take it so far will intimidate him/her into paying it back as soon as possible.

Hello spin:

The small claims court will award a judgment or not. That's ALL they do. They don't force people to transfer deposits. They don't collect debts. They award judgments - or NOT.

That's what prog was trying to tell you in your very first response. However, once you have a judgment in your hand, YOU can take it to HER bank and seize the money in her account... You can take it to her place of employment and garnish her wages...

However, if you don't know where she banks, or how much she has in her accounts, and if you don't know where she works, or if she does, then you're not going to be able to collect on the judgment.

excon

There is no lease, just month to month so it's kinda irrelevant..

Legal aid said small claims can prove she owes the money but can't force her to pay it back... is this true?


The reason legal aid said small claims can't force her to pay is because all they do is place a judgment on the person that owes and then it is up to them to pay but if they do not pay it IS on their credit report that they did not pay. And just like Excon said YOU can pursue it from there since you have the legal document of the judgment.
I would still tell the new owners but they legally are not required to do anything.

Hello again, spin:

The new owner IS responsible to adhere to ANY rental agreement that the previous owner entered into. It makes NO difference whether it's a month to month or a 30 year lease. However, they need to be informed about the tenancy at closing. If they weren't, then they're not responsible.

Couple things... This is an "apartment". I don't know if it's a room in a house, or a regular rental unit. If it's NOT a room in a private home, then the new owner probably wants to rent it too.

So, whether your boyfriend can move in surely might be handled by contacting the new owner. IF, however, the new owner didn't inherit the deposit and the month to month agreement (written or not), then I wouldn't involve the new owner in my dispute with the old owner. From what I gather, I doubt whether the new owner knows anything about your boyfriend.

excon

So a landlord that is selling their building and decides they need some quick cash and they dishonestly get a few or a bunch of new leases written up and then turns around and says too bad I sold the building but I need the money makes the new owner responsible to pay them back if she doesn't pay them back?

Hello Saph:

I didn't say that. Read it again. I DID edit a bit right after my post, and that might have led you down that path.

excon

Yeah I caught it before the edit.
I actually have seen so many rental scams.
Like people that find a way to get into an abandoned house and then act like the owner and rent it out. Then they lock it back up after they get the money.

So a landlord that is selling their building and decides they need some quick cash and they dishonestly get a few or a bunch of new leases written up and then turns around and says too bad I sold the building but I need the money makes the new owner responsible to pay them back if she doesn't pay them back?

Legally, yes. Dishonestly is a bit tricky. If there is a vacant unit, and the original owner gets a lease and deposit on it the day before the sale, there is nothing dishonest about that. Now, the security deposits are supposed to be turned over to the new owner, and if the landlord doesn't, that's grounds for the new owner to go after the old one. But yes, if the old one doesn't turn the money over, that doesn't mean that the new owner is not legally responsible for returning the security deposit.

Okay I knew that if the new landlord did have to pay for it then he could then go after the old one so they do need to inform the new owners since the landlady most probably will not.

First althoiugh on a month to month rental, the new owners can give you an eviction notice with 30 day notice, you have a legal rental from this peron and could move in. And in closing unless the current owner evicts you first, the money on the deposit legally has to go to the new owner at closing. So he can move in, even if the property has sold, but could be evicted with notice.

Small claims court can issue a judgement but then you will have to find the persons money, bank accounts or more to get your money

Hello again:

This is an interesting legal conundrum - that's why I love this stuff so...

Who owes who, isn't quite so simple. It seems to me that IF the boyfriend demands to move in, the new owner IS required to let him. Therefore, it would be the new owner who would be responsible for collecting the deposit and the rent (if he paid her any), from the old landlord.

If he doesn't want to move in, it seems that he must collect from the old landlord.

But, the question I DON'T have an answer to is, is the new owner responsible to adhere to a lease he wasn't told about?? Maybe.. Where is Lisa when you need her?

excon

What I was looking at is since it is a month to month then the landlord may not even have the stuff transferred into the new owners name during the time that they would be in there for a month or two and that is why I am questioning the new owner being responsible.
Like if she leased to them to start renting Sept. 1 and the closing doesn't happen until Nov 1
Is the new landlord responsible for Sept?
That's how I was looking at it.

But, the question I DON'T have an answer to is, is the new owner responsible to adhere to a lease he wasn't told about?? Maybe..
Yes. The new owner has to honor the lease but they can sue the former owner for damages.


Where is Lisa when you need her?
Right here... watching you and everyone else do a fine job of picking this one apart. :)

It is an apartment on top of a house, we don't feel comfortable asking the new owners for the security deposit back, it isn't their fault.. word around town, she is a scammer.. for all we know, she didn't even sell the house.

I would definitely look into it and do something. If you let her get away with it then she will do it to others. I think she was scamming for some quick cash and is lying about something. I would take her to small claims court or investigate who owns the house. You can also start by going through your counties property assessment office to get some information about the building.

Like (I believe) has been established... the new owners have to honor "the lease", even if it's verbal, month-to-month.

I would start by verifying that there are new owners. Has you boyfriend moved in? He needs to contact the original owner and tell her that he'll be by to get either the keys or all of his money back. Then ask for the new owner's contact info so he can get it touch with them, introduce himself, let them know how much he's looking forward to meeting them, etc. Just because there are new owners, if there are, is no reason he shouldn't move in. He needs to tell her that he understands that, by law, she has to pass his security deposit on to the new owners.

Assuming all of that doesn't work, which it probably won't if she's a scam artist, then he's got little recourse but to sue her in small claims. Which I would still do. It's cheap. He'd almost for sure get a judgement. And that judgement may have to be paid at some point down the road before she makes a major purchase. Like if she were to sell this property, she'd have to pay that judgement before she could buy another property.

Boy is this an interesting one. Let me summarize.

1) If you can prove a valid lease, then the new owner have to honor it.
2) However, since it's a month to month, they can terminate the lease with one month's notice.
3) Legally the security should have been transferred to the new owners. It's the new owners responsibility to get it from the previous owner.

But you have left a number of very important points unclear here. For us to help we need to know these pieces of info;

a) Did your boyfriend actually move in?
b) have you confirmed the sale and talked to the new owners?
c) Will the new owners honor the lease?
d) Had a contract for sale been entered into before or after your boyfriend agreed to rent the apt?
e) what has your boyfriend actually paid and to who?

d) is a very important issue. If the landlord knew the house was going to be sold and did not mention the lease to your boyfriend and/or the new owners then this is fraud and constitutes a criminal matter. She can be brought up on criminal charges.

So please give us the full story.

If the landlord knew the house was going to be sold and did not mention the lease to your bf and/or the new owners then this is fraud and constitutes a criminal matter. She can be brought up on criminal charges.

So please give us the full story.

This is an excellent point, Scott! If she didn't inform the new owners of the existing lease she committed fraud!

Unfortunately, for the tenant, there is no requirement that they be told of an impending sale of property. If it was already SOLD at the time she entered into the agreement with him, maybe. But if there had been no closing, she doesn't have to tell him squat! She does have other obligations, though, like passing on the deposit.

I'm still not convinced there are any new owners. In fact,

Original Poster, is your boyfriend SURE that she's the rightful owner of the property? Might not hurt to check with the county assessor's office.

rockinmommy disagrees: Yes they are. If there's a lease, they bought that right along with the house. They have to honor it.

So the lady that owns it now leases to them as a month to month and the closing doesn't happen for months the now owners are responsible and even if she was pulling a scam? I took it as the old landlord was scamming him. Pretty rotten that if they landlady was scamming them and backing out and the new landlord wasn't even involved all that much yet.
Seems to me that any landlord that wants to pull something could rent a bunch of places out month to month before the place is turned over and then back out and leave it on the new owners.

It seemed to me she had scammed them from the get go and there may even not be any new owners.
Then when I went back to add that if the contract was going through then the new owner would have to be involved but then I saw she had posted more and didn't change my original because it had looked even more like she was defrauding them.
I stick to what I said along with what Excon said in post #18 because I really believe this lady scammed them and wanted out of the lease and keep the money. And figured that they would just feel they had no course of action and drop it before the place got turned over to the new owners (if there are even any new owners). As I said I would find out who these new owners are and tell them what she pulled.

I stick to it also because
She told him she sold the place and she calls to say she has sold her house (she never mentioned it was on the market) and she would have his money in two days.
So to me SHE had backed out of the agreement anyway.
Also looked like fraud to me because what is she doing renting the place out if she HAD sold it.

.

rockinmommy disagrees: Yes they are. If there's a lease, they bought that right along with the house. They have to honor it.

So the lady that owns it now leases to them as a month to month and the closing doesn't happen for months the now owners are responsible and even if she was pulling a scam? I took it as the old landlord was scamming him. Pretty rotten that if they landlady was scamming them and backing out and the new landlord wasn't even involved all that much yet.
Seems to me that any landlord that wants to pull something could rent a bunch of places out month to month before the place is turned over and then back out and leave it on the new owners.

I agree that it's TOTALLY ROTTEN. But sadly, it's true! The new owners could go back on the seller and have a strong case against her. But if the tenant can produce a lease (and yes, a verbal month - to - month lease counts - she said he had a receipt for his deposit, so he probably wouldn't need much more proof than that) the new owner legally HAS to honor it. Most people who buy rental property (like I believe this is at least a 2-unit property from her description) know to check all this stuff out. But I've been stuck with a couple of less than ideal tenant circumstances over the years because of a dishonest seller. And I'm sure unsuspecting buyers get screwed all the time.


It seemed to me she had scammed them from the get go and there may even not be any new owners.
Then when I went back to add that if the contract was going through then the new owner would have to be involved but then I saw she had posted more and didn't change my original because it had looked even more like she was defrauding them.
I stick to what I said along with what excon said in post #18 because I really believe this lady scammed them and wanted out of the lease and keep the money. And figured that they would just feel they had no course of action and drop it before the place got turned over to the new owners (if there are even any new owners). As I said I would find out who these new owners are and tell them what she pulled.
I stick to it also because she told him she sold the place and she calls to say she has sold her house (she never mentioned it was on the market) and she would have his money in two days.
So to me SHE had backed out of the agreement anyway.

.

I agree that she's (most likely) scamming them - at the very least a VERY unscrupulous person. And I agree that there may not even be a buyer.

I was disagreeing with your statement that the new buyer would not be responsible. That is not factually true. Unfortunately for them, they would be responsible for honoring whatever lease is/was in place at the time of the sale. And the tenant in this case would have every right to expect them to honor it.

I don't LIKE it either, but that's the way the laws are currently set up!

I agree they would be responsible in 'normal' circumstances' but I smelled a rat and she had backed out instead of offering to tell them she would turn it over to the new buyers, etc...

I agree they would be responsible in 'normal' circumstances' but I smelled a rat and she had backed out instead of offering to tell them she would turn it over to the new buyers, etc........

Again, I completely agree that there's a "rat"! I smell it too! It reeks, as a matter of fact.

But that doesn't alleviate the new buyer's (assuming there is one) responsibility to the tenant. Their recourse would be to go after the seller. If they didn't honor the lease they'd be breaking the law.

And at that point it's not up to her to "back out". I mean she could try, but unless the tenant agreed, it wouldn't be up to her at that point.

I wasn't trying to jump down your throat with a "red". I just wanted to make it very clear what the LAW says in this situation. I don't agree with it any more than you do.

I agree too I think she was hoping he would just drop it as too much of a hassle.
But they do need to go through all means possible including the 'new owner'
Just like excon explained