I allowed my cousin to stay at my place for 2 months in agreement that she give me 700 a month and now she refuses to leave. I already have another apartment and now I was told by a friend that is she doesn't leave on my move out date, the landlord cannot kick her out and that the time she is there, even if for months that I will be liable to pay, up to 6 months. Does anyone know how I can get out of this? I absolutely can't afford that. She has to checks that she gave me, on bottom says rent. Help? I need a fast response. If possible can you please help, I only have a few days.

If I understand you right, your lease is up and you are moving? If your lease is up and you move you would not be responsible for your cousin. Your cousin would have to leave when you leave because once the lease is up and you move he is free to rent to somebody else.
Why would you be responsible for her or she be entitled to stay there at your expense if your lease is up and you do not renew it?
If you were breaking the lease and she stayed then you would be responsible for the rent until your lease was up whether she was there or not.

But I am breaking the lease but there is no penalty for it. I think that is why she intentionally wrote "rent" on the checks. In agreement, I was moving out in August for my daughter to start high school by sept, I am a single mom and see they schemed me on this.

I already have most my things moved into my new apt and they are sitting there. She asked to put her on the lease, but I think its wrote they are trying to force this on me. I was warned that they cannot get thrown out until a court process and the time they are residing in here, whether I am here or not, I am liable to pay however long it takes and that can be as long as 6 months.

I can't afford this! Can I not pay my rent, go through the eviction process and then they are forced out? It might be cheaper for me and they'd have to pay but I'm also risking my credit. I'm leaving by the first and I'm restlless. I was even told to have their things removed, drop off and her brother's house, and change locks
?

Also, what if I add her name to the lease to avoid more problems? When I do not renew the lease can she keep the apartment? Even if I don't? Also, they have only been here 2 months and this Friday August rent is due, but I had planned to out before since I cannot afford it. They have 2 checks for June and July that they paid me $700. They receive no mail here and no bills are in their names (her & hubby), I'm in N.Y.

Would it be in my bst interest if I let my landlord know about the 2 who are not on my lease and break my lease and let him deal with it or I istead of my breaking my lease, I keep it and just not pay the rent at the same time while trying to get them evicted. I was also told in the state of N.Y I have up to 90 days to get someone out.

On August 1st, it will make 90 days but they won't leave

When the lease is up SHE can start a lease in HER name. She can not renew you as a lease holder. Since you are breaking the lease the rule is for whatever the lease says regardless of if she was there or not. Usually the landlord requires you to pay the rent until a replacement is found for you to take over your rent. She should still be responsible for whatever share the two of you agreed on in the beginning $700. For every two months.
Actually, I would think that you should be able to consider them the replacement for you and leave it up to them to pay the rent but I am not sure if or how that would work.
I would tell them they have the option of taking over the lease or the landlord evicts them.
Actually New York you give a three day written notice and then if they do not leave you go to the magistrate and have them formally evicted and the constable or sheriff will take care of it if they still don't leave. I would think your landlord would be the one to serve them.

Thank so much for taking time to answer my questions. I've been up all night over this, my daughter went to bed crying with a headache.

Here's the senario. She asked if I can hold some stuff from storage because I have 2 extra bedrooms. I explained to her that I was considering renting them out but because she was my cousin I'd help. We agreed that she can give me 1400 in 2 payments because it was for 2 months. The stuff was way more than to fit in the rooms because it was her husbands and hers. I agreed to allow them to stay the last month.
They knew before augustThey set to move. They asked if they can stay and I said I didn't think I'd want to leave the apartement in my name to someone.

I statred to worry because they way they see suspicious. Then I realized on the checks they wrote "Rent" as payment for. I didn't think much of it until now. Last week, her husband came to me and said... ummm we are not leaving! So, I was just going to turn in the apt and let management deal with it, but was advised that until they can get them out, I will be held liable for the rent that accrue during that time and that it can take up to 6 months sometimes. I absolutely cannot afford this, and they apparently knew what they were doing... I didn't.

I was thinking of going to management and explain the situation. I know I may get into more trouble because I allowed them to stay here and they are not on the lease (illegal tenants) I think. I am now wondering if I should just leave, not pay rent, get evicted and deal with it in caourt because at this point, I think this whole thing is going to cost me thousands (My rent is 1300).

No matter what, I already paid my security and part 1st month rent in my new apartment, not expecting this. They just took advantage of me because I'm a single mom & wanted o ge extra bucks to move my daughter into a better neighborhood so she can start hight school. I just don't know what to do. Since they know all this legal syuff and I don't I wonder if me taking the legal way (which I have no idea) and except the consequences:(

I cannot afford to pay both rents

They knew before August

Ok, if you leave them there, they can evict him, but it may take a couple months, during which time you are liable for the rent.

You need to evict him first.

What a couple... just 2

I realize that no matter what this is going to cost me a lot

If I get them out, what do I do? How long will it take? They have the 2 check stubs... will that go against me? Can they sue? Me

If me or management serves them with a 30 day, can they dispute this. I know that out of spite, its not the goal to have the apartment, they just want to do this to me out of spite to feel they win. It's horrible when your in you "home" and can't walk around without the snickering remarks, slamming doors, cursing at me, blasphemy... all this in front of my 13 yr old daughter. They also have a baby.

I'm asking because I see they are scheming cruel people

Maybe I should just go to management and tell them and maybe together we can do it?

I cannot pay the rent... I didn't think this would happen and I have the new apartment. I know that definitley an eviction will come in this one, this will be on my credit report.

If my management evicts me for none payment, which I am not going to be here anyway, and they come they are just going to evicet them. Will they be able to sue me or get me in some kind of trouble?

It was also suggested that perhaps I shoul tell management I have people here who are not supposed to be here, which they do evict residents all the time for, and just wait to get evicted! If I were able to have them take the apartment off my hands I would, but I know that I would have to first put her on the lease yet leaving myself as head of household... evenn when I'm not living here. I refuse to stay here, I had this planned for an entire year, my daughter if miserable n scared of the things they are doing. I hate to see my kid go through this!

Anyone...

Please help

I allowed my cousin to stay at my place for 2 months in agreement that she give me 700 a month and now she refuses to leave. I already have another apartment and now I was told by a friend that is she doesn't leave on my move out date, the landlord cannot kick her out and that the time she is there, even if for months that I will be liable to pay, up to 6 months. Does anyone know how I can get out of this? I absolutely can't afford that. She has to checks that she gave me, on bottom says rent. Help? I need a fast response. If possible can you please help, I only have a few days.
Ok. First of all... CALM DOWN. I know you're very upset, but you're all over the place. You need to take a deep breath so you can deal with this rationally.

One course of action, which I'm not suggesting as LEGAL, or the best solution, is to just move their stuff out. You mentioned a brother?? What do you think they'd do if you just moved their stuff out? Do they know where you're moving to? I'm wondering about getting your daughter safely to the new place and just basically (nicely - no damage or anything) moving their stuff "for them". If/when questioned just say, "well, it was moving day and I wanted to help you out." Like I said, not a legal suggestion. But it is one of your options... They just sound like bullies, and usually when you stand up to a bully they loose their bravado and go away.

As far as you being responsible if they stay. Yes, there's some degree of accuracy there. The key is your landlord regaining possession of the property. If he can't regain possession because there are people still in it, then it's still leased and your name is the one on the lease. There are so many different factors at play here, with a broken lease, illegal sub-lease, etc, it's really hard to say what would happen if the whole mess wound up in a courtroom.

What's the landlord like to deal with? I'm guessing they must be pretty easy if they're letting you break your lease w/out penalty?? As a landlord, I'd appreciate knowing exactly what's going on - the sooner the better. Even if the tenant screwed up and let someone in there, etc. The sooner the LL knows what's going on, the sooner they can do something about it. I'd recommend going to the landlord and explaining everything. Be very humble, tell them you were trying to help your cousin, but realize now how bad you've screwed up. Tell them you want to make this right, you'll do anything you can to help, but you need their help and guidance.

It's a sticky, messy situation. And you're right... it's probably going to wind up costing you. Is there a grandparent, friend, somewhere safe your daughter can go stay until this mess is over?

Your right, I decided today that I'm going to have to let go of my new apartment and stay here until this is over. I will admit. I'm not a smoker, but I will be for as long as they are here (they have a baby and I know I'd leave), parties, no cleaning, leaving friends to hang out when I'm not home. Cops came to day and kind of told them that If I move out that they have to get their stuff and leave or they can be charge with tresspassing. I doubt that's true but cop was angry at what I'm dealing with.

This is all out of spite. I would have just left and moved on. Her brother has a room. I was even going to offer to pay for Uhaul and 2 months storage, so I can avoid having to pay another month and I can eave. This is not the greatest neighborhood and I wanted to do something better for my daughter, I work and people want to take. In all, this will come back to them.

I'm going to the property manager tomorrow morning. I have a friend who is good friend with her and going to call in the morning to put in a good word.

They are not on the lease and usually management will evict you for this... and I'd love to get evicted.

Wish me the best hun,

Thank you,

Kristina

I think the cop was right because of the fact that they are not on the lease and you wanted to move. So if you had broke the lease they could get trespassing charges if the landlord and cops wanted to be a problem.

Ok. Several points:

1) Because you agreed to let them stay in return for money they became YOUR tenants. It doesn't matter that they wrote Rent on the checks, but that helps their case. Since they were your tenant, you have to evict them to get them out,

2) The cop was being nice, but he was wrong. In the eyes of the law they are tenants and need to be evicted.

I'm curious as to why the RELATIVES are screwing you around? Or can they afford to pay the full rental? Maybe they just want the apt. If that's the case, then let they stay and pay the full rent. Another thing you can do is talk to the landlord, see if they will agree to add them to the lease and take you off.

But if they are intent on screwing you, then what I would do is move (you really can't not move because you will still be responsible for the rent on the new place). Immediately start eviction proceedings against them Then sue them for any unpaid rental and costs.

Thank you all so very much for responding to my problem. Here's what happened. Today I woke and set to go to the property manager and explain to them the situation, when I arrived THEY, my cousin & her husband who refuse to leave were already there! They cried about some story that they have lived there since February (a Lie) and that I told them to move in 2 days (another lie) they knew they had to leave by August since they came in. I accepted the checks because I didn't think they'd be the types (I really didn't know him).

I was told on & on about the lease and how I was not supposed to rent to other people and except money, that I CAN LOSE MY JOB FOR FREUD! Is this true ( I work for the city) I then tell her before you go on, I want to explain my side and I did. So, she explained they are going to court and getting a 30 day and then they'll be out. She said I could get them evicted because I am not the landlord and I wasn't supposed to have them there.

I know they went to the property manager to be vindictive and out of spite. I offered to pay for their Uhaul and 2 months storage because her brother said they can stay with him. They said no.
I siad but what if they don't? She said OHHHH I'll get them out!

She then called me when they returned and put me on speaker. She said they are leaving at the end of the month and that they will not be paying me, that to be considerate of each other and try to pass the month fine. Well, I already have an apt I am supposed to move into at the end of the week.

Hey, I'd leave because I lucked with it all included and beautiful! But who's to say after the 30 days, they won't try to extend it longer. I overheard him say that the judge said they have 30 to a year!

A year!

You mean to tell me, a person can live rent free for a whole year. Why wouldn't this working person be able to get another place?

If that's the case, wouldn't everybody do this scam? I'd love to live rent free!


My cousins husband comes into the aptartment and explain how they have the upper hand, that they 'd appreciate that the no smoking and no loud music and they promise they will not leave in 30 days! Hmmm... giving me altermatums in my place! Nice!

I told him, then its going to be a very overbearing, uncomfortable situation for them. I will truly let this place be a dump... literally. Are those conditions they want to live in with a baby? I cannot believe this.

I'd leave to my other aptartment if it were set in stone they would leave by the end of the month and I can make a payment arrangement to pay for the month of August (I cannot afford this). I figured it would be best to stay because they will be miserable. I already had some loud guys drinking and smoking last night and they never came out the room. I know they didn't like that and perhaps if this continues they find it unbearable and leave, if I leave then they are content and abuse it more and set to ask yet again for another month and another...

What should I do?

Why didn't I get evicted? I did so something against the lease policy

I'm a single mom, no child support and my kindness bit me on the arse

ScottGem

What do you mean sue? Will I be able to get this money back?

I can do this?

Ok, first, you did not commit fraud. You will not lose your job over an illegal roommate. Those are just empty threats. I'm not clear as to who told you that though.

Second, while they may think they have the upper hand, they don't, at least not completely.

Third, yes, you most certainly can sue them for any costs you incur getting them out of that apartment.

Now, I'm not clear what exactly happened when you went to the property manager. It sounds like the property manager is going to handle evicting them. Is that what they said? Was it the property manager who called and put you on speaker telling you they would leave at the end of the month? Did they then come back and say they weren't? I'm sorry but your post (#14) is rambling and very confusing.

But the bottomline, if the property managers are willing to go through the eviction process let them. Even if you illegally allowed them to live there (and I'd have to see your lease to be sure you broke it), they are still your tenants so you would be the ones to have to evict, but let the landlord take care of that if they are willing.

Don't be petty and try to make them uncomfortable and want to move. If the property managers are willign to handle the eviction, ask them if they will hold you to the rental after you move out.

Sorry, I'm just really upset.

The property manager told me I can lose my job, that she would call them.

The property manager said that she told them to go to court for a 30 day and to bring it to her and she will discuss things with us. They went to her office and I received a call on speaker and she stated that they have a court order to have 30 days to find another place of residence & they are leaving at the end of August. In the meantime, try to be considerate of one another and no harassing.

(In the background, I heard him say 30 day to up to a year of extensions). Meaning, they can keep asking for more time, in which I will be responsible for paying the rent while they remain here (can be months) If it is 100% they are leaving in 30 days then fine, I'll move and make arrangements to pay. But, why should I leave if it might be longer.

I think this is truly unfair.

It's not that I want to petty, but I figured if I move into my other apartment, they will feel comfortable and content, take advantage of not having to pay rent and do so for as long as they can. If I stay then maybe they will find the living condition unbearable and leave. My daughter is crying all the time, having headches, the runs... this is physically affecting her and I can't fix it.

The landlord has no business in this, unless they have a lease, they rent from you, not them, you may evict them unless the management wants to rent to them.

Well I would perosnally had told the property manager a few things about them losing thieir job for maing threats and attempting blackmail. But then that is me.

Also if it was me, and they did not pay property, I would give them a notice to evict, and take them to houseing court for eviction, since they rent from you, not anyone else.

Of course if they were in my house doing this, I would most likely do something that was not legal at this point but I can not advise on that.

But the property manager said that I can't take them to court because I don't have authority to do so. That I had no right, in breaking the policy to have people in my apartment not on the lease and charging them,

At this point...

They went to the court and got a court to stay for 30 days
~He tells me they have upperhand
~I see no papers, He and property manager tell me over phone
~If I leave, I still have to pay the rent for them
~They can continue to ask for more time, in which , I am liable to pay (Months)
~He tells me that he will leave(words) in 30days as long as I agree to stop having people smoke, music, etc. If I do then they will not leave.



~

Here's what I'm thinking. I feel the property manager is having pitty for them and the story they told. I too have a child!

I work hard, provide for us, volunteer for a teen program, go to church weekly. Yet, they are drinking slurring thieves (they ripped a family friend off, which I just learned) I allowed them here to help them & myself so we can each afford to rent elsewhere. They offered the $700 knowing for both room I should get more.

I'm them one getting screwed and it might be for a long time.

I knew I wasn't allowed to have them here without being on the lease, but thought I was doing good helping them

First, the Prop Mgr has already lied to you so I wouldn't believe them. Second they cannot have gotten a court order so quickly and definitely not without you being informed of a court hearing.

I think you need an attorney to advise you. But the first thing you need to do is read your lease and see what it says about other occupants and sublets. Then you need to check with your local court and find out the process for eviction. Then follow that process.

You move out. Make sure you do a walk through to record the condition of the unit. Let them sue you. You counter sue them. If the Property Managers are helping your cousins stay, then they can be a party to your suit. Wile you may have violated your lease, that's not a criminal action. The worst they can do is terminate your lease which is what you want anyway!

By the way, there is no way they get a years worth of extensions on a stay of eviction.

Scott thanks so much!

I have a question though. I believe they did go to court (N.Y) I saw them when they came back and went to the office. I didn't see any documentation. I can't afford a lawyer hun, at this point I can barely afford groceries now that I have to come up with extra money.

How can I sue? Them or the property manager? I thought by law, they are allowed to stay by the court and not pay, so how can I sue?



I spoke to the woman from the new apartment and it was hard for me to tell her I might not be moving in, I already have the keys and she didn't ask for a deposit. I don't know what to do.

If I ask him to sign a notorized letter stating he will leave at the end of the month, will that be accpeted as legal documention in a court?

Also, when I told the landlord maybe I should go to court, she said for what? I can't do anything because they were not allowed here and I don't own the apartment.

That is why they work in a apartment complex and do not work as an attorney,

Also does anyone know how long they can get in extensions?

How can I call you Scott, I clicked on the link and don't get what to do

Maybe they did go to the courthouse. But there is NO way to get a stay of eviction until someone files an eviction. There is NO way they will get a stay without a hearing and there is no way they will get a hearing without serving you notice of the hearing. So stop listening to them, they are lying to you to delay you. Listen to the advice we have given you.

As for contacting me. I'm currently online with AIM, MSN and Yahoo Messenger You can IM me using an of those services and we can arrange to talk. I'll be online for the next couple of hours.

They are taking you for a ride all the way around talk to a lawyer.

My AOL is [email]

Thank you

I'm online

I'm online

Go back and edit out your email address. You don't want that out there for the world to see.

I'm a landlord. Have been for about 15 years. This is a convoluted mess.

At this point I agree with Scott. You should just move. Don't speak to anyone, don't argue, discuss or interact with anyone. You and your daughter pack up all of your stuff and move to the new apartment. Call them and see if you can have access to the unit today. It would be really nice if no one knows where your new place is?? I don't suppose you've kept that to yourself?

Let the landlord come after you. They are obviously disorganized and uneducated, and I wouldn't be surprised if they threated, but never actually get around to suing you. Or they may. I'd take my chances.

Honestly, if you're gone and the free-loading cousins are just hangin' out in that apartment, they're going to get real sick of them, real quick.

As far as your job... honestly, I don't think you have anything to worry about. If you have a good, professional relationship with your supervisor you might mention what's going on. If you do keep it BRIEF and try to be as professional-sounding as possible. Or it might not be worth bringing up at all. I don't think you can lose your job for violating your lease. That's ridiculous.

But my big concern is also being charged for months that they string this along because they will not leave.

I'm going in the morning and telling them I am leaving and breaking my lease and get a receipt.

Keep you all posted tomorrow

Thanks a mil

And thank you sooooooo much scott... for giving me hope:)

I'm packing!

Scott, I wasn't sure if I asked you if the property manager can deny me and when I go in tomorrow to put in my letter to leave and break my lease, my mind is such a mess.

I want to make sure they give me the release form (like you said) .

I'm worried that they are going to say they can only give it to me when the inspector checks the apartment, which they do know that they are here, and tell me they can't give me a release form because people are still living in the apartment. That would be denying me to forfeit my lease, right?

If they do that then how can I prove I moved out before August 1st

I would leave and then when they take you to court tell the Judge the whole problem and how you had decided not to break the lease but then the property manager didn't want them to leave, wouldn't evict them and you could not tolerate dealing with them not doing their share.
Under your circumstances I haven't seen any other way other than the landlord evicting and then you said they won't.

(Note to other readers, I talked with Kryssy on the phone last night. She lives in a very large multi-building apartment complex in NYC. I'm familiar with this complex and it has a waiting list a mile long. So that's why they have no problem with a tenant moving before the lease is up.)

To Kryssy,
Even if they don't give you the release move. Tell your cousins, that you are moving and terminating your lease. That if they don't move and you wind up having to pay rent for August or later, you will sue them to recover that money. Its time for you to stand up and do some intimidating on your own.

Your new landlord can provide an affadavit of when you moved in. As Nohelp said, if they take you to court, you tell the judge that you leased another apartment after the complex told you they would release you, therefore you had to move otherwise you would have lost the money you paid for that apartment. You tell the judge, that your counsins were aware that you were moving and they caused all the problems by refusing to leave. You had no choice but to move, leaving them there.

I just got back from seeing the property manager. I told her that I want to leave and she said that I can leave but they cannot give me a release form because people are still living in the apartment.

I can turn in my keys though and inform her. She said she believes they will leave because they have an application in here and she warned them they won't be able to get an apartment if they are in the matter of illegally living here.

She said if I want to leave its OK, if by the 31 they are not out, she is going to start legal procedures to on me, because it's still my lease, and that may take up to a month or two, to have me evicted. Yet, I am still liable to pay the rent. I remark that it may be possible I can sue them. She told me a judge told them to sue me for feb, march & April, the 3 months they claimed they lived here(they came in may). I don't understand how, they have no proof! They have no reciepts etc

Why would they lie about that? What can they gain by saying it's 6 months they have been here?


I'm thinking, OK then I wouldn't have to worry about them stringing this thing for months.

I called legal aid and they said if I just leave, I may be liable to pay until my lease is up, which I don't think starrett will allow that.

Why don't they just start the legal actions now to have me evicted? Then they'd have to be out sooner

Does anyone know how much a lawyer will cost? I just spoke to he again and ask what did they go to court for. She said that they went and said I told them to leave in 4 days.

At least get a receipt that you turned in the keys. Anyone can sue anyone else over anything. But winning is harder. If its true that a judge told them that (and remember they have lied several times), its probably because they lied to the judge and he based his advice on those lies. The fact that they have cancelled checks for only 2 months will help your case, not theirs.

Like I said they are trying to intimidate you. When you show them you aren't going to be intimidated and will fight back, I think they will back down. Under NO conditions should you put off your move. You acted in good faith and they haven't. That will come out in court.

Well with the proof you have that they only gave you money for two months then that should work against them saying they were there longer. You could say then where is what you owe me for the other months.
Whether they are there or not you would still be liable to whatever they charge for a broken lease but I really understand how it bothers you that your free loaders will be the beneficiaries of it in the long run.
You have to do what you got to do and let them take you to court

Does anyone know how much a lawyer will cost? I just spoke to he again and ask what did they go to court for. She said that they went and said I told them to leave in 4 days.

She said that If I do go to court I may lose my job because it is fraud and I work for the city. That I illegally had tenants here in a subsidized complex. I said maybe I can go to court and she said she doesn't think the Judge would do anything because they already beat me.

OMG! I don't know what to do!

She said if I want to move, just go and all we can do is wait until the 31st, from there we'll know.

You will need to emphasis to the court that they were only guests staying for two months and then refused to leave. May not save your job if it is really in jeopardy but at this point you need to stand up for rights.
I think you have more proof on that than they do with the lies that a Judge would hopefully see right through.

It was 3 months

May, June, July

Each $700

Whether they are there or not you would still be liable to whatever they charge for a broken lease but I really understand how it bothers you that your free loaders will be the beneficiaries of it in the long run.
You have to do what you gotta do and let them take you to court

Two points here. As I mentioned this complex is a large one (almost 6000 units) that has a long waiting list. So they have no problem with people ending their lease early. Its an advantage to them as they can raise the rent for the new tenant.

I don't believe these people will benefit in the long run. I believe if they try to sue kryssy, she can countersue and they will be in more hot water.

Scott , can you call me?

Hey guys, here's the latest...

I spent yet another day entirely on this situation. I started a pre-paid legal account because it's the only thing I can afford. I went to the property manager and asked her for any documentation that they will leave by the end of the month & she said she wasn't able to provide that and she honestly "feels" they will leave. She told me to keep between us... they have an application in and if I seek legal action, they will not be considered because they were illegally living in one of their apartments.

I asked her what happens if they don't? She said that she will start court procedures against ME to have me evicted and it may take a month or so, again I am liable to pay the rent. What if they went to court? Can a Judge order my landlord not to evict me because they are there?

I found this hotline http://www.cwtfhc.org/hotline.html while running a search online and spoke to a woman who advised me that there seems to be something strange and the property manager is lying. That they could have gone to court and just ask for time to stay here if there was no pending court *something (this law talk is not for me:), they can't just go to a court like that! She said something about a "holdover" and that I can go to housing court and speak to a Lawyer (free) for my legal rights.

The lawyer told me that there has to be a court dispute or order by someone in order for them to go to court. She ran a check and nothing came up. I told her that it's possible the property manager worked something out with them. She ignored that and told me that it would be good for me to get that notarized letter because I may be able to sue them(Scott... your right!)


I got nowhere!

Still at point A

I spoke to my cousins husband (the one's who won't leave) and he swore to leave by the end of the month or sooner and agreed to putting it in writing (notarized, with a witness) with that he asked if I would consent to them replacing the bolt lock for their safety for the month. That we will not cause harm to one another or our vehicles (my cousins on dad's side showed up and they were pissed) . I told them that I will be leaving and we can both be at peace until this is over. If they do not leave, I will be spending many nights here... me and anyone I know who wants to and I will allow them to spend night whether I am here or not etc. I'm sure any man wouldn't want to wake in the morning and see several men sleeping around while his wife and baby are here alone. Nothing crazy, just annoying. Big guys who are professional business men... they just look mean:) I know I'd leave!

Maybe that wasn't funny*

I'm tired and drained. But, I lost 13lbs!


Feel free to share your thoughts on this.

Want to thank all of you who took time to respond. Don't know what I would have done without you:)

Move & be happy;-)

As I told you, everyone seems to be telling you the same thing. The hotline, us here, the attorney are all saying the same thing. So listen.

You did not comment fraud. You may have violated your lease, but that is a civil, not a criminal matter. Yopu might want to let your boss know ahead of time about this, though. If they went to a court and claimed you tried to illegally evict them by telling them to leave in 4 days, they would be asked to show proof of that. Since they can't, no case, which is what you found out.

So everything you have found out just confirms what I told you (I don't mind you double checking, but once confirmed then listen).

You still need to go ahead with your plans to move. DO NOT under any conditions not move. I can't empahsize that strongly enough. Also do NOT give them permission to change the locks. In fact, tell them they cannot do so. Tell them you will tell the property manager that you told them specifically not to change the locks when you turn in the keys.

Here's what will happen.

1) They move out by July 31. In this case you are golden.
2) They move out by August 31. In this case you will be liable for the August rent, but you can sue them for it.
3) The landlord starts eviction proceedings on August 1. You show up at a hearing and tell the judge, that they were staying with you but you told them you were moving and they refused to leave. Judge orders them to vacate, Landlord executes eviction. They should be out by end of August.

I don't see any other scenario but one of those three, except maybe the eviction taking longer than one month. In ANY case, if you are held liable for rent past July 31, you can sue your cousins to reimburse you. And you need to tell your cousins that you have been advised by several people of this so that if they cost you money, you will sue.

So, as I told you on the phone, the worst case scenario is you owing the landlord 1-2 months rent. And I'm sure this landlord will agree to allow you to pay that over time. You then sue your cousins for that amount. But I really don't think it will get that far.

Still in agreement!

MOVE to the new place ASAP. Yesterday would not be soon enough.

I don't think you have anything to worry about with your job. Honestly... you kindly let family stay with you. They overstayed their welcome to the point that it's a huge hindrance to you. Yes, give your boss a little head's up. Do NOT go on and on and get all worked up. Just tell them a VERY short version of the story - stay as professional as possible.

You keep getting all upset about what the cousins and the property manager are telling you. Keep in mind.... the people who are upsetting you have all been LYING to you. Why would you pay any heed to ANYTHING they say at this point???? You're playing right into their hand!

You've been given EXCELLENT advise by more than 1 source. And you're still running around like a chicken with your head cut off worrying about what the liars are telling you. Pull it together, follow the advise you've been given, and take charge!

Thanks!

I asked my Union rep about it and he said he doesn't think I can lose my job. That's a personal matter. I did ask him to look into it for me with My boss. He told me not to worry.

The hotline people believe if it is a subsidized apt then that is a bigger thing, I had section 8 but I don't receive it anymore because my income is too high.

On the notarized letter, he wants me to agree to change just the top lock just to the end of the month which will be stated on the letter. (they think I'll have a group come in etc) Also he wants me to do it, so If any ideas what I should make sure is in it please share?

Scott, I don't think he'll do the letter if I don't allow them to change it just until the end of the month. I was going to write he agrees to leave the apartment by August 31st and if not, then he is liable to pay and rent there after. How's that?

Also, I think a Judge would give them a lot more time because they have a baby if this goes to court. Which, I don't think it will. I'm more relaxed and I know I will feel better when I'm out of here...

Rockinmommy we're almost packed:)

Tomorrow we are leaving.


Question: Should I turn in the key? I didn't want to because she said they wouldn't give me the release form until the apartment in vacant. I rather hold on to it, in case I'll be coming back with friends because living here will be unbearable.

The hotline people believe if it is a subsidized apt then that is a bigger thing, I had section 8 but I don't recieve it anymore because my income is too high.

That's a big deal in the fact that it could/would have caused you to lose your benefits. Since you're no longer receiving benefits - no big deal.


On the notarized letter, he wants me to agree to change just the top lock just to the end of the month which will be stated on the letter. (they think I'll have a group come in etc) Also he wants me to do it, so If any ideas what I should make sure is in it please share?

Scott, I don't think he'll do the letter if I don't allow them to change it just til the end of the month. I was going to write he agrees to leave the apartment by August 31st and if not, then he is liable to pay and rent there after. How's that?.

I would NOT agree to change locks, or let them change locks, etc. They can (and probably will) change them regardless of what you do or say. If you do it, or indicate that you know they are going to do it that's another lease breach (I'm sure your lease says the locks can't be changed.) If that's the only way he'll sign this letter (which I don't think is that big of a point in your favor, anyway), then forget the letter. Tell them that you aren't going to change the locks. They can contact management if they have an issue with the locks - since they're all such good buddies now.




Question: Should I turn in the key? I didn't want to because she said they wouldnt give me the release form until the apartment in vacant. I rather hold on to it, in case I'll be coming back with friends because living here will be unbearable.

I think you should turn in your keys and NEVER return to this property. Take a TON of pictures of the condition of the place when you leave. You may still be held responsible for any damage they do, but at least you'll have something to show how you left it. Take the keys to the office and get SOMETHING from them in writing that you turned in your keys. Tell them you don't expect a release, but that you need a receipt of some sort showing that you turned in keys.

Do NOT go back there with friends, etc. If this winds up in court - and it probably will - you want to be able to go in there, be professional, and hold your head up high. Not have to admit to stooping to their level and acting immature.

RockinMommy beat me to it. I totally agree about the locks, taking pictures, turning in the keys etc.

You did good talking to your Union rep. That's even better than talking to your supervisor. I didn't realize you were in a Union otherwise I would have suggested that instead.

If you want to get them to sign an agreement, use the attached agreement. If they refuse to sign it don't push. But don't agree to anything else. They have to understand they are in the wrong.

Hi everyone, I'm at the new place and took a couple of days to get internet.

Here's the latest...

The move was a mess but we did it, I rented a truck too small and had to leave a few things behind. I told them that I will not agree to the locks being changed. I have belongings in there, need to take pics etc. We communicated by text messaging only. I told them that the last week I'll be there with friends to fix up etc.

They wrote:

1)There's no agreement to what you are saying now.

This is the response to Not allowing them to change the locks...

2)Alright, you want to play it that way, well andrew says 3 weeks is not enough, we'll need more time so there goes another month added. Ur relentless!!

I went to the place after work, and sure enough... the locks were changed!

I don't get this! I can't but they can. I could have called security and have management come in and bust it open, but I didn't bother. I'm just tired of this!

They are basically telling me to pay the rent, apt in your name, promise to stay away for a month, not damages to property and cansent to them changing the locks or... YOUR SCREWED! We'll stay another month!

I'm tired.The only good thing is my daughter is away and at least I can hide things from her. We love the new place but I can't enjoy it because my mind is on how in debt this is going to put me, did they go to the precinct and make a false complaint. Everyday I'm worried & scared about what's next. Let alone the principals. I'm angry.

You should definitely get security to come in and open the apartment (if they will), what they did was illegal. At the very least report it to property management. If they changed the locks and did not give a key to management, that may give them grounds to force a quick removal. And its not going to help them when and if things get to court. So you need to document that they did that.

Don't let them intimidate you and DO NOT pay any rent. Get your things out of there as soon as you can. Tell them, in no uncertain terms, that what they are doing and have done violates your rights and the law. That they are totally in the wrong here and that you have gotten several legal opinions that support that. So, if they persist in breaking the law, they are the ones that will suffer, not you. Intimidation can go both ways. When they are forced to open the doors for you, maybe they will learn.

Let the landlords file suit against you for unpaid rent. You go into court and you present your story that you were just doing a relative a favor. That you had informed them you were moving and they they refused to vacate when you did. That since you had signed a lease for a new place, you had to go ahead with your move. I doubt if there is any judge that would not rule in your favor. At the worst, they would rule that you had to pay the rent but award you a judgement (from your counter suit) against your cousins forcing them to reimburse you.

Hi everyone, here's the latest...

They didn't leave on August 31, but made sure to hold me to Sept and they moved out yesterday, my neighbor who has been looking out phoned me. I am relieved they are finally out but now this puts me in at a debt of owing $2800. The lanlord madea statement that a judge had told them they can sue me! The lawyers I spoke to through the pre-paid legal service said the only way they could have sued me is if they were paying me & the landlord... whish isn't the case.

My neighbor did get the name and number of the moving company, but now how will I find them to sue them.

A lawyer told me that I can sue for what they were originally paying me, the $700 for each month but not the whole amount. Again, how will I find them?
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I went to the apartment today and it was a MESS! And yes, they did do damage from tearing the screens, holes on the door, glass everywhere, opened my mail( I know this because papers where left regarding the rent lateness and the bill were left on the counter) and garbage everywhere. She also had forgotten something cooking and the wall in the kitchen and ceiling were black from smoke, the tiles lifted on the florr do to water damage, hole in the wall. My neighbor had informed me about running into her in the hall and it was all smoked out.

Now remember, I never went back to take the pictures because when I went back 2 weeks later, they had changed the locks and when management informed them this was illegal, they went and filed a false police harassment complaint and now I avoided any attempt to go there in fear of getting arrested (I have no idea what they said) but it was lies.

I considered leaving it as is, making some kind of payment arrangement and continue moving on, but after seeing the place I am so disturbed and simply... angry!

Any advice? I'm going tomorrow to still take pictures and then clean up.

I thought these were relatives? You should have enough info about them to find them and sue them. I would hold tight and let the landlord sue you for the arrears and the damage. When you go into court you produce your documentation that you moved out, that you had informed both your relatives and the landlord that you were moving out and that the landlord gave them advice allowing them to stay longer. And that they trashed the place after you left.

Worst comes to worse, you lose and have to pay what they say you owe now. But there is a good possibility that the judge will throw out the landlord's suit.

Hi Scott, I just came back from the inspection and finally the lease is ended. I was able to fix the damages they did (I worked 3 days) and the property manager didn't seem to take notice. I will received a statement of any other expenses I'm aware of.

They property mananger said I wouldn't have to court and she can work out a payment arrangement with the backed up rent & the apt bill combined.

They are relatives but made sure to hire a moving company & workers so no one else in the family knows there location. I was able to get a little information. I'm not sure if I'm even going to sue because of time and the stress. I'm happy it's over and they are finally out. I've heard some horror stories where it costs people over 5000 and more.

I just want peace and to move on. This has been a horrible experience for both me and my daughter. At this point it probably would cost me more money (I don't have) and time.

Thank you so much:)

You helped me in so many ways through this:-)

This is always a scale one needs to balance. Whether its worth going after a person or just paying and moving on. It's a decision only you can make. Sure, if you agree to pay the landlord will not take you to court. And the hassle you would have to go through to collect from them may not be worth it.

My only feeling here is that if you refuse to pay and they do take you to court, you stand a good chance of getting out without paying. But you have to decide for yourself.