View Full Version : Illegal "collective punishment"
Dark_crow
Jan 20, 2008, 09:37 AM
Critics say the fuel reductions to Gaza amount to that, but is it really true?
Gaza's main power plant began shutting down on Sunday due to a fuel shortage caused by Israel's closure of the Hamas-controlled territory's borders, a move taken in response to Palestinian rocket attacks.
Palestinian militants have been firing rockets daily into Israel from the Gaza Strip, which Hamas Islamists seized in June after routing President Mahmoud Abbas's secular Fatah faction.
"The ball is in their court," said Mekel. "If they stop the rockets today, everything would go back to normal."
washingtonpost.com (http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/01/20/AR2008012000667.html)
excon
Jan 20, 2008, 10:03 AM
Hello DC:
Even if it IS collective punishment, why would you think the Israeli's owe the Palestinians a nice warm comfortable home to live in? Why do they owe them ANYTHING? They GAVE them the land to do with as they chose. The could have chosen to trade with Israel. Instead they chose to BOMB Israel.
Is ANYBODY in Gaza doing anything to stop it?? Nope, they're not!
I'm sorry. I don't feel their pain. By the way, who say's it's "illegal"? The UN?? Bwa, ha ha ha.
excon
tomder55
Jan 21, 2008, 05:36 AM
The US Press buys into this b.s. propaganda !
Gaza electricity is supplied by direct link to the Israeli ,and Egyptian grid as well as generation of their own through plants that use fuel oil provided through Israeli check points . The flow of this oil has been disrupted due to about 70 rocket attacks per day from Gaza. Hamas has COMPLETE control of where electricity goes once it is in Gaza . So, yes ,Gaza city has seen dramatic blackouts that are visible from Google satellite cites ; but ironically it does not appear to affect the Kassan rocket plants. I would guess that if they would just quit targeting the Nahal Oz fuel terminal then perhaps even that source of energy would not be restricted ;or maybe if they would use that rocket fuel to fire up their generators then there would be no energy shortage. (only kidding... I know they don't use rocket fuel on small surface to surface weapons)
The way I see it ; Gaza has a working port and a border with Egypt. Why should Israel provide ANY fuel to them ? If this is a crisis let the Muslim world deal with it. In the mean time let the Gazans cash in all the carbon credits they are collecting with the blackout. That should take care of their needs.
DC ;what about the collective punishment inflicted on the residents of the border towns ?
magprob
Jan 21, 2008, 12:43 PM
Here is a sample of the bias Palestinians face in our media:
On February 25, 2005, the Los Angeles Times website edition headline read: "Palestinian Suicide Bomber Shatters Calm of Late." The article goes on to state that this bomber "shattered a month-long period of relative calm."
The author is referring to the ceasefire between Israel and Palestine agreed to on February 8, 2005 and the "relative" calm before and after it was agreed to.
There are two issues here: 1) who has been breaking the "calm," and 2) whose "calm" are we talking about?"
Issue #1: Who has been breaking the "
Issue #1: Who has been breaking the "?
- Since the ceasefire on February 8th until February 25th - the bombing, Israeli military and illegal settlers have killed eight Palestinians, two of them children.
- Since the previous Palestinian suicide bomber on November 1, 2004 in which Israelis lost three lives, Israeli military and illegal settlers have killed 170 Palestinian men, women, and children; injured and maimed 379 Palestinian men, women, and children; have held 8,000 Palestinians – 300 of them children - in prison where they are routinely abused; confiscated hundreds of acres of Palestinian land; expanded the illegal Apartheid wall; expanded the illegal settlements; demolished hundreds of Palestinian homes and orchards; continued the ruination of the Palestinian economy with checkpoints and curfews until 70% of the Palestinian people are unemployed and living in abject poverty, etc. etc.
Issue #2: Whose "?
- Since the ceasefire on February 8th until February 25th - the bombing, Israeli military and illegal settlers have killed eight Palestinians, two of them children.
- Since the previous Palestinian suicide bomber on November 1, 2004 in which Israelis lost three lives, Israeli military and illegal settlers have killed 170 Palestinian men, women, and children; injured and maimed 379 Palestinian men, women, and children; have held 8,000 Palestinians – 300 of them children - in prison where they are routinely abused; confiscated hundreds of acres of Palestinian land; expanded the illegal Apartheid wall; expanded the illegal settlements; demolished hundreds of Palestinian homes and orchards; continued the ruination of the Palestinian economy with checkpoints and curfews until 70% of the Palestinian people are unemployed and living in abject poverty, etc., etc.
Issue #2: Whose " are we talking about?
Surely, after reading the above, not the Palestinians!
The article might better be titled "Palestinians Retaliate for Israel's Terrorist Actions" are we talking about?
Surely, after reading the above, not the Palestinians!
The article might better be titled "If Americans Knew" You will never see a headline like that in the mainstream American media, no matter how much it is deserved. I guarantee it!
Issue #3: Who did the suicide bomber attack?
This subject was not even touched in the article by the L.A. Times. The Palestinian bomber attacked an Israeli combat unit that had taken part in numerous brutal invasions in civilian Palestinian neighborhoods. They had killed and mutilated numerous Palestinian men, women, and children. In the Palestinian attack no Israeli civilians were hurt.
When all this was brought up to an editor on the Los Angeles Times foreign desk by Alison Weir, a noted journalist and author of the excellent website "Back in 1982, I was able to place an Israeli soldier, a reservist, who refused to serve in Lebanon on the biggest radio talk show in San Francisco. He told the truth about the Lebanon war, that the Palestinians were not shelling Lebanon, and in the second hour of the program which was broadcasted to a national audience, someone, with a strong accent, called and asked 'who is responsible for putting this communist on the air?' The talk show host said that he was…. Very soon afterward, that talk show host who was the most popular radio programmer in San Francisco, was replaced by a Zionist who is there to this day (2006) and who is such a Zionist that every year, when they have an Israeli Day celebration in San Francisco, he is the master of ceremonies. On the airwaves, on the major networks, you will find either among the owners or the more important decision making positions, people who are clearly Zionists."
tomder55
Jan 21, 2008, 12:58 PM
Above quoted from this cite : ZionismExplained.org/Zionism and the Media (http://zionismexplained.org/media/media.html)
I note your unbiased source does not provide confirming links either .
magprob
Jan 21, 2008, 01:19 PM
February 25, 2005, the Los Angeles Times
Sorry there wasn't a hot link tom but you can Google.
Israel agrees to ease Gaza blockade - Israel-Palestinians - MSNBC.com (http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/22765132/)
By the way, while Bush was on vacation in the region, he told Egypt to tighten their border with Gaza.
magprob
Jan 21, 2008, 01:24 PM
msnbc.com Video Player (http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/21134540/vp/22012534#22012534)
Blair on Mideast peace.
Dark_crow
Jan 21, 2008, 01:40 PM
Here is a sample of the bias Palestinians face in our media:
On February 25, 2005, the Los Angeles Times website edition headline read: "Palestinian Suicide Bomber Shatters Calm of Late." The article goes on to state that this bomber "shattered a month-long period of relative calm."
The author is referring to the ceasefire between Israel and Palestine agreed to on February 8, 2005 and the "relative" calm before and after it was agreed to.
There are two issues here: 1) who has been breaking the "calm," and 2) whose "calm" are we talking about?"
Issue #1: Who has been breaking the "calm"?
- Since the ceasefire on February 8th until February 25th - the bombing, Israeli military and illegal settlers have killed eight Palestinians, two of them children.
- Since the previous Palestinian suicide bomber on November 1, 2004 in which Israelis lost three lives, Israeli military and illegal settlers have killed 170 Palestinian men, women, and children; injured and maimed 379 Palestinian men, women, and children; have held 8,000 Palestinians – 300 of them children - in prison where they are routinely abused; confiscated hundreds of acres of Palestinian land; expanded the illegal Apartheid wall; expanded the illegal settlements; demolished hundreds of Palestinian homes and orchards; continued the ruination of the Palestinian economy with checkpoints and curfews until 70% of the Palestinian people are unemployed and living in abject poverty, etc., etc.
Issue #2: Whose "calm" are we talking about?
Surely, after reading the above, not the Palestinians!
The article might better be titled "Palestinians Retaliate for Israel's Terrorist Actions" You will never see a headline like that in the mainstream American media, no matter how much it is deserved. I guarantee it!
Issue #3: Who did the suicide bomber attack?
This subject was not even touched in the article by the L.A. Times. The Palestinian bomber attacked an Israeli combat unit that had taken part in numerous brutal invasions in civilian Palestinian neighborhoods. They had killed and mutilated numerous Palestinian men, women, and children. In the Palestinian attack no Israeli civilians were hurt.
When all this was brought up to an editor on the Los Angeles Times foreign desk by Alison Weir, a noted journalist and author of the excellent website "If Americans Knew", the Los Angeles Times editor just hung up on her.
Another Example - Jeffrey Blankfort Tells This Story
"Back in 1982, I was able to place an Israeli soldier, a reservist, who refused to serve in Lebanon on the biggest radio talk show in San Francisco. He told the truth about the Lebanon war, that the Palestinians were not shelling Lebanon, and in the second hour of the program which was broadcasted to a national audience, someone, with a strong accent, called and asked 'who is responsible for putting this communist on the air?' The talk show host said that he was…. Very soon afterward, that talk show host who was the most popular radio programmer in San Francisco, was replaced by a Zionist who is there to this day (2006) and who is such a Zionist that every year, when they have an Israeli Day celebration in San Francisco, he is the master of ceremonies. On the airwaves, on the major networks, you will find either among the owners or the more important decision making positions, people who are clearly Zionists."
Israel wants Hamas to stop bombarding them with rockets, Hamas demands Israel dissolve its government, and in that lays the crux of the problem. People can spin the issues of who is at fault all they want but that remains the problem.
magprob
Jan 23, 2008, 12:28 PM
The day Gaza's Berlin Wall came down - Telegraph (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2008/01/23/wgaza323.xml)
AlterNet: ForeignPolicy: Gaza: The Lessons of Violence (http://www.alternet.org/audits/74588/?page=2)
Gazans destroy wall, pour into Egypt - Israel-Palestinians - MSNBC.com (http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/22794305/)