Originally Posted by daveskee
The fix for my problem was running the high loop and getting rid of the air gap. Nothing else worked.


Thanks Dave, I rest my case. Tom
Growler! Any last words?

It is good to rest [smilez]

Any last words??

Gimme a break, Tom.

If I had any last words to add, they would fly in one ear and out the other as they always have.

And besides -- No matter how wrong you might be, I'm under direct orders from the Mods to never openly disagree with you again.

Go figger.

No matter how wrong you might be, I'm under direct orders from the Mods to never openly disagree with you again.
HORSE HOCKEY!! You were told not to disrespect and trash out other experts. Don't lay this on me, you brought on the censure all by yourself. Did you read what Dave said? NOTHING ELSE WORKED!! And this is what this page's all about. What works for the asker. Not what agrees with your area code. And the reason you have no last words is that your augment's with Dave and it's hard to argue against success Sour grape from a poor loser on your part Growler, I expected better. You're a good plumber but your attitude could use some adjusting. That's why the site mods stepped in. And as far as disagreeing with me there's a right way and a wrong way. You may disagree with us all you wish. Just don't trash us out when you do it. Regards, tom

HORSE HOCKEY!!! You were told not to disrespect and trash out other experts.

Let me see if I have this right:

You invite me to respond (some might even say you goaded me into responding) -- And then you trash my response.

Does that sound about right to you, Tom?

Would you like me to put up the mods post to you so you can reread it. You seem to have lost the content of the message along the way. Goad you? Nah Growler! I just like to tweek you once in a while. Any body that places code above a working solution's always fun to mess with. And you're more fun then anybody on this page. Oh yes! And would you like to point out to Dave how weong he is. " If it ain't according to my code it won't work". Too funny!!

Would you like me to put up the mods post to you so you can reread it.

Certainly not for my benefit, but you do have my permission to do so if you think it will benefit somebody else.


You seem to have lost the content of the message along the way.

I didn't, actually.

Rick was quite specific in what is and is not appropriate posting behavior.


Goad you? Nah Growler! I just like to tweek you once in a while.

Right.

And when the reverse happens and I "tweek" you, you drag the moderators into the fray.


Any body that places code above a working solution's always fun to mess with. And you're more fun then anybody on this page.

So the forums rules don't apply to the group moderators, right?


Oh yes! And would you like to point out to Dave how weong he is. " If it ain't according to my code it won't work".

I didn't say it wouldn't work, I said it wouldn't meet code.

And if you read the original thread, Daveskee says:

"Yes local code here requires the air gap. If I was staying in the house I'd solve it with your solution but we're preping to sell soon and it'll have to pass inspection so I'd rather take care of it per code. I also want to know for my own education why it's happening."

In the international code an air gap is required, but in the amendments of many municipalities an amendment to allow the loop is added but most don't catch it. I can tell you, I will never use an air gap for a dishwasher. It is unsightly and can get clogged with debris. A mechanical trap in principle has laways been against code and that is what this is. A check valve on a water distribution system is used because the water does not have debris in it and has a constant pressure to push it.
As for the 'dialogue' you 2 have, there is obviously a personality conflict. It is sad, I like you both. Hate to lose either of you because you could not 'let it go'. Highly unprofessional.

Give it a rest growler! It's your "pit-bull" attitude that got you censured. Not only with me but with other experts. I'd just like you to think outside the code box once in a while. I may "tweek" you for quoting code like bible scripture but I've never mounted a personal attack on you. I respect you as a plumber too much for that.
Let's bury it now and get back to ansering questions. Regards, Tom PS. As you authorized I have posted Ricks post to you. Gee groiwler! I'm looking for the part where it says you can never disagree with me. Oops! It's not there is it?

Originally Posted by RickJ
Hi Growler. I'll save the fluff and be right to the points:

Clearly you have expertise that benefits this site. We appreciate it a lot - and have even discussed naming you Plumbing Expert.

In so many ways you compliment our current Plumbing Expert well (like here), but elsewhere are comments directed to other answerers that are absolutely unacceptable; like

"...the biggest problem I have with yours and Tom's advice..."

"How can you say that without knowing..."

We explain in the Posting Rules, but the gist is to stick to answering the question. Perfectly fine to quote another's answer then say "I disagree because..."

From there, let the asker decide.

Please direct your comments to the asker and the question, not to other members.

Thank you,

Rick.

in the international code an air gap is required, but in the amendments of many municipalities an amendment to allow the loop is added but most don't catch it. I can tell you, I will never use an air gap for a dishwasher. It is unsightly and can get clogged with debris.

Y'know, I keep hearing this, yet have never had an issue with any of the hundreds I have installed over the years-- On the flip side of that argument, the ones installed by others that I have seen overflow could be traced back to an improper installation.

In my experience, the two biggest offenders are; Not thoroughly knocking out the plug in the disposal and back grading the 7/8" discharge hose where it enters the disposal.


a mechanical trap in principle has always been against code and that is what this is.

I'm not sure I follow.

There are no moving parts, so how can it be considered "mechanical"?


a check valve on a water distribution system is used because the water does not have debris in it and has a constant pressure to push it.

Having cleaned out the trap on a number of wye strainers over the years, I have to disagree with you on that point -- Not to mention the number of atmospheric vacuum breakers that failed when debris lodged in the seat.


as for the 'dialogue' you 2 have, there is obviously a personality conflict.

Yeah, collisions between 'by the book' and 'fly by the seat of the pants' personalities are pretty much pre-ordained.

>shrugs<

And so it goes.


it is sad, I like you both. Hate to lose either of you because you could not 'let it go'.

Barring banishment by the powers that be, I'm not going anywhere anytime soon.


highly unprofessional.

>shrugs<

Sometimes I just got to be me, Doug.

I wouldn't be much of a Growler if I didn't growl every once in awhile.

Clearly you have expertise that benefits this site. We appreciate it a lot - and have even discussed naming you Plumbing Expert.


In the immortal words of William Tecumseh Sherman:

"If drafted, I will not run; if nominated, I will not accept; if elected, I will not serve."

:D

We are going to miss you