Hope you experts out there can give me some clues before I become desperate and turn to a pro. Here is some info about the tractor and what I have done so far:

This is a 1999 Kohler electric start 42' mower, bought new in 2001, model 917.271141. I have replaced oil filter, air filter/screen, fuel filter, and spark plug. It does start with choke, but dies instantly once release the key or shift to full throttle. Inside carb, choke & throttle adjustments seem to work just fine, and sparks look OK but a little suspicious, since no sparks at all as soon as key is released. Also, while inspecting sparks with plug out, don't see any fuel mixture puffing. However, when I try to start again, always get backfires with a bang (thought indicating no fuel line issue). Inspected all three switches (seat, engage and brake), they seem to function as supposed to (but not sure if any electrical fault). The gaskets between the carb and engine are fairly worn and a little dirty and will be replaced. After all above, with fresh fuel, still no luck. The very last time it started with some difficulty (after a few tries) and when I engaged the mower, it died.

I'm a total novice, never opened an engine and not even sure how the fuel is pumped (don't seem to have a pump, but don't fully understand my carb either). Short of opening up the engine, is there anything simple that I can do before turn over to a pro? Could it be gum caused valve sticking? Help!

- ny4fun

Could be the ignition switch since you stated it quit firing when the key was released, could be the flywheel key if it is backfiring as you say. Check the flywheel key by removing the blower housing (top of engine) and the nut that holds the flywheel down, visually inspect, you should see a groove in the flywheel and the crankshaft, they are to be lined up.

The flywheel key shears to protect the engine under extreme stress.

Umm, yes that is right k.i.s.s. (what a name).

So do propeller keys. You learn the hard way when you have to row back to shore. <G>.

Row , row , rrrrrrrrrrrrrooooooooooooowwwwwwwwwwwww your boat kiss.(do you mean that mean like? some people may see it that way, [keepitsimplestupid].

Thanks guys! I'll take a look at the flywheel key. This may be a little challenging to me with limited tools and experience, but I'll let you guys know. If it is not the problem, I'll replace the ignition switch.

I don't quite understand why no fuel puffing out from the plug hole when I tested it several times, and yet if I try twice or more on choke, I get the bang. The owner's manual is almost useless to a novice like me. Any suggestion for a better manual?

There are shop manuals available, although may be a little hard for you to come by. Use extra caution when replacing the switch. Some shops will carry aftermarket switches, if you look on the connections, or the body of the switch by where the connections are, there will be letters designating what that connection goes to. If these are not in the exact correct order, your mower is going to either fry something electrical, or just will not work.

MM:

No I don't mean that mean. I was young, like maybe 12 or younger and was out on the water with my uncle on Lake Michigan on a row boat with like a 5 HP outboard motor. I think I was "piloting" and hit something with the prop. There were no extra sheer pins in the boat, so "row row row your boat" so to speak back to shore. You learn the hard way what it means to "be prepared".

KISS

MM, k.i.s.s.

Following your suggestion, I took off the blower housing and the nut holding down the flywheel, but unable to take it off. Tried gently to prod it up with screw driver and wedge , but didn't work. Any special tool or trick for this?
Of course, I don't want to damage anything, and boy, taking out the nut was some challenge with self made tools.

Well, with the nut removed from the flywheel you should be able to see if the key is sheared or not. If it is not aligned up it is sheared. Sometimes this is difficult to remove (the flywheel) even with a flywheel puller.

Hey MM,
A blue mark on the shaft and the slit on the flywheel are not aligned, about 90 degrees apart. I suppose the key is under the flywheel and is damaged and ought to be replaced. I guess even the key is not damaged and just needs to be realigned, I'd still need to remove the flywheel first. Hold on, I'll let you know.

The key is damaged.

It's visible when you remove the nut like MOWERMAN said.

Pulling the flywheel is a different story all together. It fits on a cone, so there is a lot of surface area that can grab. A flywheel puller may be required.

Thanks kiss!
I've tried various ways and still can't remove the flywheel. Tried to pry it up, rock it loose, and lift it up by securing a long metal rod to the flywheel with the fan securing screws and nylon wires. Doing so, I almost lifted the tractor many times and yet the flywheel didn't budge. Need to hit a tool store for a puller before retry.
This is my first attempt ever to play a mechanic, and with your help, it's fun and hope to get the tractor back to life without the help of a Pro.

You need to be cautious, you are scaring me now. Remember you are working with aluminum crankcase. You pry too hard and you need an engine housing, and I don't think you are up to that. You can get a flywheel puller for a briggs and stratton engine. Apply the nut flush at the top of the crankshaft bolt, apply the puller, set lock nuts against bolt threads going into the flywheel, tighten the nuts against the puller itself, then give it an EASY blow with a hammer. Then tighten the top nuts against the puller itself and tap again with the hammer, not TOO hard though. Remember you are dealing with your crankshaft here. Be careful.

Look at page 12.

http://www.briggsandstratton.com/miscpdfs/RNT/tool_cat.pdf

You have to get one for your engine. You can get a diagram of your engine on this site so you can see what your up against.

MM,
Thanks for your warning! I was quite careful and easy on the flywheel, not wanting to cause any further damage to the tractor for sure. I'll get a puller and do what you prescribed and wish me luck.

KISS,
Thanks for the link! The basic tool set is already an eye opener to me. I barely have any of these tools. No wonder I was wondering how am I supposed to get the right torque specified, etc. I definitely need a few pieces of them to get the flywheel work done right.

I remember designing and building something and I kept having to make special tools in order for the design to be workable.
1. A tool to square a round hole in teflon
2. A split nut to hold a set screw in a lathe so I could drill and tap it without
Damaging the threads
3. A spring depressor, so I could insert a pin

And then tricks to add a 0.002" gap so Sn 96 solder would flow between two very small flat pieces 1/8" wide and 0.4" long x 1/16" thick and a piece of 1/8" square tubng.

Any progress? Remember , be careful!

Didn't find the right puller yet, but with help from a friend, tried a lot more diagnosis. First, did see the key in the slit on the flywheel (could it really split off from the keyway from shearing?). Second, taking spark plug out, turning flywheel around confirmed piston reaches top when magnet hits coil, seems to suggest flywheel key still in place. Third, spraying start fluid and WD-40 into carb many times, didn't start. Forth, further confirmed strong sparks. On choke, it almost starts normal until switched to run or backfires if I hold at ignition for too long.

Will get a puller in the next day or two to take off the flywheel, and then thinking about taking off the cylinder head to inspect valves. I was ignorant and didn't empty fuel tank for the past 6 winters, and didn't use stabilizer either. Spraying into carb didn't start, seems to suggest either fuel cut off by non-responsive intake valve? Also, before it died, I do recall I had less and less reaction time to move to full throttle after start at choke, not exactly sure what this suggests. I would've delivered to a shop for repair if I realized this is way beyond me earlier, but have gone so far, with many things apart, would want to continue. Hey, I got the whole winter to deal with this!

The key is supposed to sheer when stressed.

Talk about a Rube Goldberg flywheel puller: http://ohmelovelo.dnsalias.org/tools/FlywheelPuller1.jpg

Looks like you hit the center bolt with a dead blow hammer.

Here is Briggs info on inspecting the flywheel key:
How is the flywheel and key inspected? (http://faqs.custhelp.com/cgi-bin/faqs.cfg/php/enduser/std_adp.php?p_faqid=3422&p_created=1098394295)

Use Carb cleaner for starting fluid.

I guess, you didn't get the nut off?

Your test: Second, taking spark plug out, turning flywheel around confirmed piston reaches top when magnet hits coil, seems to suggest flywheel key still in place isn't 100% valid unless you know what part of the stroke the engine is in and you'd need a compression tester or you need to be able to watch the valves.

Spraying into the spark plug it will only sputter once or so. That might confirm timing is OK and you have a fuel delivery problem. Do you think it's flooding or not getting gas because of debris in the tank holding the carb fuel valve open or closed?

If you remove the plug wire and try to start it, is the plug wet which would confirm fuel?

Remember, you need fuel, spark, oxygen as a first level diagnostic. Compression can be a little harder to check depending on the engine. Some engines won't show compression unless turned backwards.

I am still at a total loss about the flywheel key. I did take off the nut, and the big washer under it, and was able to see the key in the flywheel keyway. The weird thing is I did not hit anything hard. I engaged it probably 20sec earlier than I normally do, it died till today.

That's quite a puller of your picture! I doubt I can make that (need to gradually build up my tools). Will look around the tractor shops for both a wrench and puller.

About my test of piston movement, I forgot to mention earlier I thought I should get the piston up at 180 degree from the magnet, but did not, and still wonders why and how to push the exhaust out?

Spraying into the carb hole, I was trying to see whether it would sputter a few times, that would indicate problem is with the carb, not delivering fuel. But, no, it did the same, stalled instantly when key is released, which somehow seems to indicate fuel gone into the engine but might be blocked by the intake valve?

I have strong sparks, can't be sure about fuel delivery including intake valve, and not sure about oxygen either, since it would not attempt to start if not at choke, no matter how loud it cranks.

I need to clear up flywheel key question first, and then look into the valves. Boy, I'm a first timer, with barely any tool, and worse barely any knowledge before I ventured into fixing the tractor, and so glad that you and mm are here giving me guidance!

Well, the flywheel key could be the problem here. If this is an ohv engine, you can remove the tappet cover(valve cover that has ohv on it). And set the engine at tdc and then turn the flywheel another 1/4 INCH clockwise, and set the valves. BUT to do this, the flywheel key has to be correct and not sheared.

After several trips to local tractor shops, auto parts, Sears/Walmart, I realized a flywheel puller that fits my engine isn't that easy to find. Didn't get a wrench that can hold the flywheel either (to put it back together once done). Anyhow, didn't do much in the past 10 days. Talk to a number of folks in the local shops, and heard different suspects. One was quite sure it's electrical, while another suspected fuel pump, and others of course, the flywheel key. I guess I'll need to figure out a way to isolate one at a time.
I probably wasn't clear enough on the start. It starts on choke always like normal, but doesn't run at all, and dies instantly when key is released, suggesting 1) timing off, couldn't deliver the momentum to run, or 2) not enough fuel to keep it going (blocked fuel delivery), or 3) electrical fault under seat which could cut off fuel delivery in circuits, or 4) sparks too weak (my sparks like bright yellowish, no where close to blue color).
Any more ideas or comments based on above?

Any possibility it's the ignition switch?

Like, it can spark when cranking and stop when the ignition switch is in the on position?

I'm not sure, if the ignition switch works like a car. In a car, during crank one terminal gets powered and another looses power. The terminal that looses power is connected to non essential loads like the radio. Ever notice that the radio goes off while your cranking.
The terminal that stays powered runs things like the ignition system.

One is ACC and is usually the terminal that looses power when cranked.

Can you post a schematic or a link to one?

BTW: The parts diagram is on www3.sears.com

MM: Help!

I looked at the diagram and I have another suggestion:

Take out the plug and fasten it so you can see the spark. Put the ignition in the ON position.
Jump the solenoid terminals carefully with a screwdriver and see if there is spark at the plug while cranking.

Yeah, ignition switch is a suspect, and I'll need to figure it out a way to test or just order a new one from Sears. You and MM warned me earlier not to fry it.

I don't have a separate switch on position. It is the crank position when key is released. Did try to see whether there is any spark by using hand to spin the flywheel by the coil, did not see any spark. But was thinking maybe I wasn't spinning the flywheel fast enough to generate enough voltage for the spark.

Here is what the Carb looks like and a schematic. (http://www.geocities.com/ny4fun2002/Craftsmn_Tractor.html) Not sure whether the thing below the carb is fuel pump or what.

So, it's off, on and crank. What you have to do is put ignition switch in ON and crank using some other method: Jump the start terminal on the ignition switch. Make the starter solenoid go using the low current side or make the starter go using the high current side.

Jump white on the solenoid to battery when the ignition switch is ON. This bypasses all interlocks, so be careful.

The flywheel key is iffy. Lets assume it's OK.

The thing on the bottom of the carb has to be fuel cut. Where is the other wire?

The Kohler engine is on www3.sears.com under model CV16.5S-43527.

You can post pics directly on this site. Use the "Go adv.anced" tab. And remember to select and download. Good free picture cropping software is "Irfanview"

Yeah, ignition switch is a suspect, and I'll need to figure it out a way to test or just order a new one from Sears. You and MM warned me earlier not to fry it.

I don't have a separate switch on position. It is the crank position when key is released. Did try to see whether there is any spark by using hand to spin the flywheel by the coil, did not see any spark. But was thinking maybe I wasn't spinning the flywheel fast enough to generate enough voltage for the spark.

Here is what the Carb looks like and a schematic. (http://www.geocities.com/ny4fun2002/Craftsmn_Tractor.html) Not sure whether the thing below the carb is fuel pump or what.
No that is not a fuel pump, that is the anti-after fire (fuel shut off solenoid), to test, remove from carb bowl, reconnect wires, hold against a grounded area of the engine and turn the key, it should have a plunger looking pin in the center that will retract downwards toward the body of the fuel solenoid when the key is activated.

Hope you experts out there can give me some clues before I become desperate and turn to a pro. Here is some info about the tractor and what I have done so far:

This is a 1999 Kohler electric start 42' mower, bought new in 2001, model 917.271141. I have replaced oil filter, air filter/screen, fuel filter, and spark plug. It does start with choke, but dies instantly once release the key or shift to full throttle. Inside carb, choke & throttle adjustments seem to work just fine, and sparks look ok but a little suspicious, since no sparks at all as soon as key is released. Also, while inspecting sparks with plug out, don't see any fuel mixture puffing. However, when I try to start again, always get backfires with a bang (thought indicating no fuel line issue). Inspected all three switches (seat, engage and brake), they seem to function as supposed to (but not sure if any electrical fault). The gaskets between the carb and engine are fairly worn and a little dirty and will be replaced. After all above, with fresh fuel, still no luck. The very last time it started with some difficulty (after a few tries) and when I engaged the mower, it died.

I'm a total novice, never opened an engine and not even sure how the fuel is pumped (don't seem to have a pump, but don't fully understand my carb either). Short of opening up the engine, is there anything simple that I can do before turn over to a pro? Could it be gum caused valve sticking? Help!

- ny4fun
It seams like you have two problems (the one where the engine dies when you release the key is probably a short in the kill circuit. Try disconnectiong the kill wire that goes to the ignition coil and if it stays running check the seat switch first. The second one where you get it to run abd it dies is probably the carburator adjustments or the carburator needs to be cleaned (some time two or three cleanings with acitone mite correct the problem) of course the initial settings on the carb-is a good place to start

Where have we gotten to on this unit?

My regulator on the Craftsman 917.271141 Kohler engine CV16.5s I think is bad. The original part has five wires coming out of a black box. Three go to the igniter and two go elsewhere. The replacement part shows only three prongs. Can someone tell me that is correct