8 threads merged together for the full story


I recently discovered my ex girlfriend of 4 years in college/grad school is now married. I had always wanted to call her and reconnect but never did as I was the one that ended the relationship. I always thought she'd be available and I'd be able to win her back. It's been 5 years since we broke up. I have dated other girls and still she's always on my mind. She was everything I wanted and I blew it. She was smart, cute, and funny and had a great family. In short, I am convinced she was "The One" for me and I let her get away. Now, I have found her number and feel I have to call her in hopes of salvaging a "friendship" out of a relationship I ruined. Too many things have not been said that should've. Maybe I can't change the fact that she's married but I feel I have to let her know how I'm feeling and have felt.

Thoughts?

How long until song/pictures, etc. don't bring up vivid memories of us together. So painful, so sad, so full of regret.

I recently discovered my ex girlfriend of 4 years in college/grad school is now married. I had always wanted to call her and reconnect but never did as I was the one that ended the relationship. I always thought she'd be available and I'd be able to win her back. It's been 5 years since we broke up. I have dated other girls and still she's always on my mind. She was everything I wanted and I blew it. She was smart, cute, and funny and had a great family. In short, I am convinced she was "The One" for me and I let her get away. Now, I have found her number and feel I have to call her in hopes of salvaging a "friendship" out of a relationship I ruined. Too many things have not been said that should've. Maybe I can't change the fact that she's married but I feel I have to let her know how I'm feeling and have felt.

Thoughts?

How long until song/pictures, etc. don't bring up vivid memories of us together. So painful, so sad, so full of regret.

I can understand your pain and desire to be her friend... which you may give a shot at. One should do what he or she wants to do at least once... so if you die today, no desires should be left undone. So see for yourself if she is willing to be your friend but if she doesn't then accept and don't look back. This is life and you need to take each day as it comes... live it because you live it just once! any clearer...

My thoughts are you let this relationship go for a reason. If she was so great then would you have really ended it? Often time clouds our memory of what was real, maybe you have just forgotten what made you break it off in the first place or time just makes your differences seem not as important. You may just be suffering from hurt pride, that she got married before you did. I say don't contact her ex's are ex's for a reason. On the other hand if you happen to see her and say hello, fine, but I would leave it at that.

You didn't mention why you dumped her.. if it was for the same reasons that people in here get dunped for (there are no clear reasons), then I'd shoot you if I was in her place.
And if you dumped her because she wasn't worth it, then I wonder why you'd want to contact her after 5 years? The only reason would be is that you got "jealous" in some way and it's a bit selfish if you ask me.

Again, just my insight based on the little things you mentioned.

My thoughts are that the past should be left in the past. It did not work out for a reason and if she was truly the one for you, you would actually be with her right now. The thing is we all move on and experience different situations. This is a time that you need to throw that number a way and leave it in the past. Both of you went in different directions and you need to realize that it was not meant to be. After 5 years, to actually come into somebody else's life will just cause more turmoil.

Joe

As Numb suggested, it's not likely that she'd appreciate you contacting her now. And neither will her husband. Just let it go.

It sounds like you are beating yourself up and not really being honest with yourself. You and your ex-girlfriend broke up 5 years ago and now she is married. You ended the relationship.

If you ended the relationship then there must have been reasons you felt she was not right for you. There must have been things or something that happened that you felt were not for you. Otherwise you would not have ended it at all. You would have stayed with her. Somehow you are blocking out the reasons you left and now discounting it. But the reasons you broke up were valid reasons.

If she was everything you wanted you would not have left. You would have known then and there that this was it.

Now listen, if you ran because you got scared and the relationship was moving on to a marriage - and you didn't want that - and so you left - then it was still a valid reason why you left. There is something here that you are not acknowledging to yourself about this relationship. Because had you really felt the connection and wanted her back you would have done it. Don't beat yourself up over this.

Yes, perhaps you regret the relationship ended. Ok, that is normal. The sadness that it was over. You have good memories to live by. Had it been right it would have gone on and you would have stayed together. Move on at this point. There will be another one for you and when the time is right you'll have your wedding day. Take care.

Get over it, after all this time, and leave her alone. You blew it years ago, so let it go now.

I am only 15 and have loved my friends ex since 6th grade. I know how you feel. But you have to let fate take control if it was meant to be then it WILL happen but if not there are plenty of fishes in the sea (wow that rythmes!) haha sorry but leave her alone for now she is happy and married you would regret it if you tried to come between them because she obviously loves him. How would you feel if you were him? Lol hope I helped ansner my q's lol thanks

A few weeks I posted on hear and got some good feedback. A bit of background first. I regrettably ended a relationship with a girl I had dated for 4 years in college and graduate school. To make a long story short, I pushed her away for thoughtless and shallow reasons and destroyed what could've been a great marriage. I'm certain she was THE ONE and always will be. Problem is I contacted her after about 5 years after we finished grad. Schools in different cities. I regrettably found out she's married for about 4 years. My world fell apart after this news. If I had contacted her earlier, I know things would be different. I had always wanted to and she was always on my mind but never felt she wanted to ever hear from me again. I had to contact her and ever since we have talked for hours late at night while her husband heads off to bed. She says she's happily married. Our e-mails have helped heal old wounds and she and I e-mail frequently. So much to catch up on. So much pain. Is there is any chance to think of us ever getting back togetherr? (Her husband's almost 13 years older than her, and I think I could take him in every aspect of life) She would like to meet up again in person. Yet she wants to understandably run the husband first. I know he'll agree, but seems to me that there is some small glimmer of hope of winning her back if she routinely e-mails me and takes my calls. It was her and I way before him. This shouldn't've happened. Thoughts? Never been in this situation, never thought I would be. Always have been able to correct for a mistake. This is the biggest mistake of my life. :(

You have to stop beating yourself up over this. If she was THE ONE the cards would have fell in place a long time ago. As the saying goes "if it was mean't to be it will be". You never contacted her in the past for a reason...

As for trying to win her back... you are absolutely crazy for even thinking of such a thing. She is very happy in her marriage for the past 4 years. You are about to embark on a mission to convince her to love you more than her husband and leave him. Would you want that done to you if you were in his situation? That is just the wrong way to enter this...

I would take this as a beginning of a renewed friendship and nothing more. From what I can tell she has not thrown out any signals as to wanting more. What happens if your plan does not work and you destroyed a perfectly good marriage and lost her as a friend? Think about this first long and hard... you think this was a mistake by letting her go... you are about to make an even BIGGER one by pursuing her...

No offense, but I think this situation is the dream of a lot of people who have been dumped. To move on, find someone else you love and the other person regretting it and coming back once its too late. Personally I think you had your chance, she's married now and you should just be friends (if that's possible).

I think you are fixating on this girl because its easier then moving on.

She is happy and married and has moved on. I think you need to leave her alone because its not healthy for you. You need to close the book on this relationship and move on. If she was supposed to be your wife she would be your wife. Accept that. Saying you lost her and now there will be no one else is ridiculous. If you keep fixating on her and keep saying you will never love again you won't because it's a self fulfilling prophecy.

Its been a LOOOOOOOOOONG time. Not to sound harsh but get over it. Its not going to happen. Move forward in your life and find someone who is available for you to love and want to be your wife.

I agree with all of the below. Any form of a relationship with this girl (even phone/e-mail) is not healthy for either of you, ESPECIALLY for you! Things and people are in the past for a reason. I think like Glinda said, you need to close the book on this relationship. This chapter of your life is over. Now you need to move forward. If you keep moving back, then you will get nothing out of love and life than heartbreak. Cut your losses and move on, she has. Leave the past in the past and build your future. She's married and happy, don't you want happiness for her? If so, she's got that. Now you go find your happiness.
Good luck hon and keep us updated!

<3
Leslie

A few weeks I posted on hear and got some good feedback. A bit of background first. I regrettably ended a relationship with a girl I had dated for 4 years in college and graduate school. To make a long story short, I pushed her away for thoughtless and shallow reasons and destroyed what could've been a great marriage. I'm certain she was THE ONE and always will be. Problem is I contacted her after about 5 years after we finished grad. schools in different cities. I regrettably found out she's married for about 4 years. My world fell apart after this news. If I had contacted her earlier, I know things would be different. I had always wanted to and she was always on my mind but never felt she wanted to ever hear from me again. I had to contact her and ever since we have talked for hours late at night while her husband heads off to bed. She says she's happily married. Our e-mails have helped heal old wounds and she and I e-mail frequently. So much to catch up on. So much pain. Is there is any chance to think of us ever getting back togetherr? (Her husband's almost 13 years older than her, and I think I could take him in every aspect of life) She would like to meet up again in person. Yet she wants to understandably run the husband first. I know he'll agree, but seems to me that there is some small glimmer of hope of winning her back if she routinely e-mails me and takes my calls. It was her and I way before him. This shouldn't've happened. Thoughts? Never been in this situation, never thought I would be. Always have been able to correct for a mistake. This is the biggest mistake of my life. :(
All right kind of new to this so going to try responding to the answers and see what transpires. First, you have some good points, but I've never believed in the "if it's meant to be, it will be" mantra. I made this relationship happen and it was astronomical from the first date. Both our families met and got along great. But, if I can screw it up, I will. Due to an uncertain future for me then, and a then clouded reasoning caused me to obsess about unimportant details (skin tone, religion, lack of exercise). Embarrassing and very petty huh? Deep down I knew these were shallow and unimportant... but wanted to think I could do better, though I knew she was the one for me. So, a great thing came my way and I destroyed it. We even talked about marriage--especially after 3 years of dating most of her and our friends thought it was a done deal. Maybe I was scared. So, how can one say it wasn't meant to be? I have found NO ONE like her since. Trying to move on but after 5 years of her always being on my mind and me chosing to not call her before she married is hard to deal with. It took me 4 years to finally listen my inner voice and alter academic fields for one I should've originally pursued. I fear this is the same case with my ex... however, she is no longer available.

Friendship is what I'm hoping for at least now. In a year or two, who knows. If she actually knows how I've always felt and things happen, they happen. All I know is that if this is affecting me after 5 years, it's a signal to me that I really goofed on reading the signs of life. Looking forward to meeting up with her again in a few weeks.

Thoughts?

You are just trying to rationalize your reasons for wanting to break up her marriage.

You had your chance and you messed it up she has moved on and is happy AND married. Its WAY too late and you need to leave her alone.

How would you feel if she was your wife and some ex-boyfriend popped back in the picture trying to woo her back?

You need to let it go. My guess is that you are obsessing on this girl because you believe that she held your happiness and that had you just married her everything in your life would've been great. You are deluding yourself. If you keep running after her what do you expect to accomplish? What you want her to leave her marriage to be with you? What if once you have her again you start doing the same things you did before or realize that you don't really want her just the idea of her? Have you done ANY therapy because you are obsessive about this woman and I think there is a lot more going on here then you are letting on.

The past is the past, you are trying to fix what happened 4 years ago. Let it go and move on... the only thing that you should look towards is a friendship. To be quite honest I don't think you are quite ready for that either. Stop fixating on HER as a possible mate, you have a choice of the entire WORLD here... how many billions of people with a woman to man ratio of 3-1! Resolve whatever internal issues you have and go fishing... give up on her! She is happy with her life NOW, don't read into anything just because she agreed to meet with you!

You are chasing a DREAM that has been lost for some time now!

A few weeks I posted on hear and got some good feedback. A bit of background first. I regrettably ended a relationship with a girl I had dated for 4 years in college and graduate school. To make a long story short, I pushed her away for thoughtless and shallow reasons and destroyed what could've been a great marriage. I'm certain she was THE ONE and always will be. Problem is I contacted her after about 5 years after we finished grad. schools in different cities. I regrettably found out she's married for about 4 years. My world fell apart after this news. If I had contacted her earlier, I know things would be different. I had always wanted to and she was always on my mind but never felt she wanted to ever hear from me again. I had to contact her and ever since we have talked for hours late at night while her husband heads off to bed. She says she's happily married. Our e-mails have helped heal old wounds and she and I e-mail frequently. So much to catch up on. So much pain. Is there is any chance to think of us ever getting back togetherr? (Her husband's almost 13 years older than her, and I think I could take him in every aspect of life) She would like to meet up again in person. Yet she wants to understandably run the husband first. I know he'll agree, but seems to me that there is some small glimmer of hope of winning her back if she routinely e-mails me and takes my calls. It was her and I way before him. This shouldn't've happened. Thoughts? Never been in this situation, never thought I would be. Always have been able to correct for a mistake. This is the biggest mistake of my life. :(
Wow! I believe that she stills has feelings for you. I also believe that she has committed the biggest mistake of her life. The way it seems to me, she doesn't really love her husband. If you truly love your significant other, you will not be conversing with another individual. It doesn't matter what part of your life they took place in the past. the past is the past. She needs to look inside herself and ask herself the question of what it is she really wants. When things didn't work between the two of you guys, she found a comfortable place and stood there. We can go through that situation, that's the reason why there is so much divorce. Sometimes it takes us a while to find our soulmate. You guys might be soulmates. She needs to be a lady and if being with you is what she really wants. She needs to be sincere with her husband and end it. If she has kids with him, thinks become more difficult. When we put children in the middle, we can't always be selfish. Life is not anymore about us, but about our children. Our children are the ones that will suffer the consequences. Still and all, I believe that she needs to rethink herself and figure out what is the best decision. Playing the down low ordeal is not a decent thing to do. You will bound to cause a tragedy. You should tell her to really think if she wants you in her life. If she doesn't want you around, tell her that you will be a man about it and move on. If they have kids, you have to be the bigger person and think of those innocent ones. Sometimes when something is not meant to be, is not. If it didn't work then, maybe it is because that's the way things had to go. Else, I believe you must give her her space, if she ever solves her life to look for you. Good luck!

A few weeks I posted on hear and got some good feedback. A bit of background first. I regrettably ended a relationship with a girl I had dated for 4 years in college and graduate school. To make a long story short, I pushed her away for thoughtless and shallow reasons and destroyed what could've been a great marriage. I'm certain she was THE ONE and always will be. Problem is I contacted her after about 5 years after we finished grad. schools in different cities. I regrettably found out she's married for about 4 years. My world fell apart after this news. If I had contacted her earlier, I know things would be different. I had always wanted to and she was always on my mind but never felt she wanted to ever hear from me again. I had to contact her and ever since we have talked for hours late at night while her husband heads off to bed. She says she's happily married. Our e-mails have helped heal old wounds and she and I e-mail frequently. So much to catch up on. So much pain. Is there is any chance to think of us ever getting back togetherr? (Her husband's almost 13 years older than her, and I think I could take him in every aspect of life) She would like to meet up again in person. Yet she wants to understandably run the husband first. I know he'll agree, but seems to me that there is some small glimmer of hope of winning her back if she routinely e-mails me and takes my calls. It was her and I way before him. This shouldn't've happened. Thoughts? Never been in this situation, never thought I would be. Always have been able to correct for a mistake. This is the biggest mistake of my life. :(


Nice1 thanks for your thoughts. Kids are not in the picture and I don't think they ever will... a point we both agreed on when we dated. Friendship is definitely in the future, but I'm not sure how well it'd even work as every time I'd see her it'd be a constant reminder of what I had lost and can't have yet. I guess one good thing is that I know I'll never encounter so much agony and pain again in this life. Death, sickness? Bring it on, I can handle that. Granted there are other girls out there, but I have yet to see one who emobodies all the traits I loved about her. I received an e-mail from her about how she saw nothing hopeful in my last e-mails years ago about us and so maybe she did as you say find a comfortable place with a guy 10 years older than her and divorce could be in the future. I'd feel bad for the guy, but darn it, if she had called me earlier all of wouldn'tve had to go through this. Thoughts on why she didn't call me earlier? It takes to to tango. Maybe I already answered this in that she saw nothing hopeful in my e-mails a few years back but then again she was always the type of girl to wait for the guy to call her.

she is no longer available

You said it right there.

Leave her alone. Don't even try to be friends. That isn't possible with you in the mental state that you're in.

Move on.

Hold on.

She told you that she is happily married. Do not manipulate her by saying you want to be friends, when you're here discussing how you're hoping that her and her husband will have a divorce. What's wrong with that picture? I'll tell you:

When you love someone, you want the best for them. You don't hope that the girl you love will suffer through a divorce. Nah; if you love that person, you let them go. And if they come back to you in an "honest" or "clean" way, then your relationship will be that much better!

But, it's time to stop living in a fantasy, and to start living in reality. The reality is that she is married.

Be mature and do the right thing, and I promise that things will work out in your favor; you will be on a clean road towards finding your soulmate, or you'll instead have, in an "honest" way, she may come back to you. Trust me, that if you do the less selfish thing, that your good energy won't go unnoticed or unrewarded. This is hard, but it's called "being a man".

Be a man.

I tend to side with Nice1 on this topic. Yes she says she's happily married but how can one be happily married to someone more than 10 years older than her. Plus, as Nice1 answered that maybe she found a comfortable place and decided to stay there after I broke it off. It wasn't the best choice but she tried to move on. Well, guess what, I'm back. I do think there is a glimmer of hope beyond a potential friendship but I will deal with that option later if that comes around. Otherwise, why would she keep e-mailing me and taking my calls? Just recently I had a lapse in e-mailing her and she said she was concerned she had said something out of place since she hadn't heard from me. If someone is happily married, why would they opt to talk for long hours at night, respond to e-mails and even be open to meeting up again? I know I can salvage a friendship out of this but I don't think a possible relationship is completely out of the question in a couple years from now if she think she goofed also.

If she goofed, let her make that decision on her own, working it out with her husband.

Please break contact and allow her that freedom.

You know... you cannot convince someone that they are in love with you or that they made a mistake and should be with you. She has to do that on her own... by her own terms. You are placing yourself in a situation that will end very badly. Think about the following:

Say you do "convince" her to leave her husband for you. Everything is all fine and dandy for a year or so. He enters in her life and tries the Same thing you did to get HER back. How do think the chips will fall? She did it for you... she may have feelings for him still, she may feel bad on how things ended up with them. She WILL go back to him... A relationship is like a court of law, if there is a shadow of doubt... guess what... you two will never have that healthy relationship that you deserve. You are building a foundation of deceit and lies... that will crumble.

Why is she contacting you so much? Ummmm you have a lot of time that has lapsed to catch up on.

The following is my advice:

STOP reading into things!!
Look for a friendship and nothing more!
If you can't handle it, leave her alone! Stop living in a fantasy and step into planet reality.

Let me set the record straight. I'm not trying to convince this girl that she should be with me. I am in full agreement that she needs to decide this on her own. I am not attempting to persuade her by any means. I am very grateful that she is still willing to talk and catch up and let me be a part of her life again. Whether she'll in time realize what she lost remains to be seen. I think it is interesting to note that in our initial e-mails she stated she tried not to think about our past because of the pain... however it is becoming evident she is remembering our past---a goal I was hoping for as I could not bear the thought that she had forgotten all of our good times.

However, answer me this. Why would someone want to catch up with her first love if she was happily married, etc. Why might it not be for the same reason as to find out if there is anything there and whether she might've too made a mistake? Granted, I believe her primary reason would be to come out with a friendship but you have to admit, it is interesting to ponder (even my friends tell me that at least right now, the potential for this to be more someday exists... however microscopic those chances are).

As far as the reality bit, I've never been so connected to life as I am now. If she was not married then maybe I'd side with everyone saying my hopes for a friendship, etc. are fantasy. However, realizing she is married has brought me out of a long slumber on life.

Hello everyone.

A while ago I threw some questions out there to get feedback on whether to pursue my ex girlfriend of 4 years (college and grad school) who I pushed away some years ago for no good reason. It was totally my fault and I thought I had destroyed any hope of any type of "-ship" occurring. Most told me to not pursue it and to let it go. I couldn't... and listened to my heart. Know what? Since then we've talked more, she's confided in me, had a high end dinner, drinks, and we even came back to my place for a bit and hoped the night would never end. She hadn't changed a bit! While I appreciate the feedback I received, I'm glad I didn't listen to everyone. Following my heart was the best decision I've made in a long time. We are continuing "to go out" again sometime soon and continue to talk and e-mail. And to think, I would've missed out on all of this if I had listened to everyone else. Friendship is secured but this is more than friendship. I know she senses it and also wants more. This time I'm playin' for keeps.

Jim

CONGRATS JIM! My therapist told me its not good to get toooo much advice. It can cause more of a headache. I was getting allot of advice also allot of it I already knew just didn't want to admit. However there also was some that was very negative and I just didn't think some of the things said applied in my situation. Really nice to hear. Good Luck!

Hello everyone.

A while ago I threw some questions out there to get feedback on whether to pursue my ex girlfriend of 4 years (college and grad school) who I pushed away some years ago for no good reason. It was totally my fault and I thought I had destroyed any hope of any type of "-ship" occurring. Most told me to not pursue it and to let it go. I couldn't...and listened to my heart. Know what? Since then we've talked more, she's confided in me, had a high end dinner, drinks, and we even came back to my place for a bit and hoped the night would never end. She hadn't changed a bit! While I appreciate the feedback I received, I'm glad I didn't listen to everyone. Following my heart was the best decision I've made in a long time. We are continuing "to go out" again sometime soon and continue to talk and e-mail. And to think, I would've missed out on all of this if I had listened to everyone else. Friendship is secured but this is more than friendship. I know she senses it and also wants more. This time I'm playin' for keeps.

Jim
First of all... you must always follow your heart. What's the worst answer you could've gotten back from her?? NO? Ok, and then that's fine, because at least you made that step forward, instead of keeping it bottled up inside thinking: would have, could have, should have.

I think that you are very lucky that she gave you a chance to come back into her life. Remember that with a lot of communication in a relationship is key, and will keep that relationship flowing.

I wish your relationship all the best!

Problem is your heart and your brain rarely communicate or agree on things. Following your heart while ignoring your brain has ruined countless lives and wasted lifetimes.

Hello everyone.

A while ago I threw some questions out there to get feedback on whether to pursue my ex girlfriend of 4 years (college and grad school) who I pushed away some years ago for no good reason. It was totally my fault and I thought I had destroyed any hope of any type of "-ship" occurring. Most told me to not pursue it and to let it go. I couldn't...and listened to my heart. Know what? Since then we've talked more, she's confided in me, had a high end dinner, drinks, and we even came back to my place for a bit and hoped the night would never end. She hadn't changed a bit! While I appreciate the feedback I received, I'm glad I didn't listen to everyone. Following my heart was the best decision I've made in a long time. We are continuing "to go out" again sometime soon and continue to talk and e-mail. And to think, I would've missed out on all of this if I had listened to everyone else. Friendship is secured but this is more than friendship. I know she senses it and also wants more. This time I'm playin' for keeps.

Jim
Did I mention she's been married for about 4 years? I know it's an uphill battle but I'm up for it. Her husband was previously divorced and much older than her. The way I look at is that rat bastard had his chance with his first wife and blew it. So bring it on. I've known her much longer than he and had an incredible evening with her. So, this is where everyone told me to forget and move on. I can't and won't. I was hoping that when I saw her I would feel differently... then it might not be real love. Guess what? I saw her and wanted her even more than ever... so the heart wants what the heart wants. She was basically apart of my family before I broke it off after 4 years and she definitely misses that and remembers much of our past.

Anyone want to change their response knowing this info?

You know HER side of the story, not his. Trust me, I've been there before and by the time it was over I actually sympathized with the poor man.

I think it is very hard to send such a question in a forum like this.
People answer based on their beliefs, fears, upbringing, culture.
No one knows what is the "right" thing to do, because there is no right thing to do. Life is a game of guessing, we always make a choice (from so many options) and hope that they will come out to be good for us. In that sense, you're always doing the right choice!
We are not fortune tellers, we never know the outcome of what we're doing, we "guess" what will be the best for us, sometimes we are right, sometimes we are not.
I believe following your heart is the only formula that is closer to your truth. Remember, your truth is yours only and it is your greatest asset.
When you asked the question, you needed help to decide, well, everyone answering you, helped you decide to go and see her, so you should thank them! (even if you didn't like what they wrote, they helped you by writing what was true to them - many times the things we don't like are a great help for our growth)

Good luck in your new love, keep it going and next time, listen to your heart too.

Ronit
Life Coaching - Be Happy in LIFE (http://www.behappyinlife.com/lifecoaching.php)

Against most. Recs. I contacted my old ex-girlfriend who is now married for about 4 years. I pushed her away for stupid reasons that I explained to her (lack of tanning, etc). I knew she was THE ONE and after we saw each other again she also knew I was THE ONE for her. She feels stuck in her marriage as it has not been good for many years. He takes her to appointments, cooks, and cleans---a glorified roommate. But that's it. (Did I mention he's much older than her and previously divorced) Anyway, things have gone so well over the past 3 months with our "dates" that he's since caught on and put limits on our phone calls and IM. Where we once talked for hours (3-4 hours) and flirted, we have sometimes only half that time or less. She doesn't like it... I definitely do not like it. She's told me she feels toward me and I to her. It is love and always has been even after 8 years. So, how long do I have to expect until she leaves her marriage? I don't think she'll be the one who calls it because she doesn't want to be the one who ends it. I think it more likely that he will get fed up and leave.. but how long?Wouldn't you think that if your wife was talking right up to the curfew with her ex that she wasn't into you and that this isn't working? This relationship has progressed much faster than I ever thought it would but it's killing me waiting for her. She and I are in the prime of our life with everything in common and want to be together if it wasn't for her marriage... which is just a shell for the most part. How long?

Thoughts?

Please don't get me wrong. Are you sure you will not push her away again for stupid reasons ( as you said ) if you get her back. Consider this. She will have to break a marriage to get back to you.

Please don't get me wrong. Are you sure you will not push her away again for stupid reasons ( as you said ) if you get her back. Consider this. She will have to break a marriage to get back to you.


400% positive I won't push her away. I dated her for 4 years and never stopped thinking of her in grad. School and even now. She also admitted she always thought of me too. I know what I've lost and nothing can change the way I feel toward her. She's even more beautiful in every way now than even then. Hard to believe I know but it's true. She even said she feels there is a "higher" reason for me coming back into her life than just to apologize for how bad I hurt her. I feel the same way. So much in common re: like/dislikes, 12 years of history... she still remembered our anniversary of when we first went out! Crazy! She and I never thought we'd be in this situation but here we are. She said she wasn't even really looking for marriage when she got married and felt I was never coming back into her life so got married. So no, I'm so changed from being hung up on little tiny flaws that nothing would cause me to push her away ever again. Nobody is perfect and I accept that--although she's perfect in my eyes. So many little things I miss about her when we're together.

To be honest I would stop communicating to her. IF she wants you back and is willing to give up her marriage than it will happen. To me, her husband is not being treated fairly, if she loves you and wants you back than she should tell him and do it. Making him limit your calls and putting this in his head is just not right, if you back off then its HER decision and you can rest easy knowing that.

To me, it sounds as if it plotting and scheming behind his back, how would u feel?

I think BMI got a good point here. How would you feel if you were the husband in this story.

I understand what you are going through right now. I am also in a similar but less complex situation right now. May be you are very emotional, stressed and tensed right now. Very prone to making wrong judgments. I can't tell you what to do now, since I am also in a similar problem and like you I am also looking for a solution. But one thing I can tell you is, please keep your head cool. Do not do anything that makes the situation more complex.

Against most. recs. I contacted my old ex-girlfriend who is now married for about 4 years. I pushed her away for stupid reasons that I explained to her (lack of tanning, etc).

"Lack of tanning?" was one of the reasons you pushed her away?

"Lack of tanning?" was one of the reasons you pushed her away?

Yes, (gulp) stupid stuff like the fact that she didn't tan, etc... stupid pointless stuff. This is too much to delve into here but yes, sad to say... I was not in the right frame of mind then. She knew it and we parted... but the parting lasted too long. I should've called her. Both she and I can't eat nor sleep much since getting back together. She's not happy in her marriage. At times she tells me someone will cross my path... that we have to be friends... yet she tells me her marriage is a shell but she is committed to her word. What do I have to do to convey to her to leave. I know it has to be her decision but if she never decides how wrong is that? I'm terrified of what will happen if we actually talk about all this because I am certain I can't deal hearing her say she can't leave her marriage. Fortunately, it's early in our relationship and maybe later this won't ever even be a choice for her. I'm hopin' her older husband will get a clue and leave. Otherwise, I'm so dead. I have never encountered anything in life so hard as this. How to deal with knowing that what you lost was so incredibly rare and you may never get it back. I've tried to move on but over the past 5 years haven't been able to. She and I both think there has to be a reason for us coming together and again... and not just to apologize. I hope to heavens she's right because, if I not, I don't know when I'll hit bottom if ever. I've tried to see my life without her and it is not one I want. It's dark and bleak, empty and sad. I've lived that for too long. I cannot and will not go back.

BTW, I'm in the right frame of mind. I've never seen things clearer.

Thoughts now?

To be honest I would stop communicating to her. IF she wants you back and is willing to give up her marriage than it will happen. To me, her husband is not being treated fairly, if she loves you and wants you back than she should tell him and do it. Making him limit your calls and putting this in his head is just not right, if you back off then its HER decision and you can rest easy knowing that.

To me, it sounds as if it plotting and scheming behind his back, how would u feel?

I agree here with BMI , how would you feel?? If she wants to be with you then let her finish it with her husband and THEN you can go for it. She is cheating emotionally on her Husband and your there helping. Just think , if she cheats on her now husband there's always a chance in the future she will do it to you.

From your words, I am not so clear about what your girl thinks! She said her marriage is a shell, she has to be committed to her word,but she also said she always believes you will be together again! How? It seems she does not love her husband,but she married him,I don't know why! (maybe just for loneliness or maybe just for making a living,I don't know)she does not love her husband, and she still has feeling for you,believe you will be together again! But she does not end up her marriage unless her husband leaves first,I do not know why either! If she really still loves you and want to be with you and feel sorry for her husband, she should talk with her husband,then find a way out!if not,maybe it is true that you and her husband means the same for her,she can live with any one of you for the rest of her life,now her marriage is boring,she does not love her husband enough,but you are there,you can talk with her,make her feel a little happy in the boring marriage,but be noted that any man can do that! If there is no that man,life goes on,will make no difference for her as time pass by! I think it would be good if you go away,and let her make a decision,or you guys talk with her husband!whatever you do,don't hurt others! No one deserves pain!

I agree here with BMI , how would you feel??? If she wants to be with you then let her finish it with her husband and THEN you can go for it. She is cheating emotionally on her Husband and your there helping. Just think , if she cheats on her now husband there's always a chance in the future she will do it to you.

I think we're beyond the cheating stage. He knows it just an emotional thing right now and as long he as he knows that we're okay still. (He's about 10 older than her and previously divorced) No chance she'd cheat on me. She never did all the time we dated exclusively and if I had called her earlier, she would never have married him. She's even told me this. I cannot walk away from her. She even told me to not walk away. I think she's still working this out in her brain as her heart says yes... again. Plus, walking away a second time?? I feel life has a way of self correcting for mistakes that shouldnt've happened in the past. I could've taken 2 jobs by now in another state over the past 2 years, but something kept pulling me back. I so glad I didn't go because I would never know this feeling now... both good and bad.

So no, I can't walk away. I want to but I can't and I won't. Yes, I think she's cheating emotionally on her husband... but the marriage died a long time ago. Now just basically roommates... not a good reason to stay in it. I hope she sees this soon. I will never be happy without her... she and I complete and click on so many levels it's scary. I am banking on everything... letting everything ride... all the marbles, pulling out all the stops, going for broke, whatever it takes and wherever it takes. Crazy huh? Totally not me but telling someone "I love you" has never been easier or more true. Ya can't love two people and be married. I say be true to your heart. A talk is coming up with her and I... and I'm terrified of how it will end because she's always been the rational one and usually regrets her decision on these things later saying I was right. I KNOW I'm right on this one. I've never been so clear or so sure of anything in life.

So how do I proceed? Attacking her marriage is not a good option. Even if I reiterate all the things she told me about it and ask her how she could consider staying married to one she doesn't really truly love, her answer isn't fair to either of us as she'll say she can't. Maybe just wait for a few more months for her to sort it out and then bring up this stuff?

Daily e-mails, phone calls, flirting, dates, gifts, contact... you tell me. If these aren't signs, I don't know what is.


Thoughts?

First how dare you contact and start seeing a married women, that is just the sign of a real "dog" who does not care about others or moral values at all. I am disgusted.

You stop seeing her, recommend she gets married counseling, AFter a while if her and her husband can't make it, and they divorce in latter time, then after a few months after the divorce you may consider dating her.

If not, may all the misery this type of relationship brings be what you find.

Hey Chicago,

I'm not trying to be a wet blanket, I am only trying to help with what I think is the best think for all parties involved. Whether its what you want to hear is not the concern.

You say that the marriage died but you are in no position to comment on that, its not YOUR marriage. Also, that they are just roomates and that's not a good reason to stay together, again, these are not things that are up to you to deceide. Your justifying the emotional cheating by saying that the marriage is dead and so it lessens the crime, which it doesn't. IF she ends the marriage than you may consider the "signs", as long as you continue to engage in this situation you both are guilty.

I understand what you are saying, believe me. I know whatit is like to want somebody beyond any reason, to do anything for that person, but also to shut out reality and convince myself I am in the right and that this is all for "love", or its fate. Please consider this, I'm not trying to convince you as it seems you will not change your mind and I know its hard to see what I'm seeing when your in the situation and want to see something else. It's wrong Chicago, justifying your feelings and convincing yourself it was "meant to be" will see somebody hurt in the future.

When you do the right thing the right result will happen for you. Please see that.

So no, I can't walk away. I want to but I can't and I won't.
Yes, you can walk away. You can, but you don't want to and therefore, you won't.


Yes, I think she's cheating emotionally on her husband...but the marriage died a long time ago. Now just basically roommates...not a good reason to stay in it. I hope she sees this soon.
She's either not as dissatisfied with her marriage as she has led you to believe, or she has a higher tolerance for a bad relationship than you do.


A talk is coming up with her and I....and I'm terrified of how it will end because she's always been the rational one and usually regrets her decision on these things later saying I was right. I KNOW I'm right on this one. I've never been so clear or so sure of anything in life.
If you're that sure, tell her to call you when her divorce is final. In the meantime, leave her alone to make her decision. Your constant availability and urging yourself on her is actually what's making it possible for her to continue in this holding pattern, delaying making a decision.

So how do I proceed?
....
Maybe just wait for a few more months for her to sort it out and then bring up this stuff??
A few more months of constant interaction behind her husband's back will produce a few more months of what you already have--vacillation, hesitation, and indecision.


Daily e-mails, phone calls, flirting, dates, gifts, contact....you tell me. If these aren't signs, I don't know what is.
Oh they're signs all right. Signs that she loves the excitement of the forbidden (you) without wanting to give up the comfort of the familiar (him). She's using you, and probably will keep doing it for as long as you let her. You may think you're waiting for her to decide, but actually, she's waiting for you to make her decide.

Yes, you can walk away. You can, but you don't want to and therefore, you won't.


She's either not as dissatisfied with her marriage as she has led you to believe, or she has a higher tolerance for a bad relationship than you do.


If you're that sure, tell her to call you when her divorce is final. In the meantime, leave her alone to make her decision. Your constant availability and urging yourself on her is actually what's making it possible for her to continue in this holding pattern, delaying making a decision.

A few more months of constant interaction behind her husband's back will produce a few more months of what you already have--vacillation, hesitation, and indecision.


Oh they're signs alright. Signs that she loves the excitement of the forbidden (you) without wanting to give up the comfort of the familiar (him). She's using you, and probably will keep doing it for as long as you let her. You may think you're waiting for her to decide, but actually, she's waiting for you to make her decide.


All very good points. Thank you. However, know this... she initiated first contact, and subsequent e-mails and IM's. Says she cannot stop thinking of me (nor I her), she realizes that she made a wrong choice but is torn between staying in a situation she's expressly said is not too great. I am simply following my heart. In her heart she also feels the same thing. I've asked if she wants me out of her life... she said no. I can think of nothing more cruel than to (as you suggest) turn a cold shoulder to someone as special as she is and who is reaching out for help. That's not me. I did that 7 years ago... and still feel sick about it. Note: I have never offered her advice on her relationship with her husband nor on the subject of divorce. I fully recognize she has to be the one who makes that decision. Says it's so hard because she wants to be with me but not sure if she can divorce and live with those regrets too. Bottom line... if I had not left her life, she and I would be set. She feels trapped. So, maybe this paints a better picture and puts me in a different light?

What are your thoughts now? (For the record, my closest friend who is married and very honorable in his actions sees my side and is supportive) If she was happy in a marriage, why talk to an ex, go on dates with an ex? She's not that type of girl to just enjoy the fact that it's wrong. In fact that is what is making her sick because she knows its not right, but can't help it as she and I have so much more in common than her husband and misses all we had... because she doesn't have that in her marriage... even after counseling. Ultimately, she feels she made a mistake but doesn't know how to get out. It's her move I know on divorce but I do not see any logic nor humaneness in breaking contact with her in this time of need... did I mention she is some isolated and doesn't have many friends to talk to about this??

Just because she initiated the first contact doesn't mean it's right. I know you would love to think she would never do this to you, but she would. If she is married and it's to the point that the husband knows, and she isn't affected by that... I would worry. Explain that this relationship is not healthy emotionally for either of you... and you must be the one to end it, but this time with good reason. You may have been childish the first time, but from what I see... you haven't done much growing up since then. Not trying to be rude, but what adult thinks it's okay to have a time limit put on conversations and abide by it? If you want no restrictions, she will have to leave. However, do you want that hanging over your head? I would hope not. Please.. please.. please do some soul searching and find the truth and morality to this subject... it's just not right!

I can think of nothing more cruel than to (as you suggest) turn a cold shoulder to someone as special as she is and who is reaching out for help.
I'm not suggesting cruelty or turning a cold shoulder. Tell her how much you love her and how much it hurts to do the right thing. Tell her how much you hope she decides to get a divorce. All I'm suggesting is that you stop enabling her indecision.

In fact that is what is making her sick because she knows its not right, but can't help it as she and I have so much more in common than her husband and misses all we had...because she doesn't have that in her marriage...even after counseling. Ultimately, she feels she made a mistake but doesn't know how to get out.
She can help it, and she does know how, but your constant presence and availability makes it harder for her to act on her knowledge.

It's her move I know on divorce but I do not see any logic nor humaneness in breaking contact with her in this time of need...did I mention she is some isolated and doesn't have many friends to talk to about this???
The logic and humaneness is in not prolonging unnecessarily a wrong and hurtful situation. Every day that this goes unresolved adds to the karmic baggage that all three of you will have to carry away from it. Do the logical and humane thing and cut it short. If she divorces him and comes to you, your relationship will be healthier for it. If she decides to stick with her marriage, it will be easier to fix, and you will find it easier to move on.

Just testing to see if last post worked

Yes it did

Fourteen years ago I met the love of my life. Love at first site. Dated for 4 years. Marriage was in future. Split was over little things... nothing fundamentally wrong. Went on to pursue my degree and lived on my own and found myself. Devastated to realize she had been married 6 years. Marriage was mainly rebound from me and a bit pressured. Says she never really loved him... always loved me... and wouldn'tve married if I had given her hope that I'd be back. Her marriage is sexless, emotionless, and no real connection/little in common. Marriage counseling has failed. Have been dating for 2 years now. Exchange birthday gifts and Christmas gifts. Family reaquainted with her. Sleeping together on weekends and taking vacations together. Talk to her/e-mail every day. Has told him she has feelings for me and she wants something different. Says she'll marry me. Going to counseling to get "tools" to get out of marriage and make decision. He doesn't believe in divorce (first wife left him) and she doesn't want to be the instigator of divorce.

Q is this. How long does general counseling of this type last? How long until she may act after counseling to file for divorce?

Spare me the details about "other fish in sea" and "married women off limits". She's different affair is different. Following my heart. Waiting is killing me but she's the one and no one else.

PS... I know there are alotta nay sayers out there. Have you heard of Dr. Nancy Kalish's book "Lost Loves Found" A therapist told me about it. It's a collection of stories about lost loves found again and how people ended perfectly good marriages to go back to their first true love. Goes into detail about how strong and deep a bond sometimes exists between those who really found true love and for one reason or another parted. IT HAPPENS AND you have Ph.D writing about it not too mention... much documentation via letters and stories.

I'm curious to know what one's response is now

Sparing the 'other fish in the sea' and the 'married = unavailable' and came up with nothing.

Good luck to you.

Right now you do not need to be the other guy 'that broke them up' in others eyes.
Be supportive of HER decisions without influencing them. Keep your distance as far as romance and dating until she is to a place where she is free to be in a relationship with you.

Your description certainly didn't sound like a "love of your life" sort of deal. I can't believe you fell for her story, as well. If you get together with this person, you are being disrespectful of an already existing relationship- how would you feel if somebody did that to you?

Try to play the tape ahead a bit to six years or so from now... when she's telling her new boyfriend that she's never loved you, is in a sexless relationship, but she just doesn't want to get divorced...

Well lets only hope she is telling the truth to you. But if you were the love of her life why did she take that walk to the alter? Why did she move on and not look back? Why didn't she contact you before she took the leep into marriage? Maybe she is the love of your life, but are you truly the love of her life? Maybe she needs someone and having you there to catch her when she falls from divorce is comforting to her and that's why she tells you those things. Will she still be there or stay? Well we don't know. But I would be cautious and just back away a bit. Because no matter what, you are the other guy. Would she divorce had you not come back in to her life? Maybe not, so you are the other guy, the one that split them.

Spare me the details about "other fish in sea" and "married women off limits". She's different affair is different. Following my heart. Waiting is killing me but she's the one and no one else.


Every type of affair is different, don't try to justify your situation.

If you want us to spare the only details that seem to matter, why the hell are you here?

Another thing you need to think about. You need to really wonder what is going on in the counsling. Are they there to divorce easily, which there is no easy divorce. Or are they really there to work on the marriage. You only know what she tells you. Trust me I have been in the shoes on the other side. I had the affair and regretted it. But the whole time I was with the other man acting happy, I was at the same time in counseling working on my marriage with out him knowing. You don't know.

Ask Me Help Desk - Search Results (https://www.askmehelpdesk.com/search.php?searchid=4420546), This is the whole story.


Q is this. How long does general counseling of this type last?
It could be years!

How long until she may act after counseling to file for divorce?

She can have a divorce anytime she pleases.

Spare me the details about "other fish in sea" and "married women off limits".
From your history, its obvious you only see what you want to anyway. Like any common dope fiend. Except she is your drug of choice, and you may need help, more than she does.


She's different affair is different.
Cheating is cheating, your reasons will never change that, or justify the actions of you both. Your cheaters, and both of you are not healthy enough to sustain a healthy relationship.

Following my heart.
Thats why you have wasted YEARS, on someone who is sick, and unavailable.

Waiting is killing me but she's the one and no one else.
Thats what all addicted people say.

My advice, get help with your problems, you really are out there, and need to get back to reality, so you can build a fresh happy life.

Whatever it was that was "little" to break you up in the first place was probably not so "little" at that time. visit that and figure it out.
Also...
What I don't understand is if she is interested in divorce what is there to counsel on? What' the wait... two years is longer than it needs to be if you are who she would like to be with. Life is short and Karma's a b!tch. Be careful what energy you draw back to yourself.
Believe in yourself enough to know that you deserve better than this part time love.
Leave her to decide what it is that she is going to do, right now she has it all. Cake and eating it too. It's not fair to you.

Well it seems to me like you guys are soulmates, I have not read dr. nancy's book though, but my beleifs are if soulmates are lucky enough to find each other in this life, then they should make every effort to be together and if bith individuals are married or one is married they SHOULD DIVOURCE THEIR SPOUSE.

That's my take on the situation, good luck to you:)

I am not sure I believe that someone should divorce for their *soul mate*
I do believe in lost love mates 'found' but you have to have patience.
It is her decision but often I see perfect couples, soul mates, two people totally in love but the married one, as much as they may want out of the marriage, stays because it is what they are use to and comfortable with.
She may want to leave. She may want to be with you but she may be afraid and put it off indefinitely.

I really do not think you should encourage her to divorce. She has to make her decisions in her time. All you can do is ask her to keep you informed with things like when does she think she will have her divorce.

Hi:

Very complicated story so very brief. Ex-girlfriend whom I dated for 4 years in college and should've married. We were set, but I messed it up (not sexually, just stupid stuff like picking on her)--I hadn't really matured then. Went to grad. Schools and lost touch but I never stopped thinking over. She got married as she didn't hear from me and thought unresolvable differences. Now, 6 years later, she admits she doesn't want to spend the rest of her life with a guy 15 years her senior. Never loved him and still doesn't. BUT, doesn't want to be the divorcer. Husband doesn't believe in divorce... except for adultery. Knows of affair, but she hasn't told him details. This is husband's 2nd wife (first wife had affair and divorced him) and he married only for companionship. Marriage counseling: Failed as husband not interested. Affair keeps going on with no end. Says we'll be together... she's even going to counseling to get help to get out. Q is this: If I end it how likely is she to realize how much she misses me and divorces him? Or is it unlikely? Can't go forward, can't go back. Stuck. She's the one.

I don't think she is the one. YOU told us she doesn't want to be the divorcer, that would tell me something, that she really doesn't love you. Sorry just an opinion. Your wasting your time, and being involved with a married woman. Ex girlfriend or whatever, you have no business being with her.

Leave her alone, she's married. Happily or unhappily, she's married. She's obviously not interested in leaving him. She's having her cake and eating it too.

leave her alone, she's married. Happily or unhappily, she's married. She's obviously not interested in leaving him. She's having her cake and eating it too.

Great advice!

You never get involved with someone married.

you never get involved with someone married.

Thanks but my questions were if I am to give an ultimatum or give her time, how likely is it that she would divorce him after knowing how life is with me and experiencing the real possibility that I won't be around. And BTW, she reciprocated e-mails, phone calls, everything. Hard to walk away from one's faith because it damn well certainly feels that this is happening for a reason. The only girl I've ever loved and who just happens to not have ever stopped loving me, is in a bad marriage from start, has been dating me, gone on vacation with me, and says wants to be with me seems all to coincidental. Maybe this is where faith comes in and I must walk away so that she can walk with me.

If she wanted to be with you she would get a divorce and walk away from her so called unhealthy marriage. She's cheating and so are you.

Not wanting to be a divorcer is just a BS excuse.

Leave her alone to sort her drama out , if there is any , and find someone who's available.

Does she love you enough to get a divorce?

The answer to that will lead you to a more defined answer.

Does she love you enough to get a divorce?

The answer to that will lead you to a more defined answer.


Wow! That's something I never really considered. When I ask her if she loves him, she says no. Do you want to spend the rest of your life with him? No. She and I are even seeing counselors/pscyh because she feels this is happening for a reason and wants to know what's holding her back and mine has told me to keep seeing her, that her issues are workable, that it's apparent she loves me and were it not for that, it might be hopeless. Guess love conquers all? But a real Q is this. Her dysfunctional husband is also seeing a counselor... she doesn't know why nor has asked (they talk very little). Might he be trying to cope or try to justify getting a divorce as he has told her he doesn't believe in divorce but also stated adultery is grounds for divorce. Can't help but think if she really told him what was going on, he wouldn't be so understanding. But she doesn't want to be the adulterer... even though she already is. Thoughts?

1) She's married so she's off limits nor matter how you see it.

2) She knows you want to be with her, so if she wanted to be with you, she would divorce her husband regardless of all the excuses.

3) Unless she divorces her husband, you need to move on with your life. If she comes to you then great (but emphasis on after she divorces), but you can't put your life on hold for a married woman.

4) You don't want to end up being the guy she cheats on her husband with and you don't want to be her rebound.

1) She's married so she's off limits nor matter how you see it.

2) She knows you want to be with her, so if she wanted to be with you, she would divorce her husband regardless of all the excuses.

3) Unless she divorces her husband, you need to move on with your life. If she comes to you then great (but emphasis on after she divorces), but you can't put your life on hold for a married woman.

4) You don't want to end up being the guy she cheats on her husband with and you don't want to be her rebound.

Explain this: The counselor I see disagrees with those thoughts as I mentioned earlier. In fact, she knows of situations where while it takes time... a divorce does happen. Goin' on 2 years dating and she's never home with him on weekends. MAIN Q IS THIS... ANY IDEA AS TO WHY HE'S SEEKING INDIVIDUAL COUNSELING? And BTW, if you knew the whole story she's essentially married only by paper. Crazy I know... but going on vacation, staying over, dating essentially kills any chance for her current marriage succeeding eh?

We don't have the answers to that. The point is, she's married so you got to stay away from her mess until she figures it out.

Only if she's single, then you can consider a relationship with her. Let her sort out your problems, while you live your own life. If she wants to be with you, she will find you.

Don't you want more?

Don't you want a woman to love you with every fiber of her being? Want to show you off to the world? Bring you home to her parents and share her life with you?

Don't you think you deserve that?

This married woman cannot give that to you.

Chicago. You asked us a question, we answered it. You don't like it. If you want to continue your affair, go ahead but I can GUARANTEE you it won't end the way you want it to.

If she loves you SO much, why can't she SEPARATE from her husband? Get her own place or move in with you? If she causes the separation and KNOWS that it's because she was cheating and left him for you, don't you think he'd file for divorce? Then she wouldn't have to be concerned with being the "divorcer".

Explain this: The counselor I see disagrees with those thoughts as I mentioned earlier. In fact, she knows of situations where while it takes time...a divorce does happen. Goin' on 2 years dating and she's never home with him on weekends. MAIN Q IS THIS...ANY IDEA AS TO WHY HE'S SEEKING INDIVIDUAL COUNSELING? And BTW, if you knew the whole story she's essentially married only by paper. Crazy I know...but going on vacation, staying over, dating essentially kills any chance for her current marriage succeeding eh?

How would we know why he's seeing counseling?

Because his wife is screwing another man?
Because his wife won't talk to him?
Because he feels cuckolded?

You post reeks of self righteous justification to continue in this cheating charade.

If your GF really cared about you and genuinely wanted to diminish the pain her husband is feeling then she would file for divorce now and cease this stupidity around not wanting to initiate the separation. A person with integrity and compassion would do what is required to avoid hurting people.

It may well be a marriage on paper only, but her actions in these circumstances only serve to make matters worse for all concerned.

Take off your 'rose colored glasses'. Open your eyes. Wake up. Something is not quite right here.

How would we know why he's seeing counseling?


If your GF really cared about you and genuinely wanted to diminish the pain her husband is feeling then she would file for divorce now and cease this stupidity around not wanting to initiate the separation. A person with integrity and compassion would do what is required to avoid hurting people.

It may well be a marriage on paper only, but her actions in these circumstances only serve to make matters worse for all concerned.

Take off your 'rose colored glasses'. Open your eyes. Wake up. Something is not quite right here.

I agree with many of your points but I'm not wearing rose colored glasses. Her marriage was bad from beginning (married for all the wrong reasons). Many offers by him for her to leave (if you want to divorce me... go ahead... I'm not going to change) and prayed for something to happen. I called 8 wrenching years later and we picked up right where we left of on conversation. She aknowledged this was happening for reason & glad I was back in life. Can't help feel this is life correcting for what shoudn'tve happened. One thing to know about me is I took her for granted maybe... got cocky (not really me). That happened with her the first time around. Never again. Yes, she should divorce. It's why she's seeking counseling (4 months) to figure out why she's hesitant (b/c he's got a "good heart") and she's making progress. Once counselor and her sort through issues it is her hope that she will divorce with a clear conscience knowing she tried everything.

One other Q is this: Don't you think she should tell her parents? They have much influence over her and put her husband in higher regards than her as he cooks, cleans, etc. while she brings home the paycheck. Makes her upset and me too because they don't know all the lies (how he's killed her dreams and wishes, never any intimacy, connection). He's 15 years older than her and has neck problems enough to not do factory work but app. He's able to swing a sledge hammer and bust up cement steps and put in a wood entry way. (A first rate BS con man if you ask me).

2nd Q: He says he doesn't believe in divorce except adultry is grounds for divorce. He suspected his first wife of having an affair. But isn't it possible that if she told him everything he could change his belief and file?

One other bit: She has Int. cysti. Which can limit sex because pain. With him it never happened-too painful. When we did it, miraculously no pain! Explain that. Seems to be another sign that she and I are supposed to be together. Recog. It's wrong but she and I both know we want to marry and we're in our 30's not just some 18 year olds who aren't aware of implications.

Chicago, your making all kinds of excuses why she is with this man. It is what it is. YOU have no right butting in their business, whether it's a past girlfriend or what. How can she make her marriage work with you in the picture. Besides if your going to counseling for this and there telling you to stick by her, then your at the wrong counselor. What comes around goes around... remember that... someday it will come back to bite you.. Don't mean too be harsh its just the facts... Let her live her life alone with her husband, sorry butt out.

Chicago, your making all kinds of excuses why she is with this man. It is what it is. YOU have no right butting in their business, whether its a past girlfriend or what. How can she make her marriage work with you in the picture. Besides if your going to counseling for this and there telling you to stick by her, then your at the wrong counselor. What comes around goes around......remember that... someday it will come back to bite you ..Don't mean too be harsh its just the facts... Let her live her life alone with her husband, sorry butt out.


Her marriage wasn't working from get go. No sex, no nothing. Tell me how likely it is that she'd divorce him if I walked away. Scene is diifferent this time... because before I came around she wasn't happy (depressed) and just thought her marriage of no hope or dreams was typical.

She knows how I feel and how things really could be. Do you think she'd still stick it out with him and forgoe her real feelings, sex, and happiness or would she probably realize she has to divorce?

I can't understand how she can consider going back considering all the damage she's done with having an affair. We have 17 years of history!! We have gone as far as we can except being married. :( I so want this to work. If I have to have faith and walk away I will... but want to know your input on the odds of her leaving him after 6 years of marriage and no kids. Believe me, neither of us would be doing anything like this if we didn't intend on marrying. She's even said many times she will marry me. Moot point. I just don't want to as she says maybe "wait till he dies" or he divorces her. She says divorce is "unlikely" but many things she said we're unlikely and have changed. I.E vacation. Please help.. agony!

Sorry Chicago, the writing is on the wall. She will not divorce him, what don't you understand about that. What goes on with her husband and her is there business. It could be 20 years of going together, that means nothing. She is committed to someone else. She has the best of both worlds. What makes you think if you were married to this wonderful woman as you say she is she wouldn't cheat on you. So continue this relationship with this ex girlfriend and see where it gets you, nowhere. YOU are putting your life on hold for something that isn't going to happen. She has made it clear, she isn't divorcing him. Sorry, but sometimes the truth hurts, and we all learn from it.

Sorry Chicago, the writing is on the wall. She will not divorce him, what don't you understand about that. What goes on with her husband and her is there business. It could be 20 years of going together, that means nothing. She is committed to someone else. She has the best of both worlds. What makes you think if you were married to this wonderful woman as you say she is she wouldn't cheat on you. So continue this relationship with this ex girlfriend and see where it gets you, nowhere. YOU are putting your life on hold for something that isn't going to happen. She has made it clear, she isn't divorcing him. Sorry, but sometimes the truth hurts, and we all learn from it.

Call it intuition, heart, knowing someone better than their spouse does. Ever since we fell apart due to me, my life has sucked. Empty. Tried... in grad. School. Didn't happen. So my life isn't on hold because it wasn't goin' anywhere anyway.

Consider this: She and I'd be married if I hadn't screwed up. I don't believe God gives one just one chance to be with that person. ( And for me (as screwed up as you think it is) there is no one else. She said it best by saying she'd never been in such a deep loving rel'tp as this. ) She's not happy and has never really has been truly happy and in love with this guy. Never stopped thinkin' about me (still has photos etc.). She prays for some intervention in her life and I show up. Crazy? She said kissing was unlikely, she did it. She said staying over was unlikely, she did it, she said vacation was unlikely she did it. Is it too far of stretch to think that her "unlikely" she can "get a divorce" will turn into likely. Or maybe his counselor will break through to him that it's not a real marriage and he should leave. Hell, it's not even consummated. Torment continues. Please some good news? :)

Has it ever occurred to you that she is not telling you the truth?

If we are all making guesses at her motivation, why not include the possibility that she doesn't want a divorce, and wants you on the side, and if she tells you the truth, you wouldn't stick around?

What makes you think that she loves you. She has told you she won't divorce him. Her husband won't divorce her. Both of them are in counselling. Why go to all that trouble if you aren't trying to save your marriage. I know you seem to think otherwise, that she is in counselling to ease her guilt and find a good reason to leave her husband, but she hasn't done that. Perhaps she is re-thinking her commitment to her husband and trying to find common ground.

Don't you think it is a bit of a coincidence, and possibly a lie, that he isn't trying? Isn't it also a coincidence that BOTH of them are in counselling over the same issue?

If she were as miserable as she tells you she is, and not in love with her husband, and sees no alternative but divorce, why hasn't it happened. Maybe the truth is that the marriage is not that far gone that it can't be repaired, and if she were to tell you that, she'd lose you.

You have only the facts of a person who is cheating on their husband. Why would she lie about him and cheat, and not do the same to you. Keep you both on the hook. You have nothing to prove her stories as truthful, and you have no personal knowledge of her husband's motivation, or even what kind of man he is for that matter. All you know comes from her, and she's painting the worst possible picture of him, to keep you on the hook.

They cannot repair their marriage if you don't realize that you are not welcome there. She doesn't get it obviously, but you should. You are wasting your time with a married woman who is probably lying to you about her 'issues', and who is cheating on her husband. How stellar can her character be.

I think you are getting suckered, and you cannot see what is going on here. You're sucked in by the lies and deceipt of a cheating woman who has no intention of divorcing her husband. Your integrity is compromised because you are blind to the truth in my opinion.

It is a toxic three-way relationship, and the only one getting any satisfaction, is her.

I would start asking myself, why won't she divorce her husband if she loves me so much? Maybe that will give you your answer.

You said you blew it back years ago.You said she got married because she didn't hear back from you ( which is very cocky). She is married now. You need to try to find your own woman, not someone else's. You say he does this, he doesn't do that, that is NONE OF YOUR BUSINESS. What happens in their home is their concern. She is cheating on her husband, and should be ashamed of herself.

Let me ask you this: If you were married, and someone like... YOU came along and started an affair with YOUR wife, trying to get HER to leave YOU, how would that make YOU feel?

This world is full of available women, go find one without a husband. You don't live on Gilligan's island.

Hi:

Very complicated story so very brief. Ex-girlfriend whom I dated for 4 years in college and should've married. We were set, but I messed it up (not sexually, just stupid stuff like picking on her)--I hadn't really matured then. Went to grad. schools and lost touch but I never stopped thinking over. She got married as she didn't hear from me and thought unresolvable differences. Now, 6 years later, she admits she doesn't wanna spend the rest of her life with a guy 15 years her senior. Never loved him and still doesn't. BUT, doesn't want to be the divorcer. Husband doesn't believe in divorce...except for adultery. Knows of affair, but she hasn't told him details. This is husband's 2nd wife (first wife had affair and divorced him) and he married only for companionship. Marriage counseling: Failed as husband not interested. Affair keeps going on with no end. Says we'll be together...she's even going to counseling to get help to get out. Q is this: If I end it how likely is she to realize how much she misses me and divorces him? Or is it unlikely? Can't go forward, can't go back. Stuck. She's the one.

Call it intuition, heart, knowing someone better than their spouse does. Ever since we fell apart due to me, my life has sucked. Empty. Tried... in grad. School. Didn't happen. So my life isn't on hold because it wasn't goin' anywhere anyway.

Consider this: She and I'd be married if I hadn't screwed up. I don't believe God gives one just one chance to be with that person. ( And for me (as screwed up as you think it is) there is no one else. She said it best by saying she'd never been in such a deep loving rel'tp as this. ) She's not happy and has never really has been truly happy and in love with this guy. Never stopped thinkin' about me (still has photos etc.). She prays for some intervention in her life and I show up. Crazy? She said kissing was unlikely, she did it. She said staying over was unlikely, she did it, she said vacation was unlikely she did it. Is it too far of stretch to think that her "unlikely" she can "get a divorce" will turn into likely. Or maybe his counselor will break through to him that it's not a real marriage and he should leave. Hell, it's not even consummated. Torment continues. Please some good news?

Wow! That's something I never really considered. When I ask her if she loves him, she says no. Do you wanna spend the rest of your life with him? No. She and I are even seeing counselors/pscyh 'cuz she feels this is happening for a reason and wants to know what's holding her back and mine has told me to keep seeing her, that her issues are workable, that it's apparent she loves me and were it not for that, it might be hopeless. Guess love conquers all? But a real Q is this. Her dysfunctional husband is also seeing a counselor...she doesn't know why nor has asked (they talk very little). Might he be trying to cope or try to justify getting a divorce as he has told her he doesn't believe in divorce but also stated adultery is grounds for divorce. Can't help but think if she really told him what was going on, he wouldn't be so understanding. But she doesn't want to be the adulterer...even though she already is. Thoughts?

Dude, sorry to break it to you but anyone can say they love someone, if they really mean it, they ll show it by their actions. She made a vow, that only death would do them part. She ll have lots of different feelings even if she does love you.

Feelings of guilt for leaving her husband, feeling of pity and stays with him while cheating on him with you. Personally this is too complicated for me to be in a situation like this. If she really loves you, I would honestly think she wouldn't still be married and have a divorce already.

Sometimes people just don't want to make a rash decision so they will regret later. That's what I think is going through her mind now. Things aren't always so perfect or greener on the other side. If she is having this doubt, I would want someone that would never doubt me.

Just my opinions.

Dude, sorry to break it to you but anyone can say they love someone, if they really mean it, they ll show it by their actions. She made a vow, that only death would do them part. She ll have lots of different feelings even if she does love you.

Feelings of guilt for leaving her husband, feeling of pity and stays with him while cheating on him with you. Personally this is too complicated for me to be in a situation like this. If she really loves you, i would honestly think she wouldnt still be married and have a divorce already.

Sometimes people just dont want to make a rash decision so they will regret later. Thats what i think is going through her mind now. Things arent always so perfect or greener on the other side. If she is having this doubt, i would want someone that would never doubt me.

Just my opinions.

Finally! Some encouragement. Yes, she's always been very slow in making decisions. Had to consult with a counselor on whether to leave her past jobs. This is why she's seeking a counselor (not marriage) so that she's good with her decision when she makes it. Crazy and complicated I know. I'm wondering if you could reply to my add-on post (see above)

Call it intuition, heart, knowing someone better than their spouse does. Ever since we fell apart due to me, my life has sucked. Empty. Tried...in grad. school. Didn't happen. So my life isn't on hold because it wasn't goin' anywhere anyway.

Consider this: She and I'd be married if I hadn't screwed up. I don't believe God gives one just one chance to be with that person. ( And for me (as screwed up as you think it is) there is no one else. She said it best by saying she'd never been in such a deep loving rel'tp as this. ) She's not happy and has never really has been truely happy and in love with this guy. Never stopped thinkin' about me (still has photos etc.). She prays for some intervention in her life and I show up. Crazy? She said kissing was unlikely, she did it. She said staying over was unlikely, she did it, she said vacation was unlikely she did it. Is it too far of stretch to think that her "unlikely" she can "get a divorce" will turn into likely. Or maybe his counselor will break through to him that it's not a real marriage and he should leave. Hell, it's not even consumated. Torment continues. Please some good news?

If this is the add-on post you are mentioning about here's what I think.

There is some good news but it might not be the good news you want to hear.

The good news is you can get your life back on track and get somewhere in life. You will end up with a girl, whether its her or not. The good news is torment does not have to continue if this doesn't continue.

Anyway back on track. Sounds like she is definitely hesitant on her decision. If she wasn't, she would have a divorce already. As for him leaving her, don't count on it. Even if he does, wouldn't you feel you are the back up? She doesn't have him anymore so she can be with you? She couldn't leave him by herself to be with you.

You said your life isn't on hold because its not going anywhere. That is not true. Trust me, I know what you feel. A love triangle. In the end, I couldn't do it anymore because no one is going anywhere. I gave her up to the other guy. She was just another confused girl, not knowing what she wants, and it wasn't worth it. I want someone that is not confused and loves only me.

Wouldn't you agree with me, if you had a girl that loves you and not married to another guy, you would be doing so much more amazing things in life instead of being in this situation where your life is not going anywhere? You are waiting for an answer for her, what if you never get that answer?

You ll be waiting your whole life and your whole life would be on hold. Your life isn't going anywhere is because you don't have the motivation to get it somewhere or you need to have an answer first from her.

Sorry Chicago, its excuse after excuse. Oh, she's seeking counseling not for her marriage, for her past jobs. I thought she wanted to get out of this so called mess she is in. Well to me if she was sooo determined to be with you, she would be seeking counseling how to get out of her so called loveless marriage. Don't see that happening. Your smarter than that, sorry she is playing you for a fool. By the way, everyone of us are on the same track, and were trying to help you, and your still going backwards, falling for this stuff. You have to get with the program, she has no intentions of leaving her husband... I don't know what is so hard about understanding that and building your life with someone that is normal with no attachments.

[QUOTE=none12345;1912077]If this is the add-on post you are mentioning about here's what I think.

Anyway back on track. Sounds like she is definitely hesitant on her decision. If she wasn't, she would have a divorce already. As for him leaving her, don't count on it. Even if he does, wouldn't you feel you are the back up? She doesn't have him anymore so she can be with you? She couldn't leave him by herself to be with you.

You said your life isn't on hold because its not going anywhere. That is not true. Trust me, I know what you feel. A love triangle. In the end, I couldn't do it anymore because no one is going anywhere. I gave her up to the other guy. She was just another confused girl, not knowing what she wants, and it wasn't worth it. I want someone that is not confused and loves only me.

Wouldn't you agree with me, if you had a girl that loves you and not married to another guy, you would be doing so much more amazing things in life instead of being in this situation where your life is not going anywhere? You are waiting for an answer for her, what if you never get that answer?

Thank you. How long did your love triangle last? Ccan't help think my sit. Is different. I know of other past gf's who are married and I'm not nor would ever consider calling them. She was different from the start. She felt it too. I broke her heart back then though. So naturally she is hesitant. She's always reminded me that she's kept her word to me "that I'll meet her parents again...your times coming." Yes I'd love to be doing many things with her (already have vacationed with her, etc). If she hadn't offered up she wasn't happily married it would not have happened. Aren't the gifts that she's accepted, meeting my parents again, etc... those are commitments too? My therapist tells me she far tighter bond to me than him knowing that she doesn't feel spiritually, sexually, or emotionally connected to him are good signs that these issues can be resolved and she can divorce... but it has to her decision. I will never view myself as a back up for her. It is her husband who I think is feeling used as he's not seeking m. counseling but general counseling to figure all this out. That's why I ask perhaps he's trying to rationalize in his beliefs it's okay to divorce her under these circumstances.

We can't read her mind and therefore can't predict how she might react or what she might do. But we can tell you this, and that is that this is not a good situation for you to be in. She's married, plain and simple, and married women are off-limits. Why she married him, his age, what happened during his first marriage, why he married her, what happened between you when you were together, etc. etc. are all irrelevant details. You need to wash your hands of this situation and move on with your life. Find a nice, single girl to date.

Why do you think her husband is being used? It's the other way around, your being used. She is still with her husband. YOU HAVE NO RIGHT BEING IN HER BUSINESS... what are you gaining from this so called love scenario? A bunch of hurt in the long run. It's like a waiting game, its like you have blinders on. I just wondered how you would feel if you were married and you found out your wife was cheating? Nothing good will come out of this, I can promise you that much. It seems like your looking for someone to agree with you on this point, and that's not going to happen on this site. She is off limits..

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How many times are you going to ask the same question, and get the same answers and still ask that question again, and again??

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How many times are you going to ask the same question, and get the same answers and still ask that question again, and again???????

I had to spread the rep Tal. but great research. This seems more like an obsession now. They've made movies, over and over again, about this same scenario. I think we all know how most of them end up in those movies. Someone ends up in jail. I'm not saying that this is one of THOSE cases, but why keep on, and on, and on?

I know if someone was chasing MY wife like this , well...

I'd hope for a good jury.

Obviously the OP isn't going to take off the "rose colored glasses" and step into reality.

He doesn't like the answers he gets, which are all mostly the same, and are realistic and reasonable.

She's using you, she's not going to leave her husband. Move on or continue to be hurt and ruin someone's marriage.

Another question. If you and her had been dating for two years... why hasn't she left her husband yet? Why wouldn't her husband leave her yet?

I had to spread the rep Tal. , but great research. This seems more like an obsession now. They've made movies, over and over again, about this same scenario. I think we all know how most of them end up in those movies. Someone ends up in jail. I'm not saying that this is one of THOSE cases, but why keep on, and on, and on?

I know if someone was chasing MY wife like this , well...........

I'd hope for a good jury.

FYI, she returned my call at first and since then has been most of the pursuing. AND her husband IS aware... but not aware of all that is going on. It's that inaction on his part that she wishes would change so she doesn't have initiate the divorce. But she just may and so that's why she's goin' go counselor (non-marry) so she's confident in her decision. Divorce is a big thing for her and to trust someone who broke her heart... well you get the point.

How do you know she's not seeing a marriage counselor and so is he? To try and repair the mess that you made?

LEAVE HER ALONE. Let her go and if she comes back to you, it was meant to be.

You're already showing us signs of obsessive behavior. Imagine that she knew this about you. It will freak her out.

Take a few steps back and reflect on your actions first before you push forward.

Keep in mind that she's a married woman nor matter how many angles you look at it.

I'm not sure if you want our justification for you to break up a marriage or what, but that's definitely not the way to go about it.

Another question. If you and her had been dating for two years...why hasn't she left her husband yet? Why wouldn't her husband leave her yet?

Great Q. Finally! She doesn't want to be the one to initiate the divorce. And her husband doesn't believe in divorce. Soo, might he change his beliefs if he really knew what was going on??

And re: be hurt and ruin the marriage. I didn't ruin the marriage. She has... but rather he killed it along time ago by not ever being intimate with her and telling her he married her probably just for convenience or companionship. Nice guy eh?

I'm sorry, that's a BS excuse. She obviously wants to be married to him and wants to date you. And that's the best excuse that she could come up with to convince you that she cares.

Perhaps her marriage wasn't picture perfect before, but you are definitely not doing it any good. Why is it ANY of YOUR business how her marriage runs? It's not. THEY are married. THEY made that commitment to each other (for whatever reason). You're an intruder. Again I say, leave her alone.

FYI, she returned my call at first and since then has been most of the pursuing. AND her husband IS aware...but not aware of all that is going on. It's that inaction on his part that she wishes would change so she doesn't have initiate the divorce. But she just may and so that's why she's goin' go counselor (non-marry) so she's confident in her decision. Divorce is a big thing for her and to trust someone who broke her heart...well you get the point.

Divorce is a big thing, but she sure doesn't have a problem with adultery. His inaction? What do you and her want him to do?

"her husband IS aware, but not aware of all that is going on" What does this mean? That he knows that you exist, but he doesn't know that you're nailing his wife?

After all these posts, what is it that you're looking for? Help to steal this guys wife?

Divorce is a big thing, but she sure doesn't have a problem with adultery. His inaction? What do you and her want him to do?

"her husband IS aware, but not aware of all that is going on" What does this mean? That he knows that you exist, but he doesn't know that you're nailing his wife?

After all these posts, what is it that you're looking for? Help to steal this guys wife?

I'm lookin' for agreement maybe that she should tell him what's really going on. I'm lookin' for maybe any experience where this has happened and the husband does leave or file for divorce. I find it hard to believe that he'd be fine and let it continue. She says he loves her and cares for her but both his actions toward her and hers toward him convey otherwise. I guess she couldn't even tell him she loved him when he told her he loved her.

I'm looking for agreement in my belief that if he knew what has transpired and had her best interests at hand that he'd grow a pair and give her the divorce she wants. Because right now she thinks she has to categorically dislike every aspect of him to divorce... and all of us know that that is a ridiculous idea. You look at what's best for you and what will make you happy in this life right?

When one door closes, another opens. You can't exit one door while walking through the other at the same time.

These are things for HER to figure out. If you want to be there for her while she does, fine. Do that as a friend. Seems to be that you are taken advantage of her being so hurt and discontent.

No one here is going to tell you how to dissolve her marriage. If she wants to bad enough she will.

I ll try not to be too blunt but she says she loves you and she wants to be with you and she does nt love her husband?action speaks louder than words.if she really wanted to be with you-she d be with you.there s more than one dog buried here:a whole kennel.you need some space away from this you need to sort out your priorities.ten years from now are you still going to hang around and wait for her divorce?

When one door closes, another opens. You can't exit one door while walking through the other at the same time.

These are things for HER to figure out. If you want to be there for her while she does, fine. Do that as a friend. Seems to be that you are taken advantage of her being so hurt and discontent.

No one here is going to tell you how to dissolve her marriage. If she wants to bad enough she will.

That's what I'm lookin' for kind of. I know she can't marry me while married to him (door analogy). Well aware of that. (We're in our 30's and he's near 50). And no every step of the way I've made sure it's what she wanted. The power has been always hers. Not looking for how to dissolve marriage. Thank you. Though I still hold that if he knew what was going on... if her parents truly knew, she'd do something or he would do something.

Maybe she doesn't want her parents to know because she doesn't want them to know she's cheating on her husband. Or that her boyfriend is trying to dissolve her marriage.

Just remember actions speak louder than words. She has stated she wants to divorce him but made no effort towards it.

Why do you want to be with someone who OBVIOUSLY doesn't see a future with you in the long run. You might see it, but what you are portraying to us says: "She wants to be married and play the field at the same time."

She's been married 6 years and dating you for 2. Do you think this is the first time that she has done this?

Maybe she doesn't want her parents to know because she doesn't want them to know she's cheating on her husband. Or that her boyfriend is trying to dissolve her marriage.

Just remember actions speak louder than words. She has stated she wants to divorce him but made no effort towards it.

Why do you want to be with someone who OBVIOUSLY doesn't see a future with you in the long run. You might see it, but what you are portraying to us says: "She wants to be married and play the field at the same time."

She's been married 6 years and dating you for 2. Do you think this is the first time that she has done this?

First marriage counseling has failed twice. So that avenue is closed. Second, he's told her that he's not going to change and to accept his walls, lack of intimacy/attraction toward her. So that's out in the open. So she has since been seeing a counselor in order to get "the tools she needs" to divorce (therp. Quote, not mine.) So aren't these actions of her moving toward me? She see a future in the long run for us... she's verbalized it many times. Says all this is happening for a reason... (yet another reason why she's seeking counseling. And yes, this is the first, last, and only time she'll ever do this. That I'm 1,000% certain. Wouldn't be there for her if I wasn't.

Just because there are signs (to you) of her moving away from him doesn't mean that she is moving towards you. She's married, this isn't your business in the first place.

How do you know this is the only time this has happened? Cause she says so? She also says she wants to leave her husband, has she? She always says she wants to be with just you, is she? NO. Get the hint. She is throwing it at you and we are spelling it out for you. You just don't get it.


Maybe marriage counseling has failed twice because there are more than two people in this marriage.

Great Q. Finally! She doesn't want to be the one to initiate the divorce. And her husband doesn't believe in divorce. Soo, might he change his beliefs if he really knew what was going on???


Dude... do you see something wrong here? They will never get a divorce if this is the situation. You could be waiting forever. All those fairytales in the movies like the notebook or whatever that preaches that one who loves another so much and would wait forever and in the end if they become your's its all worth it, is BS. That's what I believed at first but what if they never come around. You throw away your life. There's only one shot at life so don't waste it man.

So the question is, are you going to continue pursuing a woman that is married and not your's and hope for the best?

Or are you going to move on and find a new girl and don't hope for the best because you have the best and she is all yours?

Those are pretty much the 2 choices you can make. I say the 2nd one.

Just because there are signs (to you) of her moving away from him doesn't mean that she is moving towards you. She's married, this isn't your business in the first place.

How do you know this is the only time this has happened? Cause she says so? She also says she wants to leave her husband, has she? She always says she wants to be with just you, is she? NO. Get the hint. She is throwing it at you and we are spelling it out for you. You just don't get it.


Maybe marriage counseling has failed twice because there are more than two people in this marriage.

Yes she says so. And I trust her word... just got to "trust me on that." And both marriage counseling sessions were init. By her and she had to drag him. So what does that say? Secondly, when that counselor told her in order for her marr. To have a chance I'd have to leave. She asked if I'd give her that. I did and after 1 week she collapsed and realized having me out of her life was not an option she was willing to accept. So here I am. I will wait for her because I don't want to put myself in a similar situation. I'd always be comparing and make another girls life miserable.

You trust her word? She's a married woman dating you, obviously she isn't the most honest person.

The fact that she had to drag him to marriage counseling says, "Guys don't want to admit what they have isn't perfect, nor do they want someone else making that jusgement. Especially if that person went to school on the matter and is right."

Again, I say she wants to have her cake and eat it too. She's a selfish person.

She wants to keep her husband around because he offers her things that you don't and vice versa.

Yes she says so. And I trust her word...just gotta "trust me on that." And both marriage counseling sessions were init. by her and she had to drag him. So what does that say? Secondly, when that counselor told her in order for her marr. to have a chance I'd have to leave. She asked if I'd give her that. I did and after 1 week she collapsed and realized having me out of her life was not an option she was willing to accept. So here I am. I will wait for her b/c I don't want to put myself in a similar situation. I'd always be comparing and make another girls life miserable.

If that is your decision, it is your life and we won't tell you what to do but we've gave our advice, whether you take it, its your decision.

There's nothing more we can do here. And quite frankly to answer your question about my love triangle, it lasted for about a year. I was the guy originally with the girl. She fell for someone else and left me but I was holding on tightly but then I decided to let her go and be happy and in my heart I know I was the one that loved her the most and she threw that away for some other guy.

So I do not sympathize with you trying to take another guy's girl away. I've been there and I know how it feels. There will be tons of drama awaiting you in the future. Be prepared.

I give up. Obviously no one here is going to convince you what you are doing is SO wrong. But when you come back heart broken cause she decided to work it out with her husband and let go of your leash, expect a whole bunch of "I told you so's".

Good day.

When are you going to think for yourself, and realize you're the dude on the side, and she feeds you the same lines every cheating husband feeds their mistresses?

You have presented no facts whatsoever to the contrary. More over all this for a liar, and a cheater. Even if you leave she can find another toy to play with, so what kind of future would you have with her?

I guarantee if you would do the right thing and step away and let her marriage work, without NC she will go on with her life. Can you be a man and do this ? Your like fixed or obessed with this girl, its actually scary. Downright controlling...

You trust her word? She's a married woman dating you, obviously she isn't the most honest person.

The fact that she had to drag him to marriage counseling says, "Guys don't want to admit what they have isn't perfect, nor do they want someone else making that jusgement. Especially if that person went to school on the matter and is right."

Again, I say she wants to have her cake and eat it too. She's a selfish person.

She wants to keep her husband around because he offers her things that you don't and vice versa.

I fully trust her word. And true her husband offers her things I don't. But it seems I offer far more than him as her main crutch to staying with him is that "he's not all bad". But she says she loves me so maybe I need to take that last leap of faith and trust in God that he will show her the way toward me as I wait in the wilderness.

Sorry but God isn't going to bring you together with all the faith and trust you have in him. She is committing adultery, and your destroying her marriage. Bottom line, you're the reason her marriage isn't working. It won't sit with God.

I'm lookin' for agreement maybe that she should tell him what's really going on. I'm lookin' for maybe any experience where this has happened and the husband does leave or file for divorce. I find it hard to believe that he'd be fine and let it continue. She says he loves her and cares for her but both his actions toward her and hers toward him convey otherwise. I guess she couldn't even tell him she loved him when he told her he loved her.

I'm looking for agreement in my belief that if he knew what has transpired and had her best interests at hand that he'd grow a pair and give her the divorce she wants. Because right now she thinks she has to categorically dislike every aspect of him to divorce...and all of us know that that is a ridiculous idea. You look at what's best for you and what will make you happy in this life right?

Right here you said "... he'd grow a pair..."

How about this. Why don't you call this guy and tell him that you're sleeping with his wife. Why don't you do that. With everything that you've told us. You said he wouldn't divorce her unless it was infidelity, so call him. Where's your pair?

Let us know how it goes.

Wow! That's something I never really considered. When I ask her if she loves him, she says no. Do you wanna spend the rest of your life with him? No. She and I are even seeing counselors/pscyh 'cuz she feels this is happening for a reason and wants to know what's holding her back and mine has told me to keep seeing her, that her issues are workable, that it's apparent she loves me and were it not for that, it might be hopeless. Guess love conquers all? But a real Q is this. Her dysfunctional husband is also seeing a counselor...she doesn't know why nor has asked (they talk very little). Might he be trying to cope or try to justify getting a divorce as he has told her he doesn't believe in divorce but also stated adultery is grounds for divorce. Can't help but think if she really told him what was going on, he wouldn't be so understanding. But she doesn't want to be the adulterer...even though she already is. Thoughts?

She can't have it both ways. If she is feels things are happening for a reason she needs to pick her path and follow it. Right now she is holding back and wanting it both ways. Not disrupting her married life and not ready to give all to you. Yes she needs to get divorced and be with you but will she? Until then she is being unfair to you and to her husband no matter how bad their relationship may be.

Sorry but God isn't going to bring you together with all the faith and trust you have in him. She is committing adultery, and your destroying her marriage. Bottom line, your the reason her marriage isn't working. It won't sit with God.

I did not destroy her marriage. She had been thinking for a long time about leaving... in fact praying for a sign. Maybe I'm that sign... maybe not. A bit odd though considering I called her up shortly after her cry to the heavens without even knowing all of this. Her marriage isn't working because it never worked. She reassured me and has told the counselor she doesn't regret me coming back into her life and in fact is glad. Now she's figuring out the reason all of this is occurring. Cite her strict Cath. Upbringing, overbearing parents... whatever. I know she has issues which is why she's going to counseling when others would simply divorce.

Me walking away would involve absolving myself of comm.interaction with her. I would be out of her marriage for her to see whether to meet me in the isle or leave me in the wilderness. THAT is what I meant. God's will you know?

Right here you said "... he'd grow a pair..."

How about this. Why don't you call this guy and tell him that you're sleeping with his wife. Why don't you do that. With everything that you've told us. You said he wouldn't divorce her unless it was infidelity, so call him. Where's your pair?

Let us know how it goes.


Seriously? I mean I have thought of that. She's certain this will all come out in the open sometime and hopefully he'll divorce her... but that would be letting fate happen instead of intervening. Wow! I do find myself in agreement. And that is precisely from the same vein that I'm taping into that everyone has there limits even a passive guy like him. If I wait long enough, something will be forced to happen. Never heard of a husband being content to let his wife have a life long affair knowing full well what is going on. Right?

Thank you though!

Yeah I'd tell her 'IF you don't tell him I will' and see what she has to say to that.
Don't just let yourself be her side dish for you.
You are wasting your life if that is all you'll ever be to her. You could be out finding someone right for you if she isn't going to make a decision.

"in fact praying for a sign. Maybe I'm that sign..."

Do you really think you are a sign from GOD? Are you kidding me?

Your name here should be " burningbush95"

You really think God is sending you signs to commit a sin? Isn't this one of the Ten Commandments? And you think you are a sign from God? Or that it's God's will that you be together? NO WAY! Sorry.

You are just making yourself appear more and more naïve. She's playing you, open your eyes.

You really think that telling her parents would bring the two of you together? If she tells her strictly Catholic parents that she is cheating on her husband, you think they'll tell her to divorce him and marry the man that ended that marriage. NO.

And whether the marriage was bad before you came along, you are the driving force for its dysfunction at this point. Why would you do that? Don't you see how wrong all of your actions with this woman are? If you truly believe in God, ask the head of your church what he thinks you should do.

She may be playing him as a side dish only that is why he needs to come up with plan B and call her *bluff

You really think God is sending you signs to commit a sin? Isn't this one of the Ten Commandments? And you think you are a sign from God? Or that it's God's will that you be together? NO WAY! Sorry.

You are just making yourself appear more and more naive. She's playing you, open your eyes.

You really think that telling her parents would bring the two of you together? If she tells her strictly Catholic parents that she is cheating on her husband, you think they'll tell her to divorce him and marry the man that ended that marriage. NO.

And whether or not the marriage was bad before you came along, you are the driving force for its dysfunction at this point. Why would you do that? Don't you see how wrong all of your actions with this woman are? If you truly believe in God, ask the head of your church what he thinks you should do.

Your greatly construing my words. I do NOT think God is sending me signs. I'm not that religious but I do feel it's a bit too coincidental that her marriage is bad and all the signs she's been given to leave. Then praying for a sign and out of the blue I call her and she calls me back. Plus not being able to consummate a marriage because of the pain is absent with us. And that would not have taken place had she any doubts about us. Yes, I can't help that life is trying to correct for mistakes that should not have been made. But I do have a conscience... why else would I be on here and wanting to spend the rest of my life with her? If I had none, wouldn't I be happy the way things are or send pics of us to him? I don't think so. Gess. Cut me some slack. You don't know the whole picture.

And this has already gone on for 2 years!!

Says it all really.

You're right, we don't know the whole picture. Just what you have painted for us. And that is you disrupting someone else's marriage, trying to steal his wife, her wanting her cake and eating it too and you sitting idly by while she does.

Please re-read what I wrote. I never said that God was sending you signs. You said that you were a sign from God to her. I whole-heartedly disagree here.

And no if you have a conscience you'd not be messing with a married woman.

This thread is going from the sublime to the ridiculous.

I have never read so many justifications and excuses for an affair, and I have never read so many justifications and excuses for not leaving (a supposedly) unhappy marriage.

My only question, on reading all the posts is - if the cuckolded husband is SO awful, why doesn't she leave? Heaven's knows she's had years to do so!

Answer - because she doesn't want to. It's as simple as that. All the stuff about her strict Catholic upbringing is just an excuse.

There is something in the drama and emotion of this situation that is keeping you all stuck in this dysfunctional triangle, and it sounds like she is pulling the strings. You and the poor hubby are the puppets that dance to her tune.

My husband's ex wife (who is a malignant narcissist) is currently doing the same thing to her new husband - been with him for about 9 years, claims he does not satisfy her needs (but continues to live with him as she's a 'practicing Anglican'), has met her soul mate (yea right) and is having an affair with him whilst telling him that she can't leave her marriage yet. And they both stay!

As I said in my post (some time ago, now) - take off those rose colored glasses because I can't help but feel that you're being seriously used by a master manipulator.

Yep you ain't no practicing Catholic if on one hand you don't believe in divorce yet you justify adultery.

Firstly, God do not send signs to disrupt a marriage. The couple made a vow in front of God to be with each other till death do part and yet God would send signs to disrupt his will? Doesn't make sense to me.

Firstly, God do not send signs to disrupt a marriage. The couple made a vow in front of God to be with eachother till death do part and yet God would send signs to disrupt his will? Doesnt make sense to me.

Maybe it wasn't His will? If marriage is God's will so often, then why are there so many divorces. I think God is much stronger than that. I believe God understands we make mistakes in life. And I also believe he tries to show us the way with signs. Often we miss them (i.e so many red flags in her marriage like him not being emotional or intimate) but He continues to try and show us. Over the 6 years, I'm told her marriage hasn't gotten any better... tolerable but to be with a guy just because he's nice is not a reason to stay married if you don't love that person.

Enough said. I'm done. I have my therapist. I thank you for the input some of you were good... alot were very attacking. But it's been interesting.

NO ONE here has been attacking. We are honest, and someone needs to get through your head.

Again, maybe she doesn't belong with him. Who knows? But you are interfering where you have no business.

The best part is you came here when you first got back in contact with her, and asked if you should pursue it. And you were told it was a bad idea and to move on.

https://www.askmehelpdesk.com/dating/ex-girlfriend-4-years-now-married-still-not-over-her-124764.html

I agree chicago. We often marry the wrong one because we do have free will. God allows for divorce because of adultery. Thing is she can't have it both ways. If she is using not divorcing because of her Catholic belief then she can't use adultery as her answer to satisfying her unhappy marriage.

She needs put on the spot to make a decision one way or another. The last thing God is into is having your cake and eating it too when it comes to infidelity.

I would tell her that she has to make a decision and tell him or you are and while your at it get hubby's side of the story too.

I really think you should just avoid getting let down. First, She would divorce if she wanted to. Second, if her husband is religious/spiritual then he would not hold back divorcing her because the bible does allow divorce for adultery. It is not against God. So maybe she isn't being entirely honest with you. If she doesn't love him then why are they married? You don't just say "i do" if you don't love eachother. I am in a relationship were he cheated twice. I put my foot down and packed and left him with our daughter and baby on the way. He just was so miserable and begged me to come back. I told him if he loves me he needs to be faithful. His father was the same way so i can see why he was that way. Now he has not cheated. My point is that he was spending time with and being intimate with someone eles. They always thought they meant something. But when I found out, he totally cut them off. These women knew about me so I did not pity them. I simply let them know that they were just used for one thing and did not matter to him. I believe a woman who knows a man is involved or married should know better. Also she is just a wh*re to try to take another womans man. I feel it goes both ways. I wish you luck with this, but i don't believe she will leave her husband for you. Just like my man told his "women on the side" lies about me just to get his way. She may be doing the same. She may also have marriage problems but for some reason doesn't want to throw it away

The best part is you came here when you first got back in contact with her, and asked if you should pursue it. And you were told it was a bad idea and to move on.

https://www.askmehelpdesk.com/dating/ex-girlfriend-4-years-now-married-still-not-over-her-124764.html

I remember well. And many said nothing will come of it... well look where I am now. I'm quite certain everyone would be surprised things have gone so well with her and I. Again, this a woman who is not your typical girl... otherwise a divorce would've followed a long time. She takes her time... and I guess I understand it because she wants to be as sure as she can... especially considering living with me after I hurt her so bad. So, I knew it was going to be rough. But giving her self to me physically, spiritually, and emotionally is pretty good I say.

And you must admit, it is very strange why her husband sits back and lets all this happen. He's a pacifist and knows she's going to do what she wants so why fight it. Sounds like a toxic rel'p to me. To not fight for your wife nor care what she does? Crazy and sick!

No, they wouldn't be surprised. They said "don't get involved with a married woman." and you did and now you're the man on the side that she doesn't love enough to leave her husband for. You're naïve, and it's so apparent.

He should fight for his wife, you're right. But he's not fighting now, and look, she STILL doesn't want to leave him. What will it take for you to realize she's not going to leave him for you?

I remember well. And many said nothing will come of it....well look where I am now. I'm quite certain everyone would be suprised things have gone so well with her and I. Again, this a woman who is not your typical girl....otherwise a divorce would've followed a long time. She takes her time...and I guess I understand it because she wants to be as sure as she can...especially considering living with me after I hurt her so bad. So, I knew it was gonna be rough. But giving her self to me physically, spiritually, and emotionally is pretty good I say.

And you must admit, it is very strange why her husband sits back and lets all this happen. He's a pacifist and knows she's gonna do what she wants so why fight it. Sounds like a toxic rel'p to me. To not fight for your wife nor care what she does? Crazy and sick!

Hey slick, Remember he doesn't know that YOU'RE HAVING SEX WITH HIS WIFE. You don't have the balls to tell him. You spineless piece of... work. If things are going so well , then why are you coming here, over and over and over again like some pyscho. So don't talk bad about the only good person in this mess that YOU'VE made.

No, they wouldn't be surprised. They said "don't get involved with a married woman." and you did and now you're the man on the side that she doesn't love enough to leave her husband for. You're naive, and it's so apparent.

He should fight for his wife, you're right. But he's not fighting now, and look, she STILL doesn't want to leave him. What will it take for you to realize she's not going to leave him for you?


Evidently a lot more than anyone can offer. If I had listened to you when I was contemplating on breaking up with her when we we're going out in college you probably all would've said move on because I found too many little things wrong with her and made her feel terrible. You might've said she's not the one, and that if she doesn't make you happy you should let her go. Thing is she did make me happy then. I got arrogant and cocky due to immaturity, lack of social life, misinterpreting how a girlfriend should act and look. And you'dve all been wrong to encourage me to leave her. Now here I am... with a licensed therapist telling me this may work... she just needs time to sort out these issues. To think of her as a severely injured person... ya can't expect someone like that to up and walk. Time and healing... and a lot of faith. She's never lied to me before... others yes, but not to me. Sorry you don't believe. Really doesn't matter.

It won't ever work ***at least not right* until she comes clean with her hubby and gets a divorce---until then you are barking up the wrong tree.

There's obviously nothing that anyone can say to you to make you realize what you're doing is wrong in every way possible. Just because someone has a license to be a therapist doesn't mean they are right. You give him how much money? Yeah. I'd tell you what you want to hear for $100 an hour too.

But you know? I come here, and give my advice for FREE. Because I like to help people. Even people that don't want help, they just want to be lied to to make themselves feel right and their wrongs justified. Not going to happen.

Good luck to you in all your endeavors, I hope one day you'll find someone that actually loves you.

Yep therapists don't always look at the overall picture.

There's no way a qualified therapist would tell you this is all right.

They are either incompetent or you haven't told them the whole story.

You know, I'm actually quite saddened at all of this.

The people on this thread have given their honest (albeit sometimes a little "rough around the edges") opinions about what you, the OP, should do in your situation. They have given advice from past experiences, the school-of-hard-knocks, and just plain common sense. They have tried to understand, tried to rationalize, tried cyber-yelling, and the like to nail their points into your head.

But, they can't make you believe or understand what you're not willing to believe or understand.

You are a hopeless romantic. I really do think you believe this woman is your "other half." You believe that if you wait long enough, she will realize it and eventually ride off into the glorious sunset with you.

It is your prerogative to believe whatever you wish... that is what being human means. We are given the ability to make our own choices, come what may.

You have made the decision to give your heart completely to this woman. No, we do not know the whole story. All we know is that she is married, that her marriage is a sham, that she says she is in love with you, and that you are her "piece" on the side.

I do not believe that married people should be involved with anyone other than their partner. Period. And, I will never change that opinion.

But, that is MY choice to make.

If you do decide to continue loving this woman, giving her your entire heart (because love is a choice), you MUST take the high road, disappear from her life, and let HER make up her own mind.

Love her until her dying day, but let her make the decisions that she NEEDS to make about her marriage. She has a free will, too.

People do what they want to do. She is doing what she wants. No one can make someone do what they choose not to do. Her husband is not tying her up, threatening her life. He is simply maintaining a relationship. (Yes, relationship. They have a paper signed, sealed, and dated to prove that they have a relationship)

Bottom line: we cannot make you not love this woman or wait for her until she decides that you're her prince charming. We cannot convince you to do anything that you do not want to do... in the end, we all do what we feel is morally right. Let her make up her own mind.

Take your bow and sit in the audience until she decides to pull the curtain. If you choose to wait for her, great, but let her be. Let her fix her own life.

Don't force her. Don't expect things of her. Don't influence her. Don't try and convince her that you're her best. If she feels that, she will make things happen where she can be with you.

Leave their relationship alone and wait to see how the cards fall... if that is your choice.

You know, I'm actually quite saddened at all of this.

The people on this thread have given their honest (albeit sometimes a little "rough around the edges") opinions about what you, the OP, should do in your situation. They have given advice from past experiences, the school-of-hard-knocks, and just plain common sense. They have tried to understand, tried to rationalize, tried cyber-yelling, and the like to nail their points into your head.

But, they can't make you believe or understand what you're not willing to believe or understand.

You are a hopeless romantic. I really do think you believe this woman is your "other half." You believe that if you wait long enough, she will realize it and eventually ride off into the glorious sunset with you.

It is your prerogative to believe whatever you wish.... that is what being human means. We are given the ability to make our own choices, come what may.

You have made the decision to give your heart completely to this woman. No, we do not know the whole story. All we know is that she is married, that her marriage is a sham, that she says she is in love with you, and that you are her "piece" on the side.

I do not believe that married people should be involved with anyone other than their partner. Period. And, I will never change that opinion.

But, that is MY choice to make.

If you do decide to continue loving this woman, giving her your entire heart (because love is a choice), you MUST take the high road, disappear from her life, and let HER make up her own mind.

Love her until her dying day, but let her make the decisions that she NEEDS to make about her marriage. She has a free will, too.

People do what they want to do. She is doing what she wants. No one can make someone do what they choose not to do. Her husband is not tying her up, threatening her life. He is simply maintaining a relationship. (Yes, relationship. They have a paper signed, sealed, and dated to prove that they have a relationship)

Bottom line: we cannot make you not love this woman or wait for her until she decides that you're her prince charming. We cannot convince you to do anything that you do not want to do... in the end, we all do what we feel is morally right. Let her make up her own mind.

Take your bow and sit in the audience until she decides to pull the curtain. If you choose to wait for her, great, but let her be. Let her fix her own life.

Don't force her. Don't expect things of her. Don't influence her. Don't try and convince her that you're her best. If she feels that, she will make things happen where she can be with you.

Leave their relationship alone and wait to see how the cards fall.... if that is your choice.

Bravo! I really agree. I never intended to convey to anyone that I woud persuade, influence, or convince her. She and I discussed that long ago that she will have to make the decision. Hence why she's seeking counseling (although much of what the counselor has told her is what I've told her in the past). The fact that she's seeking counseling I believe says a lot anyway. She could just as easily say no and end it. But she knows there's a reason and when she finds it through counseling as to why she's with me more than him, then that reason will be made clear to her. A waiting game. (See Dr. Kalish's book on Lost Loves Reuinited. Perfectly good marriages have ended because the spark never was there and the spouse realizes their undying love for that special lost love and THAT union grew)

The real question is how long are you going to live with her not making any changes though?

You can't go on indefinitely with her calling all the shots and not ever having to make an ultimate decision of him or you.
She could go at it forever playing both ends against the middle. Why would you want that?

Bravo! I really agree. I never intended to convey to anyone that I woud persuade, influence, or convince her. She and I discussed that long ago that she will have to make the decision. Hence why she's seeking counseling (although much of what the counselor has told her is what I've told her in the past). The fact that she's seeking counseling I believe says alot anyway. She could just as easily say no and end it. But she knows there's a reason and when she finds it through counseling as to why she's with me more than him, then that reason will be made clear to her. A waiting game. (See Dr. Kalish's book on Lost Loves Reuinited. Perfectly good marriages have ended because the spark never was there and the spouse realizes their undying love for that special lost love and THAT union grew)

Thank you for the book recommendation, but I really have no interest in marriages that broke up. You see, my example for marriage was the perfect, idyllic match - my parents. They both had pasts, but they made their present, lived for the future, and made a timeless story... a story that was only the preface to mine.

I, too, am a hopeless romantic... but I also know that, for me, there is a reason why the past is in the past. It could never make it to my present.

I've had my heart broken, I've lost loves, I've broken hearts, and yes, I was someone's best. But that is in my past. Circumstances dictated that it be in the past. And, I'm OK with that.

When I marry, it will be forever... because that's who I am. I will marry a man who knows that it will be forever... because that's who he is. For me, it's as simple as that.

And those that are married have that choice to make... whether they will remain forever intertwined...

**EDIT**
REading back over that, it really has nothing to do with the OP... sorry about that! I just got on a literary tangent...

Just let them be. Let her make her own mind. Take the high road. Wait if you choose, but just let her be.

Hi. I think the fact that you re posting here shows that a part of you is already aware that many things are not right in this relationship of yours.have you considered counselling for you?

His therapist said 'Go for it' in so many words

You really think God is sending you signs to commit a sin? Isn't this one of the Ten Commandments? And you think you are a sign from God? Or that it's God's will that you be together? NO WAY! Sorry.

You are just making yourself appear more and more naive. She's playing you, open your eyes.

You really think that telling her parents would bring the two of you together? If she tells her strictly Catholic parents that she is cheating on her husband, you think they'll tell her to divorce him and marry the man that ended that marriage. NO.

And whether or not the marriage was bad before you came along, you are the driving force for its dysfunction at this point. Why would you do that? Don't you see how wrong all of your actions with this woman are? If you truly believe in God, ask the head of your church what he thinks you should do.

Beautifully said

It's why she's seeking counseling (4 months) to figure out why she's hesistant (b/c he's got a "good heart") and she's making progress. Once counselor and her sort through issues it is her hope that she will divorce with a clear conscience knowing she tried everything.

How can she possibly come to the point where she has tried everything with her husband? She isn't worried about making it work, she is out with another man. YOU. And for that matter if she does so happen to divorce her husband and be with you, what if things go wrong in your marriage...how would you feel if she was doing you the same way as she is her husband now? How will you be able to fully trust her? And without trust, how can you build a successful relationship? Just an opinion, but a few things for you to think about.

One other Q is this: Don't ya think she should tell her parents? They have much influence over her and and put her husband in higher regards than her as he cooks, cleans, etc. while she brings home the paycheck. Makes her upset and me too b/c they don't know all the lies (how he's killed her dreams and wishes, never any intimacy, connection). He's 15 years older than her and has neck problems enough to not do factory work but app. he's able to swing a sledge hammer and bust up cement steps and put in a wood entry way. (A first rate BS con man if ya ask me).

She chose this man to be her husband no matter what BS excuses she is throwing at you. She is married to him, if there was problems from the start, she wouldn't be with him now. Just like she left you when the two of you had problems, she could have done the same with him. Fact is, she didn't leave him. She married him, she's lieing to you.



2nd Q: He says he doesn't believe in divorce except adultry is grounds for divorce. He suspected his first wife of having an affair. But isn't it possible that if she told him everything he could change his belief and file?

Why should he file? She is the one wanting out of the relationship. She is the one cheating on him. She is the one wanting to be with another man. She thinks it is never going to work. She doesn't want to be the divorcer...why? Could it be that if he divorces her over having an affair that she won't get as much of the assets as she is wanting? Is she thinking possibly that if she divorces him that in court she will be at fault and not receive anything? Who knows? But if she does love you, she would divorce him. No excuses!

One other bit: She has Int. cysti. which can limit sex b/c pain. With him it never happened-too painful. When we did it, miraculously no pain! Explain that. Seems to be another sign that she and I are supposed to be together. Recog. it's wrong but she and I both know we want to marry and we're in our 30's not just some 18 year olds who aren't aware of implications.

This makes me laugh! Honey men are made differently which you should know that already. If he's hurting her, and you are not haha it doesn't mean that the two of you are meant to be together. Wow! What a way to make a point!