Seems the Dems' worries keep increasing. First it was talk of how success in Iraq would be a problem for them, now their front runner has them concerned about hurting the rest of their slate.


Looking past the presidential nomination fight, Democratic leaders quietly fret that Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton at the top of their 2008 ticket could hurt candidates at the bottom (http://www.kentucky.com/216/story/148453.html).

They say the former first lady might be too polarizing for much of the country. She could jeopardize the party's standing with independent voters and give Republicans who otherwise might stay home on Election Day a reason to vote, they worry.

In more than 40 interviews, Democratic candidates, consultants and party chairs from every region pointed to internal polls that give Clinton strikingly high unfavorable ratings in places with key congressional and state races.

"I'm not sure it would be fatal in Indiana, but she would be a drag" on many candidates, said Democratic state Rep. Dave Crooks of Washington, Ind.

Unlike Crooks, most Democratic leaders agreed to talk frankly about Clinton's political coattails only if they remained anonymous, fearing reprisals from the New York senator's campaign. They all expressed admiration for Clinton, and some said they would publicly support her fierce fight for the nomination -- despite privately held fears.

The chairman of a Midwest state party called Clinton a nightmare for congressional and state legislative candidates.

A Democratic congressman from the West, locked in a close re-election fight, said Clinton is the Democratic candidate most likely to cost him his seat.

A strategist with close ties to leaders in Congress said Democratic Senate candidates in competitive races would be strongly urged to distance themselves from Clinton.

"The argument with Hillary right now in some of these red states is she's so damn unpopular," said Andy Arnold, chairman of the Greenville, S.C. Democratic Party. "I think Hillary is someone who could drive folks on the other side out to vote who otherwise wouldn't."

"Republicans are upset with their candidates," Arnold added, "but she will make up for that by essentially scaring folks to the polls."

In national surveys, Clinton's lead over chief rival Sen. Barack Obama of Illinois has widened. Her advantage is much narrower where it counts most -- in early voting states such as Iowa and New Hampshire. In matchups against potential GOP presidential candidates, Clinton leads or is tied.

Looks like Hillary is a nightmare for both sides, those who think she's may cost them the house or the Senate, and those who think she's just plain scary. So what's a Democrat to do now? Obama, "the Great Contender"? They're concerned he may flame- out. (http://www.nydailynews.com/news/wn_report/2007/08/12/2007-08-12_they_fear_obamas_too_hot.html) But hey, he'll look fabulous doing it...

Steve ;

I think you could point a finger at the Kossacks and their stooge in this election ,John Edwards for authorship . The big surprise here is that AP would publish it.

Hillary must have lots of angst . First she's not black enough and now her electability is questioned and even if she is elected does her petticoat have sufficient tails to carry the rest of the party ?

The sorry truth is from a spectrum perspective she is about as centrist as you get from the Dems. Now part of that is deception as manifested in her fake toughness in foreign policy ,and some of that comes from the false impression that she would be the heir to her hubbies generally centralist economic legacy (at least he was a free trader ) . You would think that all of their performances at the NFL-CIO "debate " would dissuade anyone from that illusion.

Steve ;

I think you could point a finger at the Kossacks and their stooge in this election ,John Edwards for authorship . The big surprise here is that AP would publish it.

It actually doesn't surprise me, al-AP has been doing a lot of odd things lately.


Hillary must have lots of angst . First she's not black enough and now her electability is questioned and even if she is elected does her petticoat have sufficient tails to carry the rest of the party ?

Ya think? :D

http://www.michaeltotten.com/archives/images/Hillary%20Clinton.jpg

Seems the Dems' worries keep increasing. First it was talk of how success in Iraq would be a problem for them, now their front runner has them concerned about hurting the rest of their slate.



Looks like Hillary is a nightmare for both sides, those who think she's may cost them the house or the Senate, and those who think she's just plain scary. So what's a Democrat to do now? Obama, "the Great Contender"? They're concerned he may flame- out. (http://www.nydailynews.com/news/wn_report/2007/08/12/2007-08-12_they_fear_obamas_too_hot.html) But hey, he'll look fabulous doing it...
America is not ready for a Black, or Female President; especially in time of turmoil.

America is not ready for a Black, or Female President; especially in time of turmoil.

I have to disagree on both points.

Firstly, Obama has something none of the other candidates from either of the two mainstream parties has -- Being a first term Senator, he has a relatively clean slate.

(Being a charismatic, eloquent and intelligent public speaker works to his advantage as well.)

And this makes him a very appealing candidate to those fed up with the antics (voting records) and stances of the rest of the field.

Then again, to a thinking person, the absence of baggage will likely translate to a lack of experience.

As for Hillary, it isn't her gender that makes her so unappealing -- It's her abrasive personality, voting record and connection to Bill Clinton -- Most people I talk to have had enough of Presidential dynasties.

What this country needs more than anything else is a breather from familial dynasties and Red Neck Crackers from Texas and 'The South'.

That isn't to say all folks living South of the Manson/Nixon Line or those who hail from Texas are Crackers -- But being a Red Neck Cracker certainly seems to be a prerequisite for election to higher office in those necks of the woods.

I have to disagree on both points.

Firstly, Obama has something none of the other candidates from either of the two mainstream parties has -- Being a first term Senator, he has a relatively clean slate.

(Being a charismatic, eloquent and intelligent public speaker works to his advantage as well.)

And this makes him a very appealing candidate to those fed up with the antics (voting records) and stances of the rest of the field.

Then again, to a thinking person, the absence of baggage will likely translate to a lack of experience.

As for Hillary, it isn't her gender that makes her so unappealing -- It's her abrasive personality, voting record and connection to Bill Clinton -- Most people I talk to have had enough of Presidential dynasties.

What this country needs more than anything else is a breather from familial dynasties and Red Neck Crackers from Texas and 'The South'.

That isn't to say all folks living South of the Manson/Nixon Line or those who hail from Texas are Crackers -- But being a Red Neck Cracker certainly seems to be a prerequisite for election to higher office in those necks of the woods.
Well, people are not going to come out and say they are against a Black, of female President, that’s for sure. But if you take a look at the bias that still exists, it appears telling to me.

Well, people are not going to come out and say they are against a Black, of female President, that’s for sure. But if you take a look at the bias that still exists, it appears telling to me.

Being from the 'Left Coast', I'm not seeing the bias.

And posting from the capital of the 'Left Coast' as you are, I have to wonder where exactly this backwoods bastion where centrist views are apparently still allowed is located.

Being from the 'Left Coast', I'm not seeing the bias.

And posting from the capital of the 'Left Coast' as you are, I have to wonder where exactly this backwoods bastion where centrist views are apparently still allowed is located.
Your question reminds of the time when I when I was growing up, I mean by that elementary and High school in Oceanside, San Diego County. Occasionally I would hear about race relations and so forth. But we didn’t have any of the problems like, different bathroom for blacks, different drinking fountains, or the like. Blacks played on the football team and sat where they liked in the movies. I believed these race stories was from a different country than America. This was in the 1950s, which as I know now, were violent Racial times in much of the country.;)

Obama is imploding. Edwards is a lightweight. The rest of the Dems are all there for comic relief. The only serious contender left from the Dems is Hillary. Not because she's so good, but because she hasn't had a major screwup yet. Emphasis on "yet".

That said, there is something to be said for the argument that she is a danger to her own party. Certainly she hasn't been left-leaning enough to satisfy the moveon.org/Michael Moore types.

But think of it this way: if she is the only game in town for the far left wing of the Dem party, wouldn't they bite the bullet and vote for her rather than grant support to her Republican opponent? And if that is true, she won't really have lost them in terms of losing their votes.

On the other side, we have the moderate Dems. They will have a tougher choice: Hillary vs. Giuliani or Hillary vs. Fred Thompson.

But the difference is that moderates, by their very nature, will be willing to vote for whoever looks best to them at every level. That means that the moderate state-level and Congressional candidates won't really lose the support of their moderates, even if Hillary is seen as either too far too the left or too far to the right. Moderates, in my experience, vote the candidate, not the party. Hillary's candidacy for President won't necessarily mean a shift of moderates at the congressional level.

So, I don't really agree that Hillary is necessarily a danger to the Dem party. I think that the Dem politicians as a whole are a danger to the Dem party. They are losing their moderates by shifting too far to the left... a mistake that Hillary has not yet made. Moderates don't like to vote too far to either side... that's what makes them moderates. But the Dems have been making a leftward shift for 4 years now, and they are losing their moderates because of it. Hillary isn't the danger to the Dems. The Dems are the real danger to the Dems.

Elliot

What this country needs more than anything else is a breather from familial dynasties and Red Neck Crackers from Texas and 'The South'.

That isn't to say all folks living South of the Manson/Nixon Line or those who hail from Texas are Crackers -- But being a Red Neck Cracker certainly seems to be a prerequisite for election to higher office in those necks of the woods.

I guess I'm a "Red Neck Cracker." Funny how you speak of Obama being "charismatic, eloquent and intelligent" just prior to disparaging those of us in the south. I can tell you as a "Red Neck Cracker" from Texas that I don't have a need to vote for another "Red Neck Cracker," I intend to vote for the best candidate that has a shot at winning, which at this time appears to be Rudy.

But, it is precisely your attitude that makes us leery of "left coasters" and northeastern politicians, that smug attitude is not welcome here. Your values are not our values in so many areas, we resent that liberal/progressive air of superiority that's so often on display and we especially hate Yankee politicians that come to the south and pull out their "sho 'nuff, y'all" accents like Hillary does.

Other than that, we don't care about your gender, your color or where you're from :D

I guess I'm a "Red Neck Cracker." Funny how you speak of Obama being "charismatic, eloquent and intelligent" just prior to disparaging those of us in the south. I can tell you as a "Red Neck Cracker" from Texas that I don't have a need to vote for another "Red Neck Cracker," I intend to vote for the best candidate that has a shot at winning, which at this time appears to be Rudy.

But, it is precisely your attitude that makes us leery of "left coasters" and northeastern politicians, that smug attitude is not welcome here. Your values are not our values in so many areas, we resent that liberal/progressive air of superiority that's so often on display and we especially hate Yankee politicians that come to the south and pull out their "sho 'nuff, y'all" accents like Hillary does.

Other than that, we don't care about your gender, your color or where you're from :D
Hell, that comment could almost pass as coming from David Ernest Duke a former member of the Louisiana House of Representatives, a candidate in presidential primaries for both the Democratic and Republican parties, and former Grand Wizard of the Knights of the Ku Klux Klan:eek:

Hell, that comment could almost pass as coming from David Ernest Duke a former member of the Louisiana House of Representatives, a candidate in presidential primaries for both the Democratic and Republican parties, and former Grand Wizard of the Knights of the Ku Klux Klan:eek:

DC, you should know better than that. I have never demonstrated even a hint of racism on this board, that other place or in this post. It speaks only of the arrogant, dismissive attitude that we in the southern part of the country are a bunch of racist, illiterate, white, "Red Neck" bumpkins. And until those people that insist on portraying and thinking of us as such stop that insulting behavior and honor our values, we will continue to reject their candidates no matter their color or gender.

DC, you should know better than that. I have never demonstrated even a hint of racism on this board, that other place or in this post. It speaks only of the arrogant, dismissive attitude that we in the southern part of the country are a bunch of racist, illiterate, white, "Red Neck" bumpkins. And until those people that insist on portraying and thinking of us as such stop that insulting behavior and honor our values, we will continue to reject their candidates no matter their color or gender.
C’mon…”That isn't to say all folks living South of the Manson/Nixon Line or those who hail from Texas are Crackers “

The response covered your objection before you responded.

Agreed, I have never heard you say you make a racist remark. However, right wingers are traditionally racist and sexist, while “Left coasters” are not. I refer you to my post #8

C’mon…”That isn't to say all folks living South of the Manson/Nixon Line or those who hail from Texas are Crackers “

The response covered your objection before you responded.

But you omitted the latter half, "But being a Red Neck Cracker certainly seems to be a prerequisite for election to higher office in those necks of the woods." Coupled with the opening salvo, "What this country needs more than anything else is a breather from familial dynasties and Red Neck Crackers from Texas and 'The South', that was a rather weak qualifier.


Agreed, I have never heard you say you make a racist remark. However, right wingers are traditionally racist and sexist, while “Left coasters” are not. I refer you to my post #8

This may be a shocker, but this kid from a "right wing evangelical conservative" background that grew up at the height of the civil rights movement in the 60's, was (and still is) a white minority in his Texas neighborhood. Almost all of my friends had a different color of skin than my own. I didn't know anything about racism or sexism. It wasn't until I grew up, got married and had a family did I learn from the left that I was intolerant, racist, sexist scum because I'm a white, male, heterosexual, evangelical conservative. Now, ain't that a kick coming from those who tell me not to judge others?

But you omitted the latter half, "But being a Red Neck Cracker certainly seems to be a prerequisite for election to higher office in those necks of the woods." Coupled with the opening salvo, "What this country needs more than anything else is a breather from familial dynasties and Red Neck Crackers from Texas and 'The South', that was a rather weak qualifier.



This may be a shocker, but this kid from a "right wing evangelical conservative" background that grew up at the height of the civil rights movement in the 60's, was (and still is) a white minority in his Texas neighborhood. Almost all of my friends had a different color of skin than my own. I didn't know anything about racism or sexism. It wasn't until I grew up, got married and had a family did I learn from the left that I was intolerant, racist, sexist scum because I'm a white, male, heterosexual, evangelical conservative. Now, ain't that a kick coming from those who tell me not to judge others?

“When Lincoln High School traveled to the city of Vidor for a football game in the 1960s they were greeted by burning crosses and a police escort.”

You must have been born into a recluse family not to have experienced your environment.

Whatever the case, I’m glad for you; but that does not change the fact that as a group…right wingers are traditionally racist and sexist, while “Left coasters” are not.

It actually doesn't surprise me, al-AP has been doing a lot of odd things lately.



Ya think? :D

http://www.michaeltotten.com/archives/images/Hillary%20Clinton.jpg

Did she sit on something? I don't think it was a happy meal.. lol

“When Lincoln High School traveled to the city of Vidor for a football game in the 1960s they were greeted by burning crosses and a police escort.”

You must have been born into a recluse family not to have experienced your environment.

You're not helping your case here, that's more than a rather insulting remark. My family is anything but reclusive. In case you didn't know, Texas is a big, diverse state. Vidor is 657 miles from here. That's 22 miles further than the distance from Bangor, Maine to Baltimore - halfway across Maine, past New Hampshire, Massachusetts, Connecticut, New York, New Jersey, Pennsylvania and Delaware. Not exactly local news.


Whatever the case, I’m glad for you; but that does not change the fact that as a group…right wingers are traditionally racist and sexist, while “Left coasters” are not.

Even if that's so, what does that have to do with today? For example, this president has had the first African American Secretary of State, the first female African American National Security Adviser, the first female African American Secretary of State, the first African American Secretary of Education, the first Female Asian American Secretary of Labor and the first Hispanic American Attorney General. Has anyone noticed?

You're not helping your case here, that's more than a rather insulting remark. My family is anything but reclusive. In case you didn't know, Texas is a big, diverse state. Vidor is 657 miles from here. That's 22 miles further than the distance from Bangor, Maine to Baltimore - halfway across Maine, past New Hampshire, Massachusetts, Connecticut, New York, New Jersey, Pennsylvania and Delaware. Not exactly local news.



Even if that's so, what does that have to do with today? For example, this president has had the first African American Secretary of State, the first female African American National Security Adviser, the first female African American Secretary of State, the first African American Secretary of Education, the first Female Asian American Secretary of Labor and the first Hispanic American Attorney General. Has anyone noticed?
Look, you may feed someone else this poppy-cock story of having learned about racism from the “Left” when you were an adult, but given that Texas was a slave state and the following news items, I refuse to buy it.

A delegation of leaders from the African American community that included Arthur DeWitty, Rev. B. L. McCormick, Mrs. Friendly R. Rice, and Dr. Beadie E. Conner requests that the two “For Whites Only” signs be removed from the basement of the Travis County Courthouse. [AF-Segregation-Public Schools-S1700 (2)-1960; The Austin Statesman, “Courthouse Integration Complete,” March 01, 1960]

White and African American students from several area colleges picket businesses on Congress Avenue urging “integration of lunch counters.” [AF-Segregation-Public Schools-S1700 (2)-1960; The Dallas Morning News, “Student Pickets in Austin Ask for Integration,” April 28, 1960]

African American and white University of Texas students at Austin stage three demonstrations against the segregated Texas Theater on the main campus. [AF-Segregation-Public Schools-S1700 (1)-University of Texas; The Texas Observer, “Students Demonstrate Against Texas Theater,” December 09, 1960s]

The Travis County Grand Jury indicts University students John Winborn and William H. McKnight for setting off a homemade bomb outside an integrationist meeting at The University of Texas YMCA. [AF-Segregation-Public Schools-S1700 (1)-University of Texas; The American-Statesman, “Pair Indicted in Bombing,” December 04, 1960]

Integrationists conduct stand-ins at the Texas and Varsity Theaters on the Drag near The University of Texas campus area. [AF-Segregation-Public Schools-S1700 (2)-1960s; The Austin American, “Stand-ins Continue on Drag,” December 14, 1960]

Rev. Buck, a priest in charge of St. James Episcopal Church, carried a sign stating: “The segregation policy of St. Andrew's Episcopal School is unfair to Negro Episcopals. Do not support segregation.” [AF-Segregation-Public Schools-S1700 (2)-1960s; The Austin Statesman, “Pickets Walk in Front of Episcopal School,” April 20, 1961]

Five hundred African American students are eligible to transfer to white schools as a result of the Austin ISD Board of Education's decision to continue its desegregation policy into the elementary schools. [AF-Segregation-Public Schools-S1700 (2)-1960s; The Austin Statesman, “500 Negro 6th Graders Can Enter White Schools,” July 11, 1961]

Houston public swimming pools integrate, June 7th. Houston Mayor Lewis Cutrer orders that Houston municipal pools be open to blacks. The city had already desegregated all public buildings in 1962. Parks and municipal golf courses had previously been opened to all races. City pools are the last of the municipal facilities to eliminate segregation. [Scrapbook Collection: News Clippings Recreation Department 1963; AR Z.025]

On May 10th, Superintendent Irby B. Carruth issues a letter to all parents announcing that Austin Independent School District would “no longer have schools for children of different races.” The U.S. Office of Education had accepted the school desegregation plan, whose adoption was begun in 1955 and completed in 1963. Now all students had to make a “choice.” [AF-Segregation-Public Schools-S1700 (2)-1960s]


And you wonder why I suggested you must be from a recluse family…

Look, you may feed someone else this poppy-cock story of having learned about racism from the “Left” when you were an adult, but given that Texas was a slave state and the following news items, I refuse to buy it.

Dark, that's precisely what I've been talking about here - judging us on ignorant assumptions. It doesn't really matter what you think is a "poppy-cock story", I'm the one that has lived this life. You can post all the 1960-1961 Austin stories you want and it won't change the fact that I was born in 1960, lived 528 miles north of Austin, and therefore didn't have a clue about what was happening there. Geez, what's a guy got to do to convince someone these days? Amarillo is not Austin, is not Vidor, is not Selma or Atlanta. My first teacher was Hispanic as were most of my classmates and friends for the first 6 years. The only real difference between us was I didn't understand the conversation when my friends and their parents spoke Spanish, and we didn't eat menudo at home.

I'm sure my parents and older siblings were more aware of events, but we were not "reclusive" and I'd appreciate it very much if you stopped insulting my family and myself as such. We were a nice, outgoing, fun-loving, fairly well traveled, lower middle class, conservative, non-racist family living in a predominantly Hispanic neighborhood. I can't help it if you find that hard to believe, but it's the truth.

And by the way, I didn't say I learned about racism from the left when I was an adult, I said I didn't learn I was racist until they labeled me as such - based on their intolerant ignorance. I'm just sick and tired of being called hick, redneck, racist, homophobic, bigoted, "FundiEv" and all other manner of BS by a group of people that advocate "tolerance" and don't know the first thing about me. I would have hoped that you wouldn't join in on the insults.

Forty-seven years plus later and since segregation, Austin by comparison is the most diverse major college city in Texas. In fact it ranks 4th in the nation according to the University of Texas Longhorns official website. Travis county has voted overwhelmingly Democrat the past four elections that I know of, maybe longer.


Profiles in Diversity : Diverse People and Ideas (http://www.utexas.edu/diversity/profiles.php?e=0)



Bobby

Dark, that's precisely what I've been talking about here - judging us on ignorant assumptions. It doesn't really matter what you think is a "poppy-cock story", I'm the one that has lived this life. You can post all the 1960-1961 Austin stories you want and it won't change the fact that I was born in 1960, lived 528 miles north of Austin, and therefore didn't have a clue about what was happening there. Geez, what's a guy gotta do to convince someone these days? Amarillo is not Austin, is not Vidor, is not Selma or Atlanta. My first teacher was Hispanic as were most of my classmates and friends for the first 6 years. The only real difference between us was I didn't understand the conversation when my friends and their parents spoke Spanish, and we didn't eat menudo at home.

I'm sure my parents and older siblings were more aware of events, but we were not "reclusive" and I'd appreciate it very much if you stopped insulting my family and myself as such. We were a nice, outgoing, fun-loving, fairly well traveled, lower middle class, conservative, non-racist family living in a predominantly Hispanic neighborhood. I can't help it if you find that hard to believe, but it's the truth.

And by the way, I didn't say I learned about racism from the left when I was an adult, I said I didn't learn I was racist until they labeled me as such - based on their intolerant ignorance. I'm just sick and tired of being called hick, redneck, racist, homophobic, bigoted, "FundiEv" and all other manner of BS by a group of people that advocate "tolerance" and don't know the first thing about me. I would have hoped that you wouldn't join in on the insults.
I am truly sorry and had no intention of insulting you with the suggestion that your family was recluse, as I have been. There are only a couple of definitions of the term and I won’t say with which one I attribute to myself. Somebody who lives alone and deliberately keeps away from other people, and somebody who lives a solitary life devoted to prayer and meditation.

So you see, I could not conceive of anyone considering it an insult to be called a recluse.. Anyway, I’ll drop the whole subject.

I am truly sorry and had no intention of insulting you with the suggestion that your family was recluse, as I have been. There are only a couple of definitions of the term and I won’t say with which one I attribute to myself. Somebody who lives alone and deliberately keeps away from other people, and somebody who lives a solitary life devoted to prayer and meditation.

So you see, I could not conceive of anyone considering it an insult to be called a recluse.. Anyway, I’ll drop the whole subject.

Fair enough. :)

I guess I'm a "Red Neck Cracker."

All right, while not a stretch, I guess I'm going to have to take your word on that.


Funny how you speak of Obama being "charismatic, eloquent and intelligent" just prior to disparaging those of us in the south.

I guess you left out 'Unejumacated' when you described yourself as a "Red Neck Cracker", speechlesstx, 'cause an ejumacated Cracker would have read the rest of the post and deduced that I wasn't "disparaging" all of the fine folks living South of the Manson/Nixon Line, or those fortunate enough to hail from the Lonestar State.


I can tell you as a "Red Neck Cracker" from Texas that I don't have a need to vote for another "Red Neck Cracker," I intend to vote for the best candidate that has a shot at winning, which at this time appears to be Rudy.

Well, I liked Rudy too, but then the baggage started falling off the cart.

Right now, I'm rooting for Romney, but that'll change the second Thompson actually declares.


But, it is precisely your attitude that makes us leery of "left coasters" and northeastern politicians, that smug attitude is not welcome here.

Fair enough, 'cause I'm not about to change my attitude towards our present Mental Midget in Chief who happens to hail from your neck of the woods.


Your values are not our values in so many areas, we resent that liberal/progressive air of superiority that's so often on display and we especially hate Yankee politicians that come to the south and pull out their "sho 'nuff, y'all" accents like Hillary does.

Yeah, but.. .

Y'see here, speechlesstx, you seem to suffer from the same 'disparaging' syndrome you accuse me of suffering from.

Small secret here, speechlesstx, but I'm a registered Republican up here in the Northernmost armpit of the Left Coast -- And even voted for the Mental Midget/Red Neck Cracker in Chief not once, but twice.

And upon reflection, I surely do regret both of those votes now.

I guess you left out 'Unejumacated' when you described yourself as a "Red Neck Cracker", speechlesstx, 'cause an ejumacated Cracker would have read the rest of the post and deduced that I wasn't "disparaging" all of the fine folks living South of the Manson/Nixon Line, or those fortunate enough to hail from the Lonestar State.

I can tell an insult when I see one, kind of like calling me 'Unejumacated'. Look, you're a Republican and good for you, but you need a little better qualifier than what you used. We homegrown Texans fight back... especially at northern state senators that come down here and pretend to be one of us and folks that use the term "Red Neck Crackers." We take "don't mess with Texas" as more than an anti-litter slogan.

I can tell an insult when I see one, kind of like calling me 'Unejumacated'. Look, you're a Republican and good for you, but you need a little better qualifier than what you used. We homegrown Texans fight back ... especially at northern state senators that come down here and pretend to be one of us and folks that use the term "Red Neck Crackers." We take "don't mess with Texas" as more than an anti-litter slogan.
Why do you set North and South apart, what is this, “Us and Them” mentality that you and Bush favor. Some of you folks down in Texas still trying to deal with the Civil War.

We homegrown Texans fight back ... especially at northern state senators that come down here and pretend to be one of us and folks that use the term "Red Neck Crackers." We take "don't mess with Texas" as more than an anti-litter slogan.


Huh???!!! Just some facts about the President.


"Born in NewHaven, Connecticut, Bush was the first child of George H. W. Bush and Barbara Bush. Bush was raised in Midland and Houston, Texas, with his four siblings, Jeb, Neil, Marvin, and Dorothy. Another younger sister, Robin, died in 1953 at the age of three from leukemia.[9] Bush's grandfather, Prescott Bush, was a U.S. Senator from Connecticut, and his father served as U.S. President from 1989 to 1993. He is also distantly related to President Franklin Pierce and several other presidents.

Bush is sometimes referred to informally as George Bush Jr. in order to distinguish him from his father. However, because the son's full name is not exactly the same as his father's (the younger is George Walker Bush as opposed to the elder George Herbert Walker Bush), the "Jr." is incorrect.

Bush attended Phillips Academy in Andover, Massachusetts where he played baseball, and was the head cheerleader at the all-boys school during his senior year.[10][11] Following in his father's footsteps, Bush attended Yale University, where he received a Bachelor's degree in history in 1968.[12] As a college senior, Bush became a member of the secretive Skull and Bones society. By his own characterization, Bush was an average student.[13][14]"




Bobby

He also got an MBA from Harvard . I'd say acedemically that puts him above average.

You have to understand where DC is coming from . He is not particularly concerned about the details as much as the essence of the man . GW Bush would be the first to tell you he is a Texan rather than a country club Republican like his old man... and proud of it.

I now reside in the bluest of blue states but in my heart am a (dare I say it ?) redneck .

Huh???!!! Just some facts about the President.

Thanks Bobby, I don't recall saying anything about the president and I did intentionally say "We homegrown Texans" to make that very distinction. :D

He also got an MBA from Harvard . I'd say acedemically that puts him above average.

You have to understand where DC is coming from . He is not particularily concerned about the details as much as the essence of the man . GW Bush would be the first to tell you he is a Texan rather than a country club Republican like his old man .....and proud of it.

I now reside in the bluest of blue states but in my heart am a (dare I say it ?) redneck .


Tom, you should go into political humor. LOL! You have it backyards.

Speechlesstx said, "We homegrown Texans fight back ... especially at northern state senators that come down here and pretend to be one of us and folks." PS. Spell check "academically" next time.


Bobby

Tom, you should go into political humor. LOL! You have it backyards.

Speechlesstx said, "We homegrown Texans fight back ... especially at northern state senators that come down here and pretend to be one of us and folks." PS. Spell check "academically" next time.

Precisely, northern state "senators" such as Obama and Hillary. I know where Bush is from and who he is, after all he was my governor for a number of years prior to becoming president. He may not have been born here but he doesn't have to act the part either. The first time Hillary had a southern drawl was when she told the folks in Selma, "I don't feel nowaaaays tired."

Precisely, northern state "senators" such as Obama and Hillary. I know where Bush is from and who he is, after all he was my governor for a number of years prior to becoming president. He may not have been born here but he doesn't have to act the part either. The first time Hillary had a southern drawl was when she told the folks in Selma, "I don't feel nowaaaays tired."


Obama and Hillary are not from Texas either, although in Hillary's defence she's your cousin from Arkansas. :)



Bobby

Why do you set North and South apart, what is this, “Us and Them” mentality that you and Bush favor. Some of you folks down in Texas still trying to deal with the Civil War.

As my old non-southerner favorite Ronald Reagan said, "There you go again." In all my nearly 47 years I've never run across anyone in any part of this great state still trying to deal with the civil war. And don't you find it a little silly to complain about our alleged "us and them" mentality while slamming us with another undeserved, divisive label?

Let me just announce this for everyone to see, I don't care where you're from, what color your skin is, what religion you adhere to (or not), your gender, sexual orientation, political affiliation or lack thereof. Did I miss anything?

I now reside in the bluest of blue states but in my heart am a (dare I say it ?) redneck .

If you want to be a redneck that's cool. It's just kind of like that 'n' word thing, we can call each other rednecks, but outsiders need to tread lightly :D

He also got an MBA from Harvard . I'd say acedemically that puts him above average.

You have to understand where DC is coming from . He is not particularily concerned about the details as much as the essence of the man . GW Bush would be the first to tell you he is a Texan rather than a country club Republican like his old man .....and proud of it.

I now reside in the bluest of blue states but in my heart am a (dare I say it ?) redneck .
Right you are... As they say, ”it's not where you're from; it's who you are that matters.' I have great admiration for Bush, he is a Mans' Man; that is, he lives his beliefs and that is a great deterrent in politics.

Obama and Hillary are not from Texas either

And we thank God for that.


although in Hillary's defence she's your cousin from Arkansas. :)

No, you can't pawn her off on us, she's an Illinois native that followed Bill to Arkansas 9 years after graduating from Wellesley and then Yale Law School and ended up a NY senator. Her 'roots' in the south are rather shallow.

As my old non-southerner favorite Ronald Reagan said, "There you go again." In all my nearly 47 years I've never run across anyone in any part of this great state still trying to deal with the civil war. And don't you find it a little silly to complain about our alleged "us and them" mentality while slamming us with another undeserved, divisive label?

Let me just announce this for everyone to see, I don't care where you're from, what color your skin is, what religion you adhere to (or not), your gender, sexual orientation, political affiliation or lack thereof. Did I miss anything?


Yes. But... "especially at northern state senators that come down here and pretend to be one of us."

BTW I'm still wondering where the hell "Bush Country" begins and ends. When he was campaigning around Texas, he was a Texan. Although he didn't choose to attend college down south. Hmm... Anyway when in Massachusetts he was one of their homegrown on his daddy's coattails. Then one brother in Colorado (S&L scandal) and another in Florida (vote controversy), Dubya's national campaigns emerged into the slogan,
"Bush Country." I'm telling you this post evolved into the best political humor in awhile.:)



Bobby

And we thank God for that.



No, you can't pawn her off on us, she's an Illinois native that followed Bill to Arkansas 9 years after graduating from Wellesley and then Yale Law School and ended up a NY senator. Her 'roots' in the south are rather shallow.



Come on Steve! By comparison owning the then mismanaged worst team in Baseball the "Texas Rangers" was not that impressive.:)


Bobby

Yeah who in his right mind trades away Sammy Sosa ?

yeah who in his right mind trades away Sammy Sosa ?

Tom-

LOL! I keep meaning to ask you for your opinion on Bonds. As far as I concerned Aaron is the last legitimate HR record holder. When Bonds came into the league he was a wiry guy (his rookie baseball card declares such). Since then his hat size increased four fold and amazingly most of his stats increased dramatically while in his mid 30's. Personally, I hope Bonds and others are finally busted and erased of any records.



Bobby

I've never seen a major sports milestone broken with so little fanfare . Nobody cares . And I think that has to do with the person who broke it. Everyone knows he was juiced up .The only real question was if he was violating some baseball rule by taking roids.

I guess for him it is fortunate that he broke it before his indictment . Now all the people who hoarded the 1987 Topps Bonds rookie card can collect their nickel.

Aaron broke the record playing a lot of his years in Milwaukee in a stadium not conducive for the hr. ball. He was also a class player who never really got the credit he deserved .

So that rule only applies to Senators originally from the north and not Presidents. Got it! :

Nice try, but I don't get boxed in that easily. As you yourself said "Bush was raised in Midland and Houston, Texas, with his four siblings, Jeb, Neil, Marvin, and Dorothy. ' He doesn't have to fake his accent, he earned it and his personal home his still here, perhaps you've heard about it. As for the Rangers, who cares? I'm not much of a baseball fan.


Yes. But... "especially at northern state senators that come down here and pretend to be one of us."

Simply put, we prefer that people just be themselves. Don't you?


BTW I'm still wondering where the hell "Bush Country" begins and ends. When he was campaigning around Texas, he was a Texan. Although he didn't choose to attend college down south. Hmm... Anyway when in Massachusetts he was one of their homegrown on his daddy's coattails. Then one brother in Colorado (S&L scandal) and another in Florida (vote controversy), Dubya's national campaigns emerged into the slogan, "Bush Country." I'm telling you this post evolved into the best political humor in awhile.

Well, according to USA Today, this was Bush country in 2000:

http://images.usatoday.com/news/politicselections/elections2004/_images/2000countymap.gif

And here it was in 2004:

http://images.usatoday.com/news/politicselections/elections2004/_images/2004countymap-final2.gif

Does that help?

yeah who in his right mind trades away Sammy Sosa ?

You have a point there. :D

Right you are...As they say, ”it’s not where you’re from; it’s who you are that matters.’

Exactly.

I don't know who drew these maps, but given that San Francisco never was, is not, nor likely ever be Bush country, the whole map is suspect.

On Tuesday, February 28, 2006, the City and County of San Francisco became the first large municipality to call for the impeachment of George Bush and...

I don't know who drew these maps, but given that San Francisco never was, is not, nor likely ever be Bush country, the whole map is suspect.

On Tuesday, February 28, 2006, the City and County of San Francisco became the first large municipality to call for the impeachment of George Bush and ...

DC,

Well, the map is a county by county map of who voted for whom. I have seen this same map at CNN, MSNBC, Slate.com and USA Today... none of whom are particularly disposed to be biased toward President Bush.

You may be right that San Fransisco is not "Bush country". In fact, you most surely are. But if liberals are too lazy to come out and vote, there's a good chance that they are going to lose their county, even if they are in the majority. Apathy is one of the two major causes of losing our rights... including the right to influence government, as I have mentioned in another post. And San Fransisco liberals are clearly apathetic if they didn't come out and vote.

The map isn't suspect. It has corroboration from a lot of different sources. What is suspect is whether San Fransicans care enough to vote on election day.

Elliot

Now that we've covered everything from rednecks to 'roids, can we get back to the subject of Hillary? Just as she spends a day shadowing a nurse she debuted her first TV ad:


You know, if you're a family that is struggling and you don't have health care, well, you are invisible to this president. If you're a single mom trying to find affordable child care so you can go to work, well, you're invisible too. And I never thought I would see that our soldiers who served in Iraq and Afghanistan would be treated as though they were invisible.

Is she running against Bush now?

DC,

Well, the map is a county by county map of who voted for whom. I have seen this same map at CNN, MSNBC, Slate.com and USA Today... none of whom are particularly disposed to be biased toward President Bush.

You may be right that San Fransisco is not "Bush country". In fact, you most surely are. But if liberals are too lazy to come out and vote, there's a good chance that they are going to lose their county, even if they are in the majority. Apathy is one of the two major causes of losing our rights... including the right to influence government, as I have mentioned in another post. And San Fransisco liberals are clearly apathetic if they didn't come out and vote.

The map isn't suspect. It has corroboration from a lot of different sources. What is suspect is whether San Fransicans care enough to vote on election day.

Elliot
I see, are you suggesting that San Francisco County has an abnormally lower voter turnout than other American counties, and therefore is not reflected on the map.

Now that we've covered everything from rednecks to 'roids, can we get back to the subject of Hillary? Just as she spends a day shadowing a nurse she debuted her first TV ad:



Is she running against Bush now?
She is the leading hawk in the Democratic field. Even the National Review and The Weekly Standard have come to applaud Clinton.

Go girl Go
http://www.truthdig.com/images/reportuploads/bighillary_300.jpg

I don’t know who drew these maps, but given that San Francisco never was, is not, nor likely ever be Bush country, the whole map is suspect.

On Tuesday, February 28, 2006, the City and County of San Francisco became the first large municipality to call for the impeachment of George Bush and ...

Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't the bay area shaded entirely in blue, indicating wins for Gore and Kerry?

I can tell an insult when I see one, kind of like calling me 'Unejumacated'.

Apparently you *can't* tell an insult when you see one, speechlesstx.

Really, if you're going to declare yourself to be a "Red Neck Cracker" (as you did earlier), then doesn't it stand to reason that you're also likely "Unejumacated"?

Look, if you're feeling personally insulted and disparaged by anything I've written, then you need to take a few steps back and reread this entire exchange to see where and when you went wrong.

Well, according to USA Today, this was Bush country in 2000:

http://images.usatoday.com/news/politicselections/elections2004/_images/2000countymap.gif


Does that help?


Obviously that was not the popular count. :)



Bobby

Apparently you *can't* tell an insult when you see one, speechlesstx.

Really, if you're going to declare yourself to be a "Red Neck Cracker" (as you did earlier), then doesn't it stand to reason that you're also likely "Unejumacated"?

Look, if you're feeling personally insulted and disparaged by anything I've written, then you need to take a few steps back and reread this entire exchange to see where and when you went wrong.



Sometimes I just try to find the humor in these posts, but usually end up shaking my head. I'd give you a big AGREE except that the rating system says I have to spread reputation around elsewhere.


Bobby

However, right wingers are traditionally racist and sexist, while “Left coasters” are not. I refer you to my post #8

Y'know, the irony here is that it was pointed out to me a few days before I joined this thread that some Texan Democrats snidely refer to the RNC (Republican National Convention) as the convention of Red Neck Crackers.

Yeah, go figger.:D

Apparently you *can't* tell an insult when you see one, speechlesstx.

Really, if you're going to declare yourself to be a "Red Neck Cracker" (as you did earlier), then doesn't it stand to reason that you're also likely "Unejumacated"?

Look, if you're feeling personally insulted and disparaged by anything I've written, then you need to take a few steps back and reread this entire exchange to see where and when you went wrong.

Growler, there was a good amount of tongue-in-cheek in what I originally said, it was a "David Duke" comment that set me off - I mean who wants to be associated with that? Still, your "Red Neck Crackers" comments weren't welcome regardless of your weak stipulation which basically said, "We ain't all a bunch of poor, white hicks - but - we dang sure ain't votin' for anybody but a bunch of rednecks." Sorry, but that's still insulting. Texas and Texans in general are a long way from being "Red Neck Crackers." By golly, we even have schools, satellite TV and that thang called the internet.

Y'know, the irony here is that it was pointed out to me a few days before I joined this thread that some Texan Democrats snidely refer to the RNC (Republican National Convention) as the convention of Red Neck Crackers.

Yeah, go figger.:D
What I find the most intresting here is that I never had head of a Texas Cracker; the term Cracker to my way of thinking was reserved for white people…"Cracker", sometimes "white cracker", is a usually pejorative term for a white person,

Historically the word suggested poor, white rural Americans with little formal education.