I am trying to remove an old shower stall to put in a closet and I opened the access panel and there are no shut off valves. How do I shut off the feed but not the entire house because I am not putting in another shower at this time?

You could just install shut-offs that will be in the wall. Otherwise, cut out the 'T intersection' of the water-lines, and install a copper adaptor to reconnect the pipes.

XenoSapien

Do you have a cellar? Shut offs may be down there. Copper, pex, hard pipe of any kind? Need more info??

No, I live an apartment, but know a bit about plumbing. If your lines are copper, you could just cut the nipples back and clamp a shut-off on the hot and cold line. Then install the wall over it. It sounds like you have to shut off the water to the whole house.

XenoSapien

Errrrr... I don't think you can "clamp a shut-off" onto supply pipes.

Certainly, even if such things are available, they're not to code, and a terrible idea.

The RIGHT way to do this is to shut the water off (to the whole house if necessary), drain the water out of those pipes, cut them and solder caps onto them.

The water must be drained from the pipes, or they'll never heat up enough to melt the solder.

With 'clamp', I meant compression type shut-offs. My mistake.

XenoSapien

Hiding compression fittings inside of walls may be code but I would never. CUT THE COPPER AND SWEAT ON A CAP

Yah, you can sweat on a cap. Compression shut-offs will be the easiest solution. Code? What is the city going to do? Start ripping out your drywall?

XenoSapien

hiding compression fittings inside of walls may be code but I would never.

All of the prevailing codes adopted in North America expressly forbid concealing compression fittings on potable water systems.

Fine. Ok, I can see that I need to get the code book out...

XenoSapien

For me its not a code issue, compression fittings just can't be trusted in areas were one can't see it. They are easy for the diy person and that's why they are popular but any good plumber that's been around will support my choice here. This I am sure of.

The OP never said it is copper pipe.
The Op may not be skilled at sweat soldering.
I would likely put a threaded cap where pipe connected to the old shower valve.
You may have to shut the water off to the entire hose to do the job. If you shut it off to the hot water tank, turn it off and leave a hot water tap open.

The OP never said it is copper pipe.

True.


The Op may not be skilled at sweat soldering.

If it is copper and he isn't skilled at "sweat soldering" then he should hire someone who is. Right?


I would likely put a threaded cap where pipe connected to the old shower valve.

You're assuming threaded fittings, Labman, what if they aren't?

Would you still use a threaded cap if it's copper connected to a 'sweat soldered' valve-- If so, what kind of threaded cap would you use, and how would you attach it to the copper pipe?

Sorry, but in the absence of more information from the OP, your two cents is every bit as worthless as most of the rest of the advice (including my own) in this thread.

Do not use compression fittings inside a wall. You will regret it. SOLDER. It takes just as long to solder a cap as it does to tighten on a compression fitting. Unless you don't know how to solder. If that's the case you shouldn't be messing with your copper pipes in the first place.

You're assuming threaded fittings, Labman, what if they aren't?
Sorry, but in the absence of more information from the OP, your two cents is every bit as worthless as most of the rest of the advice (including my own) in this thread.

Well I can't say they never made shower fixtures without a threaded connection, but I can say they aren't common.

Whether you like it or not, I am going to continue to point out safe, workable ways for the people coming here for help to get the job done themselves. My post that you disdain, very likely gave the OP the answer he needed. Too bad somebody outside the plumbing priesthood has to solve these problems.

Well I can't say they never made shower fixtures without a threaded connection, but I can say they aren't common.

From a DIY point of view, you are correct.

Tub and Shower valves sold in the big box stores that cater to the homeowner/DIY market most always have IPS connections.

As for the Wholesale houses that sell only to contractors, the opposite is true, the valves are more often than not fitted with solder connectors.


Whether you like it or not, I am going to continue to point out safe, workable ways for the people coming here for help to get the job done themselves.

Except that isn't what you did.

You chided those who responded for assuming the connections were copper, and then went on yourself to assume that the connections were threaded.

Here's the rub, Labman, none of us, including you or I, know what the connections were because the OP bailed and didn't follow through.


My post that you disdain, very likely gave the OP the answer he needed.

It isn't usually the advice you give that I disdain, Labman -- What I disdain is the arrogant, pompous and unctuous way you deliver the advice.

Y'know, when it comes right down to it, you're kind of a jerk, Labman.


Too bad somebody outside the plumbing priesthood has to solve these problems.

And there's that ol' rub again, Labman -- You no more solved the problem than I or any of the other responders did.

Wow I come to get advice from friendly helpful professionals and to read and learn things. Now and then when its something I may have some experience in I may offer some advice of my own knowing all the time we are all mature enough to either accept or reject the advice given. But now I can see I may also benefit from the wide vocabulary some of you have. Unctuous ! You Go

Wow I come to get advice from friendly helpful professionals and to read and learn things. Now and then when its something I may have some experience in I may offer some advice of my own knowing all the time we are all mature enough to either accept or reject the advice given. But now I can see I may also benefit from the wide vocabulary some of you have. Unctuous ! You Go

A must have for your bookmark lits. (http://thesaurus.reference.com/):D

iamgrowler, I will not mess with you. If I ever need to put you in your place I'll get help from speedball.

iamgrowler, I will not mess with you. If I ever need to put you in your place I'll get help from speedball.

Well, given the nature of the forum and the preponderance of ego's, it'll likely come up at some point.

Although, you've never questioned my credentials or told me to tear up my Journeyman's license, so I'd likely go much easier on you than I would >spits< Labman.

Guess you guys have some history

guess you guys have some history


Yeah, a bit.

Yadda, yadda, yadda.

Play nice guys! First, no compression fittings inside walls period! Next, in order to help we will have to know the material your pipes are made of. Without that knowledge we're just guessing. So let us know and we'll instruct you on the best way to cap off your pipes. Regards, Tom

All the arguing isn't necessary lets just help this guy with his problem. Everyone has different ideas, that's fine, but we can all figure out the best way to fix the problem together. Without trying to be a JERK... I am suggesting using a soldered cap. I will leave it at that.

Okay, I want to replace the shower fixtures with the same kit. There is only one shut off valve and that is on the cold water feed going into the gas water heater. I need a a step by step for shutting down and relieve the water pressure so as to replace the shower facuets. I am also concerned about water pressure release and if it is necessary to purge water heater after shutting off the cold water line to this heater. Also does this water heater pilot have to be turned off if the cold water feed is closed? I do not want to risk the fear of overheating the water heater by closing the cold feed if say the pilot light is on during the project.

Should there be shut off valves on the water lines feeding the tub/shower as there are with sink installations?

I'm not a plumber, and I don't know about the codes... but I would say yes, I would want them.

Of course, valves are no use if they're behind a finished wall, as shower plumbing so often is...


~aaron

okay, I want to replace the shower fixtures with the same kit.

Good idea, this is always easier!


There is only one shut off valve and that is on the cold water feed going into the gas water heater.

Are you sure? There should always be a valve in the cold line just before the water heater, but there should also be a main (whole-house) shutoff... Trace the water from where it comes in (meter or well-pipe) to find it.



I need a a step by step for shutting down and relieve the water pressure so as to replace the shower facuets. I am also concerned about water pressure release and if it is necessary to purge water heater after shutting off the cold water line to this heater.


Here's what I would do (as a semi-educated homeowner/duffer)

-- Find and close the whole-house valve
-- Make sure the valve is really closed; turn on the highest sink/faucet in the house and make sure there's no flow. Some water will come out, but it should stop pretty quickly.
-- Now turn on the hot water at the same place, should get no-flow
-- If this wasn't already the shower you're working on, go open those valves too. The only water that will come out is what's in the pipes above the valve, by gravity.
-- Go find the valves that are the next lowest (lower) than the shower, and open them. This gets the residual water level in the pipes BELOW the shower. You can't solder on waterfilled pipes.
-- -- If there is no lower sink/faucet, you can let some water out of the water heater drain. NOT the pressure relief valve at the top, but the hose-bib drain at the bottom. It's a good idea to flush your heater anyhow. Opening the water heater will lower the water in BOTH the cold and hot water pipes.

-- When you get done, close all the sink/faucet valves, and go open the main valve. Go to the highest sink again and bleed the air out by opening the valve. It will sputter.
-- Go check your work on the shower valve to be sure it isn't leaking!



Also does this water heater pilot have to be turned off if the cold water feed is closed? I do not want to risk the fear of overheating the water heater by closing the cold feed if say the pilot light is on during the project.

I have never owned or worked with a gas water heater, so I'm not much help. It seems to me that it won't be dangerous as long as you don't use the water while the main valve is closed, which is pretty much impossible anyhow. Kill the pilot light for your own peace of mind.


Just my thoughts!


~aaron



.